| Revision as of 15:24, 6 May 2024 editAlaexis (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers17,683 edits →Potential targeting of bios: ReplyTag: Reply← Previous edit | Revision as of 15:25, 6 May 2024 edit undoAlaexis (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers17,683 edits →Potential targeting of bios: no needNext edit → | ||
| Line 94: | Line 94: | ||
| The other bios that this user has raised issues with are ], ], ], ], ], ], ], and ]. ] (]) 22:24, 5 May 2024 (UTC) | The other bios that this user has raised issues with are ], ], ], ], ], ], ], and ]. ] (]) 22:24, 5 May 2024 (UTC) | ||
| :Some of these individuals are clearly notable (like Vivian Silver, Jayar Davidov, etc.), while others may be more of an edge case, on one hand they are covered by reliable sources, but on the other hand most of that coverage is related to the October 7 events (see ]) |
:Some of these individuals are clearly notable (like Vivian Silver, Jayar Davidov, etc.), while others may be more of an edge case, on one hand they are covered by reliable sources, but on the other hand most of that coverage is related to the October 7 events (see ]). ]<sub>]</sub> 15:24, 6 May 2024 (UTC) | ||
Revision as of 15:25, 6 May 2024
| Main | Talk Page | Help | Participants | Awards | Article Assessment | Templates | To do | New Articles | Sister Projects |
This Talk page is dedicated to matters related to WikiProject Israel.
| This is the talk page for discussing WikiProject Israel and anything related to its purposes and tasks. |
|
 Archives |
| 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 |
|
This page has archives. Sections older than 60 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III. |
Please help improve the following articles
Requesting collaboration to improve the articles List of terrorist incidents in Israel in 2022, List of terrorist incidents in Israel in 2024, and List of terrorist incidents in the Palestinian territories, which are all currently being considered for deletion, in order to make sure that these articles align with Misplaced Pages guidelines. I believe that all the major issues brought up in the deletion request could be addressed and fixed if we work to improve these articles collaboratively, especially considering the precedent of similar articles existing for various other countries on the English Misplaced Pages. Your expertise and contributions are highly valued. WikiJunkie (talk) 14:39, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
- What was the feedback given, and where are the deleted article contents? It appears the articles are now deleted, and the feedback is not shown. Fileyfood500 (talk) 06:13, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
IDF Spokesperson's Unit
I posted on the article talk page but assume it isn’t very active so I shall ask here:
As a former military man but with no knowledge of the Hebrew language.. may I ask why the current spokesman (a naval officer with the equivalent rank to an anglophone Rear Admiral) is listed in this article as a Brigadier General?
I appreciate that Tat Aluf could mean either but doesn’t the IDF use the English equivalents according to branch rather than direct translations? LittleEye90 (talk) 10:30, 9 March 2024 (UTC)
Requested move at Talk:United Nations Conciliation Commission#Requested move 7 March 2024
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:United Nations Conciliation Commission#Requested move 7 March 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Killarnee (talk) 23:57, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
Religious segregation#Israel
Hi! Please have a look at Religious segregation#Israel, where an anonymous user added some very non NPOV claims. Thanks, Atbannett (talk) 07:56, 25 March 2024 (UTC)
POV pushing on political party articles
I've noticed some concerted POV pushing by a couple of revived accounts on nearly all Israeli political party articles over the last couple of months – all of them are being moved one position to the left; Meretz was changed from "left" to "left to far-left"; Labor from "centre-left" to "centre-left to left", Yesh Atid from "centre" to "centre to centre-left", National Unity from "centre-right" to "centre-right to centre", Moledet and Mafdal–Religious Zionism from "far-right" to "right to far-right" etc. Worth keeping an eye on this. Cheers, Number 57 19:53, 26 March 2024 (UTC)
- @Number 57 Can you please provide links to some of the edits in question? Mistamystery (talk) 23:37, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
I made a draft on a former intelligence agent, would someone be willing to quickly check if there are any sources in Hebrew about her?
I worked on her draft here, but don’t speak any Hebrew. Would someone be willing to take a look? FortunateSons (talk) 17:04, 29 March 2024 (UTC)
- I couldn't find anything of note unfortunately. Alaexis¿question? 17:55, 30 March 2024 (UTC)
- It’s alright, thank you. I already have enough for the article, I just wanted to make sure I didn’t miss anything :) FortunateSons (talk) 17:57, 30 March 2024 (UTC)
Requested move at UNRWA October 7 controversy
More feedback is needed Talk:UNRWA_October_7_controversy#Requested_move_29_March_2024. Alaexis¿question? 21:10, 1 April 2024 (UTC)
Requested move at Talk:2024 Israeli bombing of the Iranian embassy in Damascus#Requested move 2 April 2024
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:2024 Israeli bombing of the Iranian embassy in Damascus#Requested move 2 April 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. RodRabelo7 (talk) 23:42, 9 April 2024 (UTC)
Requested move at Talk:2024 Iranian Strikes in Israel#Requested move 13 April 2024
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:2024 Iranian Strikes in Israel#Requested move 13 April 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. RodRabelo7 (talk) 21:31, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
Request for comment at Reliable Sources Noticeboard RFC: The Anti-Defamation League
There is a request for comment at Misplaced Pages:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard#RFC:_The_Anti-Defamation_League that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Mistamystery (talk) 23:43, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
Requested move at Talk:2024 Iranian strikes in Israel#Requested move 14 April 2024
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:2024 Iranian strikes in Israel#Requested move 14 April 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. RodRabelo7 (talk) 19:34, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
Requested move at Talk:2023 Israeli blockade of the Gaza Strip#Requested move 11 April 2024
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:2023 Israeli blockade of the Gaza Strip#Requested move 11 April 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. RodRabelo7 (talk) 00:21, 22 April 2024 (UTC)
Discussion at Talk:State of Palestine § Copy editing/maintenance needed
You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:State of Palestine § Copy editing/maintenance needed. Sdkb 18:23, 22 April 2024 (UTC)
Misplaced Pages Command Center
On October 2023, דוד שי (David Shay) announced a WhatsApp group to "fight" against anti-Israel bias in English Misplaced Pages. According to the announcement on Hebrew Misplaced Pages , the group seems to be coordinated by שלומית ליר (Shlomit Lir). It is also advertised on the Hebrew Misplaced Pages Facebook group, which is often moderated by Shani (WMF). The group publicly self-styles itself as "Misplaced Pages Command Center", and seems to serve as a private coordination hub for pro-Israel editing, focusing on a list of English Misplaced Pages articles. Since the group references WikiProject Israel, I bring it up here. How does this group comply with WP:CANVASS, WP:MEATPUPPET, WP:NPOV, etc? MarioGom (talk) 15:38, 23 April 2024 (UTC)
- I'm not too surprised given the prominence of the conflict. These are he-wiki users though so the question is what you think could/should be done here at en-wiki? Alaexis¿question? 21:21, 23 April 2024 (UTC)
- The group is focused on coordinating I/P editing on English Misplaced Pages, so it is relevant to this project. MarioGom (talk) 21:45, 23 April 2024 (UTC)
I guess the discussion might continue at Misplaced Pages talk:Arbitration Committee#ARBCOM, since there is a longer discussion on canvassing efforts there. MarioGom (talk) 22:07, 23 April 2024 (UTC)(This topic might be partly out of scope there. MarioGom (talk) 06:13, 24 April 2024 (UTC))- This group is focused on writing encyclopedic entries related to Israel, not only about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, although it is also about it, and its goal is to bring to the attention of readers only correct and verified information. The group in no way engages in biasing of articles, in contrast to extensive pro-Palestinian activity on the English Misplaced Pages. דוד שי (talk) 02:16, 24 April 2024 (UTC)
- Every special-interest group that organises to edit Misplaced Pages claims to only want to bring "correct and verified information". Zero 03:43, 24 April 2024 (UTC)
- I do not dispute that you might discuss other articles, but the list of 35 English Misplaced Pages target articles publicly shared by the group is 100% about the Israel-Palestine conflict and, more specifically, about the 2023-2024 Israel-Gaza War. In any case, the policies and guidelines I linked in the original post apply regardless of how broad the interests of the group might be. MarioGom (talk) 06:03, 24 April 2024 (UTC)
- I understand that the coordinators of this group have read this, since the group invite link has been revoked and the post recruiting people on the Hebrew Misplaced Pages Facebook group has been deleted. I assume there are no intentions to comply with English Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines. Just do your thing with the IDF Spokeperson Unit, with EC gaming grinding short descriptions, etc. I must admit English Misplaced Pages cannot do much against sufficiently motivated actors engaged in long term manipulation. MarioGom (talk) 19:18, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
- I agree with what your concerns, but given the imbalance of the editing that's happening here, they probably felt like they needed to do this in order to make things more balanced, not that 2 wrongs make a right. Unfortunately in the world we live in, there's a rush to come here and get a certain POV reflected and this people care less about Misplaced Pages than they do about their own agenda. So it becomes an arm race of which side has more editors to get their POV across. This isn't what Misplaced Pages is about, but given the principles it's built on, I guess it also kind of is. MaskedSinger (talk) 05:59, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- The report they published about anti-Israel bias is pure non-sense. The perception that Misplaced Pages and realiable sources contradict their positions is not a license to ignore project policies. There are, at least, three groups organized to covertly push for pro-Israel POV: the Yesha Council, the "Misplaced Pages Command Center", and the "Misplaced Pages Lobby Group". The level of institutional support they are getting both within Wikimedia and from external organizations is unprecedented. So there is, indeed, an imbalance: the tolerance towards organized efforts by pro-Israel groups. MarioGom (talk) 07:12, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- I hear you. Maybe the numbers required to be an Extended confirmed user need to be increased to 3 months and 1000 edits. Editors should be here because they want to contribute to Misplaced Pages, not because they have some axe to grind. Speaking of which, I see you are a page reviewer. Would you be able to have a look at Draft:Rivka Bayech? Thankyou. MaskedSinger (talk) 07:17, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- It's difficult to make accurate evidence-based statements about the dynamics or the current state of the topic area that avoid sampling bias, are independent of the observer and avoid hasty generalizations. I think the topic area is rather complicated, more like a forest canopy than a system with 2 opposing forces. It's good to have some humility about our ability construct true statements about balance and motivation etc. It may be better to focus on enforcing the simple rules than imagining we can grasp the complex dynamics. Sean.hoyland (talk) 07:34, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- To illustrate the complexity, this is a graph of a tiny part of the topic area, starting at the Israel–Hamas war category as a root and mapping the network of subcats, articles, talk pages, templates etc. Even for that tiny substructure within the topic area, it seems pretty unlikely that broad statements about of balance and editor motives, are going to be accurate. Sean.hoyland (talk) 08:53, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- I hear you. Maybe the numbers required to be an Extended confirmed user need to be increased to 3 months and 1000 edits. Editors should be here because they want to contribute to Misplaced Pages, not because they have some axe to grind. Speaking of which, I see you are a page reviewer. Would you be able to have a look at Draft:Rivka Bayech? Thankyou. MaskedSinger (talk) 07:17, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- The report they published about anti-Israel bias is pure non-sense. The perception that Misplaced Pages and realiable sources contradict their positions is not a license to ignore project policies. There are, at least, three groups organized to covertly push for pro-Israel POV: the Yesha Council, the "Misplaced Pages Command Center", and the "Misplaced Pages Lobby Group". The level of institutional support they are getting both within Wikimedia and from external organizations is unprecedented. So there is, indeed, an imbalance: the tolerance towards organized efforts by pro-Israel groups. MarioGom (talk) 07:12, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- I agree with what your concerns, but given the imbalance of the editing that's happening here, they probably felt like they needed to do this in order to make things more balanced, not that 2 wrongs make a right. Unfortunately in the world we live in, there's a rush to come here and get a certain POV reflected and this people care less about Misplaced Pages than they do about their own agenda. So it becomes an arm race of which side has more editors to get their POV across. This isn't what Misplaced Pages is about, but given the principles it's built on, I guess it also kind of is. MaskedSinger (talk) 05:59, 2 May 2024 (UTC)
- I understand that the coordinators of this group have read this, since the group invite link has been revoked and the post recruiting people on the Hebrew Misplaced Pages Facebook group has been deleted. I assume there are no intentions to comply with English Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines. Just do your thing with the IDF Spokeperson Unit, with EC gaming grinding short descriptions, etc. I must admit English Misplaced Pages cannot do much against sufficiently motivated actors engaged in long term manipulation. MarioGom (talk) 19:18, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
- This group is focused on writing encyclopedic entries related to Israel, not only about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, although it is also about it, and its goal is to bring to the attention of readers only correct and verified information. The group in no way engages in biasing of articles, in contrast to extensive pro-Palestinian activity on the English Misplaced Pages. דוד שי (talk) 02:16, 24 April 2024 (UTC)
- The group is focused on coordinating I/P editing on English Misplaced Pages, so it is relevant to this project. MarioGom (talk) 21:45, 23 April 2024 (UTC)
Requested move at Weaponization of antisemitism
There is a requested move at Weaponization of antisemitism that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Mistamystery (talk) 21:25, 24 April 2024 (UTC)
Potential targeting of bios
Starting today, a user has raised issues with multiple bios written for people killed on October 7. There may be genuine notability issues with some of these articles, but they also suggested that Vivian Silver (which I wrote) be deleted. When I challenged this, they proposed deletions on two other articles I wrote, Negev Institute for Strategies of Peace and Development and Project Rozana, on the grounds they were part of a "legitimization campaign". I bring this up here to ensure other eyes are on these articles, especially if deletion nominations are made, since I can't be sure that this user is working in good faith.
The other bios that this user has raised issues with are Jayar Davidov, Roee Edan, Hayim Katsman, Roi Levy, Ofir Libstein, Izhar Peled, Yonatan Steinberg, and Yahav Winner. ForsythiaJo (talk) 22:24, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- Some of these individuals are clearly notable (like Vivian Silver, Jayar Davidov, etc.), while others may be more of an edge case, on one hand they are covered by reliable sources, but on the other hand most of that coverage is related to the October 7 events (see WP:BIO1E). Alaexis¿question? 15:24, 6 May 2024 (UTC)