Revision as of 04:33, 9 November 2024 view sourceBluseventy2 (talk | contribs)19 edits →Closing paragraph of “public image” section: new sectionTags: Mobile edit Mobile web edit New topic← Previous edit | Revision as of 15:46, 9 November 2024 view source Lowercase sigmabot III (talk | contribs)Bots, Template editors2,292,662 editsm Archiving 1 discussion(s) to Talk:Kamala Harris/Archive 6) (botNext edit → | ||
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== Coconut tree and accent == | |||
I fail to see the significance of this content in the article. In fact, I don't even the the point of either paragraph. They seem to be nothing more than standard, insanely shallow political nonsense. ] (]) 23:16, 28 October 2024 (UTC) | |||
:@] I think it relates fairly well under 'public image'. Yeah, some of it seems stupid, but I think that weirdly enough, it concerns people enough to have them feel differently about her. Honestly, I see no harm in having it. The article can have the facts and people can form their own opinion of the political weirdness from it. ] (]) 02:53, 29 October 2024 (UTC) | |||
::It's just a single opinion piece by a right-leaning talking head ''dismissing'' the idea. If, as you say, it {{tq|concerns people enough to have them feel differently about her}}, you should be able to find ] non-opinion coverage of it emphasizing its significance to her public image; but right now, the coverage makes it seem more like a single failed barb by Vance that failed to land. For articles on subjects this prominent, we don't cover every single political zinger that fell flat – only ones that got enough traction to have significant secondary coverage. --] (]) 02:59, 29 October 2024 (UTC) | |||
== A "consensus" based on an all-too-brief discussion == | == A "consensus" based on an all-too-brief discussion == |
Revision as of 15:46, 9 November 2024
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view · edit Frequently asked questions Q1: Why does Misplaced Pages say that Kamala Harris is African American/Asian American/South Asian American? A1: Misplaced Pages content is based on reliable sources (see Misplaced Pages:Verifiability, Misplaced Pages:Reliable sources). Many reliable sources, over a long period, refer to Harris as African American and Asian American, so Misplaced Pages reflects that in this article. Moreover, Harris's Senate and campaign websites state that she is African American and Asian American. Social media posts have inaccurately suggested that Harris cannot be African American because she has an Indian mother and Jamaican father. As PolitiFact notes, (see A look at Kamala Harris' multi-ethnic background and racial identity in the US, PolitiFact (August 14, 2020)), "this is a poor understanding of history, and ... the implication that Jamaicans aren't African or connected to Africa is wrong on its face." While not all Jamaican-Americans identify as "African American," Harris and many others do. When Misplaced Pages describes someone as the "first" to do something, we default to the larger category. Therefore, while Harris is the first Tamil-American, Indian-American, or South Asian-American to be Vice President of the US, we describe her, as reliable sources do, as the first Asian American to be Vice President of the US. |
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A "consensus" based on an all-too-brief discussion
user:Antony-22 has interpreted this discussion to establish a consensus for including racial categories such as Afro-Jamaican or dubious ethnic categories such as Indian-American in the lead paragraph of this article. The discussion, in which four editors participated, lasted but two days (October 1 to October 3). The first three respondents (user:Jack Upland, user:JohnAdams1800 and user:Valereee didn't exactly agree with the user:Antony-22's proposal.
On the heels of an exhaustive RfC—which had begun on July 31 and was closed by user:S Marshall on September 26 and in which there was little support for including racial categories of descent—to claim that such a brief and perfunctory discussion constitutes a consensus for revision is a slap in the face of the RfC participants (who had cited dozens of sources). I have therefore undone user:Antony-22's changes in the lead. Fowler&fowler«Talk» 15:25, 3 November 2024 (UTC)
- We had an RFC, a discussion had between 4 editors can't overturn that. Slatersteven (talk) 15:28, 3 November 2024 (UTC)
- Antony-22's edit should be reverted and not reinstated.—S Marshall T/C 16:21, 3 November 2024 (UTC)
- In agreement with Fowler&fowler's revert, as it maintains the RFC result. GoodDay (talk) 16:25, 3 November 2024 (UTC)
I won't edit the lead again. But I do want to point out that the RfC was specifically about the "Black" vs. "African-American" terminology, and there wasn't discussion there about whether to use "Afro-Jamaican". As I've mentioned, some readers seem to not be aware that Black Jamaicans have ancestors from Africa and aren't fully indigenous, and my intent was just that a link to Afro-Jamaicans somewhere prominent helps our readers learn that if they're not aware of it. Antony–22 (⁄contribs) 23:50, 3 November 2024 (UTC)
- And African-Americans are none of those? Slatersteven (talk) 11:52, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
Incumbent, until Jan 20, 2025
Please oh please. When we know who Harris' veep successor-to-be is. Let's not change "Incumbent" to "Outgoing", in Harris' infobox. GoodDay (talk) 20:30, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
- Good point. Now that Harris has been soundly defeated by Trump in the general presidential election, her successor will be J.D. Vance. TopShelf99 (talk) 14:54, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
When to accept a winner and loser tonight for this page's lead?
For 178 years, the Associated Press (AP) has been the gold standard for calling the American presidential election. See AP, Le Monde, Guardian, and NPR, which partners with AP to name just a few.
- I Propose that we wait until AP makes the call at its Live website That way there won't be any jumping the gun and edit wars in its wake. Please voice support or opposition below.
Fowler&fowler«Talk» 22:50, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
- Comment. This should be on the talk page for the election article. It's also extremely unlikely we will know the winner tonight; it could take days to count Pennsylvania where Democrats disproportionately vote by mail. 331dot (talk) 22:53, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
- We follow the procedures for the main 2024 United States presidential election, which will not call a winner until:
Update notice Please do not state that a state/an election has been won by a candidate before the election has been called by all of the following networks:ABC, Associated Press, CBS, CNN, NBC
. We shouldn’t deviate for other pages Raladic (talk) 22:58, 5 November 2024 (UTC)- Oh, OK, Thanks. So there we have it in Raladic's post above. Fowler&fowler«Talk» 23:11, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
It's over – she lost. TopShelf99 (talk) 15:23, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
What to write in the lead paragraph should KH win
Obviously moot – Muboshgu (talk) 15:07, 8 November 2024 (UTC) |
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I propose that we write:
The remainder of her current lead paragraph should be in later paragraphs. Please discuss below. Of course, if she loses, then this page will not have much traffic. Fowler&fowler«Talk» 23:09, 5 November 2024 (UTC) Fowler&fowler«Talk» 23:09, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
References |
Edit request - revert "Exiting office" in the info box
I request that "Exiting office" and the Jan 20, 2025 date is reverted back to "Assumed office" with the date she was sworn in as VP. "Exiting office" sounds silly, and the info box should have the date she assumed the role, not the date two months from now that she's leaving it. Luminism (talk) 12:02, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Resolved --Super Goku V (talk) 10:36, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
What to write in the lead paragraph now that KH was defeated
Suggested change: Change "Harris lost the general election to her Republican Party opponent Donald Trump" to "Harris was soundly defeated in the 2024 presidential election by her Republican Party opponent, Donald Trump. Harris lost the electoral vote 226-312, and garnered over 4.5 million less popular votes than Trump." TopShelf99 (talk) 19:51, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Becasue we try to keep it neutral. Slatersteven (talk) 11:09, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- Exactly - What I am suggesting is both factual and neutral. I don't want this article to be completely laudatory about Harris, and I don't want it to be completely defamatory like the Trump article. TopShelf99 (talk) 14:52, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- So you do not want it to be negative, by saying she "was soundly defeated"?, Sorry that makes no sense, we say totally neutrally she lost. That is all we need to say. Slatersteven (talk) 14:56, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- She WAS soundly defeated. That is more factual and neutral than referring to Trump lying, racist, misogynistic, and one of the worst Presidents in history, and those terms were all allowed in the lede in the Misplaced Pages article on Trump. I can understand your disappointment about the election results and voters' repudiation of the damage Harris and Biden have caused for four years and what she stands for, but you and your fellow editors and administrators shouldn't let your liberal bias continue to influence Misplaced Pages articles. TopShelf99 (talk) 15:14, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- This not about Trumps article, it is about here, and we do not engage in tit for tat WP:FALSEBALANCE. Slatersteven (talk) 15:22, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- Please be mindful not to use talk pages as a WP:SOAPBOX. You can disagree, but your personal political opinions are irrelevant to the discussion. That being said, Trump's lede says "Scholars and historians rank Trump one of the worst presidents in history" as that is reflective of the opinions of scholars and historians, at least for his first term. The same is said for James Buchanan and Andrew Johnson. estar8806 (talk) ★ 15:22, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- She WAS soundly defeated. That is more factual and neutral than referring to Trump lying, racist, misogynistic, and one of the worst Presidents in history, and those terms were all allowed in the lede in the Misplaced Pages article on Trump. I can understand your disappointment about the election results and voters' repudiation of the damage Harris and Biden have caused for four years and what she stands for, but you and your fellow editors and administrators shouldn't let your liberal bias continue to influence Misplaced Pages articles. TopShelf99 (talk) 15:14, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- So you do not want it to be negative, by saying she "was soundly defeated"?, Sorry that makes no sense, we say totally neutrally she lost. That is all we need to say. Slatersteven (talk) 14:56, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- Exactly - What I am suggesting is both factual and neutral. I don't want this article to be completely laudatory about Harris, and I don't want it to be completely defamatory like the Trump article. TopShelf99 (talk) 14:52, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- What's to re-write? She lost the 2024 election, that's it. GoodDay (talk) 17:19, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- Donald, is that you? In all seriousness, can we please skip to a WP:NOTHERE block? @TopShelf99's contributions since their account creation have largely been reverted or been talk page soap boxing. Certainly not enough to warrant letting them continue. Note also the warnings and discussion on their user talk page. —Locke Cole • t • c 17:39, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- wp:ani is the place to discus user conduct, not here. Slatersteven (talk) 17:46, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
Closing paragraph of “public image” section
The closing paragraph of the public image section seems either unnecessary or written in a way that talks about Trump more than Harris. While the campaign ad did talk about her, it still seems unnecessary to talk about a campaign ad for Donald Trump under a page that is not his, or to make it the central focus of a paragraph. Bluseventy2 (talk) 04:33, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
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