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Medicine Unassessed

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what about hot things that are not in combustion? one commonsly would call the injury from, say, a hot pan a burn. Is this medically incorrect? What is the difference between a burn and a scald? -- Tarquin 22:05 6 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Your points have been incorporated. -Menchi 22:13 6 Jun 2003 (UTC)

wow! that was quick! There's some sort of calculation involving body weight & percentage of skin affected by burns that is done by doctors. We should probably put this in too. -- Tarquin 22:20 6 Jun 2003 (UTC)

I think what you're thinking of is estimation of the area of burn injury (usually done from a diagram, or (roughly) estimated by the rule of 9's: 9% for face, 9% each arm, front of each leg 9%, back of each leg 9%, back 9%, front of torso 18%, back of torso 18%). If we could find a copyright-free diagram it'd be a good addition. The calculations with weight have to do with fluid replacement and probably are too specialized for here. -- Someone else 22:35 6 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Assessing burns

I'm pretty sure that the perineum is not a factor in the Rule Of Nines. --Hungoverdrawn 16:04, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Rule of 9s

This hasnt been in use in britain (apparently) for a while because it was deemed inaccurate - see St. Johns handbook or similar

Burn temperatures?

How hot does water or metal have to be in order for it to cause tissue damage? Is there some kind of approximate mathematical relationship than can describe it? For instance, if you touch a 400(F) oven rack for a split second, you'll probably get away with a minor burn, but if you somehow got your hand caught in it you'd probably get very severely burned. Likewise, how hot can bath/hot-tub water be before a person's skin begins to be scalded? Jeeves 12:56, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)

It's not a matter of temperature, but of heat. Rama 12:35, 14 July 2005 (UTC)

Perhaps adding some images to properly show the difference of a first, second and third degree burns.

Furthermore those images currently in the article, they dont appear to me to be of a second degree burn, rather first degree; im not a doctor, but i distinctly remember from my school books that a second degree burn is worse than that.

I think there should be a section on the proper treatment of second degree burns (8 Dec 2005)

Friction burns

Shouldn't there be some information on burns due to friction, since those are slightly different from normal heat burns? Retodon8 20:32, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

I agree...the pictures are not a second degree burn. Those are first. I just found that out from first hand experiance a couple of days ago.

1st or 2nd degree?

The pictured burn doesn't look to me as if it were of second degree (compare with a 2nd degree burn example here), but closer o first degree. Benzh 14:50, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

Second-degree is when you get blistering, which did occure in this case. These two photos are more here to show the evolution leading to the blister (especially that in the beginning, it does not look that bad :p) than to illustrate the blisters themselves; of course here is much more impressive, though I suspect that there are elements of 3rd degree burns there too. Rama 08:46, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

4,5,6th degree

Here, in Canada (at least ontario) there is no class 4 5 or 6 degree burns. There is nothing officaly past 3rd degree. could someone please cite where these classes are from/used? rz350 00:17, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

I have never heard of "class 4 5 or 6" either (and it's not like I am totally uninterested in the topic)... Rama 08:43, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

Based on my current anatomy class learings, and my class pressentation of the integumentary system, (the skin among other things,) I can tell you that burns are decided based on to what layer of skin it reaches: in order of superficial in internal, epidermis, dermis and subcutanious. Because there are only three layers, you can only get up to a second degree.

I've never seen those terms either. However, Google Scholar does find a few uses of the term fourth-degree burn. A reference would be good, though. -- Anon, 22 March 2006

Someone I know has suffered 4th degree burns, though I have never heard of 5th or 6th degree. Degrees 1, 2, and 3 apply to the skin burns. Once muscle, bone, and other tissues get involved it is beyond 3rd degree. Electrical burns can easily affect deeper tissues in this manner. --Vertigo

As a 3rd degree burn survivor, I can honestly say that the 4th degree designation is used when the burns reach the layers adjacent to the bone. When there is no healthy skin left after the escharotomy and the bone is exposed, it is termed a 4th degree burn. 5th and 6th degree diagnoses are rarely used as a subtype of 4th degree burns to distinguish the damage done. I will try to find documented and verifiable sources. Jimzim66 02:19, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

According to Google's summary of a medical journal (which is not accessible online), "In the fifth degree there is destruction of the muscles, and in the sixth degree burn there is charring to the bone or total gangrene." Not sure about 4th, though --Firehawk1717 21:19, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

First Aid Treatment

I have rewritten the first aid section, I am a qualified first aider(St John Singapore) and i written it with refrence to a first aid manual. I have added more info, corrected the tone, and revised some of the treatment. So can we now remove the tag saying its unencyclopedic for that section? And I only have a basic first aid certificate, and only referenced to a single manual, so if there are others who have better knowledge than me, please feel free to edit it. Fierywindz 13:01, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

The problem is more that Misplaced Pages shouldn't contain things of that nature. It should, however, fit well in Wikibooks (Sister project) on the subject of 1st aid. You can then link to it via something like {{wikibookspar}}. 68.39.174.238 22:10, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

This page could use more information about treating burns. Like how long should a person leave there hand on ice... how quickly should one get to ice etc...

The first bullet says that you shouldn't douse cold burns, and yet the cold burn section says that you should. I have no idea which is correct, but seemingly this should be corrected by someone who does. Also, it should probably be noted that medical assistance is generally not needed for any first degree burn unless further injury could occur. If burned myself on the oven and went to the ER with a red finger, they'd just be annoyed. --Ieatlint 00:21, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

At first glance, it does seem contradictory. However, there's a slight difference between dousing in water and using flowing water, which could need some clarification. --Sigma 7 06:40, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Perspective

This article seems to be written from a first aid/medical perspective. I was thinking it might be a good idea to talk about it also from a biological perspective, eg. what actually distinguishes a burn (is it cell death?), and there's also little mention of radiation burns. cyclosarin (previously raptor) 10:15, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Unsourced First Aid section

The First Aid section does not cite any sources for the information that it provides. If someone could provide valid sources, it would be a beneficial edit to make to the article.¤~Persian Poet Gal 07:28, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Friction can cause burn?

Shouldn't friction be included in the list of causes? --Xinjinbei 07:34, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Yes. I've added friction burn in two places. Carcharoth 08:05, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

And talking of other types of burns, smoke burn is a bit of an oddity. It seems to be a rare sort of burn associated with backdraft fires, or something similar. It shouldn't be confused with smoke inhalation, but I'm not quite sure enough about all this to add it to the article. Carcharoth 08:08, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

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