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Revision as of 15:18, 4 July 2007

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Guy is away. He will be back. Probably.

Guy Chapman? He's just zis Guy, you know? More about me

• JzG (talk | contribs | blocks | protects | deletions | moves | archives | privacy policy )

If you need urgent admin help please go to the incident noticeboard. To stop a vandal, try the vandal intervention page. For general help why not try the help desk? If you need me personally and it's urgent you may email me, I read all messages even if I do not reply. If next time I log on is soon enough, click this link to start a new conversation.

Terms of Service
By posting on this page you accept the JzG Terms of Service. I endeavour to satisfy good-faith requests to the best of my ability, but if you act like a dick, I will call you a dick. If you act like a troll, I will probably ignore you and may tell you to fuck off. If you want something from me, your best bet is not to demand it on pain of shopping me to ArbCom, because that way is pretty much guaranteed to piss me off to the extent that I will do whatever I can to thwart your plans. This page may contain trolling. Some of it might even be from me, but never assume trolling where a misplaced sense of humour might explain things. I can be provoked, it's not even terribly difficult. You may find, if you provoke me enough, that I will do something I later regret. Only remember, you may regret it more. I am a middle-aged surly bastard who spends his working day wrestling spammers and beating Windows with a stick, but I am capable of seeing good in the most improbable people if they don't go out of their way to make me do otherwise. Guy (Help!) 22:32, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

This user posts using a British sense of humour and does not repress those instantaneous motions of merriment.

Today was an interesting day for me, as far as Misplaced Pages is concerned. As well as exchanging emails with people spanning pretty much the entire gamut from banned trolls to Jimbo, I had a talk with Danny and another with Jeff Merkey. And you know something? Despite deep-seated differences about many things of pressing importance to the project and its future, the one thing that was never in doubt was that all of us - Jimbo, Danny, Jeff, various admins and several long-standing editors and former admins - want the same thing.

We want to build a credible online encyclopaedia.

We may disagree about how best to do that, what precisely constitutes credible, what should be done to attract the right kinds of people, how ready we should be to kick out the wrong kinds of people, but in the end there is no doubt that success is going to look pretty much the same to all of us, at least from the outside. It's going to look a lot like Misplaced Pages does right now, almost certainly with some form of stable versions (which will be a massive boon in fighting vandalism, perhaps allowing me to get back to writing articles more - this may not be altogether a good thing). It's going to have a many fewer "biographies" of kids who once did something stupid or maybe whose friends did something stupid, many fewer news stories of no lasting historical or societal consequences, a tighter focus on sourcing and good writing.

Hell, even Larry Sanger wants the same thing. Everybody who has been involved with Misplaced Pages in more than a trivial capacity seems to be fundamentally in agreement on the core objective. We have built an online encyclopaedia, we proved that could be done. Step 2 is to make it more credible. Right now it is a curate's egg - parts of it are excellent.

I suspect we all share much the same general view of the enemies of this aim. Trolls. Vandals. Abusers of the project. You can abuse the project in many ways: self-promotion, pursuing your external political or personal agenda, violating the privacy of others, harassment, perpetuating the harassment of others. There are some things it is safe to leave to other sites.

If your aim is the same as mine, then we probably are not going to have a problem getting along. And if we do, it's because we haven't had a talk a bout it. You can send me email. Guy (Help!) 19:12, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Old U.S. Congressional Reports Shed New Light on History of PRT

U.S. Congressional Reports show how PRT was used to stop rail transit planing in Minneapolis and Denver in the 1970's

ATRA Chairman Jeral Poskey makes an admission ... enjoy...Avidor 14:31, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Natalina Mathias

You have put a tag on this article so that it cannot be created. I dont mind but i think that you should not have put siliness as the reason because it is a true article and i just could not get enough information. I am a member of the Lari family as it says in the article

Helpme

Hi, I have all of the copyrights to the pictures that I am putting on Misplaced Pages. I have never put up a page before and I do not think I am citing them correctly. As a result, I have been accused of blatant copyright infringement, which isn't true. I saw that you were the person that last took down the page I created, and then blocked me from trying to edit it and fix the problem. I'm really sorry that I didn't put the page up correctly, but if you could help me I would really appreciate it!!! Thanks.

Improvised explosive device vandalism

Hello, I read the message (Please stop now) you left for me in my User Talk page. Thanks you for communicating with me. However, I must inform you that it is not my intention to vandalise or misuse Misplaced Pages. I made alteration on the Improvised explosive device and I left a message on the Discussion board. I also communicated with Parsecboy. This user simply did not reply and reverted to the previous version. I do not understand why you are asking me to stop. I will now revert back the the changes I made as it it my right as a Misplaced Pages user. I am open and welcome to any future discussion. Thank you -- ]

100 Hour Board Deletion

I had a question regarding your recent deletion (2 June 2007) of the article BYU 100 Hour Board. The reason given in the logs was "Absolutely no assertion of notability." In the protected titles for June 2007, you commented: "Massive article on a student noticeboard at Brigham Young University. Yes, really, a noticeboard. As in a bit of cork nailed to the wall."

Perhaps I can help explain why the 100 Hour Board should be considered worthy of inclusion in Misplaced Pages.

To clear up a possible misunderstanding, the 100 Hour Board is not a noticeboard. Think of it instead as something along the lines of Google Answers, except free.

We have a registered readership of 2,000 and get 1,250 unique visits per day. Although our primary reader base is composed of BYU students, we also have questioners from a wide variety of backgrounds with little or no connection to BYU. We provide a public service, and do our best to answer anyone's questions. During the school year we answer an average of 30-50 questions a day, with a slight decrease during the summer. We also currently have over 37,000 questions and answers in our archives.

Perhaps you could help me include this (or any other necessary information) so that the page can be restored. I appreciate any thoughts from you about what else would be necessary to restore the page.

Respectfully yours,

Peppergrower 18:54, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

An editor has asked for a deletion review of BYU_100_Hour_Board. Since you closed the deletion discussion for this article or speedy-deleted it, you might want to participate in the deletion review. Peter 21:58, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

myg0t deletion review

Could you please post the last request for undeletion regarding myg0t? I'm not sure what I've read was the latest one or not. --Android Mouse 06:55, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

myg0t

There appear to be some issues with the DRV close. You may want to comment. JoshuaZ 18:47, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Raul654 offered to have Charlotte's non-TOR IPs discreetly unblocked

Guy, you wrote in the CharlotteWebb evidence page:

"At the very least it should have been made possible for CW to privately request and be uncontroversially granted unblocking of any IPs which are not TOR exit nodes."

That suggests that it wasn't made possible.

Raul654 made an offer. Perhaps you missed it? See here. ElinorD (talk) 20:57, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

• Thank you. Guy (Help!) 20:59, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Barnstar

		The Barnstar of Good Humor
		I never expected to get a laugh out of reading the ArbCom page, but this cracked me up. Seraphimblade 09:49, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Jennifer Ann Crecente

You had entered the below comment in the discussion of the deletion review of the above referenced article. I posted a response there but would like the opportunity to discuss your thoughts in greater detail and so have included both your comment and my response below. The deletion review does not seem to be the appropriate venue for ad detailed conversation but I'm hopeful that you'll be comfortable with having that conversation here instead.

• Here we go again. This is another article that pretends to be a biography but isn't. If the law gets passed, it will make a fine start for an article on the law, but the case itself is a news story not an encyclopaedic biography of a person. Guy (Help!) 21:26, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment Actually there is not one, but two laws that are associated with the subject of this article and both have already passed the Texas Senate and House. One has been signed by Governor Perry and the other becomes law on Sept 1st by default. The relevant content is up above but I'll reproduce it here with emphasis added to the pertinent sections:

• On February 5, 2007, the Texas Legislature's State Representative Dawnna Dukes entered a bill to require school districts in Texas to create policies regarding Teen Dating Violence. This bill was created in memory of Jennifer Ann Crecente and Ortralla Mosley. Jennifer Ann's Group provided testimony on February 8, 2007 to the legislature in support of this bill. Governor Rick Perry signed the bill into law on May 18, 2007 and it immediately went into effect. (emphasis added)

• On February 15, 2007, on the the one-year anniversary of Jennifer's murder, Senator Eliot Shapleigh entered a bill to grant posthumous diplomas to students that have been murdered during their Senior year of high school. The bill is named "Jennifer's Law". On May 28, 2007 the bill was signed in the Senate and passed to the Governor Rick Perry for signing. It will go into effect upon being signed or September 1, 2007, whichever occurs first. (emphasis added)

As to your comment about "Here we go again." it's difficult for me to respond without more specifics. My understanding is that this is a forum to discuss not the merits of the article but instead the unilateral "speedy delete" by User Talk:TexasAndroid. Drew30319 23:02, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Drew30319 15:13, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

• It means the subject is the law, not the individual. It should be merged and redirected to the law. Guy (Help!) 18:01, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

• There currently is no article about either of the two laws. However the subject meets the guideline criteria in WP:BIO. Do you feel that more information needs to be added to create more of a "biography?" Drew30319 22:05, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

A Shot in the dark

Hello JzG, I came across you during a research quest, and your opinion on POV caught my attention. Plain English, I add a lot of material. All referenced, sourced, cited? You may not agree with it, but hey that’s Wiki. I have an editor who continues to throw in useless comments, removes referenced material, replaces it with comment, and is just a plain nuisance? They have been warned, blocked, and challenged! I have been tolerant . Is there a description or policy for this type of behaviour. From my research (reading there contributions and talk page) I am not the only one. How would you deal with it? Hoping for the best, Regards --Domer48 17:04, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Barrett

I'm going on Wikibreak in a few minutes; could you also make changes #1 and #4 from my {{editprotected}} request on Stephen Barrett per agreement of the inserting editor? You made #2, per BLP, although it was disputed, and #3 is a subtle change of wording which I think made the sentence incorrect, but probably not necessary under the editprotected guidelines. — Arthur Rubin | (talk) 15:02, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

HHO gas

Hi. Can you explain why you deleted the redirects from Aquygen and Denny Klein (but not HHO Gas or Brown's Gas, for instance)? As I I said on AN, these and other synonyms should probably be protected redirects, and the article histories should be kept for attribution reasons. If they aren't made into redirects for some reason, they should, at the very least, be salted as per their AfDs. — Omegatron 03:50, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Pardon?

How is that a privacy violation? It is rather obvious that the only person who could have known and blocked all of CharlotteWebb's IPs was a checkuser. Corroborating that with Raul's statement and the logs of all checkusers, it is easy to see that is the only person who could have blocked all 400+ of CharlotteWebb's IPs. --Iamunknown 20:12, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

• Revealing the identity of the blocking checkuser allows privacy to be compromised. Which is, I'm guessing, why CW never did so. Guy (Help!) 20:34, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
  • I'm at a loss as to how it allows privacy to be compromised, but I guess I'm glad I didn't post my evidence, seeing as it was going to be a detailed analysis of that checkuser's block log, and by posting it I would have been allowed privacy to be compromised. --Iamunknown 20:37, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

• Correct. But do feel free to email it to the arbitrators directly. Guy (Help!) 20:40, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Everyone knows by now who blocked CW's IPs, so why not just tell it? If someone wants to know CW's IP addresses, they will just look into *CENSORED*'s block log at the appropriate date and find it. SalaSkan 20:53, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

• For the record, in retrospect, I endorse JzG's actions. I was thinking earlier when I wanted to present evidence that might not be good to do so on-wiki. At any rate, I think it is best if this is dropped and/or this thread removed. --Iamunknown 20:55, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Roy Oldham

I'm not familiar with this matter, but this edit looked suspicious. Hope I got it right. Cary Bass 14:15, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Re: New Utopia

Guy, would you please comment here? Thanks, Black Falcon 16:07, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Any ideas?

Do you have any ideas for what to do about this page: User:UKPhoenix79/Bose product sightings? The last MfD closed with no consensus. It seems pretty straightforward to me but I still didn't want to renominate it right away. —ptk✰fgs 16:56, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Badlydrawnjeff

This arbitration case has now closed and the decision may be found at the link above. Badlydrawnjeff is cautioned to adhere to the letter and the spirit of the Biographies of living persons policy. Violetriga is admonished for undeleting content deleted under WP:BLP without first undergoing a full discussion to determine its appropriateness, as outlined here. Night Gyr is cautioned to avoid undeleting BLP content without going through a full discussion. For the arbitration committee, David Mestel 17:18, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Links to deleted articles

Just a reminder that it's usual to delete incoming links, especially redirects, to articles that you delete (such as Margita Bangová). violet/riga (t) 20:29, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

• Takes a while, though, and interferes with my singing practice. Guy (Help!) 20:30, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Combine the two - sing the article names. Use the keys A, F, and D. violet/riga (t) 20:40, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

• Heh! Singing Vaccai at the moment. Guy (Help!) 20:49, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Roy Oldham

Yeah, this information is all on the Tameside Council website. Have only included the NPOV bits. Have referenced it.Torch1234 21:19, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

I don't think any of the information I added is controversial. Rather than keep deleting most of the article and turning it back into a stub when people add things, wouldn't it be better to allow the article to develop naturally. The idea being that a balance will come about and be maintained without special help or intervention. There wouldn't be much left on wikipedia if we were all so quick to delete articles that don't yet meet the desired standard on sources. Torch1234 21:32, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

• No. Because what you are adding is a flagrant violation of WP:BLP. Guy (Help!) 22:08, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Can you tell me how it is biased please?Torch1234 22:37, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

• It reads as a laundry list of grudges from political opponents. Guy (Help!) 22:40, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Chris and Cru Kahui

Is it just me, or does this more resemble a WP:COATRACK than it does a biography? And yes, it survived an AFD in November. --Calton | Talk 14:14, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Dwsolo

Hi Guy I don't understand what you are doing to me. I am adding links to free recordings of performances of music referred to in Misplaced Pages (which you said on 29th June 2007 in the personal profile of my wiki persona dwsolo would be "most welcome") and yet you are deleting them! Please explain. Please look at my site (well one of them) at www.dwschorale.com and explain why you have objections to them being linked to from wikipedia - in particular in view of the fact that many people have downloaded the free mp3s of performances over the past few months directly from the wikipeda pages, which shows that there is genuine interest

You can reply to me direct at solomons8 yahoodotcodotuk Thanks David

• You are adding links to your own website. If you want to upload free content, please do, but only if you have the full rights to the performance (including any accompaniment). Guy (Help!) 20:54, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

I am adding links to my own website - well obviously, I don't have rights to music on other people's sites! - those on my site are the recordings to which I DO HAVE full rights, in that I sang them (all the voice parts) I created the accompaniment (where there is any) and the music is either in the public domain or my own compositions or arrangements or compositions by friends who have given me permission to perform and record them. Furthermore you have deleted my name from the Delian Society page. WHY????? I am a member of the Delian Society. Thirdly was it you who removed Jean Chatillon's Misplaced Pages article about me? If so, I am getting the impression that you have something personal against me. David

• Do not add links to our own website. It is considered spamming. I have nothign against you, I do have something against people adding links to their own websites. Guy (Help!) 11:24, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

You allow links to external websites, whether professional or not. Where do you draw the line? Is is necessary for someone else to add links to my performances? Or would you delete those as well. And if so why, since they would then be added by some who doesn't own the website in question? Also who keeps deleting my name from the Delian Society page??? There's no link to an external website of mine there.

You add your website, we call it WP:SPAM.

You add your name, we call it WP:VAIN

You appear to be attempting to use Misplaced Pages for self-promotion. Please don't. Guy (Help!) 15:13, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

WP:BLP and Jeff Merkey

I already made some grammatical changes. Nothing controversial, so nobody panic, OK?

On 12 June 2007, you removed a section of content from Jeff Merkey's bio, with the note "That is a terrible source, polemical and not in the least bit scholarly. We have a better source already for the same information." I have come to agree with you on this point: because scofacts.org is very biased (probably since the operator of the site was one of the people sued by Merkey), links to pages at scofacts.org should not be in the article, on grounds of NPOV.

However, you did not replace the information you deleted with the "better source" to which you referred, nor name that better source, so I don't quite understand your edit summary. Can you please explain?

The Groklaw reader in me wants to see the actual court document, and it is very useful in understanding the claim. The article as it stands today says "various charges concerning harassment," but harassment is actually the least of the charges made - treason, support of terrorism and solicitation of murder among them. Without more explanation, it is difficult to get a better understanding of the basis of the suit. And explanation without a source is impermissible, so what better source that the very document that Merkey himself wrote?

I would like to re-add a link to the actual court document. It is available on a few websites, almost all of them biased against Merkey, some much worse than others. Perhaps a statement in the footnote explaining that the hosting site is biased would balance that a bit more? I also noticed that ip-wars.net is already used as a source, and the court document is also hosted there, so does that count as a "better source" to re-add a direct link to the court document?

The other source removed was lwn.net, where the original comment was made that formed part of the basis of the lawsuit. lwn.net directly commented on this claim. Do you consider this site as polemical and un-scholarly as scofacts.org? The court document presents one side of the story regarding Bruce Perens' comment; lwn.net presents the other, and not with the kind of vitriol and mocking that you find on scofacts.org. So this would seem like an acceptable source, at least to me.

Also, the final resolution of Merkey's re-opening of the case against Al Petrofsky is available, though I believe only from Petrofsky's site. Stating that the "case re-opened" without explaining whether it's still open or what the resolution was kind of leaves the reader hanging. I think it would be informative to state (with cite, naturally) the final resolution of the case.

I'm interested to hear your thoughts and comments on each of these points. Thanks. Pfagerburg 04:38, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

When should a talk page be deleted?

I noticed your deletion of Margita Bangová, but noticed that the talk page is still there at Talk:Margita Bangová. Should that be kept, or will it eventually be deleted? I noticed that the presence of the WPBiography template and its rating means that the article is still listed in the WPBiography assessment lists (for now at Misplaced Pages:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Biography articles by quality/131). Also, the following on the talk page documented that the article had been cited in a newspaper - is that sort of thing normally kept somewhere if an article is deleted?

This page has been mentioned by a media organization: Leo, Peter (4 August 2005). "Panhandling for fun and profit". Pittsburgh Post-Gazette.

Actually, the newspaper cite is linked, in the "details" bit above, to Misplaced Pages:Misplaced Pages as a press source 2005#August 2005, so the talk page template can be dumped if the rest of the page is deleted. But what about the discussion on the talk page? What do you think? Carcharoth 15:18, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

• Misplaced Pages pages referenced by the press