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On January 21, 2009, the Arbitration Committee opened a Request for Comment regarding arbitration enforcement, including a review of general and discretionary sanctions. The RfC is still open for comment and all editors are encouraged to comment and contribute. The RfC will close at 02:00 UTC on February 21, 2009.

VartanM

VartanM (talk · contribs) has been placed on editing restriction back in December 2007: , which limited him to 1rv per week. That restriction was indefinite, as per comment of Seraphimblade here: If there's no time limit set for such a restriction, then it is indefinite. In case of VartanM, he was on unlimited restriction. Recently he was blocked for violation of 1 rv per week restriction, , and also placed again on indefinite 1RR: But he continues to violate his parole, this time on the article Lingua franca, where he made 3 rvs withing the last week, of them 2 yesterday: Also note that while civility supervision was part of his original parole, the first 2 reverts have extremely incivil edit summaries. Grandmaster 06:39, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

How many reverts did Parishan make? Lets count those. VartanM (talk) 07:47, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

And another 2 rvs by VartanM in the article Nakhchivan: , second one after VartanM responded to this report above. Please check his recent contribs, plenty of edit warring on various articles. Grandmaster 08:56, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

You don't have to be an idiot to see, that Brandmaister was baiting me, and I gladly took that bait. Intelligent admins are required to see whats going on. VartanM (talk) 09:11, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Here is more...One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight reverts in the same article starting from January by Parishan, against three different established users. That's a lot of revert's don't you think? VartanM (talk) 09:20, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Parishan is just about edit-warring, but he is not on restriction as far as I can see. Vartan is on restriction, and has violated the restriction several times since his last block, with added incivility — as when he told Parishan to Stop acting retarded. I think we're looking at a 48 to 72 hour block for Vartan (standard 48 + more for incivility, multiple violations, and recentness of re-offending). We can considered whether or not to add Parishan to the restriction, though on a quick review I don't see anything he's done recently that would merit adding him. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 09:49, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

User:NoCal100 WP:WARing and WP:HOUNDing over several articles

Admin note: This report is not signed. Please sign it and remove this note. If the report remains unsigned, it may be closed without action.  Sandstein  23:18, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

• Who: NoCal100 (talk · contribs)
• What: WP:HOUNDing, following editors around and trying to engage them in WP:WARing and WP:IDIDNTHEARTHAT, taking a lost argument to other pages.
• ArbCom case: Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Palestine-Israel articles, User:NoCal100 has been notified of the editing restrictions here.
• Diffs: , , ,

Background: A while ago, a discussion started on Talk:Israeli settlement regarding the use of "Judea" and "Samaria" to describe the northern and southern West Bank. Without getting into the specifics, proponents of the terms, to whom User:NoCal100 belongs, have produced several sources using the term whereas the opponents, to which I belong, have produced several sources stating that the terms are politically motivated and used only inside Israel. The discussion at Talk:Israeli settlement ended with the terms "Judea" and "Samaria" being moved to a separate section labeled "Terminology" where they are presented as terms preferred by annexationists.

What's going on now: Yesterday I did a search for articles using "Samaria" as a gographical toponym and replaced several instances with the term "northern West Bank" (I left all instances of "Samaria hills" and "Samaria mountains" as the hills and mountains are indeed known only by those names). Today, User:NoCal100 shows up on three of these articles, Aryeh Eldad, Ya'akov Katz and Elkana, to revert me.

Why do I have a problem with this: There are several reasons why I am absolutely not OK with this:

• User:NoCal100 has been accused and warned of WP:HOUNDing and WP:WARing before. The three above-mentioned articles had never been touched by him and I'm guessing he would be hard-pressed to show how he got there if not by following my contributions.
• User:NoCal100 argues as if there had never been a larger discussion on the subject, or just doesn't argue at all (e.g. the edit summary "more precise"). This argument had already been lost and User:NoCal100 is trying to start it up elsewhere.
• The same behavious by User:NoCal100 on exactly the same subject recently caused User:Nickhh to blow his top, subsequently getting him blocked. This kind of WP:WARing is not helping the project in generally and not helping the state of the IP-articles specifically.

Suggested measures: User:NoCal100 should get at least a stern and final warning not to follow other editors around and WP:WAR against them or preferably a ban on edits regarding the use of "Judea" or "Samaria".

I'm pretty sympathetic to victims of wikihounding -- funny you should mention Nickhh in that regard, as he certainly did that to me, and I can think of about 4 or 5 other editors who had similar problems with him. Nothing was done about it -- and it'd be pretty amazing if Nick could complain he was driven off the project (and forced to emit a stream of filthy abuse), by the same tactics he himself employed. I wish the culture were different on this point, but it isn't. As for edit-warring, I took a look at some of those articles, and it seems as though you're edit-warring as well, no? IronDuke 16:09, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Me? No. When I went through the list of Samaria-using articles I explicitly avoided those on which discussions/WP:WARs were under way. I re-reverted on one of them and started a thread on the talk-page. Is that the WP:WAR you are referring to? If not, you're going to have to be a bit more specific.

Oh, and this is not about User:Nickhh, I only used him as an example of User:NoCal100 WP:HOUNDing somebody else too.

Cheers, pedrito - talk - 18.02.2009 16:14

You're quite right, this isn't about Nick -- I was merely pointing out a small irony there (and word to the wise, he might not be the best example to use). As for edit-warring, perhaps I made a mistake. Here I see NoCal making two reverts and you making two reverts. Here I see you making two reverts again, and NoCal making only one (is one revert an edit-war?). Here I see one revert apiece. Do I have that right? Cheers. IronDuke 16:33, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Yup. What you see is User:NoCal100 running to three pages he's never edited before to pick an edit-war he's already lost elsewhere. That's what this is about.

Cheers, pedrito - talk - 18.02.2009 16:37

Which brings me back to my initial point: it taks two to edit-war, and by my count you've done it (slightly) more than NoCal in the articles you link to. Did you want some sort of remedy for the both of you? IronDuke 16:39, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

I'm looking for a remedy for the WP:HOUNDing and the WP:IDIDNTHEARTHAT, which is what I suggested farther up (see Suggested measures:). What you left out was the chronology of User:NoCal100 reverting me first, but that's not a WP:WAR quite yet, but User:NoCal100 looking for one, yet again.

Cheers and hope that cleared it up, pedrito - talk - 18.02.2009 16:44

Your above statement does not appear to be factually correct. Looking at this diff, it appears that the first action in this series of reverts and counter-reverts was YOU reverting NoCal100, on an article you had never before edited, which would seem to me like you stalked him there. So, if you are looking for a remedy for the WP:HOUNDing, I assume you would accept that any remedy applied to NoCal100 would apply equally to you? Canadian Monkey (talk) 22:42, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Not sure what you mean by "cleared it up." I addressed the hound allegations already (the sad reality of no one caring). And you really think action is going to be taken on WP:IDIDNTHEARTHAT? Can I bet you five bucks it won't, now or on any issue? IronDuke 22:40, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Hearty cheers to everyone, but this is really a much ado about nothing. WP:HOUND is not intended for situations in which the same exact fundamental disagreement applies to multiple articles. There's nothing to indicate that NoCal is intending to "creating irritation, annoyance or distress to the other editor", per WP:HOUND. Indeed, such allegations would not be in good faith. It's merely the same disagreement that extends to other articles. If we're going to worry about "following", we might want to look into a number of editros who seem to have an unhealthy obsession with the edits of User:Jayjg.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 17:31, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

I have to second this. I think a lot of people on all sides of the IP issues get... followed... to some extent by others, but Jay seems to have the biggest fan club of stalkers. I wonder if people who are, or can be reasonably characterized as, pro-Palestinian would "police their own" and tell their fellow editors to stop? IronDuke 22:43, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Pretty much all those described as "pro-Israel" have atleast one stalker. Which leads to my complaint - why am I the only one without a stalker? I want a stalker! --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 22:59, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Dude, jeez... I'll stalk you, if you really want. What edit of yours should I revert first? ;) IronDuke 23:31, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Here's my advice Brewcrewer. Become an extremely prolific and influential editor; get admin and checkuser powers; keep your edits fiercely nationalistic; keep your policy rationales variable, specious, ad hoc, and contradictory; work on developing a more peremptory, imperious, and papal tone toward editors who disagree with you; make hair-trigger edit-warring as basic to your idiom of self-expression as iambic pentameter was to Alexander Pope's; and most importantly, make a 100+ edits a day to dozens of articles on all aspects of the Middle East conflict. Make yourself ubiquitous in that area, and take up any partisan angle you can find within it, no matter how silly. Then, if in your ceaseless, vigilantly ideological patrol of that extensive beat, you find yourself having a number of arguments with the same editors, you'll be in a position to accuse those editors of "stalking" you; with any luck, a fool or two might even believe it.--G-Dett (talk) 23:49, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

It should be WP policy - all diatribes/rants must be funny. I made the mistake of eating ices while reading your comment and parts of the ices went up into my nose. Disgusting. But getting serious for a second - are you really suggesting that anyone who believes User:Pedrito's stalking claim is a "fool"? That's a bit much I think.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 00:05, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Sorry about your nose! Is NoCal100 accused of stalking an extremely prolific and influential admin making hundreds of edits daily across dozens of Middle-East-related articles?--G-Dett (talk) 00:19, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

No, but it sounds like you think you're being accused.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 00:23, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Yes.--G-Dett (talk) 00:41, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Is it your posiiton, then, that Jayjg has never been stalked by any IP editor? IronDuke 00:58, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Oh, no, that's not my position at all. I haven't seen enough to say, but I'm sure he has been stalked by IPs. He's accused me of stalking him, and others (including admins) have implied that they take it seriously. If you were talking about random IPs, please forgive me, I misunderstood.--G-Dett (talk) 01:03, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification. I guess my point is, if even Jay can't get the behavior to stop when it's serious, there's not much hope for, say, Pedrito, complaining about a much less serious issue (about which he appears to be guilty as well). IronDuke 01:06, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

That's a fair point, IronDuke; sorry if I was unduly defensive.--G-Dett (talk) 01:08, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

No, not all, no worries. And BC is correct, your posts are often funny, though it's just possible you might be being a teensy weensy little bit hard on Jay. IronDuke 01:25, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

What's more troubling is the fact that editors who can't get their hip cool neologisms shoved into Judea and Samaria, Israeli Settlement, etc., go to these little stubs and bios and try to do the very same consensus-violative edits that they were unable to do at the parent article. If there's a consensus or lack of consensus at one article it should clearly apply to other sub-articles with the same exact issues. Editors should not edit violate a consensus or non-consensus and then cry WP:HOUND when they are reverted. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 18:10, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

The "hip cool neologism" Brewcrewer is referring to is the term "West Bank," when accompanied by the adjective "northern." When the New York Times, Haaretz, CNN, the Washington Post, the Los Angeles Times, USA Today, and scores of other sources say that "Samaria is the biblical name for the northern West Bank," he thinks they are introducing a hip cool neologism; and when editors rely on the overwhelming terminological consensus among top-notch mainstream reliable sources, they too are employing a hip cool neologism.

And Brewcrewer's screwball misunderstanding of the term "neologism" isn't even the most desperate or bankrupt piece of wikilawyering being peddled by teamplayers in the current Judea-and-Samaria-are-standard-accepted-current-geographic-terms hoax. For connoisseurs of BS, really, this hoax is not to be missed.--G-Dett (talk) 20:55, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

D-Gett: This is not the forum for you to call my points a "bankrupt piece of wikilawyering" or "screwbally" and for me to point out that the reliable sources don't really support your POV and that your psuedo-complex grammar antilogarithms can't change the plain meaning of a daily newspaper article. What has to be figured out at this forum is who should be sanctioned? The editor that unilaterally changes articles knowing that there is no consensus for these changes or the editor that reverts to the original version.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 22:06, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

The Judea-and-Samaria-are-standard-accepted-current-geographic-terms hoax has reached such proportions that the AN/I board is indeed an appropriate place to address it.

Your endlessly repeated mischaracterization of "northern West Bank" as a "neologism" is a good example of the sort of systematic, Orwellian abuse of ordinary language that is at the very heart of the hoax.--G-Dett (talk) 22:21, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

This isn't the AN/I board. IronDuke 22:41, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Comment - Unfortunately, this same stalking/hounding by the same user came up less than a month ago. We're beginning to see a pattern here. Tarc (talk) 17:46, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

The phrase User:Pedrito is looking for is Chutzpah. Having hounded me to an article which kicked off his recent spree of edits - , and to several others (, ), having edit warred with numerous other editor over his recent changes , - he somehow finds it possible to come here and complain about edit warring and hounding. Anyway: WP:HOUND is pretty explicit on this matter: 'Proper use of an editor's history includes (but is not limited to) fixing errors or violations of Misplaced Pages policy or correcting related problems on multiple articles' - which is exactly what I have been doing. NoCal100 (talk) 19:41, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

• What "errors or violations of Misplaced Pages policy" have you been correcting? Because, as a completely uninvolved admin, all I see is you changing commonly-used geographical names to little-used ones - which would, ironically, be against Misplaced Pages policy... Black Kite 21:45, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

The policy violation is WP:CONSENSUS. See Talk:Israeli settlement. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 21:50, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

....where there is clearly no consensus whatsoever. Black Kite 21:55, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Exactly. Pedrito changed the articles despite the lack of consensus for the changes. Nocal reverted to the original version.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 22:06, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Why would one need consensus to alter geographical place names to their most commonly known forms? (Yeah, sounds like a naive question on an IP article I know, but ...). Alternatively, why not use "Northern West Bank/Samaria" or suchlike? Black Kite 22:18, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

That is quite a reasonable suggestion, but please note that it is exactly this "Northern West Bank/Samaria" terminology that Pedrito has been removing from multiple articles: , , Canadian Monkey (talk) 23:44, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

While "Westbank" is quite commonly used, "northern West Bank" is not as commonly used as "Samaria" and "southern West Bank" is not as commonly used as "Judea." I don't know where you're from so forgive me for using New York as an analogy, but it's like calling the area of northeast Manhattan "northeast Manhattan" instead of Harlem. As for your suggestion, I actually did make such a proposal at the Israeli Settlement talk page but it was shot down with the same insults I got here at this talkpage.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 22:27, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

If the term Harlem were (a) an intensely controversial designation, with strong religious-nationalist overtones, for northeast Manhattan, hence a term (b) almost entirely avoided by mainstream reliable sources, who for their part (c) tended to accompany even their very rare uses of the term with an explanation that "Harlem is a name for northeast Manhattan," then Brewcrewer would have a relevant and serious point here. But it's not, and he doesn't.--G-Dett (talk) 22:37, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Though the main policy-related points have already been covered by previous editors, it is worthwhile to review them:

• Pedrito claims to be a victim of hounding. However, WP:HOUND states that it is quite appropriate to track a user’s contribution history in order to correct related problems on multiple articles. Specifically, it says “Proper use of an editor's history includes (but is not limited to) fixing errors or violations of Misplaced Pages policy or correcting related problems on multiple articles. In fact, such practices are recommended". As Pedrito’s edit history clearly shows, as well as by his own admission here, he has been systematically removing the term “Samaria” from multiple articles. Thus, to use his contribution history in order to restore the term “Samaria” to those articles is perfectly acceptable under WP:HOUND. There is no policy issue here whatsoever.
• Pedrito himself appears to have WP:HOUNDed NoCal100 to several articles he had never edited before , , ), and reverted him or otherwise opposed him on Talk pages. So, to the extent that NoCall100’s behavior runs afoul of WP:HOUND, so does Pedrito’s.
• Pedrito further complains of edit warring, but even a cursory glance at the relevant edit histories shows he has been a far more active edit warrior than NoCal – At Elkana, he reverted 3 times, against 2 different editors, while NoCal reverted once. At ], he reverted twice to Nocal’s one revert, and at Aryeh Eldad they both reverted twice. None of these mini edit wars seems to be worthy of any sanction, but to the extent that NoCal is edit warring there, clearly Pedrito is as well, and to a broader extent.
• At least one of the participants in this discussion, User:G-Dett, has made a wikipedia editing career out of compulsive and habitual WP:HOUNDing of User:Jayjg. One would be hard pressed to find even a dozen article she has edited which were NOT articles that she had followed Jayjg to, in order to revert him. It takes some gall for her to complain of someone else’s alleged hounding, as it does for Pedrito. It is also more than a tad ironic for Pedrito to bring up the case of User:Nickhh in this context – a WP:HOUNDer whose own hounding has been discussed (and casually dismissed) on WP:ANI not too long ago

In summary: Perhaps a reminder to ALL involved to attempt dispute resolution before running to WP:AE with ill-founded accusations of misbehavior, but seriously, nothing to see here. Canadian Monkey (talk) 23:12, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Any long-running I-P editor chanting "nothing to see here" really shouldn't be a part of this discussion, as their objectivity in the matter is, shall we say, suspect. Pedrito brought a matter to AE, Nocal certainly has a right to defend himself, but most of the rest of this is just continuations of grudges from elsewhere. Let the matter be looked into by the appropriate powers, and let's cut the rest of the eDrama, eh? Tarc (talk) 00:09, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Wouldn't that process involve deleting your own posts? IronDuke 00:46, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Since I was adding valid evidence of similar past actions by this same user, um, no, it would not. Nice try though. Tarc (talk) 13:58, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Ah. So you are in the category of editors whose "objectivity" is above suspicion then? (I'll give you a barnstar if you can say "yes" with a straight face). IronDuke 00:52, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

• Doesn't look like there's anything actionable here - there's a content dispute over naming that's now apparently spreading rapidly through a number of articles. Both of you were (kind of) edit warring and it looks like the appearing at articles together is more about the naming dispute than someone being followed. This particular dispute could really use some dispute resolution like RfCs or even an informal mediation - these two aren't the only ones edit warring over it. Shell 04:52, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Just got in this morning to read all this, and it looks like there are some things that need clearing up. First and foremost, User:NoCal100's (and User:Canadian Monkey's) accusation that I stalked him. The three edits in question are

• 12:28, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Barkan ‎ (Undid revision 271261947 by NoCal100 (talk) why take this fight here? get a grip...)
• 15:03, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Rimonim ‎ (→"West Bank region of Samaria"?: nope)
• 16:27, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Ma'ale Shomron ‎ (→Terminology: reply)

The first edit was the first instance of "Samaria" I had found using Misplaced Pages's own search engine and is closely followed by a series of similar edits. These edits all occur in the order in which the results showed up in the search. The fact that the first edit landed on User:NoCal100 is a coincidence, yet not such a surprising one since he seems somewhat obsessed with all things Samarian.

The other two accusations are laughable considering

• 12:43, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Rimonim ‎ (remove uncommon geographical location) (top)

i.e. I had edited the page myself a few hours ago and put it on my Watchlist. Ma'ale Shomron was added to my Watchlist after I saw that User:Nickhh got blocked. I had followed the link from his talk page. I answered on both pages after, apparently, User:NoCal100 had followed User:MeteorMaker there (and to about 20 other pages), to engage him. Here's a short excerpt from his Contributions:

• 15:08, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Mevo Dotan ‎ (→"The northern Samarian part of the West Bank")
• 15:07, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Ma'ale Shomron ‎ (→Terminology)
• 15:05, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Barkan ‎ (→"West Bank region of Samaria"?)
• 15:04, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Karnei Shomron ‎ (→"Western Samaria region of the West Bank"?)
• 15:04, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Kiryat Netafim ‎ (top)
• 15:04, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Alfei Menashe ‎
• 15:03, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Immanuel (town) ‎
• 15:03, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Alon, Mateh Binyamin ‎
• 15:03, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Nofim ‎
• 15:02, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Einav ‎
• 15:02, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Hinanit ‎
• 15:01, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Rechelim ‎
• 15:01, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Peduel ‎
• 15:01, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Sahl Arraba ‎
• 15:00, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Rimonim ‎
• 15:00, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Givat Harel ‎
• 15:00, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Pisgat Ya'acov ‎
• 14:59, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Migdalim ‎

Compare these to User:MeteorMaker's Contributions

• 10:19, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Migdalim ‎ (→"Samarian part of the West Bank"?: new section)
• 10:18, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Pisgat Ya'acov ‎ (→"Samaria"?: new section)
• 10:17, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Givat Harel ‎ (→"The Samarian part of the West Bank"?: new section)
• 10:17, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) N Talk:Rimonim ‎ ("West Bank region of Samaria"?)
• 10:16, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Sahl Arraba ‎ (→"Northern Samaria"?: new section)
• 10:15, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Peduel ‎ (→"Samarian region of the West Bank"?: new section)
• 10:15, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Rechelim ‎ (→"Samarian part of the West Bank"?: new section)
• 10:14, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Hinanit ‎ (→"Northern Samaria"?: new section)
• 10:14, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Einav ‎ (→"Samarian region of the West Bank"?: new section)
• 10:13, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) N Talk:Nofim ‎ ("Samaria"?)
• 10:12, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Alon, Mateh Binyamin ‎ (→"Samaria"?: new section)
• 10:11, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Immanuel (town) ‎ (→"Samaria, West Bank"?: new section)
• 10:10, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Alfei Menashe ‎ (→"Samaria in the central West Bank"?: new section)
• 10:10, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Kiryat Netafim ‎ (→"West Bank region of Samaria"?: new section)
• 10:09, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Karnei Shomron ‎ (→"Western Samaria region of the West Bank"?: new section)
• 10:04, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Barkan ‎ (→"West Bank region of Samaria"?: new section)
• 10:01, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Ma'ale Shomron ‎ (→Terminology)
• 09:59, 17 February 2009 (hist) (diff) Talk:Mevo Dotan ‎ (→"The northern Samarian part of the West Bank": new section)

Notice the exact reverse order? That's User:NoCal100 clicking himself through User:MeteorMaker's contributions list.

In summary, while User:NoCal100 was WP:HOUNDing User:MeteorMaker, he popped up on my Watchlist, amongst others on pages I had recently edited. Sorry, no stalking on my part, but more proof of User:NoCal100 doing so.

Cheers, pedrito - talk - 19.02.2009 07:59

Point 1 - there is no doubt that NoCal100 followed Meteormaker to all those talk pages, to reply to a comment which he had made. Now, if (for example) NoCal100 had followed round Meteormaker to 20 article pages to revert a good-faith change he made, that would fairly clearly be against WP:HOUND and would probably be block-worthy. However, replying to talk page comments probably isn't, regardless of the (shaky in my opinion - there must be more than one map or RS available) rationale that NoCal100 uses to justify the use of the term "Samaria". This isn't blockable.

Point 2, made above - As Pedrito’s edit history clearly shows ... he has been systematically removing the term “Samaria” from multiple articles. Thus, to use his contribution history in order to restore the term “Samaria” to those articles is perfectly acceptable under WP:HOUND. No - no, it isn't. That part of WP:HOUND exists to allow editors to use contrib histories to revert clear breaches of policy on multiple articles - it does not exist to allow people to edit-war, which is what is happening here. If evidence is shown here of that type of edit-history re-occurring, regardless of which "side" is doing it, I would certainly be inclined to issue block(s) for it, as I know many other admins would. Black Kite 13:46, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

You are not quoting what WP:HOUND actually says, which is simply: "Proper use of an editor's history includes (but is not limited to) fixing errors or violations of Misplaced Pages policy or correcting related problems on multiple articles" - There is nothing there about clear breaches of policy. You may think my rational is "shaky", but that is a content dispute, and WP:HOUND explicitly allows to do this. NoCal100 (talk) 14:43, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

You are wrong. "Fixing errors" means fixing obvious errors, such as spelling, hoaxes, or obvious misinformation, not information that is contentious. In other words, if you think it's an error, but others don't, then it isn't an "obvious error". It's edit-warring. Don't do it. (And that applies to all "sides", clearly). Yes, the rationale is a content dispute, and irrelevant here. Black Kite 15:01, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

I don't think I'm wrong, and I note that your personal interpretation - that we're talking about 'obvious' errors such a spelling errors is not actually found in the the text. Perhaps the powers that be should clarify what is meant, for future reference. I agree with you that this is edit warring, on a small scale, - edit warring that Pedrito is just as guilty of. NoCal100 (talk) 15:07, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

If it's not an obvious error, then clearly it must be edit-warring, and yes, more than one person has been guilty of this. I am saying to everyone - don't do this. Black Kite 15:13, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

with this I agree. I have disengaged from the related content dispute. NoCal100 (talk) 15:22, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Well, my complaint is the re-occurrence. As User:Tarc pointed out, this already happened before (see here).

Even just recently, User:NoCal100 chased User:Nickhh and User:MeteorMaker to Ma'ale Shomron, Mevo Dotan and Barkan (as the edit histories show, those were his first edits there, in rapid sequence, after User:Nickhh's reverts).

Cheers, pedrito - talk - 19.02.2009 14:03

Yes, and I'm saying that the following round to talkpages to leave a reply to someone else's similar comments isn't disruptive. A repetition of the behaviour you mention above would be, but this isn't it. Black Kite 15:03, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I probably wasn't clear enough in my last post -- in the above recent examples, User:NoCal100 followed User:Tarc, User:MeteorMaker and User:Nickhh to article pages and reverted them. I had gotten you point that following people to talk pages is in no way evil, but this was never about talk pages, the longer list above was just demonstrative.

Cheers and sorry for the confusion, pedrito - talk - 19.02.2009 15:07

Yes - see my point to NoCal100 above. I think this conversation is enough to establish to everyone here that if any further edit warring and/or disruption occurs which can be linked to following contrib histories, then we can safely assume that such behaviour will be blockable. If other admins believe that the above is blockable now then so be it, but personally I am happy to draw a line here and say that any further issues of the same sort will be sanctionable. Black Kite 15:13, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Ok, although I don't really believe that this will be the final "final" warning, I guess I'll have to live with it. Cheers and thanks, pedrito - talk - 19.02.2009 15:24

Ohconfucius has resumed date delinking in violation of the injunction

See these edits to the Edger Christopher Cookson article and these edits to the William Harold Coltman article. This is not the first time he has violated the injunction. Tennis expert (talk) 07:01, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

This seems to be limited to a handful of articles, usually in combination with edits that make other changes. These actions seem clearly outside of the injunction against mass/automated (de)linking. Vassyana (talk) 07:07, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Other articles that he has date delinked in the last couple of days: Joseph Henry Collin, John Stanhope Collings-Wells, George William Burdett Clare, William Clamp, Geoffrey Cather, George Edward Cates, List of Cabinets of Iceland, and Nelson Victor Carter. Tennis expert (talk) 07:11, 18 February 2009 (UTC) He was blocked for 48 hours earlier this month for violating the injunction in precisely this way. And see this apology from him, where he explicitly acknowledged that manual delinking was covered by the injunction. Tennis expert (talk) 07:15, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

I will alert other arbs to this evidence and solicit their opinions. Vassyana (talk) 07:23, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Two more: John Henry Carless and Marjorie Yang. Tennis expert (talk) 07:25, 18 February 2009 (UTC) Two more: Frederick William Campbell and John Fitzhardinge Paul Butler. Tennis expert (talk) 07:31, 18 February 2009 (UTC) Just a few more (I've looked back to his edits of the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising article but no further): John Crawford Buchan, William Buckingham, Walter Ernest Brown, Harry Brown (VC), Jean Brillant, Roland Boys Bradford, George Nicholson Bradford, and Stanley Henry Parry Boughey. Tennis expert (talk) 07:39, 18 February 2009 (UTC) And another he just did: Gabriel Coury. Tennis expert (talk) 07:42, 18 February 2009 (UTC) It appears he started the date delinking only a few days after his previous blocked ended: David McAllister (politician). Tennis expert (talk) 07:54, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Ohconfucius has advised me that he audits dates in not more than one article a day. Please note that it has been established (?here) that it is only mass delinking that is covered by the injunction. FA and FL nominees, who regularly delink, would rebel if suddenly they were not allowed to use a script to adhere to the guideline. Ah, those editors, BTW, who are among our most serious and professional contributors to articles, seem to be very happy with the guide lines in this respect. Tony (talk) 08:01, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Another article he just date delinked: John Bernard Croak. By my count, that's at least 10 articles in the last 24 hours. Tennis expert (talk) 08:14, 18 February 2009 (UTC) Make that 11: Victor Crutchley. Tennis expert (talk) 08:28, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

His alternative account, Date delinker, also has been blocked for violating the injunction since January 30, 2009. Tennis expert (talk) 08:21, 18 February 2009 (UTC) See this on the arbitration workshop subpage and this on the arbitration enforcement page. Tennis expert (talk) 10:33, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Before the usual vultures start to descend, it would be as well to look closely at the articles TE has identified, not just take his word for it. If you do, you'll find (from the sample I've looked at) that the small number of dates in each article were delinked there as part of an extensive revision and expansion of those articles, which has improved them immeasurably. We should thank OC for continung to do such fine work in the face of such implacable hostility. Colonies Chris (talk) 08:58, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Well, then, I wonder how you would rationalize these edits. Tennis expert (talk) 09:00, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

I have looked at the last several edits Ohconfucius has made to article space. He seems to be significantly improving and revising articles, and not linking the dates when he rewrites. That is not in violation of the date delinking injunction. Colonies Chris is correct. He has not edited frequently enough to be considered carrying out mass delinking. Risker (talk) 09:07, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

• It appears that the plaintiff has not heard what Vassyana has said, and keeps hammering on about it as if shouting louder will get his voice heard and get me blocked once again. I would take the opportunity to remind ARBCOM that this climbing of the Reichstag is EXACTLY the kind of sorry and pedantic behaviour that I (and many other) have been subjected to since the beginning of this saga in August. Just because I previously violated the injunction does not mean I am doing it again now - I have learned my lesson, and have no wish to waste any more time on this case (did I ever mention that I have lost all confidence in it?). I am doing some serious editing by expanding articles, and delinking articles in compliance with WP:MOSNUM, and it would appear that the plaintiff is attempting to stop me working on WP altogether. I am just sick and tired of his endless stalking and harassment. Ohconfucius (talk) 09:09, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

• Risker, just to clarify the extent of the injunction, you're saying it's OK to mass delink one article like Ohconfucius did here so long as you're not doing, say, two articles? It appears that you're saying the scope of the injunction has changed since Ohconfucius and Date delinker were last blocked even though the wording of the injunction itself has not. Notice that Ohconfucius has just admitted that one of his goals is to delink articles in accordance with the Manual of Style even though this arbitration is still pending. Tennis expert (talk) 09:14, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

• Why don't you just give it a break?? Have you no life to get on with? Ohconfucius (talk) 09:19, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Here is an example barely 10 minutes old of Ohconfucius's date delinking an article for no significant purpose other than the delinking. Tennis expert (talk) 10:26, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Uh... the purpose was to use Australian date styles. --NE2 10:37, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

That was what his misleading edit summary said. Notice, for example, in his edit the delinking of "November 2008" without changing anything else. And he was certainly capable of adjusting the dates to Australian order without delinking them. Tennis expert (talk) 10:42, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Delinking is fine if other constructive edits are made, you know... --NE2 10:45, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

No, I don't know that. What is your source? I suppose date linking would be fine, too, if "other constructive edits are made", whatever that means. Tennis expert (talk) 10:49, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Will Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for arbitration#Question about date delinking injunction do? --NE2 10:55, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Comment For the benefits of those who may not realise, this discussion thread was moved from WT:ARBCOM, so it has been underneath their noses and around all the houses. Vassyana and Risker are both members of ARBCOM. Ohconfucius (talk) 13:46, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Let's take a look at this edit made to List of Cabinets of Iceland by Ohconfucius on February 17, 2009. I counted 93 dates that he delinked without making even one other kind of edit. No date order change. No other "constructive" or unconstructive edit of any kind. How does that not violate the injunction? How is that any different than the edits made earlier this year that earned blocks for both of his accounts, one of which is continuing until the end of the arbitration? Tennis expert (talk) 05:30, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Any reason this hasn't been closed, please? Tony (talk) 09:16, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

• yes, indeed. I have already drawn the clerk's attention to it. Ohconfucius (talk) 09:44, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Ohconfucious violating date delinking injunction (again)

Ohconfucius has continued to make edits delinking dates using his main account, Ohconfucius (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · block user · block log) (see contribution history; a random example is provided at the Arbitration talk page), in contravention of the temporary injunction issued against such activities by the arbitrators. Ohconfucious' alternative account Date delinker is indefinitely blocked for this activity and his main account was also recently blocked for this activity. AKAF (talk) 07:57, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

There appears to be an on-going discussion on this issue already: Wikipedia_talk:Arbitration_Committee#Ohconfucius_has_resumed_date_delinking_in_violation_of_the_injunction Shell 09:22, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Digwuren request

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Per Arbcom ruling in Digwuren:

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Digwuren#Discretionary_sanctions Courtesy

"2) Misplaced Pages users are expected to behave reasonably and calmly in their dealings with other users. Insulting and intimidating other users harms the community by creating a hostile environment. Personal attacks are not acceptable."

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Digwuren#Discretionary_sanctions "Prior to any sanctions being imposed, the editor in question shall be given a warning with a link to this decision by an uninvolved administrator; and, where appropriate, should be counseled on specific steps that he or she can take to improve his or her editing in accordance with relevant policies and guidelines."

• As I am engaged in discussion regarding Wehrmacht and its war crimes in Central and Eastern Europe I would like to request and admin on intervention in what looks like increasing emotional outbursts that have started to include personal attacks by user Dapi89:
• Your behaving in an extremely dense way. This is why you cannot be trusted(...)Grow up and use your brain.

I would request and admin warning in accordance with Arbcom ruling so that the discussion can focus on essential topics and be clear of personal attacks and insults. Thank you. --Molobo (talk) 17:05, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

That's certainly a belittling statement. Are there other recent examples of snideness? Durova 23:43, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

I've notified Dapi89 of the discretionary sanctions. PhilKnight (talk) 03:03, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

The cheek of this editor is unbelievable. He and user:Peterlewis have accussed me of biased editing, to my mind this is a personal attack is it not? He can't win an argument be arguing sensibly (as you can see his comments of the Wehrmacht talk page are far from that), he runs off and complains because the dubious sources he uses are rightly ridiculed. I can quite legitimately use language like "rubbish" when he makes unsubstantiated claims about me or any anon user. So I'll delete the "warning" as a nonsense. And if I don't trust him to edit appropriately, I am within my rights to say "I don't trust you". Dapi89 (talk) 14:25, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

For the record, I have no intention of communicating with this editor again. Naturally if he makes edits to an article which are questionable, or unsourced (and much of it is), then I will delete it or request citations as an when needed. But appart from that I will not waste any more of my time with him or this issue. However, I will not allow anyone to walk all over me. Dapi89 (talk) 14:30, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

• Molobo appears to have engaged in polite provocation with his prior remark. Dapi89 responded in apparent frustration. WP:WQA is the best place to resolve civility concerns, and obviously civility complaints are not going to be taken seriously if the complainer has engaged in baiting. If there is a pattern of tendentious editing in East European articles, this is the correct page to report it. Jehochman 14:40, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

Notice of BLP Special Enforcement Deletion

Hello all, as a note of general interest I am letting you all know that I have just deleted the article Dudley O'Neill under CSD G3 and WP:BLPSE as a blatant hoax containing unreferenced and potentially libelous information about a living person. This article was listed at Articles for Deletion here: Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Dudley O'Neill. As you can see in that discussion, several editors noted the poor referencing and extreme difficulty in being able to find references; a Google search conducted by me for "Dudley O'Neill" -wikipedia turns up less than 100 hits (the exact number keeps fluctuating for some reason), and most of the links provided in the article had nothing to do with the subject, either referring to another NFL player in the most relevant case, to www.russiatoday.com in the least. This is open to review, but per WP:BLPSE I would ask that administrators not overturn this deletion unless there is a clear consensus here to do so. Thank you. Hersfold 16:31, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

If you are conducting the delete under WP:BLPSE then you need to log it at the Misplaced Pages:Biographies of living persons/Special enforcement log. I have to ask though why it was necessary to use WP:BLPSE, it looks like a very clear delete decision in the AFD and a blatant hoax (that was speediable under G3 anyway) that I cannot see any reason or chance that any admin would reverse the decision. Davewild (talk) 18:48, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

It seemed as though this was a little more severe than the average thing we get at AfD, partially because it appeared referenced at first glance. If you feel BLPSE doesn't really apply, I can leave a note in the deletion log (without actually restoring the article) to note that it was mainly a G3 deletion and not Special Enforcement. I'll hold off on the logging until later this evening to give someone a chance to reply. Hersfold 20:56, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

I think the note in the deletion log referencing the AFD is fine personally as the discussion there is clear why the article was deleted so personally would not bother adding any other notes there. Again personally I would leave it as is, don't log at BLPSE but perhaps adding an extra note to your closing statement on the AFD, deletion mainly as a G3 blatant hoax referenced by the discussion on the AFD which established the grounds for the deletion without needing to refer to BLPSE. (however I admit I could be biased here as I am not a fan of BLPSE anyway) Davewild (talk) 21:11, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

I agree. I realize it's probably more fun to swing a bigger hammer but if the article appears to be a blatant hoax about a fictitious person—well you can never be too sure, so let's say if you have no evidence that anyone named Dudley O'Neill matches even the most basic description and plenty against it, and that you can't establish that it is anything other than a randomly chosen name to accompany the bogus information—there is no need to drop the BLPBOMB. Anyone interested in undeleting the article (probably nobody) already has a significant burden of proving they know something everyone else has missed. — CharlotteWebb 03:51, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

ARBMAC and User:Jingiby

I need a re-instatement of the revert parole under WP:ARBMAC currently still in force (since August) for Jingiby (talk · contribs), which he has been systematically ignoring despite warnings (here and here). Latest reversion spree on Military history of Bulgaria during World War II. I've made the mistake of closing an eye on his infractions from time to time recently, which has evidently emboldened him, and right now I'm involved in the dispute with him, so I'd be grateful if somebody else could take action. Fut.Perf. ☼ 11:12, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

I have blocked for a week. That will expire close to the end of the revert parole, at which point it should be reviewed, given the lack of success of the sanctions applied so far. Kevin (talk) 11:30, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

User:Sarah777 and myself on Talk:Dunmanway Massacre - Troubles related article

• Who: Sarah777 (talk · contribs)
• Who: blowdart (talk · contribs)
• What: 1RR breach on a talk page, relating to a change of the WikiProject Ireland importance rating of the article.

Background: Sarah777 objects to the Mid rating of the article on the Wikiproject Ireland scale and set it to low without consensus. Since then we (and others) have been setting it back and forth and back and forth. Sarah has now used what I perceive as the threat of an ArbCom ruling to keep the rating at her preferred choice. She says there is no consensus to change it back to mid, however there is no consensus to put it to low either, and there has been no discussion on the WikiProject Ireland talk page to get one either.

This is both for a request from myself for clarity (are project ratings covered by the Troubles 1RR rating?) and as a good example of why 1RR doesn't work well when it can be used to stop edits by timing rather than consensus. --Blowdart | 22:50, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

I'm at a loss to understand how threat of an ArbCom ruling relates in any way to my actions. I'm also puzzled how and article about Dunmanway in 1921 can be considered "Troubles (1968 - 1997) related". Just get Blowdart to stop edit warring. Sarah777 (talk) 23:04, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Note: This report does not provide all the information required per the "Using this page" section above. If the information is not added soon, the report may be closed without action.  Sandstein  23:22, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

I reported what I regarded as his edit warring to an Admin, BrownHairedGirl; Blowdart appears to have thought I was threatening him with an Arbcom ruling (as if I could!) Sarah777 (talk) 00:33, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

The article itself is within the purview of The Troubles. However, edit-warring - even on a talk page about something as trivial as a project rating - falls under WP:EW anyway. To answer the question - yes, 1RR should also apply to talk pages. However, frankly this one also falls under WP:LAME. Just give it a rest, please. Black Kite 00:42, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Kite; facts - I didn't refer this to Arbcom; I didn't invoke 1RR - I complained to an Admin to warn an editor against what I reckoned was common non-Arb related edit warring. I'm not making any case here. I made a complaint to the police that Blowdart mistook for a Criminal Prosecution. Sarah777 (talk) 00:51, 20 February 2009 (UTC)