Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 19:55, 10 March 2009

Please stay calm and civil while commenting or presenting evidence, and do not make personal attacks. Be patient when approaching solutions to any issues. If consensus is not reached, other solutions exist to draw attention and ensure that more editors mediate or comment on the dispute.

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Index -index- As of January 16, 2003 September – December 2005 January 2006 January – February 2006 February 2006 February 2006, cont. March 2006 April 2006 - late May 2006 May 24 - July 2006 July 2006 - August 2006 August 2006 Most of September 2006 Late September 2006 - Early November 2006 Most of November 2006 Late November 2006 - December 8, 2006 December 9, 2006 - Mid January 2007 From December 22, 2006 blanking Mid January 2007 - Mid February 2007 Mid February 2007- Feb 25, 2007 From March 2, 2007 blanking March 2-5, 2007 March 5-11, 2007 March 11 - April 3, 2007 April 2 - May 2, 2007 May 3 - June 7, 2007 June 9 - July 4, 2007 July 13 - August 17, 2007 August 17 - September 11, 2007 September 14 - October 7, 2007 October 28 - December 1, 2007 December 2 - December 16, 2007 December 15 - January 4, 2008 January 4 - January 30, 2008 January 30 - February 28, 2008 February 28 - March 11, 2008 March 9 - April 18, 2008 April 18 - May 30, 2008 May 30 - July 27, 2008 July 26 - October 4, 2008 October 4 - November 12, 2008 November 10 - December 10, 2008 December 5 - December 25, 2008 December 25 - January 16, 2009 January 15 - January 27, 2009 January 26 - February 10, 2009 February 8 - March 18, 2009 March 18 - May 6, 2009 May 5 - June 9, 2009 June 10 - July 11, 2009 July 12 - August 29, 2009

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JimmyWales.Org and JimmyWales.Net

I edit conflicted with User:Coren who was removing a note which let you know that silliness is occurring at the domains above as trolling - I thought you might like to know, so have popped this bit back - the full post is in the history, but basically someone is squatting on your domain. (ew....) Privatemusings (talk) 02:25, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

It's not his domains if he doesn't own them, and the whois shows someone in Austrailia owning them both. Nothing to see here, move along. - ✰ALLST☆R✰ 02:34, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Jimmy Wales owns JimmyWales.Com but not those two extensions. They are now directing to Jimmy's Uncyclopedia page. How mortifying! Coren  03:06, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

I think we should simply ban those domains. But lets ask Jimbo first. He might be in negotiations with this silly site squatter as we speak. Wikiwarriorwayne (talk) 23:30, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

wiki warrior wayne, eh? - silly site squatter indeed! Privatemusings (talk) 03:31, 10 March 2009 (UTC)so yeah, I reckon wiki warrior might well be the mischievous soul behind these merry japes ;-)

How come the HTML link doesn't change when you go to another page?

It's quite interesting that Jimmy doesn't own these extensions. He should. MathCool10 04:08, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

flagged revisions trial?

Hi Jimbo - having been dead busy away from wikipedia for the last few weeks, I thought I'd come straight to the horse's mouth and ask what the current status of the flagged revisions trial is? If anyone could point me in the direction of current discussion, or try and sum up the status quo in a few words, it'd be appreciated. My reading of the various places I've dug around is that nothing happened, and no specific action is yet scheduled? cheers, Privatemusings (talk) 23:25, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

I believe there's a summary posted here. Delicious carbuncle (talk) 23:32, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Sorry to be dense, Carbuncle, but I can't make sense of why you linked to that page. It's about someone being alleged to have reverted a template more than three times. Nothing about flagging. Is there a page where it's being discussed? Here's my view on it:

1. "Flagged revisions" seems a non-desctiptive term. What is being flagged up about the revision? Perhaps they should be called "postponed edits" or similar.
2. This feature should only be activated for specific articles that have been subject to repeated, persistent vandalism or that are subject to large numbers of edits or views, e.g. the top 0.01%
3. It should be possible for any user of a few weeks to authenticate changes, and to request to receive notifications, e.g. by email, that edit attempts have been made, optionally with the diff.

Mr. Jones (talk) 11:15, 1 March 2009 (UTC) The relevant pages seem to be

1. Misplaced Pages:Flagged revisions

(fixing threads which may have been a bit split up?) - thanks Mr. Jones - just fwiw, I think Delicious was pointing out a recently departed user's views that nothing really seems to be happening on this (it's the 'BLP' bit mentioned in the banner at the top, not the specific warnings or anything, I think). IIRC, Jimbo asked the dev.s to turn the feature on - have they done so, or maybe it's time to ask nicely again, Jimbo? :-) Privatemusings (talk) 02:25, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

g'day again :-) - I think I read on the foundation mailing list (in a comment from David Gerard) that you're working on a further proposal which you hope will gain stronger support? - any pointers as to where this might be happening, or any updates as to how it's going? :-) Privatemusings (talk) 22:16, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

It's dormant. Jimbo hasn't said any thing about it for a while. The discussion of proposed trials has had just a few edits the past month. Same with other relevant pages. Misplaced Pages Review is complaining about it, but they're putting more actual effort into deleting some British quiz show contestant. If want to do something about it, I suggest going through the proposed trials and make something out of it that could get wide acceptance. Shameless plug: Trial 18: Shadow flagging --Apoc2400 (talk) 10:53, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

I'm shopping a very premature proposal around to a few people, looking for broad consensus. News to come soon.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 12:52, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Hi, may I ask you to include me into "a few people"? I actually was one of the authors of the proposal that was the subject of a large poll sometime ago. I am still very interested in Flagged Revisions and their implementation here, and I think my advice will be usefull. Thanks in advance, Ruslik (talk) 20:10, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Likely he is just asking a few trusted users about a very loose outline of a proposal, and the rest of us will hear about it very soon. I'm anxiously awaiting a proposal, along with many others I'm sure, all we can do is wait.--Res2216firestar 19:12, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

Hi, Jimbo. I've been working on assessing consensus w.r.t. flagged revisions for some time now, and I finally drafted Misplaced Pages:Flag protection and patrolled revisions. I think there's a need and support for a system to monitor and better control blps, but in the same time, a strict Flaggedrevs for all of them has no consensus. So, I think we could have consensus for a passive flag, patrolled revisions. And we also need to be able to fully 'activate' flagged revs on some pages, as a protection measure, that's what I proposed as a variant of flagged protection. Comments are welcome. Cenarium (talk) 00:40, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

< - seems like quite a few people are pulling in kinda the same direction, kinda like a cat sleigh perhaps.... Is the 'soon' of your timeframe roughly 'this week', or maybe 'March sometime', Jimbo? Privatemusings (talk) 22:26, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

"Live near SF and have an hour to help Misplaced Pages?"

There sometimes appears at the top of the page "Live near SF and have an hour to help Misplaced Pages?" but the only link it gives is a javascript link, which is a dead link. I asked on one of the forums and nobody knew what it was, only confirming he javascript link "ethnio.show" was dead for them, too. Perhaps you know? Are you ready for IPv6? (talk) 01:41, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

It could be a geonotice. I have no idea how to check though. Graham87 07:40, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

It worked for me, but only when opening it in the same tab rather than a new one. It's seeking participants for a usability study for Misplaced Pages. the wub "?!" 10:59, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

I've never seen it before, myself, and I don't know about it. But probably the Foundation does. :) --Jimbo Wales (talk) 20:37, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Wub, what URL did it end up at? Are you ready for IPv6? (talk) 21:50, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

I'll assume it's this? §hep 21:52, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

I saw it once. I clicked it and read it, but it hasn't shown up since. It was asking for people to come to downtown San Francisco on a weekend in March to spend an hour being interviewed about Misplaced Pages usage and such. I think it said they'd pay you like $15 or something. You had to sign up and they'd call you to let you know if you were picked to be interviewed. Killiondude (talk) 22:42, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Hmmm, costs me more than $15 in gas to drive there and back. I thought it was some kind of social event people were doing. Are you ready for IPv6? (talk) 00:25, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Anyone have a screenshot? §hep 02:23, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Jasonr

Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_adminship/Jasonr_(reconfirmation). Someone has posted this, without much forethought it seems like. Perhaps you can head it off - if this person, who reportedly worked for you and got his admin bit as a result, is no longer associated with Misplaced Pages... Would you remove the bit then yourself? Avruch 15:45, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Hopefully my removal of his bit will put this to rest.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 20:36, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Jimbo, apologies for the headache that caused, I was trying to start a discussion similar to m:Wikimedia_Forum#Tidying_developers.27_user_rights. I didn't expect people to turn it into a vote for actions while I was away. MBisanz 22:18, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

question

what happens when there are multiple reliable 3rd party sources that conflict, but multiple 1st party sources that say one thing. do the editors go with the 1st party source..Example: Johnny A releases a book stating he is a homosexual. "News weekly" denies the book saying Johnny A. isn't a homosexual. "News Report hour' states that Johnny is infact a homosexual. Who does wikipedia beleive? reply on my talk page. 70.242.179.192 (talk) 04:24, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Hello, you are probably not too familiar with Misplaced Pages. This is something that should be asked at the article's talk page or the help desk:) ZooFari 04:31, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Agree with ZooFari here. The question is a bit too vague as stated. In general, a book published by a person stating something about their personal life should be considered a reliable source - but there can of course be exceptions and complications. Judgment is always necessary.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 02:17, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Onscene language by WebHampster in Skull and Bones discussion

Jimbo,

I am having trouble with a user named WebHampster in the Skull and Bones discussion pages. He is hiding my text in a collapse box and told me to F-off. I thought that wikipedia users were required to respect each other and act like gentlemen. Could you please talk to this user.

Thank you, M

I'll take a look at this, Jimbo might have other things to do right now. --Rodhullandemu 18:47, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Obama issues & flagged revisions

You might (or might not) be interested in this and this. Just a thought: Right now we have 2 options, either keep reverting the edits or place full protection on the article — either one will attract even more notice from the media (Now Misplaced Pages reverts all edits or Now Misplaced Pages has prohibited all editing). Either way, it's lose-lose. Now, if flagged revisions were in place.... Just thinking out loud. --64.85.217.74 (talk) 02:48, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Or we could fix the article so that mention of notable controversies and criticisms are included. That seems to me to be the appropriate way to improve the encyclopedia based on our policies and guidelines, not to mention common sense. The articles dealing with these issues should also be linked to from that article. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:24, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Oh, please. Are you going to post this in every AN/ANI thread and talk page that you can to garner sympathy? You were adding in uncited original research, indicated here, here (bottom), here (bottom), and here (bottom). The addition of this equates to edit warring. I was nice enough to notify you of the article probation instead of outright blocking for 3RR; you should take that as advice, that perhaps you should add citations in regards to one of the highest profile BLP's at Misplaced Pages, instead of trying to disregard every administrator or editor that comes along the way to comment. seicer | talk | contribs 23:06, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Maybe next time you'll consider adding a citation needed tag to the wild assertion that Republicans criticized Obama's opposition to the surge and that Obama's associations with Rev. Wright, Tony Rezko, and Bill Ayers are controversial. You're not "nice", you're an administrator who uses his tools and position in content disputes against wikipedia guidelines. Clean up your act. ChildofMidnight (talk) 00:12, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Aaron Klein

Wondering what we should do about Aaron Klein. Editing (it appears) as Jerusalem21 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) he first creates his own vanity article and, despite getting caught sockpuppeting (see his talk page), squats on the article for two years to prevent anyone from cleaning it up. Then he engineers a fake scandal to bring disrepute on Misplaced Pages. On February 24, after never editing (from that account) any other article he suddenly makes three rapid-fire edits to the Obama article - two on the crackpot theory that Obama was born in Kenya and one to promote the election year smear involving Bill Ayers that was by consensus too trivial for Obama's main bio page. He publishes an expose about Misplaced Pages in his right wing site,World Net Daily without admitting that he is actually reporting on the breaching experiment he perpetrated to get himself blocked. The story gets mainstream coverage for a while until the hoax is discovered but by that time the story has hit the conservative blogosphere and editors are rushing from all over to as ChildofMidnight puts it above "fix the article" (i.e. edit war and badmouth the supposed "libtards" and censors who rule Misplaced Pages). That results in full indefinite protection for the article and a state of siege on its talk page.

Whatever Klein is doing here, it is clearly not to build an encyclopedia. He has sabotaged the project to create a fake scandal so he can cover it to further a political agenda. Now his article is nominated for deletion (see ]). I'm thinking we should root out his accounts and not let him edit here unless he shows he wants to use accounts to write articles. Wikidemon (talk) 18:58, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

The inability of new and experienced editors to balance the Barack Obama article with mention of notable criticism and controversy is troubling and embarassing for Misplaced Pages. I would have thought that we'd work to address the problem. To find that instead we've locked the page down and now the same editors guarding that page have launched a retaliatory nomination of this journalist's article seems ill-considered at best. Even if a case can be made that he isn't notable and doesn't meet the inclusion criteria, the timing stinks. The factual story that the Obama article is being aggresively censored and doesn't meet our own guidelines and standards for balance, and that the article is in stark contrast to the articles on other politicians who hold similar offices, certainly seems legitimate to me. I'm not surprised that other more mainstream media have picked up on it. It's certainly true that efforts to add content according to guidelines for notability are immediately reverted and the editors in question harassed. If only the same attention was paid to reigning in POV warriors and bias that was paid to Science Apologist's spelling corrections, Misplaced Pages would be a lot better off. ChildofMidnight (talk) 19:36, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Creating fake accounts to sabotage a website, then write about it as if it happened to someone else, is not considered "legitimate" or a "factual story" in most journalistic circles. The Obama article, a FA, is just fine, and represents long-term consensus by many dozens of hardworking editors. ChildofMidnight, it should be pointed out, seems to have drunk the kool-aid about liberal censors controlling Misplaced Pages, and as the diffs show is one of those who jumped in and began edit warring the Obama article just before it got protected. Perhaps it is not "POV warriors" who are "guarding that page" but hardworking volunteers who have created and maintained a featured article. Wikidemon (talk) 19:45, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Creating fake accounts is an administrative issue. Reporting on how Misplaced Pages operates hardly amounts to sabotage. I'm interested in your explanation of why a biography on Misplaced Pages since March of 2006 with numberous edits by various editors is now suddenly up for deletion by the editors "defending" the Barack Obama article? And if you're embarassed by the bias and censoring that goes on, by all means let's help fix it. Or perhaps you'd vare to explain why notable criticisms and controversies are omitted from the article? Alternatively we can block the editor who demonstrated these problems and will no doubt expose our failure to respond appropriately. This will only serve to add to the abundant evidence of bias and censorship. But it won't be him sabotaging who Misplaced Pages, it will be the poor decision making of those handling the situation and controlling the Obama article. ChildofMidnight (talk) 19:55, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Blinky Jimmy

Um, Jimbo is blinking at me. Does anyone else find this to be, oh I don't know... weird? I figured I was just tired when I first thought I saw his picture blink, but then I definitely saw Jimbo blink at me! I then realized his picture is a .gif image. Maybe a still frame would be more, uh, not off-putting? Am I alone in my opinion? -Sesu Prime (talk) 10:27, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, I kind of don't like it myself. It was sweet of someone to make it, and when I first heard about it, I looked at it, and I thought, hmmm, that's cute but creepy. But it was so nice for someone to spend the time to make it that I just let it go. But maybe it's tired now.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 21:50, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

I dunno, I didn't even notice until I read this. On looking at it it didn't creep me out. Seems to make the page a little bit more dynamic. Gives the impression of presence. In fact, I think it'd be really cool if someone decided to go all Harry Potter on it and made it do many different actions.Khono (talk) 21:56, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

What do you think of replacing it with File:Jimmy Wales Fundraiser Appeal.JPG? More up-to-date and non-blinky. §hep 21:58, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Definitely in the "Uncanny valley". William Avery (talk) 08:33, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

I like the picture Stepshep suggested.

By the way, sorry Jimmy, uh, I mean Mr. Wales, for talking about you like you weren't here. I just wasn't expecting the Misplaced Pages founder himself to respond to little ol' me. ;-) -Sesu Prime (talk) 10:24, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Mr. Wales is my father. :) --Jimbo Wales (talk) 15:48, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Japanese Misplaced Pages

Hello,Jimbo. I'm worry that I have to report that Japanese Wikipdians are POV about Christianity articles. They say trinity is the main doctrine of Christianity and the religion that doesn't support that is non-Christianity or heresy without no explainations. But I think 'heresy' is word to avoid, and I deleted this words. Then Japanese administrators decided it trolls without no explainations, and they blocked my ID. What do you think of this? 118.111.5.64 (talk) 01:10, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

I am unable to read Japanese, despite a year of study, and so I'm unable to help directly. I think that, in my experience, admins in Japanese wikipedia do not really care about such ideological matters - the block was likely for behavioral reasons. I have no opinion about the content dispute, but recommend the use of reliable sources.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 02:40, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

If you have a grievance such as this, then wherever you bring it up (and this probably isn't the best place), it would be a help if you could provide "diffs". Look in 歴史 for the edits, click 選択した版同士を比較, and save the URL of what you see. -- Hoary (talk) 04:15, 10 March 2009 (UTC)