Misplaced Pages

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This is Jimbo Wales's talk page, where you can send them messages and comments.

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Archives

Index –index– October 28, 2001 – April 12, 2004 April 16, 2004 – August 23, 2004 August 28, 2004 – December 8, 2004 December 9, 2004 – March 23, 2005 March 23, 2005 – July 24, 2005 July 26, 2005 – September 9, 2005 September 9, 2005 – September 24, 2005 September – December 2005 January 2006 January – February 2006 February 2006 February 2006, cont. March 2006 April 2006 – late May 2006 May 24 – July 2006 July 2006 – August 2006 August 2006 Most of September 2006 Late September 2006 – Early November 2006 Most of November 2006 Late November 2006 – December 8, 2006 December 9, 2006 – Mid January 2007 From December 22, 2006 blanking Mid January 2007 – Mid February 2007 Mid February 2007– Feb 25, 2007 From March 2, 2007 blanking March 2–5, 2007 March 5–11, 2007 March 11 – April 3, 2007 April 2 – May 2, 2007 May 3 – June 7, 2007 June 9 – July 4, 2007 July 13 – August 17, 2007 August 17 – September 11, 2007 September 14 – October 7, 2007 October 28 – December 1, 2007 December 2 – December 16, 2007 December 15 – January 4, 2008 January 4 – January 30, 2008 January 30 – February 28, 2008 February 28 – March 11, 2008 March 9 – April 18, 2008 April 18 – May 30, 2008 May 30 – July 27, 2008 July 26 – October 4, 2008 October 4 – November 12, 2008 November 10 – December 10, 2008 December 5 – December 25, 2008 December 25 – January 16, 2009 January 15 – January 27, 2009 January 26 – February 10, 2009 February 8 – March 18, 2009 March 18 – May 6, 2009 May 5 – June 9, 2009 June 10 – July 11, 2009 July 12 – August 25, 2009 August 26 – October 3, 2009 October 4 – November 20, 2009 November 20 – December 21, 2009 December 22, 2009 – January 25, 2010 January 22, 2010 – February 22, 2010 February 22, 2010 – March 17, 2010 March 17, 2010 – April 9, 2010 April 11, 2010 – April 24, 2010 April 23, 2010 – May 12, 2010 May 10, 2010 – June 4, 2010 June 4, 2010 – June 26, 2010 June 26, 2010 – July 22, 2010 July 22, 2010 – August 23, 2010 August 4, 2010 – August 28, 2010 August 28, 2010 – September 14, 2010 September 13, 2010 – October 6, 2010 October 6, 2010 – November 8, 2010 November 8, 2010 – November 21, 2010 November 21, 2010 – December 6, 2010 December 6, 2010 – December 22, 2010 December 21, 2010 – January 17, 2011 January 16, 2011 – February 10, 2011 February 6, 2011 – March 19, 2011 March 16, 2011 – March 26, 2011 March 26, 2011 – April 22, 2011 April 22, 2011 – May 16, 2011 May 17, 2011 – June 9, 2011 June 10, 2011 – July 1, 2011 July 1, 2011 – July 15, 2011 July 16, 2011 – July 26, 2011 July 26, 2011 – August 15, 2011 August 14, 2011 – August 23, 2011 August 21, 2011 – August 31, 2011 August 30, 2011 – September 7, 2011 September 4, 2011 – September 25, 2011 September 26, 2011 – October 19, 2011 October 16, 2011 – November 5, 2011 November 4, 2011 – November 12, 2011 November 11, 2011 – November 24, 2011 November 24, 2011 – December 6, 2011 December 3, 2011 – December 14, 2011 December 10, 2011 – December 16, 2011 (RFC about the Stop Online Piracy Act) December 15, 2011 – December 30, 2011 December 27, 2011 – January 9, 2012 January 9, 2012 – January 18, 2012 January 17, 2012 – January 30, 2012 January 28, 2012 – February 12, 2012 February 7, 2012 – February 25, 2012 February 19, 2012 – March 4, 2012 February 27, 2012 – March 18, 2012 March 17, 2012 – April 2, 2012 March 31, 2012 – April 13, 2012 April 12, 2012 – April 18, 2012 April 18, 2012 – April 26, 2012 April 26, 2012 – May 6, 2012 May 2, 2012 – May 22, 2012 May 19, 2012 – June 9, 2012 June 4, 2012 – June 20, 2012 June 18, 2012 – June 28, 2012 June 26, 2012 – July 12, 2012 July 3, 2012 – July 22, 2012 July 19, 2012 – July 29, 2012 July 25, 2012 – August 9, 2012 August 7, 2012 – August 30, 2012 August 29, 2012 – September 13, 2012 September 13, 2012 – September 27, 2012 September 26, 2012 – October 5, 2012 September 24, 2012 – October 20, 2012 October 9, 2012 – October 31, 2012 October 29, 2012 – November 19, 2012 November 17, 2012 – December 5, 2012 December 2–15, 2012 December 15–28, 2012 December 24, 2012 – January 12, 2013 January 13–31, 2013 February 1–10, 2013 February 11–28, 2013 March 1–16, 2013 March 17–27, 2013 March 28 – April 6, 2013 April 6–19, 2013 April 19 – May 3, 2013 April 25 – May 8, 2013 May 6–19, 2013 May 18–30, 2013 May 27 – June 16, 2013 June 17–30, 2013 June 27 – July 30, 2013 July 31 – August 4, 2013 August 4–12, 2013 August 13–27, 2013 August 28 – September 4, 2013 September 5–10, 2013 September 11–22, 2013 September 24 – October 6, 2013 October 7–16, 2013 October 17–27, 2103 October 28 – November 6, 2013 November 7–19, 2013 November 20–27, 2013 November 28 – December 5, 2013 December 6–24, 2013 December 25–30, 2013 December 31, 2013 – January 14, 2014 January 15–24, 2014 January 25–29, 2014 January 30 – February 10, 2014 Archives not yet dated: 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 This manual archive index may be out of date. Future archives: 184 185 186

This page has archives. Sections older than 1 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III.

What's with the blocking of the accounts of deceased users?

This is what I'm worried about. I've seen this on their ] page and find that they were indefinitely blocked! Any guidelines referring to this matter?--One moment, Reciever | Thank you for your instructions. 14:11, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

I don't think this should be thought of as disrespectful in any way. If anything, I suppose the motivation is likely to be to ensure that the passwords aren't cracked and then these accounts used in a way that is disrespectful. I don't know if there are guidelines or discussions about this.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 16:06, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Another point is that the computer belonging to a deceased Wikipedian is likely to be used by another person (possibly after the computer is sold), and the computer may contain details of the Misplaced Pages account allowing an unauthorized person to impersonate the former Wikipedian. Johnuniq (talk) 10:46, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

You could be right.

On a completely unrelated note, can I ask users to add the number of colons?--One moment, Reciever | Thank you for your instructions. 01:31, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

• We don't want to risk them coming back. A group of brain-eating zombie Wikipedians only sounds silly until you encounter it. HalfShadow (talk) 17:56, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Jimbo

User:Juliancolton may have retired. You need to do what any pusher worth his salt would do. Go over there and get high with him on Misplaced Pages again. Before the say-no-to-Wiki folks succeed in performing an intervention with him and he gets too high a count on his days of Wiki sobriety.↜ (‘Just M E ’here , now) 21:56, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Wow, Mr Wales hasn't editing this page in going on a fornight. You think he and Julian are in a program together?↜ (‘Just M E ’here , now) 22:23, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Arbcom RFC

Hi Jimmy. fyi, there is an RFC about the structure of Arbcom 2010: Misplaced Pages:Requests for comment/Arbitration Committee 2. Your unique perspective/views would be a valuable addition to the RFC. --John Vandenberg 22:21, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

WikiLit

Have you had a chance to check out Andrew Dalby's book The World and Misplaced Pages? Is it any good? ChildofMidnight (talk) 05:09, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

I haven't read it yet. But he's offered to send me a copy, and so I expect that I shall.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 14:48, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

A nightmare for Jimbo Wales

He awakens to learn:

• Somebody has shaved off his mustache & beard
  
• Myself & friends, show up at his house, to give him a 'we're not worthy bow, for a total 24hrs straight
  
• We have a rowdy Misplaced Pages convention at his place, for an entire year. GoodDay (talk) 20:28, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Lolwut?--Sooo Kawaii!!! ^__^ (talk) 09:47, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Admins taking drugs

Is this acceptable? It isn't only that they are on a highly dangerous drug, but that they are also editing while on it really bothers me, especially when they have ops. Is there any applicable guideline, standard, or tradition regarding this? Ottava Rima (talk) 16:09, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Not taking into account that "is on acid" is most probably used figuratively in the sense of "very weird", it's hardly Misplaced Pages's place to dictate what intoxicants editors can partake in. Or, for that matter, even assess whether they are. — Coren  16:14, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Without commenting on my opinion, I think you are wrong about the figurative bit Coren: . Prodego 16:15, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Not figurative. Chillum has also admitted to having a secret second account. You are not supposed to edit while drunk or using drugs, and I am concerned about what kinds of things may have happened. This user is an admin with ops, and admin are supposed to be neutral and have fair judgment. How do we know if a block didn't happen because of drug use or an unblock for the same? Ottava Rima (talk) 16:17, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

My original point remains, though. Enforcing random drug laws isn't what we're here for. Either the editor edits within policy in which case it's not an issue, or they do not in which case the reason is immaterial. — Coren  16:19, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

It's also possible that we have encountered an admin with a sense of humor. (Don't mind me. It's the drugs. Mostly caffeine at this point.) Antandrus (talk) 16:21, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

@OR: Besides, how do we know anything isn't done for the "wrong reason"? That someone makes a block or unblock because of a distraction in Real Life, for instance, or because they are tired? You can't. And there is no point in doing so even if we could: either the action was correct or it was not. — Coren  16:24, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Coren, drug laws do not matter as alcohol is legal. However, users are told not to edit while drunk, and drunk admin are bad. Acid is far more potent than alcohol in altering the ability to perceive correctly. I am asking about an -admin- having the ability to use admin abilities while taking drugs regularly as he has admitted. I am also asking for someone to check his secret account to ensure that there was no drug related impropriety. Ottava Rima (talk) 16:26, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Plus, Coren, this is a major PR nightmare. A reporter can easily attribute any problem that Chillum has been involved in to drug use, and there are hundreds just from this year. Chillum has been involved in a lot of controversial matters, for good or for bad. This compromised judgment is just the tip of the iceberg, especially in conjunction with his second secret account. Ottava Rima (talk) 16:28, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

• Let's not blow this out of proportion; IIRC, it would be difficult for anyone under the influence of LSD to be even able to find enough keys to block or delete. I happily confess that I edit under the influence of drugs, and I find it helps to do so. Please stash the moral indignation unless and until it becomes an issue. Rodhullandemu 16:32, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

He could find the keys to type up a message saying he was high. Ottava Rima (talk) 16:35, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

LSD takes about half an hour to kick in fully. Rodhullandemu 16:53, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Were you a witness to these events? Can you verify that he took acid within a time frame that would allow him not to be high at the time of posting? Ottava Rima (talk) 16:56, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Franz Kafka, thou should'st be living now! Rodhullandemu 16:59, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

I hope you realize that in posting that, you have exposed your argument as non-existent. Ottava Rima (talk) 17:11, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

• Aside from all the very good reasons provided above to avoid overblown moral outrage, there is no indication that Chillum even edited while 'under the influence'. He made no edits between the placement of the notice and its removal . Based on the comments posted by Ottava Rima and Malleus Fatuorum in response to this trivial, teapot tempest, Chillum is not the editor whose conduct we need to be concerned about. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 16:42, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

He has a secondary account and has admitted such. Do you have knowledge of what that secondary account is? If so, provide the name to verify your statement that no edits have been made under it. If not, please strike it as being incorrect. Ottava Rima (talk) 16:45, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

If you believe someone is using a second account abusively, you're at the wrong place. Otherwise, that's immaterial. If you believe that Chillum has taken problematic actions (regardless of why he did so) that didn't involve a separate account, you're still at the wrong place. If neither of these are true, why do you care? Seraphimblade 16:59, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

It is never the wrong place to ask a question. That was clear from the very top. Please don't make such claims and post off topic simply because you disagree with the question. Disruption like that is never appropriate and only means that you recognize that Chillum has acted inappropriately. Ottava Rima (talk) 17:11, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

I've done some of my best coding while stoned, it is actually quite relaxing. Munchies are a problem though, as chip crumbs are a bitch to get out of a keyboard. Then there's the issues with memory, um...what were we talking about? Tarc (talk) 17:31, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

The only thing that counts should be the editing output, not the mental state of the editor. If the editor does bad edits, we can revert/block/ban him regardless of his mental state. For what I know, you may all well be a Chinese room or a Boltzmann brain , but that's irrelevant. --Cyclopia 17:33, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Why so serious? I think admins should be allowed to be crack heads just as long as it doesn’t impair there vital duties.--Sooo Kawaii!!! ^__^ (talk) 17:40, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Mental state is 100% necessary for using admin ops. We have "trust" for a reason. Ottava Rima (talk) 17:54, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Is it silly season so soon? This is the most goofball non-issue on Misplaced Pages all day. November 1 must be the new April 1. If this is a joke, I think we've got it. If not, the thread is just a personal attack on Chillum and ought to be drawn to a close. On Misplaced Pages everyone is judged on the strength of their edits, not what they do in the privacy of their home, or what process their brain has been through to produce those edits. Indignation that somewhere a Wikipedian is doing something illegal, or that drug-taking Wikipedians are a threat to the project, is too farfetched to be worth any serious response. It may be unwise and undignified at a personal level, by some standards of decorum, to announce or joke about one's own drug-taking. But in other circles it's just fine, and we're not in any position to judge. - Wikidemon (talk) 17:49, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

If the secondary account displayed unusual conduct while under the influence, I tend to think that account would be blocked or banned if the influence was problematic. If no one knows which account that is, as seems to be the case, then there is no apparent evidence that it has been used while the typer were intoxicated, and we would more or less have to AGF that it isn't. I can and do see some problems with Chillum admitting to having two accounts, and not indicating what they are, but that is a separate matter. thankgodcaffiencedoesn'tcountasbeinganintoxicatingdrugIdon'tknowhowI'dbeabletodoanythingwithoutit. :)John Carter (talk) 17:51, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

AGF only goes until there is evidence. ArbCom has the right to know about secondary accounts to verify that there is no impropriety, so an Arb could check to verify that there was no such problems. Ottava Rima (talk) 17:54, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

I have already told you that if arbcom wants to know this information, they only need to ask me(they have not asked). Chillum 18:11, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Agreed on that point - it's discouraged for anyone, particularly admins, to have secondary accounts. Although we've gone back and forth regarding whether this is a requirement or just an admonition, admins really ought to disclose and register their secondary accounts with a checkuser / arb to make sure they're on the up-and-up. Otherwise, way too much drama and potential for abuse. Other than perhaps the shared connection to a countercultural mindset, I don't see what socking has to do with drugs. - Wikidemon (talk) 17:58, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

(EC) So go ask them to, if you're concerned. Seraphimblade 17:59, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

(ec) OR, you have come here to Jimbo's talk page to publicise something that you yourself admit might become "a major PR nightmare". The original edit may well have been a joke. You pushed very hard towards getting it out of the twilight zone, but without success. We still don't know whether Chillum was just speaking figuratively and, upon being confronted by a hysterical editor pulled that editor's leg; or whether he was simply describing fact. It is not in Misplaced Pages's interest to know which is true, and it is not in Misplaced Pages's interest to treat Chillum's statement as a credible statement of fact on the single most effective page of the Wiki for getting such things into the papers.

From the other reactions on Chillum's talk page it should be clear to you by now that there is no general consensus to be hysterical about such things. Right things to do in this situation include contacting Arbcom privately, and they include making a general policy proposal on drug use by editors and admins and on writing about drug use. They do not include deliberately stirring drama in close proximity to the event. Please back off. Hans Adler 18:14, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Sounds like you guyz need to lighten up with some weed mon. I got the shit on my Talk page. Have a party!--Sooo Kawaii!!! ^__^ (talk) 18:19, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Weed on your talk page? OK, I will bring something that should help. Herbicidal Maniac 18:41, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Hans, it has already been proven by his multiple references that he was not talking figuratively. Please read all comments before responding in such a manner. Your use of "hysterical" in such a light is incivil and inappropriate. Ottava Rima (talk) 19:23, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Furthermore, consensus on his talk page? That is not only an inappropriate claim, but it is factually wrong. A few friends making disruptive claims about a direct action has nothing to do with appropriate admin actions. Ottava Rima (talk) 19:25, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

I concur with Hans' comment a little further above. So let's put a fact-tag behind Chillum's "drug" statement. *smile* The Magnificent Clean-keeper (talk) 18:47, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Seriously folks, reacting hysterically to someone using drugs is bad, it can really mess people up. You might start out thinking it is innocent experimentation and that you can stop anytime, but before you know it you can take over your life. Chillum 18:59, 1 November 2009 (UTC)