Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 07:17, 21 January 2006

==Welcome== Hello A.J.A. and welcome to Misplaced Pages! I'm glad you've chosen to join us. This is a great project with lots of dedicated people, which might seem intimidating at times, but don't let anything discourage you. Be bold!, explore, and contribute. If you want to learn more,

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Float around for awhile until you find something that tickles your fancy. One easy way to do this is to hit the random page button in the navigation bar to the left. There are also many great committees and groups that focus on particular jobs. My personal favorite stomping grounds are Misplaced Pages:Translation into English and Misplaced Pages:Cleanup for sloppy articles. Finally, the Wikimedia Foundation has several other wiki projects that you might enjoy.

There are a few crucial points to keep in mind when editing. Be civil with users, strive to maintain a neutral point of view, verify your information, and show good etiquette like signing your comments with four tildes like this: ~~~~ If you have any more questions, always feel free to ask me anything on my talk page or ask the true experts at Misplaced Pages:Help desk. Again, welcome! -- Draeco 03:55, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

Acharya S

There are few enough who can contribute sensibly, and also keep out of the cycle of provocation on the talk page. I'd prefer to see you in that minority. Charles Matthews 17:14, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

Re: Charles Matthews

Word of advice: don't piss off the ref. crazyeddie 18:12, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

Rene-Skull, aka Rpsugar

See Misplaced Pages:Resolving disputes. She/he is also in possible violation of the "no personal attacks" policy. "He has the defense of being anonymous right now, but he will be found out and tracked for the statements he has made and has no business doing so." Ironically enough, rpsugar/Rene-Skull was not logged in at the time, so has the defense of being anonyomous. crazyeddie 22:55, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

I believe that was in response to Zaroves threats to publish Acharya's credit info online if I didn't back off and let him have his way with the article. Procuring a credit report under false pretenses is a crime. In addition, a wanted kidnapper is known to have passed around Acharya's personal info to religious groups, suggesting that Zarove may have been in contact with this person. Where, for example, did he get the 'Melne' middle name from?? His story has been that he is a former reporter, with a "masters in journalism", and that he wrote an article about Acharya for a tennessee newspaper; he says he procured this info in his research efforts. Though he will give his full name, he will not give the name of the newspaper, the title of the article, the date it was published, nor will he back up his "masters in journalism" claim. In addition, he claims he was a physics major in 2001. Masters in Journalism, a year and half in physics, and a job as a reporter a few years ago... all by the time he was 26. ^^James^^ 04:10, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Acharya S edit

Thank you for your edit to Acharya S. Since this is a disputed page, I guess a good thing to do is wait before making further edits and see how others will react. Let us hope that the article will not degenrate in an edit war again. Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 03:31, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

I can make myself scarce around those parts for the next few days, if that's what you're hinting at. I don't think any substantive improvements will be made in any case until User:Crazyeddie does his thing, or at any rate I'm not going to try. A.J.A. 03:42, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Well, asking for a few days may be too much. Say till some other involved people see your changes and have comments. Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 04:06, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Wikiproject Christianity

Hi A.J.A. Thank you very much for your invitation :) I am currently on Wikibreak, but will certainly be interested in being a part of the project when I return. Take care. Brisvegas 04:26, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

• Thanks for the invite. Great idea.   Guðsþegn – UTCE – 16:55, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Christian invite

Thanks for the invite. You may be interested in my review of Cardinal Bernardin at Amazon.com for The Gift of Peace. A link to it that may not be stable is: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-reviews/0385494343/103-1327761-6028626 Kyle Andrew Brown 22:00, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Clarification on Chick comment

Either Diligens or I have misunderstood a comment you made on Talk:Charles Chiniquy - Diligens has interpreted you as saying that www.chick.com is not Chick's official website (and removed mention of Chick again, for that and other reasons), I read your words differently. Would appreciate if you could clarify it there? --Calair 00:10, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Your nominations for deletion

It's hard to understand how you could nominate Thomas Ice, Grant Jeffrey, and Mal Couch for deletion; not to mention the entire LBU list of people. I've responded on those pages, but those three guys are very notable. Ice and Jeffrey both have over 14 million Google hits. All of them have written countless books. As a self-proclaimed inerrantist, I'm shocked that you haven't heard of them. Jeffrey is one of the biggest names in Bible prophecy. --Jason Gastrich 05:26, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

You have a low standard for "countless". Maybe you just can't count very high.

Is there any reason I would have heard of them? Not all of evangelicalism is your own little inbred pocket, you know. A.J.A. 06:01, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Why are you so bitter and why are you attacking me? Shouldn't we be like-minded as Christians? Christ wouldn't be coming after me and putting me down like you are. --Jason Gastrich 06:11, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

• Actually, if the New Testament is accurate at all, Christ reserved some of his strongest rebukes for people like Gastrich. The Scriptures have many examples of Jesus dealing rather harshly with the self-righteous, the religious hypocrites, and the frauds and phonies... - WarriorScribe 06:27, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Yes, "countless" is a bit of a, eh, shall we say, "inflation" of the numbers, keeping in mind that standards at some of the publication houses that publish this stuff is rather low. Oh, and the Google hit counts are wildly inflated--and false--as well. - WarriorScribe 06:10, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

"Like-minded" meaning what? All Christians must agree with Jason Gastrich and to disagree means one is not Christian? Mark K. Bilbo 19:49, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

One of the (many) things I object to is the attitude that you can take anything shoddy (from knick-knacks to colleges), slap a Jesus-fish on it, and expect the loyalty of everyone who names the name of Christ.

There are plenty on the other side equally shoddy, and I'm at war with them, too. *cough* *Acharya* *cough* A.J.A. 20:33, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

If these were sci-fi writers with the same number of titles and google hits, I doubt this discussion would be taking place. A quick search found Couch in major media outlets for both his religious expertise and his media work during the JFK assasination. FWIW I don't have a horse in the religious subtext here, I'm just calling it the way I see it. Also, presonal attacks are unbecoming A.J.A. - Jaysus Chris 06:26, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Let's not get too excited about publication lists and Google hits. The latter were deceptive and the former is less than impressive due to the general lack of standards (compared to the larger, secular houses) that are common to Christian publishers. - WarriorScribe 06:30, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

You mean houses like Bantam and Harper Collins? - Jaysus Chris 07:16, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Yep, among others, and even they don't always get it right...nobody's perfect, after all. Back in my "Christian days," I did a lot more writing than I do now. I submitted a couple of books to a couple of the larger publishing houses and waa turned down flat. But I was made publication offers by a couple of the religious publishers. I didn't take them up on that, though, because I was leaving the "faith" by the time they were making their offers and didn't think it would be right. Looking back at the material, I'm glad I made that decision. I'm a pretty heavy reader. Sometimes I put away a book a night (and did that in my early days in the service, too). I had a friend who owned a fairly nice Christian book store in the east county, San Diego, in the early 80s, and got a lot of reading material from him. Most of it was pretty bad. - WarriorScribe 12:28, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Maybe you didn't follow the cite, but at least one of the AFD noms has had books published by both of the houses I mentioned. How such a person could be considered NN is beyond comprehension. - Jaysus Chris 08:21, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

You forgot one: North_Tennessee_Bible_Institute. (Promotional tone, preformatted text block, one incoming link from Mal Couch and one from the community's article) --kingboyk 23:31, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

LBU isn't a diploma mill

Where did you get such a crazy notion? --Jason Gastrich 05:28, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

I'm guessing AJ, that you know that it's not such a "crazy notion." Certainly, education expert Steve Levicoff didn't seem to think so. - WarriorScribe 06:51, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

I think he got the notion from the fact that it is. -Harvestdancer 17:45, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

You guys make me laugh. --Jason Gastrich 21:27, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Oxford Graduate School

I reverted your addition to List of unaccredited institutions of higher learning because, like Bob Jones University, Oxford Graduate School is also accredited by TRACS (I looked it up at the USDOE website a little while ago). I'm leery about any group that would accredit Bob Jones U., personally, but consistency is consistency. --Calton | Talk 01:33, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

All I could find on the TRACS site was candidacy status. I'm not an expert in how that works, so maybe that's considered a kind of accreditation, in which case the OGS article itself should be altered to stop casting doubt on them. (But it wouldn't explain why they couldn't get a .edu domain.) A.J.A. 04:51, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

It turns out that both OGS and BJU are candidates . By the way they describe it on the site it sounds like schools with candidacy should be off the list. A.J.A. 05:36, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

"...is in basic compliance"? Well, I guess that counts. I wonder why some of the places listed DO have .edu domains and some don't. I also have to wonder how the unaccredited Patrick Henry College manages to send so many interns to Washington, and why Visible School is located on Huff N Puff Road. --Calton | Talk 01:43, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

AFDs

I just wanted to let you know that I support your opinion on AFDing a number of Jason Gastrich's articles. If you feel that you need to use the dispute resolution procedure (WP:RFC) let me know and I will certify the basis of the dispute. Stifle 18:11, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

As far as I see it, the problem isn't of Gastrich's articles, some might deserve deletion, it's the nubmer AJA AFDed without regard to actual notability. This was done with complete indiscriminance to what the entries said, only who wrote it, or what school (LBU) they were affiliated with. As I've said elsewhere, I'm agnostic to the religious subtext but this is careless AFD nominating at best (assuming good faith), and some kind of personal vendetta at worst (not). - Jaysus Chris 08:27, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

I fully agree with Jaysus Chris. Mass AFDing (even with cause) is simply a bad idea.the1physicist 22:47, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Your comments

You said, "He's also making a quite serious accusation about me personally, only he doesn't have the guts to come out and say it. All this is specifically about my nominations, so this stuff about "unbelievers" means me. Only I'm a Christian, as he was aware of before writing. So he's accusing me of being a false brother, without having the courage or honesty to say it plainly, or even the basic fidelity to Scriptural teachings to discuss it with me privately first. A.J.A. 00:21, 20 January 2006 (UTC)"

In fact, I have more guts than you know. I also see you as small potatoes, though. Certainly part of the problem, but small potatoes because anybody can nominate an article for deletion. I've assumed that you are a (misdirected) believer in Christ. Who else would nominate 12 Christian biography entries for deletion? Who else would attack a Christian institution, over 1000 students, and thousands of graduates by calling their school a diploma mill (even though they attend on campus classes, go to school for many years, and work hard to earn their degrees)?

I can tell you with certainty that over half a dozen unbelievers have voted to delete. The ones who dislike Christianity and me (and they generally troll me and roll in packs) have come out of the woodwork. I hope you're happy with the side you've taken and the people you've pleased. I haven't been able to find how God could possibly be glorified by your actions. Have you? --Jason Gastrich 07:50, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Try not to be too amused by Gastrich's boasting and declaration of you as "small potatoes." The same phrase has been used to describe him (when compared to other ministries and his many claims about how successful his is supposed to be--see here and here, and any time another Christian takes issue with him (and this occurs frequently, as you have probably guessed, see this recent talk page for a Christian for an example), he tries to disparage that person's Christianity--as if his standards and his alone are the deciding factor.

Notice that Gastrich does not declare that the "Christian articles" that were identified for deletion are necessarily valid Misplaced Pages articles. They are, to him, Christian articles. Remember that Gastrich is here to make Misplaced Pages "more Christian," at least, according to his POV. And his claims about the "Christian institution" were answered and debunked over here. Even by standards more objective than mine, LBU is almost certainly some kind of diploma mill, but since Gastrich was too intellectually stunted to attend a real college--where they expect you to think critically, conduct research, and learn, well, we all know about that by now.

I'm not sure why it matters if any "unbelievers" vote for deletion. It simply means that a concensus is building. While some of those "unbelievers" do "dislike Christianity" (notice that Gastrich doesn't say which, though), it doesn't strike me as relevant. It's true that many find him distasteful. I do...I've made no bones about that. He's a fraud and a liar and he's even kinda creepy (a part of his "ministry" is directed specifically to pedophiles). And notice this talk of "taking sides." Seems to me that the side you've taken is that that improves Misplaced Pages as a resource. And personally, I think God is glorified (assuming that there's a God who desires glorification from us) any time someone pretending to be his messenger and minister is exposed, as Gastrich has been. Of course, the last time I looked, I wasn't aware that Misplaced Pages was here to glorify God--or Gastrich...or that any of the articles currently being considered for deletion glorify God. - WarriorScribe 16:40, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

You must have Gastrich on the run. He is resorting to 1-1 personal attacks. Blnguyen 04:20, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

And additional sock puppets. - WarriorScribe 07:17, 21 January 2006 (UTC)