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This article was nominated for deletion on June 8, 2012. The result of the discussion was keep.

Why do you use their first names here although in the Eurovision contest that made them known as a duo they performed using stage names Ell and Nikki? --85.78.173.61 (talk) 08:46, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Rock Duo?

Im 90 percent sure Ell and Nikki are not a rock duo lol — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.45.239.125 (talk) 13:28, 27 May 2011 (UTC)

Only formed for the purpose of participating in Eurovision 2011?

Didn't Eldar and Nigar compete separately on the national selection? But then they were later announced as winners? So this means that they were just put together for the sake competing in Eurovision 2011. They are two separate artists and not really an official group. Bleubeatle (talk) 08:00, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

So I think that we should just delete this article and leave Eldar & Nigar's articles on Misplaced Pages.Bleubeatle (talk) 06:32, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

They still won Eurovision as a group and the group also released the winning song as a music single which placed high on many charts. Even if they never work together again the group is notable on its own.--BabbaQ (talk) 10:08, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

And if you still strongly believe the article should be deleted then place an AfD discussion on the article and let it run its course.--BabbaQ (talk) 10:10, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

Since Eurovision in Azerbaijan has ended what will we do with the "Years active" then? Do we still put "2011-present" once they go their separate ways? Bleubeatle (talk) 10:27, 7 June 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Bleubeatle. The chances are, these guys will never be seen as a duo ever again. I believe this should be deleted but keep their individual pages and put up a disambiguation page for when users search "Ell & Nikki". Unlike The McCauls, this duo never went on to do any more work together. Cathairawr✝ 18:46, 7 June 2012 (UTC)

Yeah that's my point Cathairawr. They are still separate artists that were put together to present/perform a song for Eurovision. They aren't really doing anything together anymore. Both have been doing solo projects such as hosting and releasing their own material since they won. Just because their song(which they sang together) charted around the world and they won Eurovision doesn't mean they should be treated as a notable group and have their own article explaining their achievements together. I'm not against Ell & Nikki at all. I just feel that people should treat them as 2 separate artists who are both of notable individual importance at this site.Bleubeatle (talk) 04:34, 8 June 2012 (UTC)

They still won the Eurovision 2011 as a duo and released their winning entry as a duo, the single placed high on many charts around Europe. I see no reason whatsoever to delete this article.--BabbaQ (talk) 19:38, 7 June 2012 (UTC)

I know I am hopping off the band-wagon a slight bit. Although, take for example, Kanye West & Jay-Z. They recorded an entire whole album Watch the Throne, yet, there is no article for this duo. The album was positively reviewed and accepted by critics. Although since this was a collaboration album, there was no need to create an article for the duo. The same applies to Ell & Nikki when you think of it. Cathairawr✝ 17:10, 8 June 2012 (UTC)

But did Kanye and Jay-Z have a duo name? No. Did they win an international contest together? No. You can't compare apples and oranges.--BabbaQ (talk) 17:14, 8 June 2012 (UTC)

They won a Grammy Award for one of their songs. That should be enough notability to equate Ell & Nikki's success at Eurovision. Bleubeatle (talk) 01:55, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

• A Grammy Award versus a Eurovision 2011 win. Its equally important but in my opinion winning the worlds biggest television music contest with all of Europe voting trumps a national win of a single music Award.--BabbaQ (talk) 13:59, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry but I don't find the reason of "winning an international contest together" convincing enough. Why don't you tell me what are we going to do on the "Years active" section? Are they still working together? Now tell me are they even a valid group? That's what I'm not sure about. I know that winning this song contest is notable but to me this article feels like its purpose is to discuss the victory of two artists who competed together at a international song contest and how their winning song that they performed charted around the world. Bleubeatle (talk) 01:23, 9 June 2012 (UTC)

They won Eurovision 2011. Their winning music single placed high in numerous charts around Europe. As Ell/Nikki they have continued to perform obviously into 2012. Winning the worlds biggest music television event is notable and having a high placing music single is notable even if they would never release any music together again. I'm sorry but you are fighting against community consensus from the AfD and WP:MUSIC guidelines. It's a fight you are very unlikely to win unfortunatly, just saying.--BabbaQ (talk) 07:54, 9 June 2012 (UTC)

My point is that Eldar and Nikki should be treated as separate artists with equal notability for winning Eurovision Song Contest. Past winning Eurovision Song entries that were sang by two people, such as Rock 'n' Roll Kids, are treated as separate artists when mentioned at List of Eurovision Song Contest winners. However, Ell and Nikki are classed as a duo act. That's why I don't think that having this article is necessary. I believe that "Running Scared" was more of a collaboration between two separate artists (much like Kanye West and Jay-Z) rather than a group. I don't want to delete this article entirely, maybe its the information moved to a proper article instead. Bleubeatle (talk) 01:55, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

I agree with you. Eldar and Nikki are undoubtedly notable as Eurovision participants (and as Eurovision winners), but they are two separate artists who collaborated for one song only, they never pursued a career together as a duo, so I think this article should be changed into a redirect to their song and its information should be moved into the articles "Running Scared", Eldar and Nikki. --Stee888 (talk) 08:57, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

I like this idea, Stee888. That would also help expand Running Scared's article a bit more. Like we could talk about the duo's promotions and activities. Bleubeatle (talk) 06:18, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Still doesnt change the fact that Ell&Nikki passes WP:MUSIC. It is as simple as that. --BabbaQ (talk) 13:56, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

It really doesn't but you have to look at it in a different angle. What is the definition of a group? That's my point when I initially proposed this article for deletion. Not for just questing its notability. Were Ell & Nikki a group or a collaboration? Bleubeatle (talk) 06:18, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Ur, Bleubeatle? Most statements posted on talk pages express a point of view (POV) i.e. an opinion - that template is for articles, in which WP:NPOV applies. As for the question on if they are group or a collaboration, you could argue they are both. Does it really matter though? The article can still pass WP:N even if they are a collaboration - particularly if you merge in the articles on the individuals. CT Cooper · talk 10:54, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

A real group or just a collaboration?

I am opening this discussion to start things fresh. Ell & Nikki already meet notability guidelines as reviewed here .

But there are still some doubts if they were actually a group or were they just a collaboration? Stee888 has pointed out that they collaborated for one song only and never pursued a career together as a duo-group. So what is the definition of a "group"? What makes Ell & Nikki a group and not just a collaboration between two artists? (like Kanye West and Jay-Z, or Brandy and Monica). Discuss. Bleubeatle (talk) 06:32, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Focusing on your question I have to say that they did participate as Ell/Nikki at Eurovision. A group name for their Eurovision endeavour. What I am trying to say is that they did participate in ESC 2011 as a group and won the competition and their music single placed in several European charts. Even if they never release any new music singles as a duo we can not say that this article should be merged into their separate articles or similar. This is my last comment on this situation as notability for Ell & Nikki is beyond any doubt as stated before.--BabbaQ (talk) 11:30, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Do you have any sources that prove this? I would like to have a look at them..just to get more knowledge. Bleubeatle (talk) 11:56, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Sources? Its all in the facts of the competition. I need no sources to prove that Ell/Nikki won Eurovision 2011 and had a music single that placed high at many European charts. Which is the basis to why the article was kept at the AfD by a wide margin.--BabbaQ (talk) 11:59, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Hi, please let the AfD go already. This is a talk page. I was only asking for sources to get more knowledge and insight for myself. Not for proof. Bleubeatle (talk) 12:55, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

"Do you have any sources that prove this?", are you sure you are not looking for proof?. Im out of this discussion. Its over and done.BabbaQ (talk) 12:58, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Then you are free to leave if you want.Bleubeatle (talk) 00:36, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Discussion is not closed yet guys. So if anyone has anything else to put then you are welcome. Also following what has been said in this discussion, a few users agree that merging this article with "Running Scared" could be a good solution. Bleubeatle (talk) 23:05, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

You're making it sound like everyone who commented in this discussion has agreed to a merger, when that is not even true. The was no official vote procedure concerning a merge; only suggestions. So please, refrain from putting words into people's mouths that haven't been said, it is impolite. Also your remarks to BabbaQ above are very uncivil, and you have been told by several users now to remain civil. You asked BabbaQ to provide sources for to prove that Ell/Nikki performed together. A question like that is very silly really, its like asking if the sky is blue, or if Paris in France. Its an obvious question, with an obvious answer, and this article has all the sources to "provide" your answer, if you bothered to take time to even read them; its called common-sense. Wesley☀Mouse 18:30, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

Hi Wesley Mouse, please avoid making anymore prejudice statements about my posts again here at Misplaced Pages. I have already informed you on that in another page. If you read closely, the section's name is "A real group or just a collaboration?". When replying to BabbaQ's post I assumed that my question was being answered as stated by the user in the first line ("Focusing on your question I have to say that they did participate as Ell/Nikki at Eurovision. A group name..."). I was merely being uncivil in my response because all I wanted was to ask if there are anymore sources(or links) so that I could understand the user's answer more and to be sure that they are an official group and did not just collaborate for this contest. After all, this is a talk page and its purpose is to discuss any suggestions or doubts regarding the article's content. It would be best if you also avoid quoting other users' comments out of context and saying that "You're making it sound like everyone who commented in this..has agreed to a merger". I clearly stated that "...a few users agree..could be a good solution". By 'agreed', that includes being suggested by an individual and other users (keep in mind that it's not everyone) coming to an agreement with that individual's input. As you mentioned, they are suggestions but to assume that I was "putting words into people's mouths", being "impolite" and also commenting on "a question like that is very silly really" is immoral, demeaning and uncivil from what I feel. So please refrain from doing this again because it makes me feel hurt and offended. Bleubeatle (talk) 00:37, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Slight input, I agree with the merging solution. In my own genuine opinion, I believe it would be the best option. Cathairawr✝ 19:07, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

In my opinion a merging is something totally unecessary. And a move highly unlikely to ever get a proper consensus. Ell & Nikki passes WP:MUSIC, and has won the worlds biggest music competition as Ell & Nikki. A merge to the music single article would only be confusing and misleading to the winners actual notability.--BabbaQ (talk) 19:17, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

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