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Revision as of 07:43, 5 September 2012

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Hello Mjroots, and thanks for the tips. There's a lot to read there, but I've already found some useful help there! Eff Won (talk) 18:44, 2 September 2012 (UTC)

Eff Won, you are invited to the Teahouse

Hi Eff Won! Thanks for contributing to Misplaced Pages. Please join other people who edit Misplaced Pages at the Teahouse! The Teahouse is a friendly space on Misplaced Pages where new editors can ask questions about contributing to Misplaced Pages and get help from peers and experienced editors. I hope to see you there! Ryan Vesey (I'm a Teahouse host) Visit the TeahouseThis message was delivered automatically by your friendly neighborhood HostBot (talk) 04:33, 3 September 2012 (UTC)

Grosjean's quote

Please note that the quote from Grosjean in the season report on the 2012 Formula One season page was placed that way for a reason. There are several other quotes in the race report section that deal with major episodes of the 2012 season - such as criticisms of the Pirelli tyres, accusations that Red Bull's car was illegal in Monaco and now Grosjean's ban. They were placed in quote boxes because they are notable enough to be mentioned, but their inclusion in the text of the race report (as you have proposed or this one) breaks up the flow of the sections. It takes the focus away from the events of the race, and pushes the word count over the ~350 per section that the section has been written to. That is why Grosjean's quote - and the others - have been put in quote boxes: so that they can get coverage without interrupting the readability of the section they apply to, and so that they can be included without using up words in each subsection. Your reasons for changing them are purely cosmetic.

Please do not revert these again. Prisonermonkeys (talk) 08:00, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

This should be discussed on the article's talk page, not here. Eff Won (talk) 08:03, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Your edit

This is unacceptable. You are bound by assume good faith like everyone else here, and an attitude which includes accusing other users of "irrational hatred" is going to ensure that your stay on Misplaced Pages will be a short one. I suggest you redact or remove your comments on Prisonermonkeys' talk page. Bretonbanquet (talk) 20:29, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

It is difficult to assume good faith of a user who ruthlessly erased my first edit here on Misplaced Pages, an edit that I was proud of for the value I thought it added to the article, using the edit summary "we don't do that", when it transpires that we actually DO do that, or did, in both the 2010 and 2011 articles until that very same editor systematically and without discussion or proper explanation removed identical content from them on June 11, 2012. That same editor then got all indignant in the talk page discussions I raised about it and has been misrepresenting the state of the article and the content I tried to add and offering genarlly weak excuses for the removal of my modest contribution; presumaby in an attempt to drum up support for his stand against me. Eff Won (talk) 20:53, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Nope, I am not joking. If you have an issue with an editor's behaviour, you take it to the relevant place. Casting aspersions against him on a talk page will simply get you blocked. Nobody cares if you find it "difficult" to assume good faith - do it anyway. If you think he has a stand against you, consider how it looks from the other angle. Bretonbanquet (talk) 20:59, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Where is "the relevant place" then? Do you support his treatment and my first edit, even if you were not aware of his behaviour at the 2010 and 2011 articles? "Blocked"? For exposing inexcusable behaviour? Who would support or enact such a "block"? Eff Won (talk) 21:16, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Try WP:ANI - be sure to include links to what you've said about him. My own view of it is that you had no consensus, nor even anyone agreeing with you about the 2012 page, yet you saw fit to roll out your preferred version to the 2010 and 2011 pages. Bretonbanquet (talk) 21:22, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Where was the "consensus" to eradicate all trace of the useful links from the 2011 and 2010 pages, more than 6 months for one and over 18 months for the other, after the end of the respective seasons? Eff Won (talk) 21:28, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

I'm not having this out here with you. The consensus existed for the format of season articles after a discussion involving a number of editors. As I say, try ANI for your problem with Prisonermonkeys. Bretonbanquet (talk) 21:30, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

There is nothing on either of the talk pages about removing the calendar table links in June 2012. In fact there is no discussion after June 2011 on the 2010 talk page and nothing after January 2012 on the 2011 talk page. And that is where it should be if it is to be seen by interested editors. Eff Won (talk) 21:41, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

There is no requirement to have a consensus on display anywhere that someone might want to read it. FYI, it's here. A proposal was made to change it - no consensus = no change. Filed that ANI report yet? Bretonbanquet (talk) 21:56, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

There's nothing there in that January 2012 discussion, about condensing the 2012 calendar table, sanctioning the mass destruction of links that took place 6 months later on the 2010 and 2011 pages. Eff Won (talk) 22:05, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Nobody condensed the table. The consensus was to leave the 2012 table as it is, and that rolls out across the other season articles. There was explicitly no support for linking race reports in the calendar. You have no consensus to put the links back, so I suggest taking them out again. Bretonbanquet (talk) 22:08, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

The January 2012 discussion was about condensing the calendar table in the 2012 article, nothing else, and was rejected. Five months later in June 2012, an editor removed the specific GP links from the 2010 and 2011 articles, with no discussion and no explanation. Yesterday I restored those links because they have value and are in compliance with the guidelines on links. I can't see any reasoned discussion or consensus anywhere that they should be absent. Eff Won (talk) 06:39, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

OK, this nonsense ends now

Not every edit requires consensus. That does not mean that any editor can do what they want, but if someone makes a bold edit and there are no objections, then there is no problem. If there is a problem, then a discussion is required and consensus is needed to go forward. If no consensus is reached, then the article goes back to where it was before the changes were made.

As of a few days ago, before you appeared, there was no problem with the way the 2012 article stood, or any other past seasons that were changed to be similar. A discussion likely did take place regarding the links in the calendar, but I do not have it off hand, all I know is that it happened a while ago. And even if a discussion did not take place, no objection was made to Prisonermonkey's edits as far as I can tell.

I specifically recall telling you that since you appear to be new, and in response to your actions on the 2012 article, you should not be making bold edits, AKA calm down. Now here we are, a day later, and you're making equally bold changes to the article, and once again engaged in an edit war with multiple editors. What part of calm down did you fail to comprehend? I also specifically told you that you should discuss changes before making them, considering you had already tripped over such a foolish move once in your brief time here. And now, because people are having to deal with your bold moves made against better judgement, you start accusing people on conspiring or having alternative motives.

So, here is where you stand right now:

• Edit warring stops now, you have already crossed the line of what is a blockable offense. It is as simple as this, if you continue to revert other people's edits or make sweeping changes to articles because you feel like it, you will be reported and blocked by an administrator, it's not even a questionable matter anymore. This warring is more destructive to the articles than any sort of benefit you think your edits make.
• Accusing any other editor of anything stops now. No insults, no degradation, no accusations of underhandedness, nothing to imply that there are personal motives behind other people's edits, because at the moment you have not a single shred of evidence to support other than that people disagree with you. This too is a blockable offense. Discuss the particulars of this matter, not the editors or their reasonings. This includes making accusations on editors' own talk pages.
• If you wish to discuss policies on Misplaced Pages, I suggest giving other editors the benefit of links to the specific guidelines you feel back your claims.
• If you have any further suggestions or wish to discuss any matters regarding the layout of Formula One pages, Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Formula One is where you should be putting your ideas forth and arguing your case, not in edit summaries. The majority of editors to F1 pages watch that page, and can be involved in discussions, and this is where most consensus is made. Decisions made there can also more easily involve a variety of articles at once, instead of concentrating on a singular season.

Now I will say it once more. Calm. Down. The5₉ (Talk) 07:43, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

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