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Important informationShortcuts WP:AE WP:ARE Please use this page only to: request administrative action against editors violating a remedy (not merely a principle) or an injunction in an Arbitration Committee decision, or a contentious topic restriction imposed by an administrator, request contentious topic restrictions against previously alerted editors who engage in misconduct in a topic area designated as a contentious topic, request page restrictions (e.g. revert restrictions) on pages that are being disrupted in topic areas designated as contentious topics, or appeal arbitration enforcement actions (including contentious topic restrictions) to uninvolved administrators. For all other problems, including content disagreements or the enforcement of community-imposed sanctions, please use the other fora described in the dispute resolution process. To appeal Arbitration Committee decisions, please use the clarification and amendment noticeboard. 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Apteva

Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.

Request concerning Apteva

User who is submitting this request for enforcement

SarekOfVulcan (talk) 11:48, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

User against whom enforcement is requested

Apteva (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

Sanction or remedy to be enforced

Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Article titles and capitalisation#Log of blocks, bans, and restrictions (Article titles)

Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

1. 21 January 2013 (See explanation below)

Diffs of notifications or of prior warnings against the conduct objected to (if required)

1. Warned on 3 January 2013 by SarekOfVulcan (talk · contribs)

Additional comments by editor filing complaint

During a related edit war, Apteva started a discussion on 2 January, seen at Misplaced Pages talk:Article titles/Archive 39#Common names, regarding the excessive number of examples at WP:AT#Common names. The last edit to that particular thread was on 6 January, with Apteva asking Are any other examples needed, or are three plenty?. Having no other input, he implemented the results of the discussion in the diff above, citing "per talk", but not linking directly to the archived discussion. (Blueboar, not seeing the discussion on the active talkpage, reverted.) Noetica posted on my talkpage requesting that I sanction Apteva, per the discretionary sanctions I imposed above to end the edit war on a policy page.

However, since the last line of the logged sanction explicitly said Should a consensus discussion determine that there don't need to be 21 examples, ... that of course will not call for a block I'm not sure that there's a violation here. Therefore, I've brought the request here for independent review. Did Apteva have sufficient consensus for his edit? If so, is Noetica's request for a block tendentious, and does it call for a block itself? Thanks.

@Sandstein -- honestly, I don't think that edit was a violation of the sanctions, as it took place after an attempt at consensus discussion. However, Noetica argued on my talkpage that it was, and I didn't feel comfortable making the call in either direction myself, so I brought it here. There's currently another discussion dealing with reducing the number of examples -- once that determines what the appropriate examples are (how many and which ones), the need for this sanction will go away. As far as the warning goes, everyone who needed to see it clearly did, as shown in the lack of edit warring on the policy page since then.--SarekOfVulcan (talk) 23:40, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

Notified here

Discussion concerning Apteva

Statement by Apteva

That was a consensus edit made per the discussion at Misplaced Pages talk:Article titles/Archive 39#Common names. Since it was reverted, it will be re-opened for further discussion. But per that discussion, a clear request was made are there any more examples that needed to be added, and since none were added, the draft was dropped in as required. "Are any other examples needed, or are three plenty?" To do anything less would have been irresponsible. Apteva (talk) 01:31, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

As others have pointed out although the warning could be literally construed to mean that forever that specific example must always be at WP:AT until someone goes to Arb to get it lifted, few interpreted it that narrowly and instead construed it to mean that if anyone changed that and only that example as a bold edit and not as a consensus process they would be blocked for continuing an edit war. The edit war was completely unacceptable, and was not stopped until that warning was given, even though there was ongoing discussion about the list of examples. Normally no one expects to not be blocked who participates in an edit war instead of participating in an ongoing discussion and waiting until that discussion concludes before taking action. WP:AT is watched by approximately 600 editors, and it does not seem unreasonable to expect that if anyone had any objection to the three examples in the draft they would have said something during the two weeks between the final are three plenty question and when the page was archived. From 20:40, 2 January 2013 (UTC) when the talk page discussion started, the page was changed and finally with the "supervote" . These follow the three edits that occurred before 20:40, so in all the edit war consisted of eight edits. Seven minutes later we were warned not to restore that example which had been removed. I would have to construe it a "tag team" edit war, which I had no intention of starting, although I would stipulate that the initial edit (of the eight) was made for the purpose of disrupting Misplaced Pages to make a point. Apteva (talk) 22:09, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Per WP:BRD, if anyone is warned, it should be those who made the six edits after mine. While it is optional to do a BDR cycle instead of a BRD cycle, there really is nothing wrong with doing BRD, and a lot wrong with doing BRR... and no discussion. Apteva (talk) 22:15, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

For the record, I prefer to be referred to in gender neutral terms, no matter how strange that seems to anyone who has not made the transition from calling everyone he and she, and using he for both. He/she, his/her, they, xe, even "it" works, but not he, and not she. Thanks. Apteva (talk) 19:14, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

Comment. 1RR is not necessary on WP:AT. There is very little edit warring there and the edit war that did exist was a tag team edit war involving eight different editors and eight different edits. On the other hand reinstating the 1RR at MOS is warranted as the constant edit warring there is still continuing. Apteva (talk) 05:16, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Just as a comment, per WP:ARBATC#The Manual of Style the intent of a style guide is not to provide hard rules. For example, titles are often names of items, and it really should not be a part of the MOS to specify how titles are chosen. Up until October 2007, there was nothing in the MOS about choosing titles, but with this edit, someone who perhaps did not even know that we already had guidelines on how titles are chosen, but did know that we had a MOS, insisted that there needed to be a section in the MOS about how titles are chosen. I think that it has been way too contentious to refer to the MOS in choosing titles, and that all of that material should be moved back to WP:AT. In this edit the bold statement which was not discussed at WP:AT, was made that effectively WP:AT has no bearing on choosing titles, but only WP:MOS chooses titles. Since then much of the discussion at MOS has been about titles, all of which in my opinion is inappropriate, as only WP:AT and WP:RM decides titles, and the idea of "styling" an article title is farcical (styling only applies to choosing a font or font size, and that is done by the browser, not WP). Apteva (talk) 17:36, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

• I would strongly recommend that that warning be given to the five editors who actually were edit warring, not myself, and to the editor who actually was being disruptive, not myself, for making the bold edit that led to that edit war. Apteva (talk) 14:45, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Comments by others about the request concerning Apteva

• Apteva is subject to community sanctions concerning MOS issues, as described in this notification by Seraphimblade. Mathsci (talk) 16:13, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

@Cailil: Agreed. I noticed after adding the comment above that he was still participating at WT:AT. Mathsci (talk) 16:45, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Comments by NE Ent

Making an edit and then declaring anyone who changes it will be AE blocked per Discretionary Sanctions is bogus. First of all, it's textbook involved -- being an admin doesn't give SoV a supervote on the content dispute. Secondly, Discretionary sanctions specifically require "the editor in question be given a warning", and the procedures for administrators specifically state:
"4. Warnings should be clear and unambiguous, link to the decision authorising the sanctions, identify misconduct and advise how the editor may mend their ways;
5. Notices of imposed sanctions should specify the misconduct for which they have been imposed as well as the appeal process;"
In simpler terms -- if an admin is going to DS an editor they should be posting a notice on the editor's talk page.

The log of the incorrect sanction should be deleted and this case closed. NE Ent 13:36, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Comments by Dicklyon

Apteva has a habit of making himself very hard to ignore. His proposal to trim to 3 examples got zero support and got archived, yet he claims it would have been irresponsible for him to not go ahead and implement it, just because nobody extended his list. Very bogus. But is there an enforceable ban against such bullshit? I don't think so. Even his violations of his badly worded topic ban slide by. Teflon? Dicklyon (talk) 23:45, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Comments by Rschen7754

MBisanz already gave Apteva a final warning. --Rschen7754 19:17, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

Comments by GoodDay

I'm assuming that whatever the arbitrators decide, that decision will also apply to Delphi234, which Apteva's an alternate account of. GoodDay (talk) 18:17, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Result concerning Apteva

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.

• Very early response. Awaiting Apteva's statement. Before going any further I do think Noetica should be named above and asked to make a statement as in fairness to them SoV is bringing up potential sanctions against them.
  From a prima facia review Apteva probably didn't have consensus for the change (especially given the warning s/he had from SoV) and as Blueboar's revert noted the talk thread wasn't linked to and even in that thread the issue isn't actually discussed. As far as I can see there was no discussion in relation to Apteva's questions "is three plenty?" (see the end of the first subsection of this thread) - in that context that edit does look tendentious to me, but I'd like to see other sysop's views--Cailil 12:41, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

• @Mathsci: Apteva's community sanction is seperate. SoV has logged a specific page probation at Misplaced Pages:Article titles WRT this particular revert war, under the terms of the linked RFAR. It's this page probation that is being discussed and whether Apteva broke that, rather than his community sanction--Cailil 16:39, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

• I don't see how this edit is in violation of any AE-enforceable restriction. From what I can tell, SarekOfVulcan's argument is that Apteva's edit was in violation of SarekOfVulcan's very informally worded talk page comment, which was apparently meant to be read as an order to other editors not to change "Halley" to "Halley-Bopp" or "Halley–Bopp", on pain of a block under the discretionary sanctions authority. However, even if one assumes arguendo that this order was a valid exercise of the discretionary sanctions authority, discretionary sanctions can only be imposed, per WP:AC/DS, after "the editor in question given a warning with a link to the decision authorizing sanctions". There's no diff in evidence indicating that a warning meeting these requirements was given to Apteva, especially in relation with the abovementioned order. Accordingly, I recommend closing this as not actionable. Furthermore, I doubt that SarekOfVulcan's order, as written, is a valid exercise of the discretionary sanctions authority. I don't think AE authority may be used to freeze a page in one's preferred state, if only because after editing the page one has become editorially involved and may no longer act in one's administrative capacity. I therefore strongly recommend that SarekOfVulcan rescind said order and remove it from Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Article titles and capitalisation#Log of blocks, bans, and restrictions, where it is logged in a confusing and lengthy manner.  Sandstein  23:27, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

• I see that NE Ent above has made a very similar point, and I agree with them that SarekOfVulcan's "warning", such as it was, fell far short of the formal requirements for AE warnings that NE Ent cites.  Sandstein  23:31, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

• I'd agree that Apteva was not directly warned. However the page in question has a very clear notification of AC/DS - I'd consider that sufficient constructive warning for all involved (especially in light of the numerous discussions they were having there). However I'd agree that SoV's approach was in the least novel, by making an edit himself. This was discussed on his talk page and the advice given was that he shouldn't implement any blocks - that's what he's doing in bringing it here. That said I think Sandstein and NE Ent have a point - even if SoV didn't intend (and in my view he didn't) to "freeze the page in a preferred state" it looks like he did. That makes the whole issue sufficiently ambiguous to create as much or more trouble than it is seeking to prevent.
  But there again we have Apteva continuing an edit war nearly a month after it was resolved with a claim of consensus that is not borne out on the talk page. In my view we CAN investigate Apteva's conduct vis-a-vis the RFAR even if we rescind SoV's warning. Such an investigation may result (and in my view it might be enough) with a final warning for Apteva but I don't think we should ignore this--Cailil 13:01, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

In view of my above comment I haven't reviewed the context of Apteva's edit, but I've no objection to any appropriate warning.  Sandstein  21:00, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

• I recommend lifting the specific restriction imposed by SarekOfVulcan on Misplaced Pages:Article titles, a sanction which can be undone by a consensus here. If Sarek had originally proposed this restriction at WP:AE instead of enacting it himself, it seems to me it would be unlikely to be approved. It is too adventurous and is open to many challenges. EdJohnston (talk) 17:50, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Agreed.  Sandstein  21:00, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Specifically looking at the sanction and enforcement request and not the surrounding issues of the edit having consensus or not, the sanction was very loosely worded and it appears, whether intentional or not, that the page was put in a locked state to enforce the right version with a sanction over top of it to stop anyone who did want to change it. Either way, the sanction was very loosely worded and I agree with Sandstien that we can't enforce it. With the wording at this level, and how it appears, I also agree that the sanction needs to be rescinded until overturned by the community as Ed worded it above. -- DQ (ʞlɐʇ) 22:18, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

• Support EdJohnston's solution. KillerChihuahua 15:55, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

• Agree with rescinding SoV's sanction but I think we are missing the point significantly if we ignore Apteva's behaviour, which was clearly incompatible with the RFAR. (However in light of the lack of a direct warning re: this RFAR I would suggest issuing a final warning to Apteva & no harsher sanction at this time)--Cailil 17:14, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

• I don't think we are ignoring Apteva's behavior; but if you feel it necessary, I have no objection to adding an official AE warning to those which they have already received. KillerChihuahua 19:19, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

• I support giving Apteva a warning of the discretionary sanctions under this case. Suggest that we also consider renewing the WP:1RR restriction on WP:MOS which had been imposed by User:Guerillero, since it expired on 15 January. Recommend that we also place a 1RR on WP:Article titles for six months. EdJohnston (talk) 04:19, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

• I agree that we should give a DS warning to Apteva. Though I'm not sure implementing 1RR is going to do anything of benefit here. It appears already that the reverts have been mostly within that restriction already. -- DQ (ʞlɐʇ) 14:37, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

• I don't particularly object to 1RR, but the need for applying such restrictions is not evident to me from the evidence submitted here, nor from the recent page histories.  Sandstein  14:49, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

• OK, if we are deciding not to impose any 1RR restrictions, then we are closing by lifting Sarek's article-level sanction on Misplaced Pages:Article titles. There are also proposals from Sandstein and Cailil to at least issue a final warning to Apteva. Can anyone propose the text for this final warning? I assume this would be in addition to the WP:AC/DS notice under WP:ARBATC. EdJohnston (talk) 01:07, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

• Something along the lines of:

  The Manual of Style, the article titles policy ('WP:TITLE'), and similar policy and guideline pages are subject discretionary sanctions, as imposed by the Arbitration Committee here. Further editwarring, disruptive editing or other misconduct in relation to these pages will result in sanctions being imposed on your account(s).

  This or perhaps the boilerplate might cover it better?--Cailil 14:18, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Noetica

Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.

Request concerning Noetica

User who is submitting this request for enforcement

Apteva (talk) 13:58, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

User against whom enforcement is requested

Noetica (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

Sanction or remedy to be enforced

Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Article titles and capitalisation#All parties reminded

Here is someone you can warn about WP:ARBATC

Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

1. 27 January 2013 ARBCOM does not resolve content disputes, their role was just to stop everyone from arguing
2. 27 January 2013 Such vitriolic serves no purpose and has nothing to do with improving this policy
3. 27 January 2013 After two further edits to fix grammar

Diffs of notifications or of prior warnings against the conduct objected to (if required)

1. Warned on 3 January 2013 by Apteva (talk · contribs)
2. Warned on 11 January 2013 by Born2cycle (talk · contribs)

Additional comments by editor filing complaint

Focusing on the editor is endemic at Misplaced Pages talk:MOS.

Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

Discussion concerning Noetica

Statement by Noetica

Comments by others about the request concerning Noetica

Comment by The Devil's Advocate

This seems like a terribly POINTy AE request given the above discussion regarding Apteva.--The Devil's Advocate _{tlk. cntrb.} 18:47, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Result concerning Noetica

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the section above.