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References to use

Please add to the list references that can be used for the film article.

Besides the usual lists of critics from Metacritic and Rotten Tomatoes there is also some good early round-up of the critical commentary from the Los Angeles Times. -- Horkana (talk) 14:29, 18 December 2010 (UTC)


GA Review

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Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:Tron: Legacy/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Ankitbhatt (talk · contribs) 17:10, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

On hold: this article is awaiting improvements before it is passed or failed.

Minor points

I'm not going to do a very in-depth analysis of the article yet. However, a single look at the article throws up a few points.

  • Lead requires expansion.
  • Too many one or two-line sentences classified as separate sub-sections. I suggest merging them with other paragraphs. Done
  • Even in other sub-sections, there is awkward paragraph splitting. I suggest the main contributors to either collect more information and expand small paragraphs, or do some re-arranging and tweaks and collapse certain section to a smaller number of bigger paragraphs.
  • References should be checked for internal consistency. Additionally, it would be preferable if all reference titles use sentence case.
  • Try to get rid of the red links. It disrupts reading flow. Either create the necessary articles or simply remove the ] part. Done

More to come. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 17:10, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

Comment I quick-failed the previous nom, back in January... and the article's been practically the same since then (the only improvement was shortening the plot and a short section on Interface design, which doesn't compensate the lack of a Visual effects section). Between Ankit's complaints, my complaints, and dead links, things don't look promising. igordebraga ≠ 20:01, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

I renominated to see another party's view and give a longer chance to clean the page up, rather than it being failed and it being re-submitted for another nom, which would be time consuming. RAP (talk) 23:16 21 April 2012 (UTC)

I just saw the first GA review of Tron: Legacy, and I was completely taken aback to see that there had not been an ounce of effort towards rectifying some of the problems mentioned. And believe me, they were major problems. i skimmed through the article once more and found some more problems (some of which will overlap with Igordebraga;

  • Visual effects section is absent. What? Are we actually talking about Tron: Legacy? Done
  • Critical reception states that the film received mixed reviews, though at first sight I can't see even an average review listed, let alone a negative one. I will be a bit hard on this part since I myself disliked the film. That's akin to POV, so I suggest changes. You can remove less-notable reviews as well. Done

Whenever I review anything, my first priority is to see that the article looks good; the article should be pleasant to read, informative, big and well-written (grammatically, prose-wise etc.) Tron: Legacy fails even that basic criteria. In fact, I don't think Tron: Legacy even passes the B-class criteria, let alone GA (which has more stringent standards). I am willing to put this on hold, and I'll be a bit lenient: within the stipulated one-week gap, I hope to see at least 60% of the concerns to be cleared up. The visual effects section is a must. I may sound a bit harsh, but I see a lot of laziness mainly because there has been no attempt to improve the article after the first GAR. I hope the second time won't be so poor. Cheers. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 05:04, 22 April 2012 (UTC)

The article will need a major overhaul. I am currently working on expanding it, but I'm not sure if it will pass this time around.—DAP388 (talk) 21:25, 23 April 2012 (UTC)
You still have six days' time to complete the 60% mark; I hope that is adequate, as I'm technically not supposed to do this :P. Let's just hope that Tron: Legacy won't need a third GAN; its long and pointless, and adds up to the backlog. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 04:55, 23 April 2012 (UTC)

Note: I have changed the status of this review to "on hold" as that seems to be the intention. Glimmer721 02:26, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

Alright, one week's time is up. I can see some good progress in the article, but a number of issues still remain.

  • Lead is still not big enough. It should adequately summarize the entire article, which the lead does not.
  • Why is that big white space present in the Themes section? Please get rid of it. Done
  • Talking about the Themes section, it should be a sub-section of Production, NOT a separate section in itself. Done
-Themes are an entirely different thing to production, so it does need it's own section.
  • Tiny sub-sections still exist - Interface design, Sound effects, Graphic novel, Electronics and toys. Either expand or merge with other sections. Done
  • References need internal consistency in formatting.
  • Dead references need to be replaced. To avoid future problems, start archiving references. Done
  • It should be just "Sequel" sub-section, not "Movie sequel". Done
  • Critical reception section is big but disordered. Apply this rule : Positive reviews in one paragraph (two if large in number), mixed reviews in another paragraph, and negative reviews in last paragraph (or two). Immediately after the RT/Metacritic bits we get a D+ review, which is weird to say the least.
  • In the box office section, avoid using words like "impressive" - "In China, it had an impressive opening of $10,624,412 but it quickly faded out for a final gross of $18,889,822." does not sound encyclopedic. Instead, write this - "In China, the film debuted to $10,624,412, which was described as "impressive". However, the film failed to sustain momentum, and ended its theatrical run with $18,889,822."
  • In fact, there are quite a lot of problems with the box office section. Try to be less emotional. "It failed to top the box office on its overseas opening, since it earned only $20.3 million", "It topped the box office with $17,509,781 on its first day and $44,026,211 throughout the weekend, far ahead of the other two new releases". Such sentences sound bad - "only", "far ahead", they give a very amateur feel to the prose. Rectify it, in a similar way as stated above.
  • Film names in all places should be italicized. "Bridges called the experience surreal and said it was "Just like the first Tron, but for real!" - Tron is not italicized. Similarly for all other places, for any other film. Done

There may be lots more, so I'll keep checking. Cheers. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 05:42, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

I am afraid that this has gone long enough. Some of the aspects have been ticked Done despite the fact that they are clearly not done. The article needs pruning of repetitions, ordering of the Reception section, work on referencing and much much more than the occasional revert. I am now further intensified in my insistence on a peer review before the article comes to GAN. In compliance with this, I am failing Tron: Legacy this GAN until more work can be done on this. I encourage re-nomination only when a thorough peer review is carried out, which eliminates a lot of the problems plaguing this article. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 11:07, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

Sorry you didn't see the massive improvements made, but your impatience has wasted another GA nom. alot of your suggestions are small things. The Themes do need a seperate section as themes aren't part of the development or production. I will have a peer review conducted and when i re-nom, hopefully a different editor reviews it. RAP (talk) 14:08 6 May 2012 (UTC)
Excuse me? If you look up, I have already said that a lot of good work has been done. If this is impatience, then I am sorry but it is more likely you who are impatient; GAs are not the easiest things to happen on Misplaced Pages. And let me correct you in this regard: the points I wrote above were the superficial problems. I hadn't even started the bits about grammar, cohesion, reading flow, detailed referencing, placement of content etc. which is the actual part of the GA. Go ahead, ask another reviewer to review the article next time, I have absolutely no problem with that and I don't review the same article twice anyway. If you wish to assume bad faith and blame your inability to improve the article on me, well, I can't say anything. Good day. ~*~AnkitBhatt~*~ 16:04, 7 May 2012 (UTC)
Excuse me? My point was you failed it while the improvements were still being made. And since that happened, another GA nom will have to be comissioned, which shouldn't have been necessary. I've spent the past few days changing the references (a very minor and picky thing). RAP (talk) 12:40 8 May 2012 (UTC)

Kingdom Hearts 3D

Where can we add on this article that the world of Tron: Legacy will be in the game Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance? Lacon432 (talk) 17:08, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

This article is not about Kingdom Hearts. Consensus has agreed that Kingdom Hearts references will not be included in this or any other Tron article. --Jeremy (blah blah • I did it!) 05:02, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Box Office

Given that I wasn't finish with the section, I do understand that some concerns have been brought up regarding the point of view and wording. Any suggestions on how to address the concerns would be helpful. —DAP388 (talk) 00:03, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Why don't I work out a compromise (likely tomorrow AM sometime) and post it here, and if you'd like to go ahead and do the same, either here or in the main article since it's been reverted back to your version anyway. Again, I liked your added analysis, I might just rework the wording. --Williamsburgland (talk) 03:26, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
Alright. That sounds good to me. :) —DAP388 (talk) 04:08, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
Ok, here's my proposed version. All your analysis is still there; I reworked some of the wording and removed some stuff I felt was OR. Let me know what you think.

===Box Office

During its theatrical run, Tron: Legacy grossed $400,062,763; $172,062,763 in the North America, and $228,000,000 in other countries. and was Disney's fourth film in 2010 to reach $400 million worldwide. It stayed in theaters until April 14, 2011.

In North America the film earning $44,026,211 during the course of the weekend. On its opening day it grossed $17.6 million, including $3.6 million during midnight showings from 2,000 theaters (29% of which were IMAX screenings). and went on to claim the top spot during its opening week ahead of Yogi Bear and How Do You Know , with with roughly $68 million. The film crossed $100 million on its 12th day in release, and closed domestically with a total of $172 million.

Leading up to the release, various commercial analysts predicted that Tron: Legacy would gross $40–$50 million during its opening weekend, a figure that Los Angeles Times commentator Ben Fritz wrote would to be "solid but not spectacular". Although the executives of Walt Disney Pictures hoped to attract a broad audience, the film primarily appealed to men: "Women appear to be more hesitant about the science-fiction sequel", wrote Fritz. Jay Fernandez of The Hollywood Reporter felt that the disproportionate audience would be problematic for the films long term box office prospects. Writing for Box Office Mojo, Brandon Gray attributed pre-release hype to “unwarranted blockbuster expectations from fanboys”, and noted that the films predecessor was considered a box office failure when it was released, and that the sequel handily out grossed it, even when inflation is considered.

In international markets, Tron: Legacy grossed $23 million on its opening weekend, averaging $6,000 per theater. According to Disney, 65% of foreign grosses originated from five key markets; Japan, Australia, Brazil, United Kingdom, and Spain. The film performed the best in Japan, where it took $4.7M from 350 theaters. Australia, ($3.4M), the United Kingdom ($3.2M), Brazil ($1.9M), and Spain ($1.9M). By the following week, Tron: Legacy obtained $65.5 million from foreign markets, bringing total grosses to $153.8 million. At the end of its run the film grossed $228 million internationally.

It's fine. My only gripe is that I think the analysis should be before the performance, but other than that, it looks good. :) —DAP388 (talk) 18:38, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
I disagree - I think the subject should come before the analysis of said subject... does that make sense? If you still disagree should we each invite a second set of eyes to come up with a consensus?--Williamsburgland (talk) 19:34, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
Nah, it's only a minor gripe. It's good the way it is. —DAP388 (talk) 20:56, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Reception

We do need to arrange the positive and negative reception in a organized fashion, as there are mixed and positive infused with negative paragraphs. It's all a bit confusing. Rusted AutoParts 16:34, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

I actually don't mind the basic format right now; it seems to be arranged by talking points, such as effects, story and character development, which I think reads better than two sections for positive and negative reviews, particularly since what makes a review positive or negative is often left up to the editor. I do agree that it needs tightening and better flow, and we could probably reduce the word count as well. Want me to take a quick pass at it and post a proposal here or are you working on it? --Williamsburgland (talk) 17:26, 18 June 2012 (UTC)
It was a point brought up in one of the GA reviews. And in my experience, if you don't fix anything the reviewers suggest, the next nom will be failed. I've been considering working on it, but the mass text confuses me a little. Rusted AutoParts 14:23, 19 June 2012 (UTC)
Ok, why not take a stab at it then; if I have any input I'll add it.--Williamsburgland (talk) 14:24, 19 June 2012 (UTC)
The reviews are linked to the most frequently mentioned aspects of the film. Not only does it give an insightful view on the critical reception, but it doesn't become repetitious and it looks much more organized (aside from the last paragraph, which I plan on writing in with the rest of the section). —DAP388 (talk) 01:50, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

I've got to say I'm having some issues with the changes that are taking place here - it seems like negative reviews are being removed in favor of more positive/neutral ones. Full disclosure - I liked the movie, but I do think the section needs to reflect critical consensus. I'll give it a closer read later on and share more specific thoughts here.--Williamsburgland (talk) 21:48, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

Lead

In the last paragraph of the article's lead-in, it states that film critics "were critical of the character development as well as the performance of the cast as a whole". Yet later, in the critical response section, its established that Micheal Sheen's performance received plaudits as opposed to the rest of the cast. Does this exception make the former phrase sound slightly contradictory? The wording made me re-read the sentence over again, therefore that's why I'm bringing it up. ~ Jedi94 (talk) 18:56, 20 June 2012 (UTC)

I think I agree... the issue is likely that the lead is making a generalization, which might be accurate in the context of the critical consensus, but not when considering individual reviews. We might want to simply include a quote of RT's critical consensus to avoid OR generalizations. --Williamsburgland (talk) 18:59, 20 June 2012 (UTC)
The reception section isn't finished just yet. —DAP388 (talk) 01:54, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

Plot contention - the color of Tron's lights

This is a minor detail, but one that has become a consistent issue with regards to this article. The color of the lights on Tron's armor, both prior to his transformation into Rinzler and subsequent to his regaining his identity, are WHITE (similar to Sam, Flynn, and Quorra). Not only is this clearly evident in the film itself, but every piece of tie-in media for the film (Tron: Evolution, Tron: Uprising, Tron: Betrayal, etc.) also depicts Tron with white lights on his armor. Tron: Evolution goes so far as to offer an indirect explanation as to why Tron's color is white (Flynn bestowed upon Tron some of his administrative power). It's understandable that due to certain environmental factors, the white lights in the film occasionally appear to be blue - however, there is still a stark contrast between blue and white, as evidenced in this image: http://idigitalcitizen.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/sam-flynn-battle-2560x1440.jpg?w=2560 I do not understand why this issue persists, but I must once again motion that where the article currently says "blue," it should be changed to "white." Zargabaath 01:15, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

It's not too important of an issue to publish onto the article. It's eludes blue, and if we change that, fanboy IP's will make a point of reverting back, causing an edit war, and we want to avoid that. Rusted AutoParts 19:31, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
I was not aware that the accuracy of a Misplaced Pages article was contingent on it's propensity for starting edit wars; and when did Wiki begin curtailing to fanboys? To the point at hand, I would argue that if the color is important enough to be mentioned in the article at all (which it currently is, as "blue"), then the correct color should be listed, period. Also, from a contextual standpoint, the changing of Tron's colors signified his breaking free of Clu's control, which is a relatively important plot point. Again, to the question of color, the only reason Tron's lights appear even slightly blue is because extraneous color from the environment can sometimes bleed into the glow of white light. When determining the actual color, one only has to look at the core of the light, which (as demonstrated in the image I linked above) makes it very simple to make the distinction. Look at the the flashback scene from the film in which Tron and Flynn are confronted by Clu - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUCBTize2mg#t=1m11s ...there's no question that Tron's light's are white, just like Flynn's. Zargabaath 09:55, 2 July 2012 (UTC)

The following images are taken from Tron: Legacy and it's official tie-ins Tron: Evolution and Tron: Uprising, all of which indicate that the color of Tron's armor before becoming Rinzler was WHITE - http://www.solidimagearts.com/danplatt/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/tron_boxleitner.jpg, http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_wxtdziSoI_M/TP4RCPQ6MII/AAAAAAAACug/5pnmJhGvX3U/s1600/tron%2Bevolution%2BGame%2BPC.jpg, http://static.thesystemaddicts.com/images/610x320/tron-evolution--15.jpg, http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6rmvwcSzl1qbu0veo1_500.png, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7L5rYo5BOI. I've provided a wealth of evidence supporting this fact, and will change the information so that it is accurate the article. Zargabaath 12:30, 19 November 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry, why is it important to note the light color of the armor at all? Is it helping to clarify a plot point, something that the costumers debated that we're covering in production? If not, it probably has no business being in the article at all as it is the very definition of a trivial detail. Millahnna (talk) 21:04, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
As stated in an earlier post, the change in the color of Rinzler's lights signifies his breaking free of Clu's control and regaining his original identity as Tron - it is the conclusion of Tron's (the titular character) involvement in the film, and creates a plot device for the potential sequel(s); it is not trivial at all. This fact has not been a point of contention previously, so there is no reason to question it now; it is the color of the lights (which must be mentioned for purposes of differentiation) that has been "debated" despite an abundance of physical and contextual evidence indicating the truth. Zargabaath 11:08, 20 November 2012 (UTC)

No no I get all of that (the story significance of the color change). But there's still no need to actually mention the color itself at all. "The lights change color" is what is important. "Tron falls into the Sea of Simulation, where the colored lights on his armor change from matching CLU's to Tron's" would work just fine. That said, I agree it's a little odd that it was stable and then suddenly is a point of such heated debate, when again, kind of trivial what the specific colors are. Millahnna (talk) 00:18, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

The destruction of the Grid?

There's been quite a lot of debate about this in the past, but I personally think that from what I saw, when Flynn and CLU were destroyed, they took the Grid with them, since everything in the Grid was caught in the blast front of the explosion. Visokor (talk) 16:33, 2 July 2012 (UTC)

Not really, we see the blast taking the Portal, CLU´s ship and the floating rocks over the Sea of Simulation and that´s it, the Sea itself and the rocky shore, as we can see, are not destroyed so the City and the large wastelands are likely to have survived as well; what role the Grid would play in a future sequel is anyone´s guess... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.27.43.242 (talk) 02:33, 9 July 2012 (UTC)

The Grid and everything in it could be restored from a backup.Cousert (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 01:20, 16 November 2012 (UTC)

Contradictory statement: "Wholly shot in 3D"

I found this phrase twice in the article: "Tron: Legacy was wholly shot in 3D", but then explanatory text in the Filming section says that portions of the film were shot in 2D. It was well-publicized that the "real-world" sequences were deliberately presented in 2D in the theaters, and some text in Filming suggests that these sequences were later enhanced or converted to 3D in post-processing.

Overall, I found the article's discussion on the use of 3D to be confusing and self-contradictory, but I don't have enough information to know which interpretation is the correct one. Could someone with some more knowledge here go through and fix the contradictions? Thanks. — KieferSkunk (talk) — 19:46, 13 November 2012 (UTC)

Since I couldn't seem to get anyone's attention to this, I took it upon myself to find a site that acknowledged the 2D real-world sequences and updated the article. — KieferSkunk (talk) — 08:33, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
The source that the claim was attributed to does not state it was "shot wholly in 3d" so I don't think there is a problem with removing that statement. It was probably just some editorializing. Good catch anyway. Betty Logan (talk) 14:51, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
  1. Cite error: The named reference BoxOfficeMojo was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
  2. Gray, Brandon (2011-05-01). "Around-the-World Brief: 'Thor' Conquers, 'Fast' Speeds Up". Box Office Mojo. Amazon.com. Retrieved 2011-05-02.
  3. McClintock, Pamela (December 17, 2010). "Tron Earns $3.6 Million in Midnight Showing". The Hollywood Reporter. Prometheus Global Media. Retrieved June 15, 2012.
  4. McClintock, Pamela (December 19, 2010). "'Tron: Legacy' Wins Soft Box Office; James L. Brooks' 'How Do You Know' Disappoints". The Hollywood Reporter. Prometheus Global Media. Retrieved June 15, 2012.
  5. ^ Hernandez, Jay (December 16, 2010). "BULLSEYE, Dec. 17: 'Tron,' 'Yogi,' 'Gulliver,' 'Grit,' More". The Hollywood Reporter. Prometheus Global Media. Retrieved June 15, 2012.
  6. ^ Fritz, Ben (2010-12-17). "Box office projector: 'Tron' to beat 'Yogi Bear' and 'How Do You Know'". Los Angeles Times. Tribune Company. Retrieved 2010-12-28.
  7. Gray, Brandon (2011-01-18). "'True Grit,' 'Inception' Impress Most in Tepid 2010". Box Office Mojo. Amazon.com. Retrieved 2011-04-08.
  8. ^ Segers, Frank (December 19, 2010). "'Tron: Legacy' Draws $23 Mil Overseas, Hits No. 1 in Europe, Latin America and Australia". The Hollywood Reporter. Prometheus Global Media. Retrieved June 15, 2012.
  9. ^ McClintock, Pamela (December 26, 2010). "'Little Fockers' Wins Box Office; 'Gulliver's Travels' Disappoints". The Hollywood Reporter. Prometheus Global Media. Retrieved June 15, 2012.
  10. Cite error: The named reference imazss was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
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