Misplaced Pages

In an apparent effort to collect "credit" for creating articles, Captain Assassin rushes to create redirects and articles, apparently merely copying info from IMDb. Palo Alto (2013 film) was created with one (and only one) source which directly and specifically stated that the collection of stories ("Palo Alto") was expected to be made into three films, none of which are named "Palo Alto" and none of which are likely to be released in 2013. The Winter Queen (2014 film) was created as a redirect with the target only stating that filming was expected to begin in 2011 (with 2010 sources); the IMDb page likely used has now been deleted. Just Before I Go was created as a nonsensical redirect to the director. Faced with the possible deletion of the redirect, Captain created an article based on one (and only one) source that only knows of the project as "Hello I Must Be Going". In general (supporting my IMDb as the only source theory) his film articles include substantial lists of names not found in any other source (seriously: where else do you find the editor's name when the film has just started filming?). In addressing this issue, Captain says, essentially, that he plans to find sources for the information he adds after adding it. In short, it seems Captain is frequently here to collect "credit", not to build an encyclopedia. - SummerPhD (talk) 02:49, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

• I've just read the editor's talk page, and I think the problem goes well beyond creating bizarre redirects and unsourced articles about possible future films. I don't think a topic ban is going to cut it here, the real problem is a total lack of competency. I would support a topic ban if that's as far as folks are willing to go, but I'm afraid the real solution is an indef block until this editor shows some sign of understanding how things work, and how he can edit productively. Beyond My Ken (talk) 03:28, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Wow, what a good idea of indefinite block, am I doing wrong now? Redirects and unsourced problems are solved already, I'm not doing that again. Now the problem is moving articles or redirects, well you can have my word and see for the next time. There will be nothing gone of you if you'll just give me some time and see if I do it again. -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 05:39, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I'll be very pleased if you show me to be wrong. Beyond My Ken (talk) 07:27, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I'll show you to be wrong, just give me time to show my improvements. -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 09:46, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

He could probably do with tidying up his signature a bit too. 529 characters to sign and date a post (especially when the I'll show you to be wrong, just give me time to show my improvements. comment is just 69 characters long). Nick (talk) 13:18, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

• I'm certainly going to support an indef, having looked at this. Captain Assassin's behaviour is flat-out wrong, and needs to stop, permanently. Moving around articles on your whim, and copy-paste moves to try and gain credit is bang out of order, and this is not what Misplaced Pages is for. Add in the inappropriate new articles you've created, and we're left with an editor who is clearly WP:NOTHERE to build an encyclopedia, but is here to attention seek, by any means possible. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 16:26, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

How is my behavior flat-out wrong now? What am I doing now, I'm just saying that I'll show myself improved if you just give me some time and see. Is there anything wrong in saying that? -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 16:58, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

• Capt. Assassin - recommend you post on the Film Project talk page to get other users opinions on page moves. For example, you recently moved Belle (2013 film) to Belle (2014 film), which I believe you did in good faith. I've moved it back, per WP:FILMRELEASE (the Toronto premiere makes it a 2013 film). Please read the FILMRELEASE guide I've linked to, and if in doubt, please head to the Film Project for futher clarity. The same with the redirects too. Thanks! Lugnuts 19:02, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

• Thank you Lugnuts, I'll discuss the films related topics there next time. -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 22:57, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

• • No probs. Rather than all this topic ban nonsense, I purpose a simple "do not move/do not create redirects" until futher notice. Captain Assassin has done some great work expanding articles and I think this is a bit heavy-handed (I can't see a previous ANI about the same issue). For page moves, if in doubt either go to the film project or log a request at requested moves. For redirects, there's no need to create them as they would fail WP:NFF and will be speedily deleted in any case. Of course, if you are actually starting a new notable article, that is fine. Any of the people who brought this to ANI disagree? Thanks. Lugnuts 06:26, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

• Thanks again Lugnuts, but look, I'll not move any redirect or film page until I noticed you but creating redirects is another problem. Because if I'm willing to create an article (as example an adaptation) later so if I have reliable sources at the target and the film is in development so I should have created the redirect, what do you think of that? Sorry if I'm wrong but I think WP:NFF is for future films articles but I'm not creating the articles until principal photography or filming begin, I'm just saying for the creation of redirects to make them article later when filming begin. -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 15:49, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

There is nothing in Misplaced Pages:Redirect which appears to justify creating a redirect for a subject that doesn't meet notability guidelines. AndyTheGrump (talk) 16:01, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes and there is a thing in that to create the redirects to the sections of other articles if we need it, so I think redirects can be created if they meet notability, like I said I will only create the redirects when target articles have reliable sources and proper evidence of the redirected article and then it is a significant redirect to wait to be created into a good and expanded article later. And its just redirects man, everyone creates the redirects some have been caught ( like me :), kidding ) and others fled, it's just the matter of time. -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 16:54, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Per the last comment, I would say that at minimum, any topic ban on Captain Assassin! needs to unequivocally include a complete ban on creation of any redirects. This contributor is self-evidently obsessed with 'getting in first', and such an attitude can only be to the detriment of the project. AndyTheGrump (talk) 19:10, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

I would agree completely with the fact that any topic ban will need to include a complete ban on creation of any redirects. Unfortunately, I cannot see Captain Assassin! being able to follow through with this. From his comments above, he clearly is not interested in agreeing to such a ban. From the conversations he has had with User:Rossami and User:SummerPhD on his talk page, he has gone back on his word to not create redirects without proper sources many times. For that reason, for his recent comments above, and his history of wanting to get "credit" for everything, I think the encyclopedia would benefit if he was permanently blocked. --Logical Fuzz (talk) 20:15, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes, the evidence doesn't look too good in CA's favour. This redirect was created in the last 24hrs (IE while this discussion was ongoing) with the edit summary "Film is not started filming or production yet so redirect to its main article". The main article states " was still in the works however likely would follow Terminator 5, which is due for release in 2015". Hardly grounds for creating a meaningful redirect of any real use. Lugnuts 11:47, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• I'm not saying that I'm always going to create redirects, I'm just saying that I'll only create some redirects with high notability. I'm not fighting and doing anything harm to you or Misplaced Pages, I'm just asking for it to let me do it just a few which I will create and expand later. I'll create redirects like 50 or 100 a moment or in a month, I'll only create which have to be created (like novel and musical adaptations with production information at their targets. I'm asking it very politely, if you are thinking I'm in bad mood or I'm a angry person, well I'm not. I'm agree with you all but about redirects I'm just asking for it because everyone here in Misplaced Pages is allow to create them, so should I. I've learned so much in this discussion but I want to help Misplaced Pages. If you just think a little that a redirect will take us to the target where information of that redirected article is available with pure reliable sources and this thing is also an Admin said to me to put information about the redirected article at the target with sources then create the redirect. I'm not talking about credits here, I'm talking about rules. There are no rules to not create the redirects, if you want to ban me you should ban completely creating redirects so no one will create redirects in future. And again (specially to you Logical Fuzz), I'm not a bad guy or a rude if you are thinking of that, I'm a very politely talking and kind heart person in my real life and I'm not talking rude here too. And as above User:Lukeno94 said about my behavior, I never get angry even if someone beat me hardly so how would I behave rude or my behavior could be wrong. I'm just a animation student with full of sorrows and grieves who is looking for happiness in real life. I never hurt a person real life how can I harm or destroy encyclopedia, I don't want to. I'm nothing in here, I've made mistakes and still making perhaps, so do everyone (if not now sometimes in the past). I like very much to help encyclopedia even I tell everyone around me (my friends) to use it and help it by editing, I'm a fast learner and I don't do the thing again if someone stopped me to not to do (even in my real life) but this redirect thing is just making me crazy, you now why if you have just saw me editing or working here you all can see that I've mostly worked on stub creating, I mean I love to create stub articles, I love to start them and see others expanding them. It's not like I want credits, once I wanted it when I moved some redirects mentioned above but when I got here in this discussion I swore not to do that again. You are not thinking clearly or perhaps not understanding me clearly, don't mind I'm just saying, I think I wrote something which teased you or I don't know...which showed you or made you think that my behavior is rude but seriously I'm very polite talking. I don't know why I want to create redirects so much perhaps for stub creating as I told. You can see my whole editing history or ask Mr. User:Bgwhite or User:Mar4d, I'm really very interested in creating stubs and I had always in past. So I'm just asking/saying please don't ban it, it helps to create history in editing of that article which I think also benefits Misplaced Pages. Or if, if you want to ban it then I'll suggest ban it permanently in Misplaced Pages so no one should create them (if you think redirects are harmful to encyclopedia). And in last this blocked thing, I don't think Misplaced Pages wants a user blocked who is editing a lot (if not a lot then a few but it is something), so I don't want to be blocked at any price but I've told you my problems and solutions as well in this comment. I don't know what you all are thinking but I'm not being rude to anyone, once I was angry only with User:Rusted AutoParts but I forgave him after that and I apologize to him now. You all should know that I'm a Muslim and we are very good in forgiving (if not everyone, I'm), our religion wants peace and we are peaceful. Today is our Eid al-Fitr holiday celebrations, this is a great celebration day for all Muslims, I'll just say Allah bless you all with great happiness :). Please don't think I'm involving the religion in this, it's just because today is a big day for us. By the way Lugnuts, I thought you were helping me in this condition of mine Twins 2 is the title in development announced by actor, is it wrong seriously?. So the decision is up to you all, I'm nothing guys but I'm just wanting to help it because I love Misplaced Pages and I told this to everyone around me when they make joke of me editing it (personally I want to edit it and edit and edit and edit it like always :) ). -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 15:24, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Considering the above, I repeat my suggestion of a WP:CIR block rather than a topic ban. Beyond My Ken (talk) 18:56, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• I also repeat my comment. Captain Assassin is either trolling, is otherwise choosing to ignore the concerns raised by everyone in this thread, or simply doesn't understand what is going on. Either way, their wall of text is a clear sign that they're a net negative. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 19:32, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• I just don't know what to say now really, I'm feeling very sorry for my last comments above. Just do what you want to do, I'm on my kneels now. Or let's negotiate it in better ways if someone here is good in that or bring someone here. -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 15:34, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

I've known Assassin since he first started. For full disclosure, I do consider him a friend around here. I've personally never seen Assassin do any trolling or ignore concerns. He does however have trouble understanding. Assassin's current actions are vary similar to when he first started. It took a bit, but Kudpung and I finally "knocked" some sense into him. I'm not sure if it a language barrier or cultural differences or.... I can see two solutions.

1. Before any page move or redirect created, he asks somebody first. After a bit of time, Assassin will understand what constitutes a good or bad page move. I am willing to be the person to help him out, however this is not my area of expertise. If Assassin does move a page or create a redirect without asking first, he should have a page move and redirect ban placed.
2. Place a page move and redirect ban now. But, not a permanent one.

I would, of course, favour option #1. Beyond My Ken said, "...real solution is an indef block until this editor shows some sign of understanding how things work, and how he can edit productively." I don't think one can get an "understanding how things work" without one showing him how in a non-adversarial setting. Bgwhite (talk) 00:41, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

• Its a good idea what Bgwhite recommends, ask someone first before creating a redirect or moving a page, if I was doing wrong or I'm doing wrong I think I'll understand the problems and errors what I was doing in the past. I've learned from Bgwhite so much, he helped me a lot and I respect him and all of you here but I'll suggest to give me time first and let me go on the good way. Eventually you'll see my improvement, I can guarantee that. -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 05:35, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
• So the solution is simple - don't make redirects and discuss page moves first (ideally with the film project)? Yes? This is the way forward for everyone, right? Lugnuts 08:27, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

• I would suggest, having read the entire screed, that CA be mentored actively to ensure that he understands. During this period we can expect a decreasing volume of errors. However, if the willingness he expresses to ask first shows signs of weakening, and if the behaviour of poor moves et al reappears, the community should take a further view. Fiddle Faddle 08:36, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

• Yes, I'm 100% agreed with Lugnuts, I'll not create redirects and I'll discuss moves at Film project talk. And as Bgwhite said to ask first, I'll ask someone for further moves and redirects. -- Assassin! No, Captain Assassin! 09:25, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

Incivility, personal attacks, bad faith by User:Joefromrandb

Joefromrandb (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

Several hours ago, User:Joefromrandb made this edit to a discussion of the merits of having either George W. Bush or Henry Clay on the list. His edit summary was "I get it- you hate George W. Bush; get in line", and his edit accuses me (and by extension the four other editors who want Clay on the list) Setting aside the NPA nature of his comments, the following things are wrong with his assertion of bias:

1. The primary reason for removing Bush was recentism, not incompetence
2. Henry Clay is a quite significant American political figure
3. We just removed Bill Clinton from the list
4. Clay and Bush are of the same political persuasion; Clay's Whig Party morphed into Bush's GOP

When I explained those points to him, he said that it was "a laugh", taking this as some colossal joke and refusing to walk back his allegations of political bias against five editors. Oh, and as I was preparing this thread, he not only continually refused to walk back his outlandish claims, he called me "assholish" for asking him to do so, referring in his edit summary as my request being "sauce for the goose". Could somebody please explain to him that he can't make blanket accusations like that, because I'm not getting through to him? pbp 18:03, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

• I would note that this is hardly the first time this user has resorted to ad homonem name-calling of people he disagrees with: a few weeks ago, he called mops who were involved in blocking him for 3RR "children". Last week, he levied this gem at an admin he disagreed with. In addition, he has been chastised for incivility at WP:VA/E within the last 48 hours. This is clearly an ongoing pattern with him. With 2 blocks under his belt, this user probably needs a 2-week forced vacation to remind him that doing this kind of behavior repeatedly is uncalled for. pbp 18:14, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
  • In all fairness, I've made that observation about quite a few administrators; not just the ones who've blocked me. Joefromrandb (talk) 18:26, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
    • Um, that doesn't make it right, it actually makes it worse. You just admitted to calling even more people names than the people in the diffs I provided pbp 18:53, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
      • I did? Joefromrandb (talk) 19:19, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Competence case anyone? Or am I thinking too much? MM (Report findings) 22:28, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• • You're thinking too much. Joefromrandb (talk) 23:33, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
• FWIW, Joe's disruptive actions are continuing. A few hours ago, he made a spurious soapboxing claim. And, for asking him to stop soapboxing, he accused me of being a troll and acts like being told to stop his incivility and personal attacks are some sort of joke. This has got to stop, and I'm afraid a block is the only way to do it. I again ask admins to review Joe's many unacceptable attacks on admins and non-admins alike pbp 05:07, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
  • When you want to accuse someone of "making a spurious soapboxing claim" it probably isn't a good idea to include a diff of the actual soapboxing. Just some food for thought. Joefromrandb (talk) 05:35, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
    • 'Cept for the following two points, buddy: a) the original posting wasn't soapboxing, and b) the diff is only you. Look, the fact remains that you have acted without regard for policy and guidelines vis-a-vis civility and AGF, and for that, you should be blocked pbp 13:33, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

• Comment - Purplebackpack89, have you considered just disengaging and finding something else to do for a while? Your reporting is somewhat misleading (October 2012 is hardly "a few weeks ago") and this all seems like a tempest in a teapot. When you find yourself getting this upset about something, it's best to take a breather and come back in a day or two. I don't see any point in this bickering and I really don't see any point in blocking someone over their rhetorical style. --Laser brain (talk) 13:47, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Um, all the other diffs are from the last two weeks, and most are a lot more than "rhetorical style"; they are flat-out personal attacks. He repeatedly engages in personal attacks, and laughs off requests to be civil. I am very disturbed by his recalcitrance, and you should be too pbp 15:26, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

• Hey Joe, where you going, cool it down a notch or two, willya, and quit abusing the admins. PBP, like Joe, I voted against the proposal, though I suspect for vastly different reasons. In any case, seems like you were involved in some pretty heated personal battles with Gabe, even on my personal talk page, only a couple months ago. Let it go for now is my best advice. If Joe keeps it up, revisit. Give me the word and I'll close this for ya. I don't see a lot of traction for your position. Jusdafax 21:53, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
  • Perhaps you could show me where I've "abused the admins". Joefromrandb (talk) 00:09, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
    • It's up above per PBP re: BWilkins, and don't play dumb, dude. Jusdafax 00:35, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
      • In other words, you can't. Thank you for the clarification. Joefromrandb (talk) 01:44, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
        • Ok I see the problem. Give him a two week block. Jusdafax 01:53, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
          • No, if you "saw the problem" you wouldn't have come here to stir the pot in the first place. "Give him a two week block"! You're hilarious. Joefromrandb (talk) 01:59, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

• I say block him for username violation. Inanygivenhole (talk) 01:54, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
  • Maybe. But he's lost me completely accusing me of stirring the pot. I am a member of WP:VITAL where PBP and I have been editing for months, and came here to cool out the discussion. If he's looking to be disruptive and antagonize people deliberately, as is becoming clear, a timely preventative block is a good call. Make it a month or two, the way he's going. Jusdafax 02:09, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
    • If you don't want to be accused of stirring the pot, don't come to a stale thread and post baseless accusations. It doesn't get much more obvious than that. Joefromrandb (talk) 02:17, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

Richard Warren Lipack

I recently encountered Richard Warren Lipack (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). Based on edits like this one (including the delightful section "'They had the internet already discovered back in the 1800′s!!!! They have SO MUCH HIGH TECH STUFF that they have been hiding from us for centuries!!!!' This claim by Nguyen is scientifically correct and today is supported by the recently discovered only extant manuscript journal of telegraph inventor William Fothergill Cooke."), I think it is safe to say that Mr. Lipack's judgement about the nature of reality can legitimately be questioned. On his talk page, he admits that he is also Epochwiki77, which brings us to Epochwiki77's magnum opus, William Fothergill Cooke. A quick perusal of that article's history shows that it was essentially created by Epochwiki77, and relies heavily on http://www.w1tp.com/cooke/ , which, unsurprisingly, is the account of a private journal of William Fothergill Cooke that was discovered by one Richard Warren Lipack.

My first instinct is to revert the article back before Epochwiki77's first edit, block both accounts, and just deal with this with some combination of WP:IAR, WP:COMPETENCE, and WP:ILLEGIT (on the argument that the name "Epochwiki77" was chosen to hide the relationship to Richard Warren Lipack). Before I do that, I'd like to hear suggestions.—Kww(talk) 06:24, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Maybe a topic ban is in order as it seems like the editor has single-minded focus on Tequila. The amount of work that went into the contribution to Tequila's article is substantial though it completely off-topic and inappropriate for Misplaced Pages. Or just keep Tequila's page protected.

I don't think a site-wide ban is called yet but a review of William Fothergill Cooke might be in order. I just think that if he could make a diligent editor if he accepted Misplaced Pages standards on RS. I don't agree with his worldview but if he can keep the conspiracy rants out of his work, he could be a productive user. Newjerseyliz (talk) 12:06, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

I think an indef block is more than appropriate at this point. We should not be wasting a second more of time discussing semi-literate tinfoil rants about lizard people, Illuminati, and a D-list reality tv personality. Drop the hammer, and we find better things to do. Tarc (talk) 12:53, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Oy vey...I just looked through this and my brain is oozing out of my ears trying to escape. Support indef - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 13:10, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Note that the same editor has also used Epochwiki77 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 13:11, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Users shouldn't be banned, especially indefinitely, just because they have kooky ideas. I mean, who knows what kind of ideas other editors have that they never express? I'm sure there are regular editors and Admins who have peculiar beliefs. We can't police minds, only conduct. The content he posted was not encyclopedic and didn't have credible sources and it was rightly reverted.

Remember, the focus on contributions, not contributors. If he can read up on Wiki policy and standards and adhere to them, he shouldn't be prevented from editing. But if there is a particular hot topic that he repeated edits in a disruptive way, he can be given a topic ban, not a site ban. Newjerseyliz (talk) 13:37, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

The user is not (with any luck) being blocked because of holding these ideas, we don't practice Thoughtcrime around here. They would be blocked for acting on them, edit warring to insert them into a WP:BLP, and posting crazy, semi-coherent screeds within edit summaries and to user's talk pages about how to contact them to discuss/demand that this material be retained. This is base incompetence. Tarc (talk) 14:10, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm disappointed that this was acted on so quickly, without even hearing from the individual you've now indefinitely banned from the website. I don't think he was incompetent, he just didn't honor Wiki MOS, perhaps due to ignorance about policies and practices. I guess I don't understand why, when so many other issues on noticeboards and dispute pages linger around for months without a resolution, that a total ban was decided upon in less than 24 hours. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Newjerseyliz (talk • contribs) 22:59, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

• Support indefinite block. Edits show that this contributor is clearly not competent to edit Misplaced Pages. AndyTheGrump (talk) 13:47, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

• Support indef block and overhaul the William Fothergill Cooke article. GiantSnowman 13:51, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

• Aha - with those links from KWW, now it becomes clearer. It looks like the entire focus of this user's edits is popularizing this "Codex Lipack", allegedly a diary of Cooke that he found (and named after himself, of course). That's the source he's using for all of his edits to the Cooke article (which is probably the epitome of Misplaced Pages:No original research) and that's the motivation for adding all the conspiracy stuff to the Tila Tequila article, since it seems that she may believe him, and she's sort of famous. I don't see any productive edits in that. (It's theoretically possible there are some, because of the great-wall-of-text style he uses, but finding any in the cruft is a real challenge.) If Newjerseyliz or someone else is willing to personally mentor this user, we can let her try, but I suspect the game may not be worth the candle. Otherwise, I support indefinite. --GRuban (talk) 13:53, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

As an aside, would anybody be opposed to me being BOLD and reverting to this version which was the last one before Epochwiki77/Richard Warren Lipack started editing? GiantSnowman 14:10, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Done. AndyTheGrump (talk) 14:15, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Good work. GiantSnowman 14:21, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

• Support topic ban from the articles on William Fothergill Cooke and Tila Tequila, and support roll back of both articles to their state pre this editor and Epochwiki77's contributions. I agree with NJL that a blanket ban or indef block is too big a hammer to bring down right now, but I have to be honest and say that I do think it may be necessary in the future. Kim Dent-Brown 14:17, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
• Support indef block This user is textbook WP:NOTHERE. Whether this is due to a competence issue, or the fact they just want to mess around and troll isn't relevant; they're not constructive at all, so they need to go. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 14:30, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
• Support indef block on the basis of competency and no evidence that they're here to benefit the encyclopedia. Other edits by Epochwiki77 are only a little better, and we don't need to enable hoaxers or the deluded. Acroterion (talk) 16:46, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

I've gone ahead and blocked both accounts.—Kww(talk) 19:58, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

After less than a day's consideration? Why the rush? Why not wait for the user to respond to this posting? He hasn't even been on Misplaced Pages today to see the notice of this discussion and there is no "block" posting on his Talk Page that even informs him a) what happened on the one day he's not on Misplaced Pages and b) how he could appeal a block.

People say that these banning actions aren't personal but the only conclusion I can draw is that a half dozen editors thought he was a kook and wanted to kick him off Misplaced Pages. I'm not defending the quality of his contributions but the process here stinks. Some editors get away with atrocious behavior and don't even receive a warning while others get immediately and completely banned without a fair hearing. Newjerseyliz (talk) 23:01, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages is not a court of law, and Lipack can respond on his talk page, if he so chooses. But yes, using Misplaced Pages to promote crackpot nonsense will usually lead to a quick exit. WP:NOTHERE and the like. Resolute 23:19, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Well, I doubt he knows what is going on since there is no notice on his Talk page telling him he is blocked, telling him why he was blocked or telling him how he could appeal. Newjerseyliz (talk) 18:44, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

The block message he receives tells him how to appeal, Newjerseyliz. For me, it wasn't so much his beliefs as it was the suspicion that he was intentionally perpetrating a hoax.—Kww(talk) 00:45, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

I still don't see any message on his Talk page that would back up the policy to "notify the blocked user". Newjerseyliz (talk) 18:42, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

It's an automatic function of the blocking software, Newjerseyliz. The block notice used to be the only thing that notified the user. Today, it's primarily a notice to other editors. When he attempts to edit, he will get a message that points him at a permanent link to this discussion and also gives him instructions on how to appeal.—Kww(talk) 00:46, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Other affected articles, including Coca-Cola

Per this and these two press releases, we also need to closely scrutinize and/or revert his contributions to Coca-Cola. It appears this user has been significantly abusing Misplaced Pages to provide support for his personal agenda. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 19:04, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Those contributions begin here, by User:Epochwiki77. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 19:07, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

User talk:74.120.133.55 will not stop with the soapboxing

The above user has been an a tear about some perceived "plot" being hatched in Gilberton, Pennsylvania. There is clearly soapboxing at that page's talk (see last section). He added (and then deleted) more yesterday (diff), at which time I left him a final warning about it on his talk (diff). He responded to it with more rant. Note that he was already blocked once for 3RR on the Gilberton page. Certainly seems like WP:NOTHERE to me. At best, he is an extreme WP:SPA with a serious bit of "lack of clue". Will notify IP user immediately after I finish this. Gtwfan52 (talk) 07:13, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Please be careful whom you call "extreme". I was just over at your user page. I would call your views right wing extremist. In fact, it seems that the only opposition to allowing any mention of the Insurrectionism in the town of Gilberton seems to be coming from the radical right, along with this entire discussion here. I call WP:CENSOR. 74.120.133.55 (talk) 23:12, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

There appears to be plenty of coverage of this issue by RS at the moment judging from a google news search, probably enough for something to be added somewhere at some point if it passes the WP:NOTNEWS threshold. The IP just doesn't appear to understand Misplaced Pages policy at the moment. Perhaps if someone worked with them on on the article talk to find proper sourcing, showed them how to cite things, how to comply with NPOV and avoid OR they might calm down. Sean.hoyland - talk 09:26, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

I am learning that the radical right's complaints that wikipedia is "left-wing" is just BS. I am learning wikipedia policy from this experience, and am almost coming to the conclusion that wikipedia is run by those wanting it to be more like conservipedia. I am willing to work with someone on wording, but the attempts by the radical right here to suppress any information on the history of Gilberton seem to indicate that wikipedia has no desire to allow anything but right wing approved material. At this point, omission of the information indicates a desire to hide the long-term status of Gilberton. 74.120.133.55 (talk) 23:12, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

There is coverage of the police chief's rant. I certainly haven't seen anything about anthrax, ricin, the overthrow of the government, the national guard, armed insurrection or any of the many other things he is going on about. Did you actually read it? I suspect this is a WP:CIR issue, and that is in your ballpark, not an editor's. Gtwfan52 (talk) 17:44, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Oh yes, I read it, and other comments, including the "honestly, I want CIA to put a bullet in his head" comment at Talk:Pat Robertson (which hasn't been removed yet and for which he probably should have been blocked) and the puzzling, given his activity level, "My daughter is going to be born Monday" from July 28. Call me cynical but I'm not convinced blocking people like this works. They just come back. Their soapboxing definitely needs to stop though. I usually just delete content like this from talk pages (in the WP:ARBPIA topic area where it's pretty commonplace) and cite WP:TALK/WP:SOAPBOX. Sean.hoyland - talk 18:46, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Ok, I did that at the city article. I am not comfortable doing at any article I am not involved in or on his talk page. Thanks for your help. Gtwfan52 (talk) 22:09, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Well, now a long term registered editor, User:Sweetfreek, is at the Gilberton, Pennsylvania page, spouting the same (word for word) rhetoric as the above IP. It doesn't take an expert to see WP:DUCK here. I have done again what Sean told me to do regarding the soapboxing, and reverted his edit per the already established consensus on the talk page. I did ask him to come back and try to discuss the situation sans the rhetoric after the city council meeting, so we have a better idea of where this is going in order to make a reasonable addition to the article, which, if we can keep the rhetoric out of it, is probably unavoidable. I hate controversy sections in small town and school articles, as they almost never are truly anything meaningful with time perspective. I am certain enough of the quack that I am not going to notify him. The IP already was, but if someone here thinks it needed, go for it.Gtwfan52 (talk) 02:58, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

I can assure you that I am not the IP listed above... though frankly, I have no idea how anyone expects me to prove my innocence now that I have been accused of a crime. After all, I have been accused by the infallible word of somebody who redacts comments and pleas from the talk page, so I must be undeniably guilty of whatever he says I am, no? Sweetfreek (talk) 05:55, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Stealth censorship of this discussion on the part of Bushranger removed. I call WP:CENSOR on the attempt. 74.120.133.55 (talk) 22:43, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

You can only call it "Soapboxing" for so long before your protest falls flat. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/josh-horwitz/the-town-the-militia-took_b_3694293.html It's only a matter of time before there are more of your prized small towns needing documented for history. I've been keeping tabs on these Insurrectionists since the early 1990's. Unless FBI/NSA/CIA/DOD steps in, it's looking like they may just pull it off on a Nationwide basis soon. Like I said, it's only a matter of time. They are on an irreversible course. That is the cumulative effect of propaganda and religious extremism. Call it "Soapboxing" if you like, I call it history in the making. In the future, someone will want to know WHY such towns were wiped out, and that it was justified for the sake of the Nation, all these Tea Traitors have to do is get froggy, and wiping out those towns will be a necessity for National Security. Gilberton is on a one-way course, and they show no sign of changing course. 74.120.133.55 (talk) 01:17, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Your words clearly indicate that you don't belong on Misplaced Pages. You should find a different outlet for your views. Zero 01:39, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Coming from someone whose own body of work seems replete with political implications and religious implications. Maybe your neutrality should be reviewed. 74.120.133.55 (talk) 22:32, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Regarding all of this stuff that you think will happen, We can wait until it fleshes out and becomes actual facts. If you are looking for the developing stories then you may want to head over to Wikinews.
 — Berean Hunter (talk) 02:06, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

To a degree, I can accept that, but the facts are coming in on the Gilberton thing now. There was an actual takeover by a Terrorist Militia there this past week, in which swastika-tattooed gun-toting freaks were keeping citizens from going into a hearing, at gunpoint. The outcome of the Council meeting shows that the problem will continue. Fact is not soapboxing. I don't anticipate major media coverage until it does turn into a shooting thing there though, as I subscribe to the theory that widespread reporting of the events surrounding that Council meeting were not publicized because of fear it will start a domino effect. 74.120.133.55 (talk) 22:26, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

And after that example of WP:NOTHERE after being warned about inappropriate discussions, a block should be applied. Probably with TPA revoked, as this IP user's only purpose here appears to be to vehemently push a political POV, using talk pages to do so after being warned about doing it in articles. WP:NOTHERE, WP:NOTFORUM, WP:NOTADVOCACY. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 05:03, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Pretty good from someone whose personal page here reads like FOX News, TheBlaze, and Infowars ( http://en.wikipedia.org/User:The_Bushranger#No_Spin_Zone ). Interesting how you can't keep the soapboxing off your own page. "to suppress Insurrections" is nonpartisan. At least I still keep MY oath. "all enemies..." 74.120.133.55 (talk) 22:18, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

In fact, I hold that the WP:CENSOR going on with the Gilberton page is so extreme, that an addition to the effect of "In January 2013, The City Council of Gilberton passed an ordinance declaring that it is the SOLE arbitor of what is Constitutional, and that the Supreme Court of the United States holds no authority over it." would be rejected by the creators of the discussion right here. That proposed addition would be a statement of fact, without a political POV, simply FACT. Seriously, we are talking about a town in total rebellion against Constitutional authority, and it's supporters are attempting to WP:CENSOR the facts from being added to the town's entry. One editor of this discussion, "The Bushranger" has even attempted to WP:CENSOR my defense of my edits in this very discussion, and given his own user page, I personally question his loyalty, and adherence to an oath he claims to have once taken. Personal attacks have been made against me in this discussion, I have a right to state my opinion as well. 74.120.133.55 (talk) 23:30, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

More inappropriate blanking of Turkic-related articles

I previously posted at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive806#Requesting rangeblock of 217.76.68.0/24 about an issue of blanking of Turkic-related articles from a range of IPs. The page Kyrgyz people is now having similar inappropriate editing done. Can a rangeblock of the IPs in question be considered? Jackmcbarn (talk) 22:40, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

 Done Rangeblocked 1 month. I'm inclined to agree based on the contribs that I can see. Nothing but nationalistic POV pushing for the last several months...let's see if 1 month will help.
 — Berean Hunter (talk) 02:40, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

It's happening again on the same pages from 2.133.32.0/18, such as 2.133.57.134 (talk) (this frist one's recent, the rest are older) 2.133.53.46 (talk) 2.133.45.214 (talk) 2.133.54.41 (talk). Can it be rangeblocked temporarily as well? Jackmcbarn (talk) 15:06, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

I've placed some semi-protections on his primary target articles to thwart him. This may be better than blocking every range that he gains access through.
 — Berean Hunter (talk) 15:44, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

He's had this range basically as long as he's had the other one, so it's not like he keeps getting new ones. Jackmcbarn (talk) 15:46, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Although it has been a while (April), other editors have used this IP range for non-controversial edits such as this. However, if he persists under this range and there is more problematic editing then we can look at blocking that range.
 — Berean Hunter (talk) 16:05, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• Comment This is a common problem on articles related to anything Turkish. We had huge problems in the spring with a very aggressive Turkish dynamic IP who targeted over 50 articles with bizarre POV-pushing, and it became almost impossible to control it; we had to block a quite wide range. Problems like this is one of the main reasons I think editing should be restricted to registered users.Jeppiz (talk) 15:29, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Ferret baiting

Some completely uncalled-for baiting of Malleus going on at Transportation of animals (NB talk:). Will someone please stamp on this ASAP, before it gets out of hand. Andy Dingley (talk) 00:48, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Unproductive; collapsed. TY Andy. Drmies (talk) 01:04, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

So once again baiting goes unaddressed. Eric Corbett 01:40, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

But it was addressed and mostly because it was you. For most editors, there would not even have been a report filed at ANI; nor would any action likely have been taken had one been created.--Bbb23 (talk) 01:51, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Are you kidding me dude? Hillbilly posted an article containing personal information with the sole purpose of mocking and baiting another user, and then proceeded to edit war without any purpose other than to get a reaction. It's unacceptable behavior no matter whether it's directed at Eric or an IP, and is borderline WP:OUTING. Eric chose to make his name known here, but Hillbilly obviously didn't randomly find an article from 2004 in a Manchester news site. This whole thing was designed to harass and bait. --Laser brain (talk) 02:11, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

My assumption was that Eric objected only to the latter part of the topic. Frankly, I thought the whole topic shouldn't have been on the talk page. I would have just removed it all. BTW, I don't mind in the slightest your disagreeing with me, but could you please not call me "dude"?--Bbb23 (talk) 02:14, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Sorry for the dude. I agree that even placing it on the Talk page was a poor decision. Edit warring it into the article was disruptive and way over the line. --Laser brain (talk) 02:21, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Speculating much Laser Brain? I was working on an article called Transportation of animals, (in fact the previous edits were concerned with transporting ferrets in particular). I think the ferret-hammock piece definitely comes under that umbrella, I brought it up on the talkpage first, linked to Eric's name so he would know that I was considering adding the material. Another editor agreed that it should be added, so I did. You can see on the talkpage I wasn't baiting anyone, just trying see funny side of it all. I've always held Eric in high regard, and am surprised that he took offense. I do apologize for the 'old chap' remark, which could be considered over-familiar. -- Hillbillyholiday 02:33, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• My apologies for misreading earlier; I thought it concerned the talk page only. The added text was, even if intended in good spirits and humorously, not of proper encyclopedic level--that should be obvious to someone like Hillbillyholiday, who seems to be an editor who knows what's what. Restoring it ("not taking the piss") is disruptive, and Hillbilly could have shown better manners: you know what's going on and you should have known better. DracoE, you know I love you, but come on--if a girl says no, it's no, simple as that. If everything else fails I can invoke BLP which would urge us to be cautions. But seriously, Hillbillyholiday81, that was not a good move on your part. Eric, I'm sorry that I did not look more carefully the first time. Drmies (talk) 02:41, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

The article has had something of a history of funny-but-true facts and I thought that the ferret-hammocks quote would perfectly fit the bill. As Eric himself pointed out on the talkpage, the fact that ferrets can now happily travel within the EU was in some part due to his efforts. The material could have been worded differently or trimmed down perhaps, but it was relevant to the article. I undid Eric's edit because his comment 'taking the piss' was simply not true, and not a comment on the validity of the edit. I have no intention of restoring that material if Eric doesn't wish for it to be there, but I must reiterate that I wasn't trying to 'bait' him, I was just trying to raise a smile. Don't worry, it won't happen again. -- Hillbillyholiday 03:01, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Surely part of the aggravation was that this was on the main page as a DYK at the time, right? Add ferrets, by all means, but the timing was perhaps a bit insensitive. Stalwart111 02:43, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
• I agree with Laser Brain's comments about about baiting. I've just removed the additions from the page history as disruptive. It seems clear they were added to get a reaction out of one editor, and are definitely WP:POINTY if not harassment. Mark Arsten (talk) 03:01, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
  • Or maybe that was an overreaction on my part. I guess if anyone thinks it's unwarranted they can revert me. Mark Arsten (talk) 03:27, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Again, I refute the accusation of harassment or pointedness or whatever. The information was relevant, sourced, and IMO (whisper it) 'quite funny'. For what it's worth, Mark, I think your wholesale deletion just then was uncalled for. I've been around long enough to know not to ask for assumption of good faith at AN/I, so I'll leave it at that. -- Hillbillyholiday 03:31, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Thinking about it some more, I don't think it met any of the criteria to be removed from the history, so I've restored it. I'd like to assume good faith here, but it really does seem like you were out to poke Eric. Mentioning passports and so on I can see, but getting into one couple's travel plans to France seems too silly to take seriously. I feel a bit conflicted though, since I've never taken you for the disruptive type. Mark Arsten (talk) 03:47, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you, Mark. -- Hillbillyholiday 03:50, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• @Hillbillyholiday81: Thanks for your thoughts on whether the edits were harassment or pointedness, but they are not relevant. Such behavior is indistinguishable from trolling, and participants here are unlikely to care whether it is intentional—that's just not relevant. Eric is known to attract misguided attention, and I ask any passing admin to ensure that nonsense like this is stopped ASAP. If the disruption continues, please block the user and bring it here for review. Johnuniq (talk) 03:52, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  Ah yes, how silly of me to think that my own opinion on my own edits could in any way be deemed relevant to the situation, though I congratulate you for proving my point about the lack of AGF here. -- Hillbillyholiday 03:57, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  Once again you are missing the point—your good faith and your intentions are just not relevant. If you lack the necessary judgment to participate in a collaborative community you will, at a minimum, have to be removed from that page. Johnuniq (talk) 04:49, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  You aren't really going to try to tell us that we shouldn't allow people to comment on their own edits, are you? AutomaticStrikeout  ?  13:23, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  Why not? It happens all the time. Intothatdarkness 13:54, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• I have no doubt that HBH was just being playful. The problem is that, while cow-tipping may be good clean fun for us hillbillies, bull-tipping is never a very good idea as bulls tend to take it the wrong way. He should remember that. Anyway, time to shut this down, I think.--The Devil's Advocate _{tlk. cntrb.} 04:39, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
• Baiting? Maybe not. OUTING? Yes. Inappropriate? Definitely. GiantSnowman 16:08, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
• Related: Misplaced Pages:Files_for_deletion/2013_August_9#File:Young_ferret_relaxing_in_hammock_before_transport.jpg Andy Dingley (talk) 09:35, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

I have speedy deleted the image, and left a warning at User talk:DracoEssentialis#Vandalism and personal attacks. Fram (talk) 09:56, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

What? You speedy deleted an image of a ferret because it was "created purely to attack or mock another editor"? This is an image of a ferret, not a portrait painted with someone's penis. Delicious carbuncle (talk) 16:02, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

It wasn't a picture of a ferret, it was some kind of long-haired gerbil or similar. GiantSnowman 16:06, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

I approve of Fram's action, and would support a block if this harassment were to continue. --John (talk) 16:09, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• I accept Hillbilly's good faith; perhaps Eric doesn't, but he has good reason to be miffed about this. I haven't seen the image so I don't wish to comment on it. Are the edits OUTING enough to warrant revdel? Mark backtracked on it (this is not intended as an indictment) while I'm inclined to think that revdel would be proper. Given the BLP issue Eric should have a say in this as well: if he wants it gone it should be gone, and since we should err on the side of caution I'm going to revdel it again. If an uninvolved admin disagrees they can undo me, preferably with an explanation here. Thank you, Drmies (talk) 16:37, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
  • Ok, good to get more input on this, erring on the side of caution is fine with me. Mark Arsten (talk) 20:53, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• The only real outing involved would be the fact that the article mentions his wife and I think that is reasonable cause for removing the edits. It doesn't seem to be a news piece too important to the article in question.--The Devil's Advocate _{tlk. cntrb.} 21:13, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• (non-admin, partly-content observation, so mostly out of place, but whatever.) Hillbilly, you seem to know the history of the article. When it was at AfD, some of us fought tooth and nail to keep barely-relevant crap like this ferret news story out of the article. Adding stuff like that brings up not only the baiting/outing concerns mentioned here (I support revdel and removing the ferrets here, by the way), but also stuff like WP:UNDUE issues that we were all trying to avoid by deleting or cutting down the article. What you did, even if in good faith, was by no means constructive, both for the community and the article in question. Ansh666 22:52, 9 August 2013 (UTC) (By the way, ping me if you want me to see a reply or something. I don't hang out at AN/I much anymore.)

I didn’t think I’d have to explain this, because it seems so obvious, but my involvement in this bit of light-hearted fun was motivated by a wish to confirm, again, that there are very different rules for Wikipedians and BLP “subjects” who don’t have friends on the inside. When User:Eric Corbett, an established Misplaced Pages contributor, objects to User:Hillbillyholiday81 adding sourced information about his wife’s achievements in the field of ferret transport, somebody drags Hillbilly to ANI, and what follows are the inevitable cries of WP:OUTING and harassment. Some of you may not know this, but Hillbilly is doing sterling work protecting notable people from actual harassment by Misplaced Pages contributors.

By the way, the somebody who started this here thread was none other than User:Andy Dingley. The same Andy Dingley who had made it his personal business to torment a non-notable living person and his family by means of a Misplaced Pages biography sourced to such wonderful publications as the Daily Mail. Andy Dingley seems to have had no qualms as to how his behavior on here would make that living person feel hounded, harassed, persecuted, you name it, and I for one am appaled that Andy Dingley is still considered an “editor in good standing”. Going after someone’s children and declaring them bastards by implication? Classy, Andy, real classy.

By now, some of you may have hopped over to my talk page and found some recent edits describing me as a vandal and a troll. One of them by Cyclopia, that living epitome of kindness and empathy (irony alert). Cyclopia has got his nose way up Jimbo’s behind whenever he posts on The Revered Co-Founder’s talk page. But his true, heartfelt “respect” for BLP “subjects” keeps shining through in “edits” like this one: 'Let's stop spinning this into some kind of "kindness", "understanding" or "respect" issue. There is nothing kind about a public person asking us to remove trivially public information. Nothing. There is just someone who is used to get things their way, and that someone this time doesn't like, for whatever reason, that we, of all websites, host an openly available official information. I think this is not kind at all, and it is instead insulting, bullying and demeaning to us to say the least. But even if it wasn't, and it was asked in good faith, it is still unreasonable. So we can give the asker a pleasant smile, and say "thanks for asking but no thanks, your request is not really reasonable because it is anyway publicly available information, so we feel we can cover it anyway". If being gagged by strangers is your cup of tea among "kind gestures", well, to each one their own, be my guest, but do not try to sell it as a regular "kind gesture" we are bound by ethics to perform. -- cyclopia 16:42, 6 August 2013 (UTC)'

This is the same Cyclopia who censored my replacing a photograph of Jimbob Wales with a portrait painted by notable Australian artist Pricasso. I had a reason for doing this. As in giving someone a taste of their own medicine. Round about a year and a half ago, Jimbob threw a notable person to the wikiwolves and then refused to reply to this notable person’s distressed emails. Said notable person had made a very simple, heartfelt request not to have a completely irrelevant piece of information pertaining to his past made known on Misplaced Pages. You know, the first google hit for his name? Unfortunately, said living person had previously identified as a liberal. The Wikiconservatives, among them a guy proudly displaying the KKK flag on his talk page, persevered, and despite the fact that the source they used was ridiculous to begin with. It’s not like I hadn’t made His Jimboness aware of the fact on his talk page while this disgusting charade was going on. (Hey there, “Beeblebrox”. You took it upon your grammatically challenged donkey to close that Rfc. Did you actually read all of it? I doubt it, but hey, I’m just a lady “vandal” who used to actually care about this project a long time ago. Hey, Jimbob, what a coincidence that one of the current Arbcommers you seem quite friendly with attempted some damage control on a certain notorious WP:SLIMEBUCKET’s talk page a mere two hours after a certain journalist had asked you for a statement. Oh the hypocrisy!)

In closing, I guess you folks can choose to get worked up over an issue that isn’t that much to write home about to begin with (let’s be real here, who outside of Wikiworld would ever give a flying ferret about Eric Corbett and his numerous wikigripes), or you can be WP:BOLD and address the wider issue. If a WP editor can get information about himself and his family deleted, why can’t you folks extend the same courtesy to barely notable people who don’t want their lives dissected on here? Draco 12:06, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

Well said! "Gum..?" -- Hillbillyholiday 13:39, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

Disruptive edits to prehistoric animal articles

Tenacious IP constantly changing fossil range data at article Alamosaurus. After source was provided for original data, editor continues to change the data without chaining the source. See This IP address has apparently only ever been used to make unsourced edits to data in the temporal_range template of various dinosaur articles. MMartyniuk (talk) 11:20, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Dinoguy2 understates the case. This IP has been doing the same thing in multiple articles without a single word of explanation. Since it has been blocked for 24 hours once before, I'm blocking it for one month. If the same behavior restarts when that block expires, let me know and I'll make it permanent. Zero 07:56, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

User:Miesianiacal and decorative icons

User:Miesianiacal is aggressively restoring decorative icons to infoboxes on articles on Canadian Governors-General. When the practice was discussed back in April at Template talk:Infobox officeholder/Archive 17#WP:ICONDECORATION there was no consensus that they were valid exceptions to WP:ICONDECORATION. Our long-established practice is not to use icons in this way, as I've explained. Could someone else have a word with him please? I'm rather surprised to see they have never been blocked as I see they have also aggressively edit-warred against talk-page consensus over terminology in another article. Edits like this one are in breach of consensus and have continued in spite of a warning that I would escalate the matter if he continued. This comes on top of discussion at user talk since April. Thanks for any attention you can give to this. --John (talk) 15:57, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

John has misrepresented the situation.

The images have been present in the articles on Canadian governors general for many years. John's first move to delete them in April was thus a bold change the status-quo; acceptable within Misplaced Pages practice. However, when that first attempt was reverted, he proceeded to revert the revert. He did on April 8 initiate a discussion at my talk page, but quickly descended to low-grade personal attacks and demonstrated a misunderstanding of WP:CONSENSUS. On the same day, another discussion began at Template talk:Infobox officeholder. But, despite having failed to find consensus at the latter venue to remove or not use the images, he proceeded to resume reverting on all the articles on April 10.

He was, at that time, reverted by editors other than myself: (never reverted by John until August 9), (reverted immediately by John on April 8), (never reverted by John), (never reverted by John). I restored some in May, which he reverted some of quickly and some others in June; others I restored in June, which he reverted, again, only some of. Another discussion was begun at Talk:Roland Michener that again resulted in no consensus for change. Today, he's resumed reverting at some of the governor general articles.

Aside from John having never found a consensus to change the status-quo after being first reverted and instead choosing to sustain a slow edit war, the result of his haphazard reverting since April has been the loss of a consistent appearance throughout a series of articles to a persistent, though shifting, inconsistency; i.e. John may mistakenly believe the guideline WP:MOSICON empowers him to remove long-present images without consensus (despite not one editor at either Template talk:Infobox officeholder or Talk:Roland Michener opining that the presence of the images, per say, is offensive to the guideline), but he has never exercised that belief regularly, always removing images from some articles and leaving them at others.

My feeling is John does not understand WP:CONSENSUS or WP:BRD. Also, I suggested he try the next step in dispute resolution (an RfC, I believe), which I think he should have pursued before coming straight here (with misleading claims about me and all). Should a consensus to remove the images ever be established, I'd take them out myself. --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 17:05, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Which claims do you regard as misleading? Where do you see a personal attack from me? WP:MOSICON is part of our Manual of Style and enjoys widespread consensus across the project. We would need you to establish some kind of consensus or rationale to diverge from the MoS to use these images, something you have never done. --John (talk) 17:21, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

(edit conflict) I'm not going to get into the details of why your claim in your OP about my editing in the context of an entirely separate matter is misleading; people can see why for themselves, if they're really interested.

The MoS is a guideline. In the two discussions you started away from my talk page, three editors participated. None indicated agreement with your interpretation of the guideline: i.e. that is is a policy in all but name without exception. User:Pigsonthewing insinuated images are permissible by starting his comment with "If they are used..."; User:PKT told you "Judicious use of the icons in question is not unreasonable"; and User:EncyclopediaUpdaticus quoted directly from WP:MOSICON and informed you specifically that "WP:ICON is a guideline not a policy and as the banner states should be applied using common sense. In this case the editors are using common sense and this article is a valid exception so the icon should stay."

No consensus was needed to be found before putting them in. Putting them in way back when would've been the bold edit, which, since it wasn't quickly reverted, gained consensus by staying and staying so long; WP:EDITCONSENSUS: "Any edit that is not disputed or reverted by another editor can be assumed to have consensus" and WP:SILENCE: "You find out whether your edit has consensus when it sticks." As I said above, the images have been there for many years, with multiple dozens of users editing all those pages over that time, and nobody made an issue of it until you in April. Of course, it's your right to do so; but, the convention is that the status-quo, which has a consensus through silence, remains until a new consensus is established; WP:BOLD: "fter a deletion of a bold edit , you might want to be bold in an edit on the talk pages so as not to start an edit war." You've failed to find any agreement for your deletions thus far, which is not to say you can't or shouldn't try. --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 17:50, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Well, others can read the discussion at template talk and see if they agree with your reading of it. I certainly don't. Putting them in broke MoS; my removal was in accordance with MoS which is a long-standing project-wide consensus. Your restoration of them was not in accord with any consensus or policy, and you have not attempted to justify your actions, and there is no justification for them. We do not use images for decoration like this. You would need to demonstrate a consensus to go against MoS and you have not done so. I am glad, incidentally, that you have stopped edit-warring on the other issue you don't have consensus for; that is very encouraging. It would be great if you could stop doing so on this one as well. --John (talk) 18:07, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Either I didn't make myself clear enough or you're not really reading what I (or others) wrote. Regardless, I'll wait to see what others have to say, if anything. --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 18:12, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

My comment was in no way intended to show support for, or "permissibility of" the use of decorative icons. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:20, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Your use of "If they are used..." indicates a permissability for the use of images, as opposed to starting with "They shouldn't be used". --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 20:27, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

I do apologise; I forgot that you know what I mean when I comment, better than I do. I'll remember to consult with you in future, before making any further statements about my intention, in case I have the wrong understanding of my own views. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:06, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

1) The MoS is intended to provide sensible/practical consistency between articles. There are all sorts of exceptions, but this particular issue doesn't seem like an exception-worthy one - If we allow shields/seals/insignia in "Canadian Governor General" articles, then it will spread, leading to disputes in thousands of other articles/infoboxes.

2) The image is tiny, compressed beyond any hope of recognizability. (eg and and ) The only way it would possibly be useful is if greatly enlarged, which would lead to problems of undue prominence, and overwhelming (the other information) size.

3) It's a symbol of the office, not of the person. A personal/family shield/seal/flag might be an acceptable exception, but not this. Particularly because a person might hold dozens of offices/positions in their career, leading to an abundance of images.

In sum, it seems sensible and practical to disallow tiny icons in infoboxes. HTH. (Please alert me if this issue is discussed elsewhere). –Quiddity (talk) 19:43, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

These are valid comments. But, shouldn't there be a proper RfC started in some appropriate location so interested editors can be alerted and contribute and a consensus established? --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 20:24, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

The crest of the governor general appears to be a copyright violation of this site's artwork . While it is not the same as the current COA of Canada, it appears to be a recent artistic rendering. I also note that the boilerplate seems to be innacurate as they are stating the source as themselves improperly.--Mark _{Just ask! WER TEA DR/N} 21:07, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

This seems somewhat OT, but I can see differences between the Commons file and the one at the GG's website, most notably the absence in the former of shading that is present in the latter. --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 21:13, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

That slight variation is not enough to say it isn't a violation when it is clearly stated in the image page where the source came from and the image is a faithful reproduction of the original. Making even color changes is not enough when it is very clear that of all the variations of this uploaded on Wikimedia Commons this one was taken from a site that still holds copyright.--Mark _{Just ask! WER TEA DR/N} 23:09, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Miesianiacal, you're making a mistake I see a lot of people make. They see that something is a "guideline", which means that there may be exceptions, and then they simply assert that their own edits are an exception (for reasons they, unsurprisingly agree with), and then go and make a bunch of changes to suit their preference. However, the burden really is on you: you need to make a case for why this one particular case is exceptional, and you need to do it not on the individual articles, but on MOS talk pages. Otherwise, you'd be trying to use a local consensus to override a site-wide consensus. Personally, I cannot possibly imagine any rationale why one particular type of politician is an exception while others are not (unless perhaps every reliable source that talks about these types of politicians uses these symbols and that is not true of other politicians), but you're welcome to make the argument. In the meantime, you should self-revert if John hasn't reverted you already. Qwyrxian (talk) 00:22, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• Comment - I would say lose the icon, what does it really add. Didn't we go through this with flags getting plastered on every bio? At the least, there should be a clear consensus for inclusion to have them. The "default" would be not to have them. Tie goes to the guideline. Just my 2 cents. --Malerooster (talk) 00:34, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
• Comment on icon - I can vouch for User:Sodacan, the author of the icon as he is usually quite informed about copyright. You may want to ask him to chime in here... – Connormah (talk) 00:46, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

PrivateMasterHD and 69.122.190.4

PrivateMasterHD keeps adding baseball terminology to football articles (and has added generally incorrect information and used questionable word choices in several articles) and has been unresponsive to messages left on their talk page except to blank the page. There have been documented concerns about them for past behavioral issues and while PrivateMaster has demonstrated the ability to make constructive edits, edits such as this continue.

I became aware of their activities on June 17 at Nick Folk when they made this edit that I reverted. Nearly a month later, they returned to the article to make two consecutive edits. There was a third edit made by an IP account (69.122.190.4) that I believe them to be using as the edit was a minute apart from the other edits. The IP claimed Folk was "designated for assignment" however, this does not exist in the National Football League (NFL) only in Major League Baseball (MLB). I left a note on the IP's talkpage however, I did not realize that Yankees10 had warned PrivateMaster a month earlier for a similar incident which aroused my suspicions. As it turned out, both accounts heavily edited MLB and NFL articles so I decided to do some research and found some trends.

Via PrivateMaster's account: Jason Babin ("designated for assignment"), Boomer Esiason (In this instance, the majority of the edit is fine but the disabled list does not exist in football), Kris Jenkins ("eliminated for the rest of the year"), Michael Crabtree ("disabled list"), Orlando Franklin (Trivial information under "Other"), Danny Woodhead (Incorrectly stating Woodhead "lead" the Jets to the AFC Championship when he had little playing time), Shaun Suisham ("designated for assignment"), Jonas Mouton ("eliminated for the entire season"), Billy Cundiff (There is no preseason roster however, there is in baseball), Jeremy Maclin ("eliminated from the season"), Percy Harvin ("60-day disabled list"), Rob Gronkowski ("60 day DL"), Physically Unable to Perform (addition of a link to the disabled list which is exclusive to MLB), and Joe Morgan ("eliminated from the season").

A look at the edit history of the IP account reveals a similar batch of edits: Darius Slay ("disabled list"), Shawn Nelson ("designated for assignment"), Colin Baxter ("disabled list; designated for assignment"), Albert Haynesworth ("designated for assignment"), Dennis Pitta ("disabled list"). Most concerning is an edit made back in May to the Injured reserve list which stated MLB players were placed on an injured reserve list if they were lost for the year. This is not true because the MLB utilizes the disabled list (for example Johan Santana was declared out for the year after undergoing shoulder surgery prior to the start of the baseball season—he was placed on the 60 disabled list).

For what it's worth, in addition to the consecutive edits made by PrivateMaster and 69.122.190.4 at Nick Folk, this occurred again on July 27 at Andre Gurode with the IP incorrectly stating Gurode had been ""designated for assignment" while PrivateMaster added dates in the section titles which has been a trend in the edits of both accounts (see here and here).

Being that they frequently edit MLB and NFL articles, I could see, earlier on, if it was a mix-up however, we're to the point where multiple messages have been left for both accounts and yet they are still blatantly substituting the incorrect terminology. -- The Writer 2.0 17:30, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Indef block until he decides to communicate with other editors. I don't see where he's communicating at all with any editor. Blanking and continuing the same behavior is not acceptable.
   — Berean Hunter (talk) 20:28, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
  • He actually has communicated with other editors - but only about protection templates, it appears, and nothing about this behavior, so I'd support an indef based on WP:IDHT if it continues. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 17:12, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
    • They blanked the ANI notice and have continued about editing. I'm beginning to sincerely doubt that they're open to discussion on this matter. -- The Writer 2.0 18:33, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
• Support indef block: Very disruptive editing, no communication with other editors about the problems they notify him about, and a clear lack of competence. Thomas.W 13:40, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

GAR discussion

I think that the discussion on Misplaced Pages:Good article reassessment/BGM-75 AICBM/1 may have become somewhat polarised. In particular, I do understand why a contributor is saying that he will bring this to ANI, if I do not withdraw the GAR. Is this manipulative? Please see this edit and this edit. I think that a calming influence is needed. Snowman (talk) 19:38, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Well, I was in the middle of writing this when I was notified of this thread. I'll post it here instead. Parsecboy (talk) 19:43, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

User:Snowmanradio, an editor who has been an editor of Misplaced Pages since December 2005, has opened a Good Article Review of the above article here. In it, s/he has demonstrated a shockingly bad understanding of both the Good Article criteria and basic practice on Misplaced Pages. For instance, s/he has suggested that the author of the article, User:The Bushranger, has a conflict of interest by participating in the review. S/he has refused to get the point that his or her requests, which are either demands for information that may or may not even exist (and if it does, is still classified) or utterly ridiculous, are in no way supported by the GA Criteria. How this editor, who as I said has been here for eight years, is so shockingly unfamiliar with Misplaced Pages policies, I do not know. But I suggest that this farce of a GAR be archived. Parsecboy (talk) 19:43, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Please note that in the GAR discussion my intention was to bring up conflict of interest only the context of an editor being protective an article that he or she has created. Snowman (talk) 19:58, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Snowmanradio, do you not understand that that only underlines how unfamiliar you are with basic Misplaced Pages practice? Authors of articles are expected to participate in reviews of their work. Parsecboy (talk) 20:04, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• I think that you are being too presumptive here. Of course, contributions to a GAR from an editor who has created the article are important, but it is possible to be "too close" or "too involved" with an article. Snowman (talk) 20:18, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• What am I presuming, exactly? Regardless, pointing out that the requests you made are completely ridiculous does not make one too close to an article. Parsecboy (talk) 20:24, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• That is a shockingly poor review, actually. I wasn't in any way involved with the creation of the article (or aware of it), but my responses to some of those review comments would have been similar. Intothatdarkness 20:01, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Agreeing with Intothatdarkness here. I have no idea what the hell is going on with your assessment of #5, Snowmanradio, but either you're not competent enough to be conducting a GAR, or you're being deliberately disruptive. Bushranger's "defense" of the article is perfectly valid, and no conflict of interest is apparent; why should a major contributor of an article be excluded from either improving the article, or explaining their edits? I've never participated in a GAR myself, I must admit; but from my work with turning articles into GAs, that review seems well out of touch. I suggest you withdraw the GAR pronto. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 21:03, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• It should be noted that User:Snowmanradio did not notify me of this AN/I. On the subject, I'll just say I would have no problem whatsoever with a productive GAR of that article, I fully accept constructive critcism (something on which the opposite was strongly implied by Snowmanradio in his GAR), and if the consensus of a proper GAR was that the article in question did not meet the GA criteria, I would have zero issue with it being delisted (indeed, I was honestly surprised when it passed its GAN - I had simply nominated it on a "well, nothing more can be done here, so let's see what happens" basis). I do not, however, believe that a GAR that is filled with WP:IDHT on the part of the revewier, and which could very easily be taken as a WP:POINTy nomination in response to the article in question being brought up as a challenge to this statement, serves the project at all. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 21:48, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Please not that User The Bushranger commented on this ANI within about 20 minutes after I had started it. Snowman (talk) 22:46, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• I brought this discussion here for opinion on another editor's contributions and not on anything you had said. As far as I am aware, under these circumstances, I have no obligation to inform you about this ANI. Snowman (talk) 18:50, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• (ec x 3) Even I can find problems with the writing there. User:Eric Corbett would probably see red. The GAR is justified, but should probably be conducted by another editor at this point. The more general problem of making GAs out of articles where not that much is publicly known about the topic (this is a 4-paragrah GA, not counting the lead) should probably be discussed elsewhere. Someone not using his real name (talk) 21:49, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  Actually no, not even a light Suffolk pink. The glaring omission for me though, which disqualifies it from being a GA in my opinion is the political and military background that led to it being proposed. What would it have been able to do that existing missiles couldn't, and why was that important? Eric Corbett 22:20, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  That's a good point, and something that (honestly) had completely escaped me while writing it. I wouldn't have any problem with it being delisted until I (or anyone else, of course!) can dig stuff up on that. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 22:29, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  It's not necessary to delist it if you or someone else can come up with a background section within the timescale of the review. Eric Corbett 22:41, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  Unfortunatly, it would have to be somebody else, as here in Podunktown I've exhausted online sources and interlibrary loan requests usually come back stamped "lolno". - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 22:52, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

  • Well, as I said, I wouldn't object to a proper GAR - heck, there's been times I've looked at that article and wondered if I should do it myself - even if it was only on a "meets the letter of the criteria, but not their spirit" basis. One like this though...ugh. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 22:09, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

    And, IMO, that should be the issue here. It's not the question of a second review, but the lack of quality and professionalism in the one being conducted. Intothatdarkness 22:21, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

    • Indeed. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 22:29, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• The article (currently 337 words of readable prose) does not say who initiated the project, why was it needed, who participated in the planning stages, and it omits costs that were incurred. These are major omissions to my way of thinking and I think that this is not meat criteria 3a of the good article criteria which says that a GA should address the main aspects of the topic. The discussion is a community Good Article Review, used for controversial GAR's, for the community to decide on. Article size is not a GA criteria. The GAR is somewhat of a mess now and uninviting for community reviewers due to the polarised discussion, and I think that it probably needs restarting. I would be happy to end the current community GAR and start a second community GAR to briefly outline the important issues that I think are important for the community to look at. I am not actually sure how to close a GAR, but if it is closed then I can start another tomorrow or in a few days time and I hope the second GAR will be better. Snowman (talk) 22:46, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
  • I'd appreciate it if you would allow somebody else (like Eric, perhaps) to open a second one, instead of doing it yourself. (As for costs, that is something not in available sources...) - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 22:52, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
  • I've not taken part in the review, so I can close it as "kept" if everyone agrees, then a second community GAR can be opened. But like Bushranger I think it would be better all round if another reviewer did that rather than you Snowman. Eric Corbett 23:02, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
    • I would be happy for you to end the current community GAR, which needs closing, because it has been spoilt by a polarised discussion. My main interest is to see that this article is either improved to GA standard or de-listed, so I would welcome second community GAR. I have no objections if someone else starts a community GAR, but if one is not started within seven days, then I would endeavour to start the second GAR myself. I would recommend a community GAR is started rather than a individual GAR. Snowman (talk) 23:19, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

      I'll close the current review tomorrow, if nobody does else first. I'd still strongly recommend that you do not start another community review; I'll do that myself if necessary. Eric Corbett 23:32, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

      If you do that, please copy my comments from the current review, as they have been offered in good faith, even though you seem to disagree with them. Someone not using his real name (talk) 23:50, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

      If you want to comment at the review you may of course do so, but I'll be copying nothing. Eric Corbett 00:21, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

      I note that the discussion on the current community GAR has recently been advanced by User Someone not using his real name. With this in mind, I have changed my mind about restarting the current community GAR, and I now think that it would be simpler and appropriate to continue the existing community GAR. The ground has already been ploughed and there is no need to re-plough it. I would take heed of User Eric Corbett's recommendation that I do not start another community GAR myself on this article. I note that User Eric Corbett would restart the community GAR, if necessary. Snowman (talk) 19:07, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

      OK, I'll leave the review open then. Eric Corbett 19:59, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Behavior of some Users against me

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

In the Misplaced Pages:Requests for comment/User conduct/Assistance I already describe the situation: here is the link http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Requests_for_comment/User_conduct/Assistance#Behavior_of_some_Users_against_me and no need to write it here again (please read it there in mentioned link). What is more interesting, the behaviour of the User:AndyTheGrump is still abusive. During discussion of this issue he wrote: I'd say that 'poor manners' sums it up nicely. Instead of apologize, he again call me man with extremaly poor manner, and moreover, he thinks that it sums up nicely. So 3 Users discuss the personality, but not an issue. Please your comments about this situation: is this kind of behaviour acceptable in Wiki? Please comment and take necessary measures for the behaviour of User AndyTheGrump.Thansk in advance. 46.71.203.2 (talk) 22:58, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

This is getting silly: see Talk:Atheism#Some very interesting and very important statistics. The IP seems to think that "please-please your comments must be reasonable" is a good way to start a thread, and that "please don't pretend that such statistics are not concern to this article" is an appropriate response to polite comments. So yes, I'll say it again: 'poor manners' sums it up nicely. AndyTheGrump (talk) 23:09, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

In the link I mentioned (http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Requests_for_comment/User_conduct/Assistance#Behavior_of_some_Users_against_me) I wrote and commented all this questions. Dear administrators, please read it. And as you see, AndyTheGrump is still very abusive, and this will become a precedent for other users to act like this. So, please don't allow it. Thank you. 46.71.203.2 (talk) 23:29, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

No one is being abusive to you. Multiple editors disagree with you, and that is all. If you want to press your point, go pursue the options at dispute resolution. Someguy1221 (talk) 23:37, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

IP user reporting possible child molestation

I'm not quite sure what the policy is, but I suspect this conversation should be redacted and the claim of possible child abuse be reported to someone. μηδείς (talk) 01:57, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

At Wikipedia_talk:Reference_desk/Miscellaneous#Closed_section_reporting_possible_sexual_assault the closing editor indicated someone at the foundation had been informed. Monty₈₄₅ 02:01, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

I missed that given it wasn't noted on the item itself. Looking at the suicide guideline I suspect it should still be redacted by an admin. μηδείς (talk) 02:07, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

I have hidden the edits. Mfield (Oi!) 04:13, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. μηδείς (talk) 04:25, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Yeah just to confirm I did email emergency -at- wikimedia.org as they seemed the best equipped to decide whether and who to inform even if it's arguably not a literal emergency. I didn't mention it in my response to the OP as I wasn't sure it was a good idea to say it there where the OP may read it. I'm aware of the guideline but wasn't sure whether to treat it like a normal treat of harm or suicide case so left the question and responses be rather then deleting and asking for revdel, but will do so in the future if people feel that's best and in retrospect I probably should have brought it here so others could decide whether to do so even if I didn't delete the question. Nil Einne (talk) 08:29, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Someone should take care of the sinebot edit where the IP is revealed.—Ryulong (琉竜) 08:40, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• One thing to keep in mind is that many jurisdictions have very strong new "requirement to report" laws where not reporting something to the proper authorities can come with its own criminal penalties. That was my reason for coming here even after seeing the thread had been archived. (Again, I hadn't seen Nil on talk saying he'd emailed WMF yet.) μηδείς (talk) 16:03, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Elaborate hoax articles

I have PROD'd these two: Murray Chance and The Tarsus Club. Both were written by WP:SPAs in 2010–2011, both are about a mysterious Chance family, neither has any decent sources, but both are supported by professional-looking hoax websites (which they'd be largely copyvios of if those sites really existed first). Am I right? How might we discover if there are more like this from about the same time? Dicklyon (talk) 06:09, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

The "Memorandum of Understanding between the HM Treasury, the Bank of England and the Financial Services Authority" doesn't seem to mention the guy at all (either as David or Murray Chance). So that's at least one problem with WP:V. The first three sources, which would be legit if verified, are unfortunately dead links now, thanks to the never-ending website redesigns that these money-laden orgs pull. Someone not using his real name (talk) 06:15, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

There's another hint of hoax if you search for the "one of the leading forces that helped create the euro in the 1990s" quote. That finds an article here (in a not terribly reliable source) with a near identical quote about "Etienne Davignon- decade-long chairman of the Bilderberg Group". Someone not using his real name (talk) 06:31, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Basically, the bio article appears to have been constructed by piecing together verifiable facts about several other people and then attributing the deeds to this Chance guy. I have tagged that article with CSD#G3. Someone not using his real name (talk) 06:38, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

As for the club article, none of the independent sources cited even mention it. So it's really only sourced to itself. Tagged with CSD#A7 as the fantastic claims about itself are not credible lacking even a mere mention in the independent sources cited. Someone not using his real name (talk) 07:02, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Apparently, it was some filmmakers' rather clever decision to promote their conspiracy film by creating Misplaced Pages articles on some of the shady fictional players before the film was even released. This is what they call guerrilla marketing.--The Devil's Advocate _{tlk. cntrb.} 07:28, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Good catch. By the way, this is an ongoing vandalism issue. The mythical club has been added as recently as last month to three articles by an IP. Google Books finds no mention of this club. Someone not using his real name (talk) 16:04, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Section blanking of Burj Khalifa by Binthaneya (with npov issues)

I don't generally find myself doing much more than basic vandal reverts (this is my first ANI post) so forgive me as I try to do the best I can here (and hopefully this is the right place). I stumbled upon this (possible) NPOV/Section blanking issue through my regular vandal patrol. I have no ties to the page whatsoever.

User Binthaneya (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) has insistently blanked the "Labour Controversy" section of Burj Khalifa (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) with edit summaries that indicate NPOV issues. Diffs of these section blankings can be found here: 1 2 3 4 - I can see no valid reason for this section to be removed without discussion.

I contacted the user via their talk page and stated that before they blank a section, they should cite sources/discuss it on the talk page. The talk page discussion can be found here with my initial comment, the user's reply and my subsequent reply. The Labour Controversy section of Burj Khalifa remains blanked as I wish not to violate 3rr. -Ryan 07:07, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• Also, a look at the twitter the user connected connected themselves to in their talk page reply (@binthaneya), indicates they are from a Human Resource company. -Ryan 07:12, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

I've restored the section and warned for WP:3RR violation, explaining that Twitter is not a good venue for dispute resolution. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 07:40, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

...apparently with not useful effect. The Guardian and the BBC are biased, western colonialisms. Can another admin please step in? --Stephan Schulz (talk) 07:43, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

User has begun making biased edits (see edit summaries) to The Dubai Mall (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) -Ryan 08:14, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Blocked 24 hours for starting a new edit war at The Dubai Mall. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 08:16, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

This is a bit strange, but the editor in the section below on AfD canvassing also has edited substantially at Burj Khalifa and The Dubai Mall. curious, especially given that they are now fairly clearly using socks. -- # ▄ 11:58, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Coincidental. Binthaneya is a self-identifying individual through his edit summaries and his attempts to use twitter features. Even then, this account should probably be indefinitely blocked. He is clearly here to push an Emirati nationalist agenda.—Ryulong (琉竜) 22:21, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Canvassing at AfD

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Nabil rais2008 appears to be engaging in some pretty obvious canvassing in response to some AfDs. , , , , , , , etc.

They also appear to have done the same a day or two ago in response to another AfD. See and similar edits from their contribs. That particular AfD has already been closed though. Advice, suggestions, etc appreciated. -- # ▄ 10:12, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• Yes - even though the notice appears to be "neutrally" worded, it isn't as it claims these things are all "notable". The editors who have responded to the canvassing have not even looked at the AfDs - they've just !voted "Keep" three times (in one case in less than a minute). I've left a final warning for the editor. I'm going to close and re-open the AfDs, along with a list of those contacted. Black Kite (talk) 10:43, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

The reason for canvassing is just to broaden the discussion, and inviting more participants and it does not mean to bring the decision to one side. In my point of view by inviting more participants randomly one can easily reach a consensus without any delay, as i did.

Nabil rais2008 (talk) 10:46, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• Which is why one editor came and voted Keep three times in a minute without even looking at the notability? No, notifications like this do not help. If the items are notable, let other editors decide that. By the way, where did User:Blog123 come from to vote Keep three times? You didn't even notify them, and they haven't edited for three years. Very suspicious, that one. Black Kite (talk) 10:49, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Even more suspicious when the edit summary of this diff is considered, IMHO... EdChem (talk) 10:54, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

As I mentioned, the previous AfD discussion regarding Balochistan Rural Support Programme quickly filled up with Keeps. I took that at face value and rescinded its nomination, but it appears the same thing has happened there. -- # ▄ 10:59, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• User:Nabil rais2008: The following edits are problematic: , , , . Per WP:CANVASS, these edits are problematic because the messages are not entirely neutral; they state that several sources have been found and that the topic is notable. Despite the fact that you suggest to !vote either "keep" or "delete," it appears that you're attempting to solicit keep !votes by stating the topic is inherently notable. There could also possibly be issues regarding a selective, partisan audience being contacted, in attempts to votestack, but this would require more research to determine. To avoid future problems, I'd advise you at the very least to word notices absolutely neutrally, and rather than posting to individual users, do so at WikiProjects and via Deletion sorting. Northamerica1000 11:01, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• Its ok to reach consensus again by re-starting the nomination for deletion, and lets see what opinion other users make. One thing more the User: The commandline had wrongly nominated the articles of Dubai Central Library, and Zabeel Mall for deletion, as they do not fall under section "A7. No indication of importance (individuals, animals, organizations, web content, events)" of , here: , as they are building structure are not (individuals, animals, organizations, web content, events). So please advice whether the articles should be nominated for deletion or not ??? Even though the articles are notable, so the question of deletion doesn't arises even.

Nabil rais2008 (talk) 11:09, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• Blocked. As EdChem points out above, User:Blog123 which voted Keep on all three AfDs in one minute after not editing since 2010 was previously named User:Nabil rais2010. Blog123 created Tanveer Ashraf Kaira which the above user then took over the editing of. an SPI has been raised, but per WP:DUCK I have blocked Blog123 indefinitely, and User:Nabil rais2008 for one week. Black Kite (talk) 11:13, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• You blocked Nabel rais2010, or 2008? (or both) Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 11:23, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• Yeah, fixed. Blocked the master (Nabil rais2008) for a week, and the sock Blog123 (formerly Nabil rais2010) indefinitely. Black Kite (talk) 12:05, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

It appears mostly solved for the moment, but I think it germane to the discussion (and for archival purposes) to point out that based on this, for example, (on the user page of one of the users canvassed above, but from 2011) the canvassing does not exactly look like a new thing, nor an isolated incident. -- # ▄ 12:53, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• On his talkpage Nabil rais2008 has claimed that the Mohammad adil account is not his but is editing from the same place. How does he know that, unless it's him? He also claims that Blog123 is not him. Editing history (and the gaps in his edits this morning) say otherwise. We actually might have quite a long-term abuse history going on here. Black Kite (talk) 14:13, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

• He's clearly being untruthful about Blog123, given that account's previous name, so I'd be inclined to disbelieve what he says about any other user linked to him. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 14:26, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

He or she could have simply looked at my contribs. I mention that the adil account mentions Quetta, bodybuilding, etc in the SPI filing. -- # ▄ 14:32, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Stephen Nowlin

Hello -- I am attempting to create a biographical article named "Stephen Nowlin" but am receiving an alert preventing me from even beginning to do so. The alert says the name of my article is blocked because it:

"matches an entry on the local or global blacklists, which is usually used to prevent vandalism."

The Stephen Nowlin I am attempting to write about is a noted curator of contemporary art. The article draft, with references, is located in my sandbox. Can you help enable me to submit this new article?

Many thanks,

Luther Hathaway

Luther Hathaway (talk) 19:33, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

You should post this at Misplaced Pages:Requested moves, not here. Note to admins/anyone else concerned: It's tripping filter

.*\bNwlins?(Wiki)?\b.*

Jackmcbarn (talk) 19:40, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

@Luther Hathaway: - I have moved your sandbox to Stephen Nowlin. GiantSnowman 20:09, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Actually, Jackmcbarn, this is the right place — when you try to create a page with a blacklisted title, you're told to come to the administrators' noticeboard if you're making the edit in good faith. Luther Hathaway, I think I know what happened: one of our more prominent administrators is someone called NawlinWiki, and the code that Jackmcbarn provides makes me guess that someone was creating junk pages to attack him. Basically, the software's set up to prevent pages being created about him, and it incorrectly thought "Stephen Nowlin" was another one of these attack pages. Nyttend (talk) 21:55, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

I've mentioned that at MediaWiki talk:Titleblacklist. Also, I just checked MediaWiki:Titleblacklist-forbidden-move, and it directs you to WP:RM. Jackmcbarn (talk) 21:58, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes, but that's one of two things that happens when you try to move a page; I can't remember seeing that name before, because I've always encountered MediaWiki:Titleblacklist-custom-pagemove. Both it and MediaWiki:Titleblacklist-forbidden-edit reference the administrators' noticeboard, and (more importantly) note that Luther said that he got a notice that didn't even let him start the page — that's Titleblacklist-forbidden-edit. I guess he put it in a sandbox because he couldn't create it at the proper title. You can easily get Titleblacklist-forbidden-edit by going to http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=HaGGER&action=edit. Nyttend (talk) 22:08, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Unhelpful edits, redux

Last month, I reported 108.54.106.70 (talk · contribs · WHOIS) for causing several issues in his edits and not responding to requests to stop. Following the end of the block, the IP has performed the same disruptive edits any time it makes edits to the whole of a page rather than its sections by removing every single carriage return between section headers . I'm aware these pages aren't the best anyway, but the edits are not going to be of any help when editing the article. The previous block obviously did not send any sort of message to the operator of the IP.—Ryulong (琉竜) 22:09, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

This one definately needs an admin to study this one somewhat. Ryulong has been hounding this IP, reverting almost every edit made, reported the IP as a vandal causing what appears to be a block by a careless admin based on just Ryulong's report. Have a look at the IP talk page for this no history block for "not responding on his talk page"?? Later another careless admin posted a warning on the IP's talk page only to have Ryulong revert the admin's reversion of the edit, stating that the edit was helpful. This is the forth frivolous complaint (I can't find one linked from talk page probably removed due to ridiculousness) Ryulong has made against this editor in what appears as a clear case of WP:Ownership. Ryulong needs some attention here. This is clearly disruptive behavior over content disputes. 99.251.120.60 (talk) 13:46, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

User:Cristiano Tomás

I would like this user banned from reverting any edit of mine on any page. I'm fed up with his uncivil attitude, exemplified by . DrKiernan (talk) 22:11, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

We generally don't do interaction bans unless other things have failed first. I've given Cristiano a "stop now" warning and will give a final warning if I notice more. Either he'll stop or he'll be blocked; an interaction ban would be a lot of unnecessary bureaucracy at this point. Nyttend (talk) 22:16, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Incivility and long-term edit warring by User:201.215.187.159

I have continuing concerns over this editor; he has been using very strict interpretations of guidelines as justification for some of his edits, he has made rather uncivil remarks in various locations (particularly edit summaries and his talk page, and has also repeatedly removed two images on You have two cows and For sale: baby shoes, never worn, asserting from the MoS that "Images must be relevant to the article that they appear in and be significantly and directly related to the article's topic", yet have been long-standing images supported by consensus. Even after being given a final warning surrounding his disruptive behaviour (and staying off said articles for just over a week), he has returned and removed the controversial images again.

Could we have someone take a look at this? ViperSnake151  Talk  23:30, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

I've blocked them for a week.--Bbb23 (talk) 23:41, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Talk page comments being deleted (from Copyright status of work by the U.S. government talk page).

Please see this DRN, which received no input, even after a relisting : http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Misplaced Pages:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard&oldid=567171893#Copyright_status_of_work_by_the_U.S._government

Re. links and diffs to involved pages, editors, proposed solutions : see the DRN, please… --Elvey (talk) 23:52, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Notification

Also, why is manual notification of involved parties still considered necessary given bots that do this : http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=User_talk%3ATJRC&diff=cur&oldid=prev ? I will notify if someone doesn't beat me to it, but still wonder. --Elvey (talk) 23:52, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Unlike DRN, there's no set process that we must follow here, so there's nothing on which to base a bot's actions. Let's say I complain about something you're doing, but I don't link your name; how will the bot know that I'm talking about you and not some random person who goes by Elvey in real life? Or if I don't mention you by name, but I link to a diff made next after an edit you made (like you did, linking to your edit when talking about the bot edit that preceded it); how will the bot know that I'm complaining about you and not the person whose diff I've linked? I agree that it would be very convenient to have bot notifications for this page, but I simply don't think it's possible. Nyttend (talk) 04:09, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

Special:Contribs/64.134.96.161

The IP defaces the user: page, making an edit war in process. Incnis Mrsi (talk) 12:28, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

WP:AIV would have been the correct venue, but I have reverted and blocked as a sock. GiantSnowman 12:31, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

• Misplaced Pages noticeboards