Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 08:23, 8 June 2006

My archived talk1

Edits to NKVD

Before threatening to accuse something in POVism, I suggest to look into person's history of edits. In this particular case, I am one of the few who systematically adds factual articles about political repressions in the USSR and maintains the consistency of the category:Soviet political repressions (I added its reference to NKVD; did you happen to look into it?). As for the deletions, I deleted all what was erroneous in this chaotic babble about how bad NKVD was. In particular, deportations of tatars etc. were put into section that speak about "liberated territories", which is nonsense. Deportations deserve a special section. In fact, this is the whole article Population transfer in the Soviet Union, which shows that there was a whole politics of the Stalinist state, rather than deeds of these NKVD villains. As for explanations, I am not going to explain every nonsense an anonymous contributor adds to wikipedia. But I am pretty tolerant to other editors' point of views in cases of disputes. Like I said, I prefer to work with factual material, which, unlike various political rant, is usually impossible to contest. I believe this is the true goal of an encyclopedia. Mikkalai 17:35, 19 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Good work on the Cassette Scandal article!

Good job. 68.81.231.127 12:25, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

And also on the UBK article!

police

i dont know if your are aware, but you deleted the police page. be carefull with your edits. Xtra 13:18, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Surely I din't mean to. And I've no idea how did it happen. Anybody has? Web experts? Cause this is not the first time when I'm accused in misterious deleting. AlexPU

Ukrainians in space

Hi Alex. On a whim, I created and populated Category:Ukrainian space program while avoiding work. The articles are all little stubs. Would you have a look and see if I haven't left out anything obvious? I wanted to start an article about the Sich-1 and Coronas-F satellites, but I've run out of time. Michael Z.

Will do my best, Michael.

Pryvit, AlexPU

Take a look at NKAU and its talk. AlexPU

Category problems

But you're a lucky guy - I've tried to create already two new categories and no freaking effect so far. Would you take a look when not so busy?

• Category:Non-combat accidents involving military
• Category:Kyiv city

You don't really have to create category pages, as such. Just put a new category link at the bottom of an article. Then go to that category, which now has your article in it, and put one or more category links to parent categories in there. The new category is now part of the hierarchy. —Michael Z. 2005-01-22 16:54 Z

One more thing: when the category is still an orphan, the links above generate a URL that goes to the page for editing. But you can still manually type or paste the URL into your browser, and see the page (e.g., http://en.wikipedia.org/Category:Non-combat_accidents_involving_military).

Khotyn uprising (1919)

I think you should be interested to take a look at the Khotyn article, which is repeatedly flooded by Romanian nationalism. If you have any facts on the Khotyn uprising, please help to make the article better. Ghirlandajo 06:55, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Fantastic idea!

Hi,

Good job man! That was a great idea to create Category:Non-combat accidents involving military. Good luck! --Pouya 19:33, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Category:World Heritage Sites in the Ukraine

I've replied on my talk page; it's prolly easiest to keep the discussion in one place. — OwenBlacker 20:34, Feb 19, 2005 (UTC)

Tobias COnradi's unacceptable actions on oblasti pages

I cannot revert. Oblast' is not english. Please look on other countries (not Russia) where else do we use non-english terms? Privet Tobias Conradi 07:19, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)

If someone has another opinion than you, you call him asshole? Tobias Conradi 07:39, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Where do you think is the best place to discuss the naming of province/oblast? Tobias Conradi 07:42, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)

If someone is defiantly ignoring the Wiki ethics and objections from other Wikipedians, and refusing to discuss his edits, I call him an asshole. And today's asshole seems to be To-o-o-bias Conradi! AlexPU

At this stage, you got no moral right to discuss anything. You had your chance after my first polite reprimand. Now you're discredited - at least for some time. If you're concerned with the naming of province/oblast, please ask some tolerant and co-operative Wikipedian to back your opinion and fulfill all necessary discussion procedures. And please, don't rename anything more. AlexPU

WikiEthics are Be bold. I stopped renaming, but had to rename until K starting from Z. Because I was allready in some K. So now we know oblasts pages from K-Z all have been moved. You call Would you stop renaming oblast' until you freaking hear the objections of other Wikipedians polite? And than after 7 minutes giving me an 24h-ultimatum? Maybe I have seen your first message only short moments before?

I stop renaming for now and would really like to talk about it. Tell me where Privjet from Berlin. :-) Tobias Conradi 08:37, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)

An appropriate place to discuss this would be Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Ukrainian subdivisions, which you may have noticed was linked from the top of each oblast's talk page. Please calm down, people. I've only noticed this debate now. Would someone summarize on that talk page?

Oblast is indeed an English word, at least according to the American Heritage Dictionary. —Michael Z. 2005-03-4 16:09 Z

I have never been on any oblast talk page. Thanks telling that oblast might be english, but what about oblast' as it was written? Tobias Conradi 07:57, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)

In the german WP we also use the word Oblast. Tobias should not try to move the oblast-articles in de:WP. --Steschke 07:46, 2005 Mar 5 (UTC)

You are talking nonsense - I never tried anything with de:WP Tobias Conradi 07:57, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Wenn du dir die Mühe machen würdest zu verstehen: Tobias should not try ist Future. --Steschke 13:16, 2005 Mar 6 (UTC)

My fight against Tobias was purely the matter of ethics (and not the question of content) - as well as my other Wikiconflict with Russian propagandists. If a guy is renaming 25 typical and large-subject articles without any discussion, "fighting" the wide-spread Misplaced Pages term, he deserves a massive censure. And I'm eager to repeat such actions against every other defiant vandal (no matter how much time would I spend for it). If Tobias voluntarily reverted his own (those still unreverted) changes, it would be the best demonstration of his tolerance, co-operativeness and contributing objectivity.

As for the essence of the oblast' question, I'm always ready to discuss the possible changes to oblast' pages. I'm going to do that exactly where Michael suggests to do it. And even if the consensus of Wikipedians recognizes the idea of Tobias, I would still demand his edits to be reverted before the end of discussion. While we discuss the edits, other people might just look for the info on oblast's :( AlexPU

Ukrain city maps

Hi Alex, I invite you to find out the best basic ukrain map to show the position of cities. We discuss here --ST ○ 06:58, 2005 Mar 9 (UTC)

Sorry, I try to explain: We try to find a construct to represent Ukrainian cities. The first point is to find a map to point the position of a city (independently if it's actually on it's correct place). We thought about oblasts with named cities first. That has the disadvantage that you only can use it in the deWP. And the oblasts are not useful to orientate. So we discuss now, if we shouldn't use simple maps of Ukraine only with dots on them. That would have the advantage, that we could store the images at commons and all WPs can use them in their language. And they would have a similar look (like the Image:Location berlin in germany.png, which are used in all german articles of cities and towns). Because of this idea, I asked you to take a look and take part at the discussion if you think this idea could be success- and useful also for you. --ST ○ 23:22, 2005 Mar 9 (UTC)

Navy Expert

I would like to work with you on articles about Military of Ukraine, Russian Navy, and so on. I am currently working on articles (very slowly) about Soviet and Russian submarine accidents. I spent many years in the United States Navy's Submarine Service, and now I work for the Navy as a civilian contractor, so in English I am something of an expert. ➥the Epopt 15:30, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I'd also be pleased to help, with English/American terminology and usage etc. Pedant 19:46, 2005 Mar 9 (UTC)

Thank you guys. I'm fastening my preparations for the joint attack. For the start, I suggest both of you (especially the professional Epopt) to consider where could you harvest the info on particular ships of the Soviet/Ukrainian (and also, if you want, Russian) navies. I mean there must be some English -language military guides (Jane's or what is it called?) where you can find the:

• old Soviet names and codes as well as the new codes (or what the digit labels on the boards are called?)
• the types of particular ships and their NATO classification
• any other relevant info (where and when she was built, history, pictures etc.)

To refine your search, I'm preparing the list of the actual ships with their Ukrainian names (judging by mostly media sources). Also, I'm going to clarify the history, personalia&ranks and bases (however, bases and ports may be also best accesible to you through international navy guides). Best wishes, AlexPU

• The military guide you're thinking of is Jane's Fighting Ships and its hundreds of spin-offs. Jane's Web site is http://www.janes.com/ .
• I'm not sure what you mean by "the digit labels on the boards" -- is that "K-141" for the submarine Kursk?
• Some information on Soviet and Russian submarines (Stupid question: does Ukraine operate submarines?) can be found at http://submarine.id.ru/ . I haven't looked for surface-fleet info recently.
• NATO reporting name are reasonably easy to look up on various .mil Web sites.

➥the Epopt 15:26, 10 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Hi Epopt. I've tried to look into Jane's. there's a lot of info there, and it seems to be largely pay-only. So I need some time (and hepl may be) to harvest something here.

By "labes" I meant the digit-letter combinations painted on the boards of the surface ships. Not sure for subs. I guess that combination is unique and important. Isn't it?

Yes, Ukraine possess a small old diesel sub named "Zaporizhia" (Cyrillic Запоріжжя). Don't know the class/project - can you harvest it knowing the name?. And no :(( we don't operate it - the sub is in permanent repair since it was commisioned form Russian guys - that's why she is a constant hero of journalist stories. But the Navy comand demonstrates the willing to operate it someday.

Thanks for the first help. AlexPU

I have added a tiny amount to your stub about Ukraine's submarine, and I'll add more as I research it. ➥the Epopt 23:16, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC)

DYK

Just so you know. Since we're on the English wikipedia here, Kiev is how most English people refer to the city. I therefore changed the link in your suggested item. (I do believe the Ukrainian name is mentioned in the lead, though. Mgm| 13:23, Mar 11, 2005 (UTC)

Arsenal

Hi Alex, please look at the note I left at the Arsenal Mutiny article talk page. Also, may I suggest you to avoid using Kyiv in Misplaced Pages as the primary name of the city. I understand that you may want to promote the usage of Kyiv by using it yourself. But at Misplaced Pages, I think, the choice of the term should reflect the current usage rather than promote some terms over the others. Regards, Irpen 07:12, Mar 18, 2005 (UTC)

Alex, I am responding to the note you left at my talk page. I don't have a big problem with FC Arsenal called either way. Save few exceptional cases, I usually don't go to the page just in order to change a single term when it is as contentious as Kiev/Kyiv. Mostly, I only do this change in the course of some other page edits. Unlike when used for the name of the city itself in English WP, the argument you made for the FC name has merit and I am happy to have it the way you changed it back.

I don't feel good, though, about the tone of the note you left at my talk page and about your calling my edits outrageous. Please don't become short-tempered when you disagree with others. I work on all articles in good faith and I don't think I deserved to be addressed in such a tone. Now, lets put this matter behind and go back to business of improving the WP. Please don't take this personally, but I think your should reconsider your usage of Kyiv for the name of the city in your edits. I left a note on the talk page of one of the articles and there is enough said on this heated discussion elsewhere. Please note, that I agreed with your moving the Irpen river article into Irpin, which I think made perfect sense for today's day. You may notice, that I created the article a while ago, and now I would have created it as Irpin as well. I hope, our discussions will remain civil, and I really appreciate your contributions to WP, including those I disagree. Irpen 22:34, Mar 18, 2005 (UTC)

Apologies presented for the tone - it really was an emotional pre-emptive attack. I'm glad you recognize the essence of my objection regarding the football club. Best wishes, AlexPU 20:45, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Chersones

Hi Alex, I'm looking for a picture or scan of an 1 Griwna banknote to use in the article about Chersones (Sewastopol). Do you have an idea? --ST ○ 19:47, 2005 Mar 18 (UTC)

Elya left this on my talk-page: Alex, where are you living and what driver do you need ? I'll be in Ushhorod in May and could bring you something on CD ;-) - if this is not too late. --elya 18:29, 19. Mär 2005 (CET) --ST ○ 19:56, 2005 Mar 19 (UTC)

Thanks a lot, Elya&Steschke. I'm a Kyivite, and, unfortunately, not going to visit Uzhhorod in foreseeable future. Actually, I'm looking for a CD ( with an HP Scanjet 6200 driver. If I don't get that from my friends or acquaintances - hope to buy it at the "something CD:)" (I got your humor) market. But anyway, thanks for readiness to help.

BTW, Elya, I see you've done a great Ukraine-related job there at De:Misplaced Pages (judging from the titles I can somehow understand from German). Best wishes, AlexPU 20:51, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC).

Unfortunately, I'm leaving for an approximately month-long Wikibreak. (Don't know how will I stand it :( ). But, feel free to post your possible messages and help requests here - I promise to answer them ASA return. Pryvit, AlexPU 21:05, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Best wishes to you during your leave, Alex. Thanks for all your hard work and knowledgeable contributions around here. Cheers, Michael Z. 2005-03-20 21:48 Z

Dropped in for a minute

Hi everybody. I dropped in for a minute - just to see what's happening in this great project. Unfortunately, I'm still on Wikibreak and have no time/energy for contribiting. Sorry if I didn't answer someone's message.

However:

• I can now scan and send some not very large Ukraine-related images (since I have a scanner). E.g., Sven Teschke requested a bank note scan.

• I've got a large multimedia collection depicting our Orange Revolution (TV newscasts&footages, animated clips, photos, photodesign, scanned leaflets, music etc.) Some of this stuff is copyrights-free or anonimous. If someone would like to post it at the respective Wiki pages - I can also send it.

So, people, if you need my help with some particular non-lasting tasks - please E-mail me.

Best wishes, AlexPU 12:02, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)

P.S. If someone is interested in my experience, I do miss Misplaced Pages, but without any addiction suffering. My work pressure keeps me far from even thinking about writing something more :(( But I miss English very much. WP was the only place where I could use it. Hope I will return to editing someday.

Welcome back

Hi Alex! Just slumming a bit at Misplaced Pages? Thanks for filling in some info at tank desant. Hope to see you around here a bit. —Michael Z. 2005-11-10 19:38 Z

Hi Michael! Thanks for your welcoming. Glad to see you active as usual. Couldn't stand my desire to edit something, and to use English again. So many things changed since I left... I'm a little afraid of returning to our mainstream Ukraine articles. Need to read and think more. User:AlexPU

And I freaking forgot how to sign myself...

Done AlexPU

Sign with four tildes: ~~~~. Yup, some things change, some don't. Add Portal:Ukraine and some of its sub-pages to your watchlist. Cheers. —Michael Z. 2005-11-10 21:35 Z

Sorry Michael

Sorry Michael, I've incidentally blanked your talk page. Tried to fix it for a 5 times - with no freaking success. Would you do it yourself and accept my apologies& AlexPU 21:12, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

No problem; already fixed. I think the page is too long; I'll archive most of it shortly. Have a look at Raions of Kiev. —Michael Z. 2005-11-11 21:14 Z

Будьмо знайомі!

Hi Alex, nice to meet you here. There is so little Ukrainian editors at WP. Let's keap contact.--AndriyK 19:04, 12 November 2005 (UTC)

Hi. I've already noticed you're an active editor of Ukraine pages. (I've been on a long Wikibreak.) And you seem to be fighting Russian gingoists - as I sometimes do. Tak trymaty! AlexPU 19:10, 12 November 2005 (UTC)

Alex, yet again, I urge you to avoid name calling. In no time after your return to Misplaced Pages you resumed using this practice all too much. Maybe you forgot, but your first ever message to me (shortly after I've just started here) was a rude one. At that time, I was almost a newbie and you were an aged Wikipedian so welcoming me. Now, that I am also an aged Wikipedian, the first message from you after your wikibreak is even more rude.

I understand that, as you put it, you are now "too busy now to study Wikiethics pages thoroughly", but even if you apply any common sense ethics and civility rules you would have not done that and you don't need to read WP:Civil to be aware of that.

I hope you said "tak trymaty" above without really studying the contributions of the above user which by now have included disruptive behaviour, lack of civility, extreme POV pushing, multiple 3RR violations, effective vote falsification by using forums to recruit socks/absentee votes see (talk:Oleg of Chernihiv), personal attacks on and off Misplaced Pages, multiple copyright vilations and moving articles by cut and paste when he could not get his way by an accepted procedure. If you are interested, you can read his talk, especially starting from User_talk:AndriyK#Discussion_at_maidanua.org, my talk, particularly starting from User_talk:Irpen#Discussion_on_maidanua.org. In no time AndriyK managed to get himself blocked thrice, see (his block log), and aggravate everyone around him. This is a rather typical representation of his contributions.

I remember many good contributions you made before your wikibreak and we do need contributors around here. I hope you will help to make several more Ukrainian articles Misplaced Pages:Featured articles. So far we have only one, the Hero of Ukraine article, mostly written by an American, BTW. Shame on us! The featureable articles, IMO (those sufficiently detailed to be within reach) are Kiev, History of Kiev, Orange Revolution, Ukrainian language (particularly its history). My pet project History of Christianity in Ukraine is largely abandoned, but could be revived if there is an interest. I am looking forward to your help. --Irpen 21:26, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

Na/v Ukrayini—eliminating vague language

Hi Alex. My question at talk:Ukraine#Na/v Ukrayini—eliminating vague language could probably use your perspective. Thanks. —Michael Z. 2005-11-15 17:37 Z

Hi. I'll see what can I add to discussion. AlexPU 18:53, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

Navbox

The navbox is done. By the way, I'm Ukrainian too. --Akhristov 00:12, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Propagandistic vandalism in progress

People, I can't stand the behaviour of some of Russian (and Russia-biased) Wikifellows. The "behaviour" is the key, cause I don't deny they right to have their highly-erroneus views an present them correctly on WP. But I will renew my fight against the propaganda-driven vandal-like actions like undiscussed deletions and unforgiveable denials of common sense.

I'm going to list such uncooperative Wikipedians here. Feel free to edit and discuss the list.

And let's see are they brave enough to not delete themselves or each other from here.

• User:Ghirlandajo (hopefully, expelled as far as I found out today)
• User:Ezhiki (self-acclaimed, may be not)
• User:El fil (embattled by objective users over East Ukraine)
• User:Irpen --added myself just to spare the effort for the host of the disgusting attack page. --Irpen 23:25, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

Discussion

See Wikipedia_talk:Polish_Wikipedians'_notice_board#Another_Black_Book --Yakudza 23:13, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

A comment on your list above. Polish editors being offended by many anti-Polish remarks on articles’ talk pages, decided once to create a page where they would be able to deal with the offending users. You may see it here 1. Unfortunately, despite their best intentions, few people on Wiki approved the idea, and the page went through two VfDs 1 2. The final result was certainly not the assumed one. Not only it didn’t solve anything, but also it backfires from time to time, like on this RfA 1.

During the many discussions we had held due to explain our view, many people suggested that problems with such problematic users should be solved with the use of the existing Misplaced Pages policy tools like RfC or ArbCom. And although that is exactly what Polish editors wanted to avoid, today, when I look back at the discussions, how much of our energy they took, and how little we achieved, I really think that the official tools would be the best idea. Some of the comments you oppose were posted on our board, and I can understand your frustration, however, the list is unlikely to resolve anything. Regards --SylwiaS 00:36, 24 November 2005 (UTC)

Hi. I think I know a better place to discuss the edits of Mr.Ghirlandajo. Why don't you engage there? In fact, there's a balance of views there (created by his proponents ignoring this list). Wishes, Ukrained 10:27, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

Thank you everybody for commenting an important and complicated issue. Please proceed! Ukrained, I already did. And thank you for alerting me of the freaking East Ukraine. Thank you Poles (and dziewczyny polskie:) for info on "black lists". BTW, I hardly could be elected admin because of my short-temperedness and poor English. And I'm happy about it. If being elected means compromise with the disgraced editors - I don't need it. I suggest this approach for Mr.Halibutt particularly. Best wishes, AlexPU 23:14, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

Ok, Ezhik and Irpen, I'll watch your asses most thoroughly if you wish - to evaluate your vandalousness. As far as I remember, Irpen qualifies enough :(. AlexPU 17:32, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Cool it

Please take a look at Misplaced Pages:Vandalism#What vandalism is not. Characterizing others' edits as vandalism in a POV dispute is a serious breach of civility. Just because someone disagrees with you, even if they are wrong, none of these are justifications for calling edit vandalism. You also need to seriously consider toning down your language. Calling others "Propagandistic" and maintaining some kind of hitlist is not conducive to building an encyclopedia. Try to be cooperactive and civil, and if that doesn't resolve a dispute, use our processes at WP:DR, don't just resort to personal attacks and revert warring. Dmcdevit·t 22:55, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Alex, leave another comment like this and you'll find yourself blocked for a while to cool off. I know you feel strongly, but that does not justify abusive language. It does nothing to build an encyclopedia, and does much to harm it. Stop. Dmcdevit·t 23:08, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

To answer your questions:

• It is not directly prohibited per se in any policy, but there is a precedent and strong consensus for forcing users to delete them. More importantly though, it is just wrong, and unproductive for Misplaced Pages.
• All of your edits to Misplaced Pages are released under the GFDL. That's what you agreed when you clicked the save button. You cannot take them back, unless there is a standar deletion criterion they fall under. But I especially don't see why you'd want to, if they were useful encyclopedia articles. If you're pondering leaving over this conflict, that may be to our loss, but I would hope you wouldn't want to reduce our store of knowledge here (for anyone in the world to access) because you can't get along with an editor. Dmcdevit·t 00:18, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

Mediation concerning St Volodymyr Cathedral

Hi Alex, if you interested in the St Volodymyr Cathedral article, why not to join the mediation procedure? Please check your mailbox.--AndriyK 09:53, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

Sorry, I couldn't find enough time. AlexPU 23:14, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

This type of censorship makes me sick

Vote to keep, show these hypocrites what's what, tolerance? ha, only when it's good for them--Diatrobica;l 23:12, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

Hi. First you read what you wrote :) Wishes, AlexPU 23:14, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

List of Ukrainians/User:Antidote

Hi, I am struggling to preserve the integrity of the List of Ukrainians from disuruption caused by User:Antidote, who repeatedly and arbitrarily deletes a number of people from the list. I would appreciate if could join me in editing the list and on the talk page.

User:Antidote is involved in a number of edit wars and has caused disurption to various East European, Catholic, and Jewish lists and is probably involved in multiple voting. See Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_comment/Antidote. I would appreciate if you could endorse the request for comment at Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_comment/Antidote#Other_users_who_endorse_this_summary or post an outside view.--Pecher 19:54, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

What a ... there ... But a really complicated issue depending on general approach. AlexPU 23:14, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

My Wikistatement

Ladies and gentlemen!

I'm concerned with  the terrible pro-Russian propaganda on
Misplaced Pages,
and community's failure to stop it.
The supposedly-neutral Wikifellows
permanently can't see (or pretending they can't)
the evident POV-contributions, and most important,
both the vandalistic and the insidious methods
used to preserve those contributions.
This disappoints me very mother-fucking much!!!

So I find Wikiediting a rather nervous (although a high-minded) activity. I passionately hope to see positive changes on Misplaced Pages NEUTRALITY!!!

I will kindly ask all of you for following:

• Don't purge this statement (even if you find it illiberal) and don't let people whom I described do it. May be it will require watching the anonymous vandalism.
• Don't purge the list of propagovandalists above, even if you dislike the idea. Instead, developing that list would be a sign of a true political correctness - towards Ukraine, Ukrainians, and, not to forget, Misplaced Pages principles.
• Do discuss the issues raised on my talkpage and elsewhere.

Thanks for reading. Best wishes, AlexPU 17:32, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Check your E-mail

Hi AlexPU. In case if you come here during your break, check your E-mail. Best wishes, Ukrained 07:57, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

Hi. I didn't. And I wasn't checkin my mail all that time. Sorry. Hope to cooperate in future since I'm back. Pryvit, AlexPU 16:52, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Deal. Check my new mail to you. Ukrained 19:09, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Ukrainian presidential election

Sorry, I justb ignored the first rerun, because it was declared invalid. Thanks for your updates.Electionworld = Wilfried (talk 10:00, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Мілена Марківна Куніс

I recently added a Ukrainian version of Mila Kunis' name in the article. I did find it using my poor Russian skills and a great deal of dead reckoning and guesswork. It would be nice if you, being a native Ukrainian speaker, could verify it and give me some peace of mind. Thank you. --GSchjetne 11:31, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

(Reply to your message in my talk page --GSchjetne 09:30, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Civility

It seems to me that you have been uncivil on User talk:Irpen. It is important to keep a cool head, despite any comments against you. Personal attacks and disruptive comments only escalate a situation; please keep calm and action can be taken against the other parties if necessary. Your involvement in attacking back can only satisfy trolls or anger contributors, and lead to general bad feeling. Please try to remain civil with your comments. Thanks!

abakharev 07:54, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

born in kyiv

hi alex, my name is ifeldman84 12:06, 1 May 2006 (UTC) --Ifeldman84 09:11, 1 May 2006 (UTC) and i would like to know whether you have a template "born in kiev" thanks long live UKRAINE

Hi there! No I don't have it, and neither do you judging by your userpage :)) But I'd like to have such template, and support the idea. Where do I sign, vote or whatever (except of draw and design :)?.AlexPU 09:25, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Calmness

So you made this vicious personal attack and were warned for incivility just above this comment. I'll reiterate: Civility is 1) not hard at all and not much to ask for, 2) non-negotiable, 3) common sense. I reiterate because almost every single edit since then has been uncivil. In combination, you've been engaging in a serious edit war. Edit wars are never okay. Now, considering the previous warning about incivility, I'm going to make this clearer for you. If I see any more incivility or edit waring in the near future, I will give you a short time off to cool down and think about your behavior and desired maturity level here, editing for an encyclopedia. Thanks. Dmcdevit·t 19:53, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Dear Dmcdevit, I don't admit any guilt in EDITING today. You see, all Wikipedians engage in edit wars, some of them get punished for that. If you decide to punish me, let it be so. If you decide to punish only me, ... we'll discuss it later if needed (for now, see the discussion below :).

As for this, so this is really serious. My new last-resort method against Wikipropagandists. Can you imagine what a mess would occur in Russia-related pages if I fulfill my threat, and recruit other Rus.-literate Wikipedians to it (without POV-pushing or trolling, mere supply of article names and external links)? In order to prevent that and keep each side on it's country pages :), you admins and bureucrats should carefully and ACTIVELY treat the issue of pro-Russian propaganda. Thanks for your intervention and sorry.AlexPU 22:46, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

I don't see how I can be more plain, but let me try. Calling someone a "Wikipropagandist" is a personal attack, and a violation of assume good faith. Make comments only about the content, not the contributor. Meanwhile, this warning was clearly not about content. I am not knowledgeable about, and frankly don't give a whit about the Russian-related pages. That is for those editors who edit them to decide amongst themselves consensually. And civility is a rerequisite to consensus discussion. So, it doesn't actually matter what wrong you are trying to right, you cannot do it with incivility. Language like "Wikipropagandists," or whatever other personal smear you choose, will get you blocked the next time you do it. Dmcdevit·t 07:27, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Discussing Wikicrimes and punishments

Alex, please take the advice above seriously. It understandable that it's hard when your contribution is reverted with "nonsense" as summary, but responding by personal insults does not solve the problem. As an example, Kuban kazak has been blocked for incivility twice (while escaping from the second term thanks to Irpen), and is "working" toward his next block. It would be despondently to see you going the same way. KPbIC 21:34, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

KPbIC, please stick to facts which you know fully well. I intervened only when Kazak was blocked for the second time for the offence for which the original block expired, there is a double jeopardy principle. The second block's summary or explanation didn't say that the blocker viewed the block too short and made it longer. Otherwise, he would have said just that. He problably haven't realized that Kazak was already blocked for his rudeness and was back because the block expired and not because he was never blocked. You've been told about that and you know exactly what you are talking about.

Irpen, it’s your opinion that Kuban kazak was blocked twice for the same offense (which probably was influential in Ezhiki's decision to unblock Kazak). But in my opinion the first block had no effect on Kuban, and I provided all evidences in WP/I, which in my opinion were in no relation to his first block (which he has got for his conflict with Space Cadet). If I steal two pockets, one from you and one from Kuban, and I’m only penalized for stealing Kuban’s pocket, you would probably ask “What about my pocket?”, and that would be a valid concern.

And Kazak will be blocked for each incivil remark and I will not lift a finger in such cases. And I tried and keep trying my best to talk him out of such behavior while what you are doing is basically saying that the AlexPU was right on the issues, just acted the wrong way, and you will miss him. For more, see his entries, edit summaries and the talk page above. --Irpen 21:50, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Irpen, it's too early to miss "me". I'm still here to watch you. AlexPU 06:07, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Wow! :) Thanks! Go right ahead! --Irpen 06:12, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

AlexPU responded uncivilly. It would be sad to lose him as an active contributor, but it’s what will happen unless he drops the uncivil part. This was the main message. (But there are some, not so black/white details). KPbIC 01:31, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

No Personal attacks

This is your last warning. If you continue to make personal attacks, you may be blocked for disruption.

This edit constitues a personal attack, sorry but I am getting tired for asking for WP:CIVIL behavior abakharev 07:13, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Bakharev, I think you are making a wrong judgement of the situation. Not speaking of the previous days, but today (so far), AlexPU and Irpen are on the same page of the civility book, and therefore they should be treated equally. KPbIC 07:37, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

You have been temporarily blocked from editing for disrupting Misplaced Pages by making personal attacks. If you wish to make useful contributions, you are welcome to come back after the block expires. You have been blocked for these edits . I and other sysadmins have warned you multiple times, your level of personal attacks against other users is inadmissable and would not be tolerated. abakharev 21:08, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, Alex, blocking me wasn't fair for two reasons:

• discussing someone's EDITING APPROACH has F nothing to do with "personal attacks"
• technically, Irpen admitted being a vandal by his own edit to may talk page, so I just let people know that

However, I'm not going to fight over this episode of your wrongdoing, mostly in appreciation of your neutral editing on Soviet partisan. But please no more unjust admin decisions, tezka. This is YOUR last warning! AlexPU 20:43, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

The block was perfectly fair, if you don't like those individual diffs there are dozens more to choose from. If you repeat your behaviour you will be blocked again, and for longer. Please remain civil both in what you write on Talk pages and in your edit summaries. Just zis Guy you know? 12:37, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Common sense

Dear Alex, I appreciate your edits very much and will help you with them as well as with fighting the Russian bias here. But discussing Irpen's mother ... that's what unaware readers would notice in the first place instead of your numerous articles :(((. I'd share your concerns and more, things have gone much far here while you were out. But wording... You're messing up the whole our point. Can't you understand that swearing is exactly what they want? It is trolling, it is simple, and it allows Russian Group to call you a troll.

Regarding above said, I support your blocking. Yes, Irpen was provoking you for few days. But yes, ... that Guy is right too: you provided plenty of reasons for blocking yourself last weekends. And yes, Mr.Bakharev would eagerly block you (or me) each time we give him an excuse. In other words, that block was entirely legal. Write something similar again, and I'll report you first - to make a point of neutrality and objectivity. Please don't undermine my politics here.

Let's discuss all other topics of our interest elsewhere (preferrably, by e-mail). Best wishes, Ukrained 19:03, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Ukrained, you a wrong here on several accounts. First, right above you are accusing Alex Bakharev of a willingness to use his admin privilleges to POV push. I quote you above: "Mr.Bakharev would eagerly block you (or me) each time we give him an excuse.". Now, admin abuse is a very serious matter, especially to settle the personal grudges and/or POV disputed. You can't just throw this in someone face with no consequences for yourself whatsoever and have Bakharev just take it from you. If he gave you any reason to accuse him in an improper use of adminship, you should post your substantiated claim at WP:AN. If you haven't done so because you know that in view of lack of any evidence and much evidence to the contrary such posting would make you just look ridiculous, you should not use smearing him at user talk pages as a workaround.

AlexPU is guilty of about dozen of personal attacks lately. Still Bakharev blocked only after four (!) recent warnings (two of them "last") and a multitude of warnings above in case you failed to notice.

As for your calling those who disagree with you a "Russian group", it is just as uncivil. Your accusations that people want to simply dismiss AlexPU presenting him as a troll is as unsubstantiated. Of all talk pages entries AlexPU posted lately, there was only one at talk:Viktor Yushchenko that was on the topic rather than an angry diatribe. In no time I posted my agreement with his suggestion and actually edited the article to make sure it is taken into account.

I absolutely don't care about you both calling me names. It is a general disruption that I am concerned about. If AlexPU's article edits start being as reasonable as yours, Ukrained, (yes, despite your trollish talk page entries and constant assumption of bad faith of everyone but yourself), this all will be a different story. I am looking forward to it but with little hope. And, Alex, if you intend to post another attacking message, better save your nerves and time. This really doesn't upset me anymore. --Irpen 05:30, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

I feel I should answer some semi-official issues mentioned above. First, I accused Mr.Bakharev in willingness (or readiness), not in commited admin abuse. There's a bif difference herem which I realize. As for his willingness, he expressed it on his talk page long before his adminship started. As you may remember, I made it public on his second RfA (when your group clowned the election attacking virtually everyone voting "Oppose"). However, we should consider that AlexPU is an experienced user. Thus, following Mr.Bakharev's logic, AlexPU shouldn't be punished at all :)). By the way, I was only answering the AlexPU's naive amusement of why so reasonable editor as Bakharev blocked him.

And yes, AlexPU was "guilty" (just like User:Kuban kazak here, I have dozens of such diffs). And he (I mean Alex, not Kazak :( ) was punished properly. And I find his article edits reasonable.

As for my reasonable edits, I'm afraid they only seem like those for you because I was out for two weeks in April and now retro-patrolling my wathclist. Sorry If I upset (or don't upset :) you. Ukrained 10:51, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi

It is good to see a contributor from Ukraine on Misplaced Pages. I believe many articles need more Ukrainian editors to preserve NPOV I would like to see a greater cooperation in areas interesting to Central European topics that are native to the region. I know work with certain other editors can be frustrating sometimes, but It is good to hold your anger, it would be a shame to loose a contributor from Ukraine, since they are so few. Have a good day and please don't let others provoke you. --Molobo 23:35, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

PS:If you believe there is a topic on issues connected to Ukraine/Poland that requires neutrality I would be happy to help in discussion. --Molobo 23:37, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Internal Troops

Hi, Ukrained sent me here. He suggested that I might touch with you about Internal troops. I can't directly contribute since I don't speak Russian, Ukranian, Polish or any other Eastern European languages. If there are any English language books or articles on this topic, i might be able to polish it up as part of my interest in Gendarme units. --V. Joe 18:35, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

Internal troops, prt ii

Legal status: I suspect that the Internal Troops are indeed legally Gendarmies, which means that they are subject to the same treatment as any other internal force. For example, American Police officers oath, is identical to that of soldiers, except for the "juridiction of". So, I "X" do solemnly swear to uphold the Constitution of the United States, agaisnt all enemies, foreign and domestic, in the jurisdiction "Y." In the unlikely case of an invasion, US police/sheriffs would act as the "light infantry. So Internal Troops would be treated as troops, rather than civillians. I am not 100% sure, but pretty sure. Other than that, i don't think they rate any official status as "soldiers," but again, I suspect they have the same status as the local border patrol/ coast guard. That they are civillian in peace, soldiers in war... --V. Joe 05:31, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

I see... OK, thanks for sharing your thoughts. Let's keep in touch.AlexPU 10:40, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

AlexPU: Valentine here again. To let you know, I don't know too much about templates, but am willing to learn--[[User: Valentinejoesmith|V. Joe]] 02:03, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

You see, Valentine, I was thinking of some templates (navboxes or whatever) regarding Soviet/post-Soviet law enforcement and military pages. I recently avocated purging one (purely misleading), but started to like the idea. I'm willing to plan them, but not ready to draw now:). If you don't draw neither, we could try to volunteer some experts in that and concentrate on the template contents. E.g., I feel a need for some navbox distinguishing gendarmerie, military police etc.

BTW, if any template-designing expert is reading this message, let them know their help would be appreciated.AlexPU 09:19, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

Tomenko

Just to let you know that it is the policy of those who maintain WP:DYK to not feature stubs there. The article to qualify has to be 1) less than 5 days old (3 days until recently); 2) not a stub. Please unstub it asap if you want it featured. If you are busy, uninterested, blocked or whatever, I will try to find time to do that on my own but I can't guarantee. It would be a pity if the article on such a colorful person misses DYK. I linked a full English L bio in UP and much of it can be used directly as UP only requires it's material to be acknowledged and does not object to its being used. Just a suggestion. Feel free to heed it, ignore it, delete it or whatever. Please don't waste your time for another attack though. Not for mine but for your own sake. That said, I do think that your return (a prolific contributor in the past), might be beneficial for the project. I hope you learn some manners and we will work on improvement of Ukrainian topics. --Irpen 19:21, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

So much you want him to be blocked, and to teach him manners, Irpen ... Please don't try pushing people to your point very much. Instead, take care of Shalashik who keeps surprising me (who else could call user a "балда" and greet him with Victory Day next morning :)

And please, Irpen, don't prevent that Tomenko stub from reaching DYK in any way (although you were right in your criteria objection). As you may remember, two episodes of yours and Ghirlandajos' questioned DYK behaviour happened so far. I wouldn't like to witness a third one. By the way, AlexPU wrote/enlarged several big articles already this month. This said regarding your "contributor in past" incinuation. Best wishes, Ukrained 08:35, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Ukrained, please point out where exactly I tried to perevent any UA article from appearing at DYK. Make sure you check before posting some imagined comments because I am doing all I can to make sure as many UA article appear at DYK as possible. Even for this article I dug up plenty of references and an extremely valuable Eblish L bio that makes unstubbing it extremely easy. SHould I have wanted the article not featured, I would not have done anything for it. And this is exactly the reason why I posted this call for expansion at the first place, and, besides, posted it at the author page rather than the article's talk or under the DYK submission to make sure I post it quietly. If I knew, I would have time within a short time-span when the article qualifies for DYK, I would have just unstubbed it. I, however, did the second best thing: linked sources that anyone, yourslef included, can use to unstub the article. Your perpetual assumption of bad faith all the time are notorious and make you look just as ridiculous. --Irpen 16:58, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

P.S. And I don't want him blocked. Reread my last sentence. While his rudeness beats all records of what I've seen, I developed an immunity here to this kind of stuff. For now I just want him learn some manners because his current manners are disruptive. If it takes blocks to learn, it is not my fault. If he can reform himself on his own, it is just as well. Actually even better. --Irpen 17:01, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, Bohdane, he made his input indeed. And I don't know what DYK problems are you talking about. If Irpen did something to my Tomenko proposition, let me know ASAP.

The thing you're right about: I dont' like instructive stuff like "learn" and "reformed" on my talk. Before writing such mentorical ... here, Irpen, don't forget why did I used some swearing on you. I mean I won't forget your vandalistic purgings of info in the Soviet partisans and subsequent ignorances of my clear arguments in edit summaries. I WILL DO MY BEST TO "REFORM" YOU FIRST, IRPEN. If it takes blocks from any admins, let it beAlexPU 18:58, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

Kuban kazak's report on WP:AN/I

Please, please, please, avoid any questionable comments, or you will be taken down. This is as simple as that. Cossack wrote yet another nonsense, but people around are not blind and they can more-less see it. Check especially Lupo's response on his talk page. Then at the end, what is the point? Also, if you want to engage in that RfC, then do so, but making it conditional on Cossack's action s reckless and bad faith, as nobody would take your comments serionsly on that RfC from this point, and this would be the right thing.

Respect others, think before you write (which I know it's hard, and I forget about it by myself, but it's still the right advice). Almost everybody around would help to fight "the imperial propaganda", just make it clear on what is the propaganda. Please work with Irpen, he is not preoccupied with any old conficts. There is some trolling here and there, but don't be a fish for "smart" fishers.

Again, there is still a lot to be written or added to the wikipedia, ther are alot names to be mentioned. Let's work on this, instead of the identities of POV pushers, which don't deserve to be mentioned. KPbIC 03:04, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

I could not agree more on that last point. I do recall how AndriyK in all his wisdom is not remembered for the useful contributions that he made because there were...none? ;) --Kuban Cossack 19:06, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

To Cossack: I didn't know you, but you deleted my very first message to your talkpage. Should I do the same? Next time I will unless I see decent constructive usage of talkpages from you. And please don't litter this page with Muscovite propaganda images! I'm deleting this shit from your signature. Regarding your message here: were you drunk when writing it or what :) ? What AndriyK has to do with your impudent conversation with Lupo or with this section :))?

My response is my policy, I do not feed the trolls (особенно тех у кого словарный запас желает лучшего). --Kuban Cossack 20:33, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

To KPbIC: thanks for your support, and please supply me with your reasons on that Lupo-images issue.AlexPU 19:23, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

DYK

Did you know? has been updated. A fact from the article Mykola Tomenko, which you recently created, has been featured in that section on the Main Page. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the "Did you know?" talk page.

--Cactus.man ✍ 16:14, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

AlexPU: Glad to help. VJS --V. Joe 22:39, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

POV in History of Christianity in Ukraine

Gigantic POV additions in article History of Christianity in Ukraine by User:Kuban kazak. Please help to clean up. --Yakudza 14:43, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

If you check the history of the article then today's edits were nothing but copyediting of the existing text that has been there for about months. --Kuban Cossack 14:52, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

I'll see what I can do. I guess we'll have problems with every each edit of this Kazak :).AlexPU 09:42, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

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Re:POWs

Here are some official documents more to come. --Kuban Cossack 13:02, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Thank you. But I already warned you about those F flags, didn't I?AlexPU 10:30, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

Bad faith

The "crap, bullshit propaganda navbox" you removed from the Russia page was added by user:Alexandru Busa, a Ukrainian-Romanian user, who is not known for pro-Russian POV-pushing. Besides, this kind of offensive edit summary rings "Troll!" regardless of the actual edits you make. --Illythr 20:34, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Whoops, a bit too late, that. Nevermind, then, I guess... --Illythr 20:35, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

An interesting CfR vote

Hi. Recently I started an obvious CfD case and lost it, probably due to lack of interest among adult editors. There's still a chance to address the issue here. Why don't you join and defend the common sense? Best wishes, Ukrained 11:45, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

OK, but what can we do now? Both category names just reflect idiotistic idea... Can we really vote for deletion there? I'm afraid it's too late :).AlexPU 17:55, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Blocked

You have been blocked for a week for violation of WP:3RR and continuing incivility despite my own previous warings. You have, in fact, had "final" warnings and continued. Hopefully a week off will let you know that we do not tolerate this misconduct, and you will be better behaved when you get back. Dmcdevit·t 20:22, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. BTW, asking you to block also Russian vandals and trolls would be fruitless I guess? Especially after I started to edit Russian articles... :)AlexPU 20:29, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Your message to me

Hi, Alex. I generally have nothing against your most recent edit to Russia, although it looks that in some portions you were overeager to expose negativity that wasn't there or to interpret some of the sources you provided in, eh, somewhat too liberal way, but I take it that you understood my attitude when you reviewed my edit.

As a hard and fast rule, I don't play anyone's games except my own, and the rules of my game are quite simple—stick to the facts; maintain NPOV; provide references, especially to the edits that may be viewed as controversial; be polite, and don't hesitate to listen to others even if you strongly dislike them—you may just discover that you are occasionally wrong. Hmm, looks like I've just quoted most of Misplaced Pages's key concepts. Oh, well.

I don't particularly enjoy adding negative information about Russia or, for that matter, about any other country or subject (one may say that's because I am not a journalist :)). I much prefer balanced approach—if there is only negative, or only positive information about some controversial topic, it means that the article is pretty much useless. I will never cover up some horrid fact be it about Russia's past or present, but I will do my best to tone it down to make it sound more neutral, while still preserving the core factual information, and, of course, to make sure, that it's indeed a fact. For example, that was the reason why I commented out your addition about militsiya "not usually interfering" with hate-crimes: first of all, it may or may not be true in different parts of Russia, so you cannot draw a general conclusion about this being a practice in Russia as a whole; second—the reference you provided only describes one case; one in which militsiya's inaction was a subject of speculation. Notice that I am not saying that the "not usually interfering" part is untrue—I am merely requesting a better source (one newspaper article is certainly not enough to draw this broad a conclusion). Of course, if I had such better source on hands, I'd added it myself.

Finally, even though I am a Russian admin, I cannot take responsibility for behavior of all Russian editors. It certainly hurts me to see that some folks (both on Russian and Ukrainian sides, with you, unfortunately, not being an exception) are unable at times to stick to a civil discussion. It's no less disgusting when any of the sides tries to push their own POV. With all that in mind, I am but one admin; I can't fix the whole world. I interfere when things get really ugly, I always try to help or mediate when being asked, I always enforce policies when I see one being breached, but unless the sides start listening to one another, my efforts often amount to a nerve-wracking, productive editing-distracting waste of time. Often the debates are over the subjects I either know little about (Old Slavic Ukrainian/Russian architecture being a good example) or have no interest in (such as militsiya). Furthermore, any interference by force means the sides are deprived the possibility (however remote) to settle the disputes among themselves on their own. Sum this all up, and you'll have a decent guide explaining my attitude toward the majority of issues. I often wish I could do something to ease the tensions, but not being born a baby-genius it's not easy for me to do :)

I hope I explained my position. Hope to see you continuing with great contributions of yours and discontinuing some of your less-than-productive behavior. You don't have to like or agree with the Russian editors, just show them some respect—everyone deserves as little.—Ëzhiki (ërinacëus amurënsis) • (yo?); 20:41, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

To my friends and enemies

Bohdan, I really need your help with my edits of this day. E-mail me if any questions. Where are you anyway? They already frightened out КРЫС and others, whom can I fucking ally here?! AlexPU 20:46, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Please see my e-mail ASAP. And please, don't edit your talk at all.Ukrained 19:46, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Irpen, that's what I was writing to you on Talk:Soviet partisans right before you arranged my block from a naive Westerner:

"Recruiting someone"? I don't get what are you talking about, asshole. I really don't. BTW, I never participate on any forums except those with advises for PC-users. I never heard of Brama before Misplaced Pages.

The most important: I want (I MEAN IT) the mess you're talking about. Unless you stop your propagovandalism like this. That's my game, don't you get?

So, пидор гнойный, ты об этом всем пожалеешь. Вы все об этом пожалеете. Кстати, я тут осознал всю адекватность твоего ника :). Ирпень - наиболее пророссийский город Киевщины. Я уже не говорю про цыган и наркоманско-проститутскую налоговую академию...AlexPU 20:46, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

the following translation from Russian of the text above is provided by Irpen:

So (sic), the Smelly Faggot (originally the "Purulent Pederast"), you will regret that. You will all regret that. Besides, I just realized the full adequacy of your nick. Irpen' is the most pro-Russian city of the Kiev Oblast. And I don't even speak about gypsies (sic) and the drug-dealling whoring (originally "prostituting") tax academy. (00:05, 2 June 2006 (UTC))

Oh dear. Look, I am not from Irpin city and I've never been there. I took my nick to the river that literally flows upwards just on the whim because... actually it doesn't matter why. When you come back after your vacation, I hope you will watch your mouth at last. You are really wasting your time name calling here. Neither myself, nor others care.

I have an idea for you. Since you like the military topics, please consider expanding the rather apolitical ramming article I wrote a while ago. That's when you are back. It could use much attention from a knowledgeble editor. Have a good one. --Irpen 21:11, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Нечего на Ирпня гнать, я тебя заблокировал вот тут . А политизировать Википедию зря стараешся, учти нас больше, хотя зачем приглашать с ру-нета? Достаточно ваших же с www.anti-orange.com.ua или www.otechestvo.org.ua Кстати действительно какой то вакуум в Украинских статьях образуеться из-за нехватки авторов с юга и востока Украины ... Знаешь я их приглашу, вот тогда тебе по-настоящему прийдеться партизанить ... А пока наслаждайся отпуском на недельку... --Kuban Cossack 20:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Пидор гнойный? Вы все об этом пожалеете? Dude, what is your problem? I could care less about you not liking Russia, but just because you are not getting your edits the way you want them is not a reason to spit poison all around you. Disgusting. Simply disgusting. Irpen, of course, is the chosen one to be blamed for everything. Yuck.—Ëzhiki (ërinacëus amurënsis) • (yo?); 21:10, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Я вижу русское сообщество работает по принципу "Защити своего троля". Вначале группа из трёх товарищей всячески провоцирует, ведет постоянные войны, откатывает любые правки, в том числе и конструктивные - работают группой, чтобы не дай бог не перейти 3RR. Потом наконец то находится какой-нибудь редактор, который поддается на провокацию, и тут уже на него организованно набрасываются - пишут доносы в разные инстанции и становятся в позу обиженных. Я ни в коем случае не оправдываю Алекса за его несдержанность и грубость, но вполне могу понять причину его злости. И не надо делать вид, что вы этого не видите. (Хотя может действительно не видите и действия Ирпеня вам представляются практически ангельскими). Но когда будете оформлять очередное представление на блокировку, присмотритесь повнимательнее. И не забудьте изложить их тоже. --Yakudza 00:35, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Но ведь тоже самое можно сказать про вашу группу Анрийка, Анро-Алексанрыч, Олег Петров, Крыс, Украинутый, Алекс и ты. Ведь сколько можно примеров привести где именно выше-перечисленные также действуют группами. Вспомни-ка бедный Владимирский собор, или Голодомор, или Украинский язык. Ведь там именно это и было. Да многие из высше-перечисленных вполне имееют конструктивные знания и что касаеться их положительного вклада в Википедию - полное уважения, но считать себя святыми НИКТО право не имеет. Кстати есть очень много Украинских авторов которые именно не тратят свои силы на гнев и зло а очень много работают над статьями: Фисенко, ДДима, Серёжа помимо других. Вот к какой группе Ирпень относиться, именно она и есть Украинская а не ваша псеводо-Украинская "шайка". А Ирпня НАДО уважать потому что он единственный который защищает нейтралитет и цельность Украинского викиобщества от (не стану отрицать) нас и от ВАС. Единственная разница это то, что он только от последних за это получает. Конечно со стороны наверно ему жалко видеть как мы, Русские, поделили Украинских писателей на "своих" и на "чужих". Но увы мы этот раскол НЕ ПРОВОЦИРОВАЛИ! Андрийка начал этот цирк а ему вслед пошли остальные. Да любопытно конечно за вами наблюдать, но только мы тут, не причем. Но лично горько видеть как настоящие творчество Украинских писателей остаеться не замеченно под вашеми капризами, я кстати Андрийки давно сказал, что он скрутит весь имидж Украинского общества википедии...как я оказался прав. Так что НАС Русских нечего обвинять в ваших же ссорах, а Ирпня лучше поблагодарить за то, что он единственный кто стареаеться этому расколу не дать раскрутиться на новые виражы. А вы его наоборот гавном поливаете, СТЫД И СРАМ своей нации вот вы кто, такое же гавно которое течет из рта Алекса.--Kuban Cossack 01:40, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Я лично никакого тролля не защищаю, и в России вообще не живу. Но всяких националистов оранжевых, фиолетовых и хз еще каких на дух не переношу. А матом ругаться запрещено категорически. А этот AlexPU еще журналист вроде как, вообще апофеоз...

Хорошо хоть его на неделькумесячишку забанили, пусть отдохнет... А то он небось притомился, столько писанины разводить... :)) -- Grafikm 18:02, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Ezhiki, I really don't care. I've got some vaccinations here from those things and my edits and respect from the community speak for it better than the trollish user's filthy mouth. When he is back, I am afraid it won't be for long. I hope I am mistaken.

AlexPU, by continuing your trolling at this page even after your block one of the following may happen:

1. extension of your block;
2. protection of your talk page so that you won't get any place at all to troll.

Please give it a thought. --Irpen 21:15, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

It is already extended to 1 month. -- Grafikm 19:18, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Soviet partisans etc.

Alex, if you happen to read this before you check your mail: please present here links/references about UPA-partisans negotiations. You were the one who promised such references. My favorite admin is requesting those references instead of deleting the issue like his friends ;).

And please don't answer the posts from above section. Some of them are trollish (while some are painfully true), and all those people are expecting some answer from you. I suggest you to ignore any expectation, at least for now.

By the way, if you are willing to add some new pages/sections during your block, feel free to insert them on this page or e-mail me, so I can read and possibly contribute to the respective pages. Of course I don't mean minor edits or rewritings of existing texts. Cheers, Ukrained 20:17, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Alex, до того воно і йде, що ти просто мусиш "працювати" тут поки заблокований. Бо я вже не встигаю відстежувати й фіксувати або відкочувати кожне їхнє порушення. А ти поки лінки шукай, добре? Cheers, Ukrained 13:09, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Easily:

• Dnepriada:The Black Hole re: nuclides in the reservoirs; draining them

• Not Sure how to translate Re: possible flooding of Kiev

• Not Sure how to translate Re: Fake terrorist alert of 2005

No English versions :(((.

But he already reverted you, must be aiming to AfD. Don't you care about links cause they won't. Just revert.

More links coming up on Soviet partisans and Category:Russia (I already have about a dozen, and counting). Like Khruschtchev said: Ми їх поховаємо!

And thank you.AlexPU 17:55, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

translation from Ukrainian above by Irpen

"Ми їх поховаємо!" = "We will burry them!

AlexPU, are you still not feeling well? Your block was quadrupled specifically for trolling at your talk post-initial block. Why continue with burrying stuff? While you have time, could you pleae bring up any references of Rudniev's article consipracy theory? I am almost done rewriting it and will post a new version soon. I will not include any of your speculations unless you provide the source for them. It was funny btw to read your "he was not a communist" for the Old Bolshevik who took part in storming the Winter Palace.

Before resorting to new outbursts, please take a breath (and a pause, if necessary). I would really like just to see the links or names of the authors for the Rudniev's material.

Besides, I copyeditied your reservoirs article and I think it should be at DYK. I thought the unsourced info there is correct (except another unreferenced conspiracy theory about Stalin's "time bomb". Thanks for useful info and please don't troll. --Irpen 19:39, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

== Internal Troops prt iii: == I posted the following remarks on the talk page, as well as did some clean up in re: grammar. Here goes:

Reviewing over, I have additional thoughts about the status of the Internal Troops. If you have a gun and fight in an uniform, you are probably soldiers according to the laws of war. Therefore, gendarmes are closer in status to the United States Coast Guard (which assists the Navy during times of war). Most prominently, many of the bosun's at Normandy were Coastguardsmen, and not sailors. Additionally, part of the chain of command during John Kerry's stay in Viet Nam were USCG officers. If they are indeed deeply involved in the Chechen conflict/war/revolution/whatever, it doesn't surprise me that the international media has mislabeled them as "Russian Soldiers/ Russian Army". Especially as very few reporters outside of the US or UK have any expierence in millitary matters, and even in the US media, reporters are often dreadfully confused about the most basic "Army stuff." and occasionally mistake soldiers, airmen and Marines with each other, and even American and British troops at a distance. (They wear different variations of camoflauge and carry slightly different weapons. Also, the Union Jack on the sleeve is a dead giveaway :)). I'm going to do a minor edit for grammar, etc in this new addition. Thanks: V. Joe 05:34, 7 June 2006 (UTC) (V. Joe 05:46, 7 June 2006 (UTC))

DYK

On June 7, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Dnieper River reservoirs, which you created. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the "Did you know?" talk page.

Thank you for your efforts to create this article. ++Lar: t/c 17:54, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Hi AlexPU

Was wondering if you might be interested in this recent article (Islam in the Soviet Union that I encountered. I think its pretty neat, but because of my lack of knowledge of slavic languages/ History of the Soviet Union/ Russian Empire that you might observe this page and put your two cents in. I look foward to your feeback. Thanks again.V. Joe 08:23, 8 June 2006 (UTC)