Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 19:39, 24 June 2006

Status

Anyone looking for the latest status on the recent dispute, or wondering why on earth someone is calling me all kinds of names, the latest information is here. - Elonka 03:05, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

• June 2006 followup: --Elonka 22:26, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Articles I have created

For anyone interested in reviewing my editing history, these are articles I am particularly proud of:

• Raphael Kalinowski
• German liner Kronprinz Wilhelm
• Alfred Niezychowski
• Kim Zetter

And though I didn't create it, I've been substantially expanding the article on bestselling author Dan Brown.

- Elonka 18:52, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

• scratches head* Very odd situation indeed. I quickly went over your last 500 edits or so, and it looks ok from here. You did collide with dreamguy, but that's about it. I suppose bishonen is looking into the latter part. Terribly inconvenient this. Kim Bruning 09:43, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Thanks.  :) Elonka 14:10, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Fun things that makes me really happy! :-)

I have no idea what to write here - it just seemed it was time for a title like that on your page.  :-) --TStone 21:36, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

LOL! Yes! And, um, kittens! Chocolate ice cream! Hopefully not at the same time!  :) Elonka 21:46, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Heh, something tells me you know about the other .cx site too. Damn! That one made my eyes shrivel up into dust. But it was quite fun hitting other unsuspecting people with that one. A few faces I wished I had photos of, :-)

I don't know if you follow my adventures here. Strange really, because I have no idea what it is all about. People who should be happy to know the real world seems upset. Oh well.. if you haven't followed it, then these comments must be really cryptic. Good thing that's your area :-)

(Did you notice I wrote in Rot-13 a while back? Dunno, seemed like an amusing thing to do).

Kittens! Yes, I'm a cat person. Don't have any now unfortunately, but had a bunch when I lived in Göteborg. Four. Then the 2 females got kittens, and suddenly we had twelve cats... then they all got cat fleas. Owww... it took forever! Bathing them one by one every third day for 6 weeks - there's nothing that can look as miserable as a wet cat... imagine 12 of them.. They made me feel like Hitler, Satan and Bill Gates in one person. --TStone 22:17, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Elonka.jpg

Hi, I was wondering whether there was any reason that Image:Elonka.jpg was PD only in the US? If we know it's PD worldwide, then we can use {{PD-because|..}}. — Matt Crypto 09:28, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

About the Masonic Knights Templar article

Hello, Elonka. I'm very impressed by the cleanup work you did on the Masonic Knights Templar article. However, you should be aware that there is one or many self-described Masonic Knights Templar who will edit the article in order to support their view that there was and is Templar-Masonic connection. So you better keep watch. ;) --Loremaster 01:01, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads-up! I'll keep my "cite your references" macro handy.  ;) Elonka 01:14, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Resizing the Knights Templar article

Hello Elonka, I've started the process of resizing the Knights Templar article. I've created two new related article, History of the Knights Templar and Knights Templar legends. Could you eloquently summarize the history of the Knights Templar and post it in the Knights Templar History section. Thank you. --Loremaster 17:36, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Request for Advocacy

You posted a request for an advocate on the AMA page about two weeks ago. Has that request been answered, or are you still looking for an advocate? If you are still looking for an advocate, please provide me with a summary of what the nature of the personal attacks is, and what the subject matter content was that resulted in this dispute. Either post the summary on my user talk page, Robert McClenon or email it to me. Robert McClenon 20:15, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

See User:Elonka/DreamGuy dispute.  ;) Elonka 20:19, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

It doesn't really answer my question. What articles were you and he edit warring on? What was he saying about you? There has been enough refactoring that it is a little hard to figure out what is going on. I will try to research the matter further. If the personal attacks resume, then please let me know immediately, and I will try to help you with an RfAr. Robert McClenon 20:41, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Other pages to make

Do you suggest I make an article about the 27th Maine Regiment? They are notable because everybody in the regiment got Medals of Honor because they defended Washington past there expiration date voluntarily. From there should I make an article on Mark F. Wentworth-the commander of the regiment? And then an article on the 32nd Maine Regiment-also under Wentworth's command. Then last but definitly not least, an article on William Hayes Googins-a person in the 27th Maine Regiment (he's my great-great-great-grandfather)? Please respond because I know quite a bit on these topics and I have books for resources.Icelandic Hurricane 21:41, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

I think that those are all great ideas, but I'd recommend concentrating on only 1 or 2 pages at a time. That'll help you to gain experience on page creation, as you learn about formatting and categorizing, which will make creation of the other pages go easier. Otherwise you'll end up having a dozen "so-so" pages which will be hard to defend all at once. It's better to go slow. For example, my first pages were Raphael Kalinowski and German liner Kronprinz Wilhelm, and then I gradually worked outward from them after they were more or less "done", branching out to August Czartoryski, Alfred Niezychowski, Maria Amparo, and so forth. Elonka 21:48, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Great! I'm going to start with the 27th and William Googins.Icelandic Hurricane 21:50, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Are there any other articles you suggest I make? Such as things I mentioned in writing. Please answer on my talkpage.Icelandic Hurricane 22:32, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

Why havn't you responded?Icelandic Hurricane 21:19, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Places associated with the Knights Templar?

This list should be alphabetized and only contain places that were truly associated with the Knights Templar. We could move the names of places that are only associated to the Templar through myth to the Knights Templar legends page and create a section for them there. Do you have enough knowledge in order to do this? Once this done, I think we should nominate the article to be featured. --Loremaster 23:48, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Brian Krebs

Spiffy that you put together an article on Brian. He deserves one :)

User:Adrian/zap 04:57, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

Sir Charles Warren

Hi. Sorry about that. I'm not sure what happened there - I didn't intend to do that at all, only to change a word or two. Either I'm having a brainstorm or Misplaced Pages is. Restored. -- Necrothesp 10:41, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

Kryptos

The most recent edits on the Kryptos page have got me thinking regarding your role in the cracking of the Cyrillic Projector. As you probably know Misplaced Pages discourages people from editting their own page on Misplaced Pages (if they have one). I think probably a similar idea should be applied to topics with which one was very directly involved in, such as the cracking of the Cyrillic Projector (I think your edits to the Kryptos page have been very good, please don't stop editting the page, I'm just refering to edits which deal directly with your own involvement in the topic). If the summary of events in the link provided by 207.69.0.179 (http://www.sciencemag.org/content/vol302/issue5643/r-samples.dtl) is accurate then I think that the wording of the sentence by 207.69.0.179 better represented the facts then your own rewording. Let me know of your thoughts on this subject. Tnikkel 08:45, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

NPOV doublecheck

I had a quick read of the Stanley Dunin article, good job! No POV stood out to me. I checked the history and noticed that you created most of the article in a couple of hours, very quick work for such a technically well crafted article! Tnikkel 04:46, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Hengelmuller

Hey, Elonka, I'm not sure where more information can be found about Hengelmuller - I do wonder if you've spelled his name properly - shouldn't there be an umlaut over the "u"? john k 07:09, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Campion High School

My dad graduated from Campion High School in 1943. His roommate and fellow classmate was:Leo Ryan.My dad's brother also graduated from Campion High School.The Campion High School article was one of the first article I started before I open an account with Misplaced Pages. Okay-there was an incident involving my dad and Leo Ryan.In the mid 1960s,Leo Ryan was a member of the California State Assembly.During this time,Ryan voluntarily got himself locked in Soledad State Prison. When my father heard about this, he went and bought Johnny Cash's record,Folsom Prison Blues and sent it to Leo Ryan.I can say Leo Ryan appreciated the gift and my dad's sense of humor.Many thanks-RFD 22:28, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Salutations

Elonka - thanks for your clarity and thoughtful rewording of entries I've come across! I would say that I'm surprised that you have time with all your various interests, but I can't keep my fingers off Misplaced Pages either, and it seems to be a great place for people who care about information to hang out. So, nice to see you here! JustinHall 23:06, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Notable People

I just got a book on a bunch of notable people in New Hampshire in 1986. Do you think I should make articles on some of them? Icelandic Hurricane 01:46, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Bogged down

Hi Elonka,

Just to let you know that I've noted your concerns, but I'm a bit bogged down at the moment. I tend to organise the day to day management of Misplaced Pages:Picture of the day (POTD) and other Misplaced Pages:Featured picture content. There is currently a redesign of the MainPage going on, and POTD looks like it is about to be included as a daily feature. This is tending to consume my Wiki-time at the moment. -- Solipsist 23:08, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

Hipocrite

Did you have an exchange with Hipocrite about a month ago? What was it about? He says that you need an advocate. Was it a minor thing? I see that DreamGuy is not bothering you now, but he is unpredictable. Robert McClenon 02:41, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Knights Templar today?

A user named Davidsolomon has created the Knights Templar today article probably without reading the Talk:Knights Templar (military order) page. Should this new article be improved and intergrated in the Knights Templar series OR merged with the History of the Knights Templar article OR simply deleted? --Loremaster 21:41, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

blue oyster cult

• thanks for your entry on John Trivers. When you have a chance, please review/rewrite the article you started, as it appears to be verbatim pulled from http://www.triversmyersmusic.com/biom/bio2.html. Thanks much! SpikeJones 04:24, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply. My eyeball caught major similarities in phrasing/sentences from the above page alone, which is why I mentioned it. No worries. SpikeJones 13:14, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Paul Andrews (magician)

Nominate it on AfD. Speedy deletion criteria do not apply as the content of the new article does not precisely match that of the old one. Johnleemk | Talk 09:10, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

Thank you

Thank you for fixing my attempt at starting the Wikipedian Astronomers category for anyone who uses the stargazer user box. (Posted by User:Heptapod on 23:39, April 2, 2006)

WikiProject Missouri

Dear Elonka, I am beginning the process to create a wikiproject for Missouri. in order to do so i'm required to show that there is a base of at least 5-10 people who would be interested in contributing to such a project. the project would serve to aid in the creation and editing of articles related to the U.S. State Missouri, its cities, counties, geography, transportation, culture, history, education, and so on. It aims to expand Misplaced Pages's resources on Missouri in a fair and accurate manner. Since you're stated as being a wikipedian in missouri, i wanted to see if you were interested. if you are, please add your username at Misplaced Pages:Wikiproject/List_of_proposed_projects#Missouri and User:Preschooler.at.heart/Missouri. thanks for your consideration. --preschooler.at.heart my talk - contribs 15:49, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

• • Thank you for the support. also, If you know any other St. Louis Wikipedians who might want to contribute, please tell them about the project. thanks. --preschooler@heart my talk - contribs 21:12, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject Missouri is now online. please feel free to contribute, and add your name to the list of members. --preschooler@heart my talk - contribs 23:28, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

dmb oreilly transcript

Hi, here's the transcript from O'Reilly's "The Factor": http://josephhall.org/dc29c322f25c1f27c5096704d9d27063/danah_on_oreilly.pdf

This document will be removed in 24 hours. -- Joebeone (Talk) 23:24, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your kind response. I just stumbled across this (which is just a tad out of date) ... and man, you are right about the <ref> system. There is no way I'm adding all of those, of course. I think the meat of the article needs to be beefed up, although I'm not sure I'm the one to do it (we'll see as I'm very interested in Misplaced Pages academically). -- Joebeone (Talk) 23:42, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

Wow. Great job on the re-write! It's neat as a relatively new user to see how an article can go from being problematic to definitely more encyclopedic with some care and attention. best, -- Joebeone (Talk) 23:26, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

I must say the anon reaction on the talk page for danah boyd has me quite embarassed... I hope it doesn't get to you too much. That's what happens I suppose when the firehose of danah's blog readership is directed at wikipedia... best, Joe -- Joebeone (Talk) 23:38, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Scary Movie actors

E! News said today (April 13) that the "Girls Next Door" have a cameo appearance in Scary Movie 4.User:TMC1982 http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0362120/

Category:People from the Greater Los Angeles Area

Thanks for the note. Based on the information in the article about you, you can see how I came to that conclusion. However, if you grew up in WLA, wouldn't that put you in Category:People from Los Angeles? BrownCow &#149; (how now?) 16:15, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

I'll move you then. Category:People from the Greater Los Angeles Area is intended for people from around LA but not actually the city itself (Ventura County, Valenica, San Gabriel Valley, etc), although in practice it's a little fuzzy since there's a separate Category:People from the San Fernando Valley when most of the Valley is within LA city limits. BrownCow &#149; (how now?) 17:22, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Re: Reference/ External link

My opinion is that it should stay as a footnote because it is the source for a direct quote; if it was moved to an external link, the quote would have no attribution. Of course, feel free to ask for more opinions on the talk page. Thanks! Flcelloguy (A note?) 00:06, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

I would leave it as it for right now and not place undue emphasis on the fact that it's a blog. The reference, of course, should source it to the blog; if we can find a better source for the quote, then by all means an article or print source would be considered "better" than a blog. Thanks! Flcelloguy (A note?) 00:12, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

No problem, and thanks for thinking of me. :-) Flcelloguy (A note?) 00:22, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Re:Congrats!

Thanks for your kind words. Your book is looking good, but it's not available in the UK yet. Does it have anything about how to solve the codes/puzzles or is that a diffrent book of yours? Petros471 19:42, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

Just bought it today, just reading the introduction so haven't got as far as solving the first one yet... Petros471 15:36, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Articles you might like to edit, from SuggestBot

SuggestBot predicts that you will enjoy editing some of these articles. Have fun!

SuggestBot picks articles in a number of ways based on other articles you've edited, including straight text similarity, following wikilinks, and matching your editing patterns against those of other Wikipedians. It tries to recommend only articles that other Wikipedians have marked as needing work. Your contributions make Misplaced Pages better -- thanks for helping.

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P.S. You received these suggestions because your name was listed on the SuggestBot request page. If this was in error, sorry about the confusion. -- SuggestBot 11:42, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

Game developing

I saw on your user page that you develop games, and you have a userbox saying you're addicted to computer & video games. I was wondering if you had a list of games you have made/helped with, or your favorites. I, too, am a gamer enthusiast, so I'm curious. --SheeEttin 18:15, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

August Czartoryski

hi Elonka, I have a question,

the entry states that August Czartoryski was "Duke of Vista Alegre" but his mother was "Countess of Vista Alegre", how does that make sense? Could you please check again on either information and let me know? Thanks alot, greatly appreciated. Gryffindor 22:17, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Wikiprojects Saints

St John Bosco

There has been some additions to the John Bosco page saying he was a closest homosexual or pederast. This is not NPOV.

• Saint John Bosco

Do you agree?evrik 23:25, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Userbox

Something new ...

This user is a member of WikiProject Saints.

evrik

Preventing an edit war on the saints

It was the established operation of the WikiProject Saints to have a section in the info box on a sample prayer. Some editors have been recently been attacking this in the individual articles.

It is my belief that prayers in a literary or historic context are NPOV. I can understand that some may consider the inclusion of a prayer to be hagiographic, but freedom of religion is not freedom from religion.

There is a 3RR about to happen on a number of these articles. I am trying to be philosophical about this, but don’t want to yield the point when what is happening goes against the consensus and borders on vandalism.

It is my understanding that if an editing disagreement occurs that the status quo, in this case leaving the prayers in place, holds until it is resolved. I encourage you to comment on this at Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Saints. I have posted my thoughts at the village pump.

--evrik 15:37, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Re:Calling other editors N00bies

While I agree with 'don't bite the newcomers' policy, I consider political correctness a folly to be destroyed, and I'll use shorter terms when applicable. Besides, this post was made in place none of those editors are likely to frequent, and they are both n00bies - moving series of pages without using talk is without a doubt a n00bie tactic. Any experienced editors would ask questions (and review discussions) and the main related page, which is the List of Polish monarchs (where Polish king redirects to). They haven't replied to my comments on their talk, neither. I'll be happy to talk to them and guide them, but currently they are n00bies. PS. To be specific: they are n00bies in terms of moving articles - the double redirect mess they created is proof enough of that. They may not be n00bies in some other wiki-regards.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 16:18, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Sorry about Jadwiga, I thought the consensus was the other way - I was confused at the noticeboard. She has been moved as per consensus.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 17:48, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Danah Boyd

Now that the anonymous editing of danah boyd has died out, and with another editor's reference to E. E. Cummings in a reply to your comment on Misplaced Pages talk:Manual of Style (biographies), I decided to apply the rules in the MOS to her article and capitalized all instances of her name except in "(also known as danah boyd)". This follows what was done at E. E. Cummings' article. As much as she may cry about "danah boyd" being the "legal spelling", the fact remains that Misplaced Pages is not "misspelling" it (D and B are the same letters as d and b) and a decision has been made by consensus specifically regarding lowercase names with no internal capitals, that they should be capitalized at each instance. I will stick by this decision and monitor the article, and hopefully we don't have another rush of anonymous fans coming from her blog. -- Renesis13 16:38, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

As far as the title goes, I could probably be persuaded either way. I can see "danah boyd" being a correct article title, as it is a common "alias" even if Misplaced Pages doesn't agree that it is a permissible capitalization (similar to 50 Cent, Shakira or other celebrities with odd or single names whose article resides at the most common form). I think "Danah Boyd" would also be an appropriate article title, as her official name. I don't think it hurts too much right now for other pages to be redirecting through Danah Boyd. At least they are using that and not danah boyd. -- Renesis13 18:46, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

honored i am sure

I did not realize you were the kryptos star. wow! i think you have done edits on couple my pages. Extremeweb 21:08, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Another ethnicity question

Hiya, I noticed that you edited out the Polish part from the bio at Stanley Dunin. In my opinion, his Polish-American status should stay, as follows: He was born in Poland, and to the Polish noble class. He also has several notable elements in his bio that deal with his Polish background. Can you please explain why you feel that it should be removed from the opening paragraph? Or were you just doing bulk edits? --Elonka 19:00, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi Elonka, yeah I was doing bulk edits and I have struggles with non US born American citizens and how their bios should read. I have been using WP:MOSBIO as a guide. When did he become "notable" before he came to US or after?? I hate the bios that read..."born in Wimbabway of french candian jewish descent American actor" ect. I am really trying to deal ONLY with American citizens who are born ON American soil since these should have VERY little wiggle room. Anyways, I am VERY open to suggestions since I am trying to "correct" as many bios as possible. I personally feel that ethnicity/desent/birth place/ect. should go DOWN further in the article under "early life" or family bachground ect UNLESS his/her ethnicity is what makes him/her notable. From my other threads you can see that I DON'T want to remove/ignore/insult anybodies ethnicity, just trying to put it in it's correct perspective per established biographical styles. Please edit ANY bios you see I changed but maybe leave a note on the talk page so all editors can discuss it there. Thanks! --Tom 13:45, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Hey! That Dunin guy is your dad!! Cool. Seriously, I actually like the way the bio now reads. It shows that he was born in Poland (in the header) and there is a section on his early life where his background can be discussed in full as it is. It looks like your dad came to the US at the age of 12?? I would consider him an American of Polish descent. Again, I don't like to see ANY mix nationalities in the header but people like your dad are a tough call since they weren't born in the States. I've seen a number of bios that would read...Joe Smoe is an Italian born American actor, ect. but I don't really like those but WHO am I to say what is right or looks good. Your bio is well writen imo. Cheers! --Tom 13:57, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Well granted, I'm biased, but I believe that if anyone deserves to be called "Polish-American", it's someone who was born in Poland. As for me, since I was born in the U.S., but one parent was born in Poland, then I could probably be described as "an American of Polish descent", but in my particular case, it wouldn't really apply since my Polish heritage isn't part of my notability. In my father's case, I believe that it is, because of birthplace, and the noble class heritage. It's standard Misplaced Pages guidelines that nobility qualified as notability.

In terms of editing other people's bios, I agree that there are some bios on Misplaced Pages that go overboard in terms of specifying ethnicity. Especially where it's a potentially pejorative term, like finding a notable scientist and then putting in his lead paragraph that he's a Jewish-American scientist or something. But I still think that it's appropriate to list some people as dual nationality, especially when they were born in one country, and live in another. Hence, someone who was born in Ireland but lives in Canada could be listed as "Irish-Canadian" without a problem, in my mind. And bottom line, yes, I still think that the Stanley Dunin bio should list him as "Polish-American". I would appreciate if you would change it back to the way that it was, thanks. --Elonka 14:31, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi Elonka, ahh here is the rub. You say that Jewish-American is a pejorative term but alot of folks would argue and funny that you mention it because that term is exactly what got me into editing bios. Edward Teller was a featured article awhile back and people took offense to removing Jewish-American from his header. If you read it today, his Jewish descent, imo, looks silly where its placed in the article. Is Mr. Teller's Jewishness really what makes him notable and should it be place so HIGH up in his article?? I am not going there. Anyways, you Dad's Polishness(is that even a word?) is notable and IS discussed in the article. Lets take your example above of somebody born in Ireland and living in Canada...WHEN did they come to Canada? 2-3 years old or AFTER they achieved notoriaty? Are they STILL a citizen of Ireland?? Again, I use WP:MOSBIO as my GUIDELINE not set in stone rules. Natalie Portman is listed due to her DUAL citizenship. Misplaced Pages has 1,000s, no 10s of 1,000s of bios out there. The ones of extremely famous persons are usually well written because of the level of scrutiny.

Finally, as far as changing Dunin's bio back, I would suggest that I/we/you work on his talk page on an introduction/header that is agreeable and THEN edit the article or you can just tell me to take a flying leap and edit it yourself j/k :) I will start something on his talk page now.Anyways, excuse my rambling and bad spelling. Cheers! Ps, I am of Polish, Irish, Welsh, German, English, Jewish Descent...MUTT, AMERICAN!! --Tom 14:59, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Okay, let's use you as an example. You identify as American, correct? Now suppose you moved to France, and then invented a cure for cancer or something. Would you want your bio to say that you were a French scientist? In that case, I think the appropriate way to describe it would be say that you were an American living in France, or maybe a French-American. But to say simply that you were a "French scientist of American descent" would be absurd (IMHO). In my father's case, he is Polish. He was born in Poland, he grew up speaking Polish, he continues to speak with a Polish accent today, and he takes pride in his Polish heritage. To say that he's simply an "American" is denying a very rich heritage, and is just plain wrong. He is Polish, and he is American. He is a Polish mathematician, and he is an American mathematician. The term "Polish-American" is correct. Please do not change the article again to say that he is just an American who happens to have Polish roots, because that is incorrect. --Elonka 15:19, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Elonka, first off, I do NOT want to offend and it seems that this thread might be turning in a direction that neither of us, I would assume, wants it to go. Computer converse is difficult because we can't see or hear each other and you now seemed perturbed which REALLY is the last thing I want to do. PLEASE edit the Dunin article as you see fit and then we/you/i/the wiki community can discuss it further on the talk page. Its never a bad idea to just reach out to another WIKI and say "hey, whats your take on this?" and see what comes back. I really don't want to make this more of an issue than it should be or offend in ANY way. --Tom 15:44, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

name change of article Edward Seykota

Hello

Please vote on the name change of article Edward Seykota , please vote here Talk:Edward Seykota wether you Oppose or Approve.
Thank you.
Trade2tradewell 11:27, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Disambiguation

Thanks for your help fixing Paul Andrews articles - it would have been useful if you'd mentioned in on my talk page, I've made other edits like this that should be properly fixed. Thanks --Thegraham 21:26, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

I think it would be useful to say "Hi, perhaps next time you do this add proper disambiguation stuff to the pages, here is how to do it".

michael/mikhail

Newest discussion at Talk:Michael of Chernigov Shilkanni 03:04, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

Deprecated educational categories

When I spotted this, my first reaction was "arggggh!" and I have since noticed that you have spotted it too. I can find no centralized discussion at all. What I am going to do is to take Category:Educational institutions established in xxxx to WP:CFD for renaming and start a centralized discussion on Category talk:Educational institutions by year of establishment. I also intend to take a lot of the empty categories over to WP:CFD for deletion. There is another issue, which is the rather bizarre classification of the first decades of each century: e.g. Category:Educational institutions established in the 1000s is made a subcategory of both Category:Educational institutions established in the 10th century and Category:Educational institutions established in the 11th century - this is probably because a pedant noticed that the year "1000" is technically in the 10th century but the other years are in the 11th. This is a level of pedantry that is not applied for e.g. Category:1900 births so I suggest it should be culled as well. Finally, once the discussion on Category talk:Educational institutions by year of establishment reaches consensus (which I am sure it will) any redundantly over-specific "year" categories can be sent over to WP:CFD for deletion. One of my earliest acts on Misplaced Pages was creating Category:Bridges by date, which, in my opinion, dealt with this "granularity" issue reasonably well. Please come over and contribute to the centralized discussion, so that a level of granularity can be decided for this project too! TheGrappler 13:16, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

(Dia)critic(al)s

Hi Elonka, regarding Misplaced Pages:Naming conventions (standard letters with diacritics) you wrote:

To be effective, the proposal needs a simple "Summary" paragraph at the top with general rules, rather than immediately launching into complex language.

I tried to follow you suggestion (should have done that a long time ago...). Just inviting you to have a new look at the "diacritics" proposal, and see whether I managed to do what you suggested. Anyway, don't feel inhibited to improve the proposal, and/or communicate new criticisms on its talk page. tx. --Francis Schonken 10:26, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Mediation Cabal

Hello! I just wanted to make sure you were aware of this mediation cabal case which probably includes you in some way. Your comments/opinions would be appreciated and I hope to see this resolved soon. Cheers! --Keitei (talk) 05:33, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Dear Elonka, I am a Lithuanian editor of wikipedia, Juraune. I am editing wikipedia only just for more that a month, and consider myself to be not very much experienced there. I happened to read materials of so called "Polish Cabal". I want to share with you some of my concerns that might help you to prove the true nationalistic views of Halibutt and Piotrus. I don't know what to do with the name of the article Ethnic composition of Central Lithuania, created in a big part by Halibutt. The naming is very misleading, I think. It is not a geographical region of Central Lithuania in the year 2006. As I have found out, this Central Lithuania is a translation from Polish "Litwa Srodkowa", the "puppet" state that existed in 1920-1922, or at least a very controvercial state if I try to express myself with less Lithuanian POV. Currently the territory of this historical formation spreads in South East part of Republic of Lithuania, and western part of Republic of Bielarus, both being souvereigh countries. I don't know how to challenge Halibutt on renaming the article, since I cannot compete with him on the knowledge of millitary history. Also, I cannot compete with Piotrus, on his knowledge of rules and laws of wikipedia, but I think he is often mistaken by his naive and deep love of Poland, and I came to believe, he is sincere there. If you happen to know an administrator, who might be not biased in this case, could you let me know, I would like to see these articles renamed. Best wishes! Juraune 18:53, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Dreamguy's RFCU

I'm not too worried about EVula's comment; as long as it is in chronological order (i.e. below Essjay) and doesn't look "official". The main reason not to modify is that no one will see it, unless they are browsing old CU requests. The only way to prevent people from adding comments anywhere is to put all 500+ CU subpages on my watchlist, so I think we trust the page histories etc. in those cases. If it ever looks like someone is modifying an old request suspciously you could contact a clerk or post to the RFCU talk page. Thatcher131 19:55, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Whether to block DreamGuy/Victrix is currently on discussion at WP:ANI. You might comment there. I would appreciate it if you didn't add more comments to the closed RFCU; it is closed after all, and while I will not go out of my way to remove a comment, I won't encourage it either. The Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/DreamGuy subpage does have an associated talk page, which would be one place for discussion of evidence. There is also Misplaced Pages:Suspected_sock_puppets where you can open an investigation and try to determine what should be done. (Although Misplaced Pages:Suspected_sock_puppets seems to be fairly new, and I have no idea how it integrates with AN/I and RFCU, or even Misplaced Pages:Requests for investigation.) Thatcher131 20:11, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

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Re:Thank you

You are welcome. And let me add here that I bear no ill will against you or any editors that may disagree with me. I also fully realize this is an English Misplaced Pages and we should use English, however in some cases I believe Polish language is appopriate, especially when given the choice of using Polish or inventing new English term/chosing from several without any dominant one. If you feel I am acting uncivil or in bad faith, or I am abusing my admin powers, you are more then welcome to ask me for clarification or ask others for mediation or comments via WP:DR or WP:ANI.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 18:53, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Elonka, just as you I take "great stock in my integrity". As I have explained on the mediation page, I believe your accusations of my misconduct are based on few exceptions and misunderstangings. Yet you repeat those accusations on several pages (please consider: have I ever complained about you *before* you started complaining about me?). Looking at the definition of Slander and libel I believe that your behaviour fits that defintion. I am of course certain that this was not your intention and you truly believe I am guilty of actions like acting against a consensus, vote rigging and abusing admin rights. As I don't believe I am guilty of such actions, I am also expecting an apology from you for those accusations. Which at present leaves us deadlocked: each of us believes in his or her righteousness and expects an apology, and is not willing to apologize themselves for in their view they are the wronged party. This is why I started the mediation - I believe that we need to hear other people's comments to help one of us realize their mistake. I hope that mediation will be enough, but if not it is possible we will have to pursue this further, as we both value our intergrity and cannot simply 'agree to disagree', as both of us are unhappy with the other one continuing to criticize the integrity of another one. Perhaps the only thing we can agree now is that this has to stop. On that note let me propose the following truce: none of us will repeat the accusations of other party's wrongdoing on any public pages except the mediation-related one and our talk, until the point that one of us backs down and apologize (or both of us meet half-way or reach another agreement satisfactory to both parties).--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 19:16, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Support Our Troops

Although I oppose the War in Iraq, I do support our troops. Could you possible tranfer your lovely "Support Our Troops" template, to my user page, right under my opposition to the war template? Dr. Dan 04:49, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for your comments. I'm away for the next few days, so I'll attempt to advance matters on my return. --Centauri 10:49, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Re: Your comment

Thanks for your comment at my talk page. It certainly did set some things straight. I can't remember working on any article with you, though I don't think that's impossible. Judging from your edits to other articles you're a reasonable Wikipedian and definitely a great asset to this project (forgive me the wording). Also, in some of the disputes you started at the talk pages we shared the same views. This is especially true to the case of Polish monarchs, the matter I was trying to settle ever since Logologist moved the articles to their Polish titles, as he often does (compare the case of Polish voivodships moved from their English titles to some Polish-English hybrid titles like Dolny Śląsk Voivodship).

As to specific issues you mentioned, in fact I didn't feel you hold a grudge against me personally. My impression was (and still is to some extent) that you have a problem with Polish wikipedians as a whole. The most important thing here is that I felt that you're starting a large-scale campaign of, say, condemnation (put a better word here if you please) of "Polish" Wikipedians regardless of who they are or what they actually do - and that I was shot at because you saw me somewhere and automatically assumed that I must be a part of some alleged Polish conspiracy. In my honest opinion basing your views on nationality of those who contact you rather than on what they actually say borders racism, which I bet is not what you wanted (yet you held this edit against Piotrus, so perhaps I am wrong on this one). Anyway, in many cases the reason behind your comments was some imagined conflict between you and "Polish nationals", while the conflict was in fact between those Wikipedians who agree with you and those who don't. Their nationality is completely irrelevant here - and I truly believe so, despite being often called Polish, German, Ukrainian or Russian nationalist here (sic!).

I'm speaking here of the fact that you've been using quite a heavy artillery when it comes to describing Wikipedians you consider Polish, yet used quite inappropriate arguments - if any. The case of linking the Ghirlandajo's RfC as some sort of an argument to prove some alleged guilts was bizarre at best, at least that's what I thought. And especially so when this attack on yours truly was a reply to my conciliatory note in which I really tried to summarize the discussion for both me and others to better understand your problems. It is also quite notable that, while the whole problem you had with the Poland-related notice board was a matter of two words (the title of the list and the wording of the welcome message), instead of simply fixing them you started to accuse everyone involved of fancy things. In the end all issues were solved, but AAMoF you could've done it without even referring to the talk page, not to mention starting such a wide-scale campaign.

This kind of behaviour is particularly visible in the case of your treatment (or maltreatment, as I see it) of Piotrus. You accuse him of quite grave offences (bias, incivility, bluffing, being untrustworthy, promoting conflicts, deception, conspiracy, abuse of admin powers, sarcasm, bad will, ridiculing other editors, hot-headedness, nationalism, promoting breaking the rules of Misplaced Pages and so on - quite a long list, don't you think?), while presenting virtually no evidence - and when you do, the evidence speaks for him rather than against him.

And the funny thing is that the axis of the conflict seems to be a mere procedural dispute, rather than problem with Piotrus' actions. Why not focus on the dispute then rather than on pro personam arguments? You apparently feel abused by Piotrus, while he has the right to feel abused by your campaign (be it slanderous or not) - but why not focus on the dispute itself and get over the rest? If that is not possible, then why not use the proper wiki way of solving things? Contrary to what you suggested, starting such a procedure is not considered flaming. Start the proper procedure against Piotrus and let him reply to all the (hopefully sourced) charges, instead of saying that you have many more examples of improper behavior on Piotrus' part, yet you won't give them. Either give them or live on without accusing him any more. Otherwise your behaviour would simply be unfair, or at least that's how I see it. It's like saying I will continue to harass your good name, but I won't give any evidence and won't let you defend yourself. It's not how people solve personal problems - and this seems like a personal matter.

Anyway, I noticed that perhaps this issue is nearing some end, and I must say I'm happy with that. We're here to write articles, not to be forced to explain ad nauseam that we're not what people accuse us of. Stay in touch. //Halibutt 19:22, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Regarding Mediation (reply posted on Keitei's talk page)

Hiya! I left a reply to your note on User talk:Keitei#Re:Mediation (Polish Cabal) hopefully answering some of your questions regarding mediation. I'm a bit sleepy, so if it doesn't make much sense, please forgive me! :D ~Kylu (u|t) 06:36, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Misc

Hello Elonka! I just wanted to let you know that I've listened the episodes where you appeared on Binary Revolution Radio, and I was quite impressed. I've read quite a bit of your works, and I find it all to be very interesting, even inspiring, though a great deal of the mathematics of it escapes me.

I read the stuff about the "personal attacks" you had. I'm impressed with you, not impressed with Misplaced Pages. But you're right you know. The new users (like me) get the shaft, and longtime users can ignore whatever they want. Lame. It's almost as bad as politics. I'd like to give people like that a different kind of "personal attack."

Anyways, I guess I don't really have anything to say. Bye. --Othtim 05:54, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Re DreamGuy

"it is essential that the victims be above reproach, treat the situation with civility, and lay out a very clear documented case about what the problem is, so that a harried admin can see the problem. But as soon as the victims resort to name-calling or taunting (even if it's justified), the powers-that-be lose sympathy. ", which is why I told Centauri to cease from PAs. Erm yeah I agree with the majority of your comment. Englishrose 18:02, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Orb Wars

God did I love that game... good to finally see somebody else on this planet name-check it (even if it is one of the employees of the company who created the game :). I'd love to see a Misplaced Pages page on it. - Merzbow 21:57, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Page moves

Hello, I noticed you've been proposing a lot of Poland-related page moves lately. In the future, would you mind advertising such proposals on the board? Cheers, Appleseed (Talk) 03:03, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps those move requests could rather be informed to potentially interested Polish and other editors by messages to individual user talk pages... I wouldn't want to leave anyone out, not either those who do not follow the Polish-specific board. Maed 14:45, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

reply

hi. Been a couple of days away, and what bunch I then find in my talk page... Seems to be some overreaction. Those warnings are all too easy to drop. Please take a look at Talk:George I of Halych - what do you think of that naming? Maed 14:43, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

a small tip

elonka - i saw your exchange with mukadderat. he is a sock puppet of mikkala. just go see 'claves' which mukadderat features a picture of on his user page and to which mikkala has a rather close connection. seems strange he makes the connection so clear. (Unsigned comment added by Extremeweb, 08:39, June 24, 2006 )

Re:Slander

I certainly agree that this is a strong word and should be used with caution. However I believe I have the right to defend myself against the recent series of false accusations/misunderstandings/lies/etc. which can be summarized by the single word (slander). What other word would you propose I use to describe such activities? I am open for a 'politically correct' suggestions, but for now when I see wolf, I cry wolf. There is a treshold at which point such personal attacks as I have been facing recently stop being a nuisance I can ignore and hope that they go away and become serious enough that they start intefering with the work of myself and of others editors, and at that point I will not hesitate to address the matter; however unlike most of my opponents you will note that I don't engage in badmouthing other people in talk without providing evidence, but I pursue the WP:DR process. That said, have you considered addressing the incivility of editors such as Ghirla - or do you think that they have the right to make presonal attacks against me and I don't have the right to defend myself against them?--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 19:12, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

Defamation redirects to Slander and libel; but if you, a native speaker, think this is a less inflammatory term I will use it from now on. As for Ghirla, you say that I did not provide any evidence. I'd have think you'd stumble upon the evidence of his incivility several times (I have quoted it several times in the past few days), but in case you have missed it, would you prefer: set A (his RfC and the warning from ArbCom), set B (how he ignores and deletes warnings he receives from other people (, , - those are just three examples from the last few days, and they by no means represent any irregularity in his behaviour)), set C (his comments 1 and 3 at Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for comment/Irpen) or Set D - his contributions (please pay attention to edit summaries). I have to say I am very suprised that an editor such sensitive to civility and good conduct as you would defend Ghirla.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 19:39, 24 June 2006 (UTC)