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Give it a read and then ask your questions in the chat.
We can research this topic together.
::::OK, I will give you a couple of days to see if you have anything more after further reflection. --] (]) 23:32, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
::::OK, I will give you a couple of days to see if you have anything more after further reflection. --] (]) 23:32, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
:::::There's no point, I won't have anything to add after a couple of days. I stand fully by my block, for the reasons I explained to the blocked user. Your question is a false one, akin to "When did you stop beating your wife?" I did not block for a personal attack directed to a specific user, but for the harassment embodied in the edit for which the user was blocked, following a general warning at article talk and a specific warning at the user's talk page. I note that you have not explained your accusatory header, nor have you modified it to a more neutral or descriptive one. Let me advise you that this sort of hostile behaviour does not promote harmonious working. It is therefore likely that if you continue in this vein, I may reserve the right to take further measures, most likely politely asking you to stay off my talk page. Or you could just change it and say sorry, if as I suspect you have no reason to consider me ] in the area and this was just rhetoric. Your call, of course. --] (]) 23:48, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
:::::There's no point, I won't have anything to add after a couple of days. I stand fully by my block, for the reasons I explained to the blocked user. Your question is a false one, akin to "When did you stop beating your wife?" I did not block for a personal attack directed to a specific user, but for the harassment embodied in the edit for which the user was blocked, following a general warning at article talk and a specific warning at the user's talk page. I note that you have not explained your accusatory header, nor have you modified it to a more neutral or descriptive one. Let me advise you that this sort of hostile behaviour does not promote harmonious working. It is therefore likely that if you continue in this vein, I may reserve the right to take further measures, most likely politely asking you to stay off my talk page. Or you could just change it and say sorry, if as I suspect you have no reason to consider me ] in the area and this was just rhetoric. Your call, of course. --] (]) 23:48, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
== Ayurveda restrictions ==
I think the consensus at ] is pretty clear that your ] restriction is unworkable for this article. Do you wish to undertake putting the notice on the talk page voiding the restriction yourself?—](]) 22:14, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Revision as of 22:14, 13 November 2014
A Note on threading:
Interpersonal communication does not work when messages are left on individual users' talk pages rather than threaded, especially when a third party wishes to read or reply.
Being a "bear of very little brain", I get easily confused when trying to follow conversations that bounce back and forth, so I've decided to try the convention that many others seem to use, aggregation of messages on either your talk page or my talk page. If the conversation is about an article I will try to aggregate on the article's talk page.
If the conversation is on your talk page or an article talk page, I will watch it.
If the conversation is on my talk page or an article talk page and I think that you may not be watching it, I will link to it in a note on your talk page, or in the edit summary of an empty edit. But if you start a thread here, please watch it.
I may mess up, don't worry, I'll find it eventually. Ping me if you really need to.
please note this is a personal preference rather than a matter of site policy
It's time to make a stand against the arrogant and incompetent Wikimedia Foundation and its complete disregard for those of us who actually build this encyclopedia. Their salaries are paid on the back of our unpaid work, therefore in line with some others I've decided to withdraw my labour every Monday until things change. And if they don't, I'll be extending the length of my strike. I encourage everyone to join me.
Featured articles
Hi John. How you getting on mucker?? I was wondering how to get articles 'featured' on the main page?? Does Wiki just pick ones or can articles be requested. Obviously I would like one of mine to be featured, lol. Is this possible?--Discolover18 (talk) 14:34, 31 October 2014 (UTC)
Oh my, I gave you the barnstar before I noticed what you did to my other pet project, the article on Battle of Warsaw (1831). Since another barnstar could be boring, here's a chapel for you. In other words - thanks mate. It must've taken ages to read through the article :) //Halibutt21:49, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
It was a very great pleasure to read and tinker with two such interesting articles. I learned a lot. I look forward eagerly to working with you on these in the future, and on helping you get them through FAC in the fullness of time. --John (talk) 21:55, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
Help
Hi John. I was wondering if you could check this draft. I've never done an article like this before. Also, I couldn't get the photo to fit in the infobox. Maybe it's something I'm doing wrong or the infobox is gubbed in some way. Also, is the gallery too much?? Anyway if the (small) article is good, can you move it into main space for us.--Discolover18 (talk) 13:15, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
I've moved it to the mainspace. I did in the end think the gallery was unnecessary so I removed it. The infobox image worked ok for me. Nice work, mucker! --John (talk) 19:56, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
User:Short Brigade Harvester Boris Adding just anything is not enough, you need to establish some agreement. On talk page of the article, there is still no agreement to add any of these edits. John has told that any kind of misconduct on this page should be reported to him, you can also view archives and search quackguru and ayurveda. Bladesmulti (talk) 13:52, 4 November 2014 (UTC)
Hmm, I thought John's No reverts, at all, for any reason other than obvious vandalism meant there were to be no reverts, at all, for any reason other than obvious WP:VANDALISM. But perhaps I am misreading.
With regard to QG's post to a community noticeboard, note John also said Discussions may be referred to central noticeboards like WP:NPOVN or to WP:RFC, in fact I encourage this. Perhaps he meant only those two noticeboards and not WP:FTN, or perhaps I am again misreading.
On just any page, per Misplaced Pages:BRD, if edits have been reverted at least 3 times, by 2 or more editors, he should not add them back. John had added - Any major changes to the article must be agreed here in talk beforehand. Last time, when FTN was still opened, he was repeating same question on 3 pages, (same as ), today he posted on FTN which is of course misuse of that noticeboard. May have been better if he had posted it on relevant wikiprojects. Bladesmulti (talk) 14:12, 4 November 2014 (UTC)
QuackGuru found to be misrepresenting a citation on lead. Read Bladesmulti (talk)
I have blocked Quackguru one week and Bladesmulti 48 hours, both for disruptive editing at Ayurveda. Lest anyone read anything into the different block lengths, these merely reflect the differing block logs of the two users and do not imply any difference in degree of misbehaviour. I will be happy to unblock either user if they undertake to respect normal editing practices at that article, as was discussed at article talk recently. Any admin watching here is specifically invited to pitch in here if they have any opinions about these blocks, or if they think this requires review at AN/I. QuackGuru, it is common sense in a situation like this to await firm consensus in talk before making controversial additions to the article, as we have previously discussed. This is even more true when there is an ongoing RfC at article talk. Bladesmulti, you reverted not once but twice while pointing out to the other user the 0RR I had requested at the article. Even without 0RR, reverting during a content dispute when the addition was non-vandalistic was disruptive. --John (talk) 21:37, 4 November 2014 (UTC)
MrBill3 has violated copyrights on his sandbox and Talk:Ayurveda. He was aware of copyright infringement policy and he had warned others before. - Bladesmulti (talk) 01:32, 6 November 2014 (UTC)
You had told that there should be no name calling, per #2 (Talk:Ayurveda#Going_forward) yet, Roxy the dog claims that those people who agreed with the restrictions "are the fringe pushers who don't have the good of wikipedia as their highest priority"Bladesmulti (talk) 05:38, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
As an observation, those people who have agreed with the restrictions are those who are pushing the "pro-Ayurveda", position, whether or not they are fringe-pushers. That suggests problems with your approach. — Arthur Rubin(talk)08:07, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
Hi User:Discolover18. For the first time I find I have a qualm over one of your proposed articles. Is the park truly notable by Misplaced Pages's standards if the only coverage is from the organisation which runs the park? Would it be better perhaps to write an article on Thomas Shanks (engineer), with some information about the modern park which bears his name? We could have Thomas Shanks Park as a redirect to the engineer article. There are not that many sources out there but I found one or two, which may make that a more profitable way forward, especially if you can find more. What do you think? --John (talk) 21:50, 4 November 2014 (UTC)
Your right I think. Seems fairly interesting. I will need to try that one later. In work at the minute, so limited internet access. Thanks again though John.--Discolover18 (talk) 08:44, 5 November 2014 (UTC)
It's a WP:GA article that's been through several prior stages of review including AFD, DYK, GA, and Peer Review, and I'd appreciate help in furthering along the quality improvement process.
I took a first pass. It looks good. I will have more tinkering to do I expect. Are you thinking of going to FAC with it? --John (talk) 20:08, 9 November 2014 (UTC)
Looks great so far. Yes, I was thinking of going to FAC. I had a request up at WP:GOCE but I'm debating removing that when you're doing with your copy editing. Let me know what you think about that, — Cirt (talk) 20:12, 9 November 2014 (UTC)
Gosh. I'm thoroughly unimpressed with your conduct in this issue, from your apparent inability to read the full text of the restriction, to your POINTy abuse of your protection right, to your thoroughly weak summing up at AN/I, to your laughable suggestion that I should apologise to an edit-warrior for blocking them, to the fact that you had to go to a drama board at all, rather than just ask nicely like any normal person would. Weren't you desysopped for a while? Don't bother to reply here, I will dig it out for myself. If not perhaps you should be. Please feel free to ping me here if you are ever being desysopped again; other than that feel free to keep your shenanigans off my page. --John (talk) 16:11, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
I know I asked earlier and then did nothing. It's been a wild year here outside wikiworld, but it seems that things are calming down a bit. Think you and any TPSs could look him over, for grammar, and any missing context? I'm thinking Mil-hist A-class then FAC. I've also got a very interesting guy to write up ... forger, slave-trader and general all around scoundrel! Not a bishop though... Ealdgyth - Talk14:10, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
I remember this one now. It's only a couple of months since I last looked it over. It's as good as I can make it grammar and prose-wise, but that doesn't mean one of my many talk page watchers couldn't help out and improve it further. Anybody? --John (talk) 17:14, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
Ayurveda - At your request
This has run its course, and there is no prejudice about other requests in the future in relation to this matter. --John (talk) 21:52, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Since you requested a response here, here it is.
Please lift the 0RR restriction from Ayurveda. Whatever it's intent, it's failed because editors simply will not work under the restrictions, and our repeated requests for discussions on those restrictions went unanswered. --Ronz (talk) 17:48, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
In what way has it failed? Editors who are not able to edit without calling other editors names, without reverting blindly, and without agreeing important changes at a controversial page, are not an asset, and would be blocked in any case for their behaviour. Calling it 0RR merely makes it easier to explain and enforce. In practice there have been no 0RR blocks at all, and I regard this as a success, so while I take your comment on board, I have to hold off agreeing with it in the absence of any evidence. --John (talk) 17:54, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
And? And? It is obvious isn't it. I was pointing out your dishonesty when you said that there had been no 0RR blocks at all. I couldn't let that deception slide by unremarked. -Roxy the dog™ (resonate) 20:38, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Dishonesty? Deception? I am sorry if you are still angry about your recent block. You acknowledged that I explained adequately why you were blocked, and no reviewing admin saw fit to lift the block. You have now served your block and it is time for introspection. I encourage you to continue to self-reflect with a view to improving your behaviour so you can avoid being blocked again. The two previous blocks you mention were discussed just above, in the section #Ayurveda. Neither was for 0RR, so it is true to say that no 0RR blocks have been issued. I encourage you to apologise for your misunderstanding, which I accept was an honest one, for the sake of your own self-esteem. Please be aware that there is no bitterness on my part about your name-calling, but do be aware that you will be blocked again if you disrupt again at Talk:Ayurveda. --John (talk) 21:23, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
I made no such acknowledgement at all. Please re-read the section more carefully. I have finished my introspection, but I urge you to heed the criticism and questioning about your motives and behaviour you have had from fellow admins and other editors over the last 24 hours. We expect far better of admins than you have demonstrated recently. -Roxy the dog™ (resonate) 21:43, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Mmm. You did actually but ok. I will take your comments with all the seriousness they deserve. I do again encourage you to continue your growth as an editor, but perhaps here and now will not be the best. I will close this section for now as I have answered all your questions. --John (talk) 21:52, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
@John: I made a simple request about the reliability of a source at Ayurveda, and I was immediately accused of being disruptive by user Roxy the Dog. After all his warnings and sanctions, I doubt if this user is going to change his course of behaviour. Jayaguru-Shishya (talk) 21:11, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Actually, he answered to me by saying: "It was explained very clearly by Dominus Vobisdu in the comment directly below this one", and "Read it, and stop being disruptive please. Thanks." Here is the explanation by Dominus Vobisdu that he was pertaining to and advised me to read: "And that just ain't gonna happen because most real physicians and scientists would vomit at the mere thought.". I wonder, how WP:CIVIL is that? Jayaguru-Shishya (talk) 21:19, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
It certainly isn't very civil but I suppose this editor is annoyed at having just been blocked so we will cut him some slack this time. --John (talk) 21:52, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
What evidence do you require that editors will not work on it, beyond the multiple statements already made?
If a consensus of uninvolved admins thinks there is a better way forward I will be happy to look at that. Other than that I stand by what I said at 17:54. Consider the possibility that if you think it is important to be able to call other editors names, and revert their work without discussion, you may be part of the problem. --John (talk) 20:25, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
I stand by what I said at 17:54. Consider the possibility that if you think it is important to be able to call other editors names, and revert their work without discussion, you may be part of the problem. --John (talk) 22:33, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
I'll assume good faith that somehow your comments apply to someone other than myself, though the lack of diffs makes the claims questionable. Given QG was involved, I wouldn't be surprised though.
0RR doesn't address problems with name calling.
If all you care about is stopping the reverts, then 0RR is one possible solution.
If you want editors to discuss matters and form consensus, then the imposition of 0RR has been a failure.
So again, are we here to improve the encyclopedia or not?
Given that the article falls under WP:AE, there are many other possible solutions, all that involve getting others involved. --Ronz (talk) 17:02, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
I stand by what I said at 17:54. Consider the possibility that if you think it is important to be able to call other editors names, and revert their work without discussion, you may be part of the problem. --John (talk) 18:47, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Involved block
Hi John, would you please explain who was the target of the personal attack for which you blocked User:Roxy the dog ? Thank you. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 22:35, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
The block is fully explained at the blocked user's page. Is your header an accusation? If so, I would be interested to see the evidence you have for that accusation. --John (talk) 22:47, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
Thank you for your reply. I've looked at the blocked user's talk page, and it is still not clear whom you feel was the target of the personal attack for which you blocked. Could you clarify, please? --Demiurge1000 (talk) 22:55, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
The block is fully explained at the blocked user's page. Is your header an accusation? If so, I would be interested to see the evidence you have for that accusation.--John (talk) 23:22, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
There's no point, I won't have anything to add after a couple of days. I stand fully by my block, for the reasons I explained to the blocked user. Your question is a false one, akin to "When did you stop beating your wife?" I did not block for a personal attack directed to a specific user, but for the harassment embodied in the edit for which the user was blocked, following a general warning at article talk and a specific warning at the user's talk page. I note that you have not explained your accusatory header, nor have you modified it to a more neutral or descriptive one. Let me advise you that this sort of hostile behaviour does not promote harmonious working. It is therefore likely that if you continue in this vein, I may reserve the right to take further measures, most likely politely asking you to stay off my talk page. Or you could just change it and say sorry, if as I suspect you have no reason to consider me involved in the area and this was just rhetoric. Your call, of course. --John (talk) 23:48, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
Ayurveda restrictions
I think the consensus at WP:ANI#Ayurveda is pretty clear that your WP:0RR restriction is unworkable for this article. Do you wish to undertake putting the notice on the talk page voiding the restriction yourself?—Kww(talk) 22:14, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
There is currently a discussion at 