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March 2010

Welcome to Misplaced Pages. The recent edit you made to International Churches of Christ has been reverted, as it appears to have removed content from the page without explanation. Use the sandbox for testing; if you believe the edit was constructive, please ensure that you provide an informative edit summary. You may also wish to read the introduction to editing. Thank you.   — Jeff G. ツ 21:46, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

warning

Please stop adding repeated information into different places of the same article. - Altenmann >t 22:31, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

My apologies Qewr4231 (talk) 06:45, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Your recent edits

Hello. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Misplaced Pages pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( ~~~~ ) at the end of your comment. You may also click on the signature button located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your username or IP address and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when. Thank you. --SineBot (talk) 22:47, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

Notice of discussion at Administrators' Noticeboard

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Bobby Tables (talk) 23:12, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

Welcome to Misplaced Pages, and thank you for your contributions, including your edits to Kip McKean. However, please be aware of Misplaced Pages's policy that biographical information about living persons must not be libelous. Any controversial statements about a living person added to an article, or any other Misplaced Pages page, must include proper sources. Thank you. Kevin (talk) 01:28, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

August 2010

Please remember to assume good faith when dealing with other editors, which you did not do on International Churches of Christ. Thank you. Please remember that personal attacks, like this one, should be avoided. Andreasm 01:11, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Your recent edits

Hello. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Misplaced Pages pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( ~~~~ ) at the end of your comment. You may also click on the signature button located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your username or IP address and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when. Thank you. --SineBot (talk) 03:56, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

This is the final warning you will receive regarding your disruptive edits. The next time you violate Misplaced Pages's neutral point of view policy by inserting commentary or your personal analysis into an article, as you did to International Churches of Christ, you may be blocked from editing without further notice. Also, remember WP:3RR Andreasm 06:12, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

My apologies. What I am trying to point out is that the Misplaced Pages article on the International Churches of Christ before I made any edits to it seems to be biased towards the International Churches of Christ and not neutral or encyclopedic. Most of the links go to websites operated by the International Churches of Christ and reputable websites that go to websites not owned by the International Churches of Christ somehow get deleted. Basically the article seems to be written by International Churches of Christ members with a pro-ICOC slant. The article is not neutral at all and that is what I am trying to get across. I was a leader in this cult, and now group of cults, and was in this for 6 years. I know what I am talking about. Ask any ex-member of the ICOC, and there are many, and they will tell you that they were used up and spit out by the cult.Qewr4231 (talk) 23:36, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

Basically members of the ICOC and new movements are using this ICOC wikipedia article on the ICOC as an evangelism tool to recruit more people into the ICOC movements. Qewr4231 (talk) 23:38, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Albert Baird

The article Albert Baird has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Questionable Notability

While all contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Minimac (talk) 07:14, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

International Churches of Christ history goes back to 1979 when Kip and Elena Mckean, Al and Gloria Baird, Bob and Pat Gempel decided to form their own organization called the International Churches of Christ. Al Baird is still with the International Churches of Christ working in Los Angeles as an evangelist and Deacon/Elder. Al Baird chose not to leave with Kip Mckean when Mckean broke away from the International Churches of Christ. The problem with the International Churches of Christ and new movements spurned from it is that most of the information is either for or against it. There is very little encyclopedic information on these cults. I know because I was leader in this cult and I was in it for 6 years. Ex-members always leave the cults in anger because the cults eat people up and spit them out. Current members are brainwashed into being 110% for the cults. The International Churches of Christ cults are basically pyramid schemes with the money going to the top of the pyramid. Also, the ICOC cults lie about their history and don't tell the truth.Qewr4231 (talk) 23:29, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Albert Baird

The article Albert Baird has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Not a notable minister.

While all contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. StAnselm (talk) 02:39, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

International Churches of Christ history goes back to 1979 when Kip and Elena Mckean, Al and Gloria Baird, Bob and Pat Gempel decided to form their own organization called the International Churches of Christ. Al Baird is still with the International Churches of Christ working in Los Angeles as an evangelist and Deacon/Elder. Al Baird chose not to leave with Kip Mckean when Mckean broke away from the International Churches of Christ. The problem with the International Churches of Christ and new movements spurned from it is that most of the information is either for or against it. There is very little encyclopedic information on these cults. I know because I was leader in this cult and I was in it for 6 years. Ex-members always leave the cults in anger because the cults eat people up and spit them out. Current members are brainwashed into being 110% for the cults. The International Churches of Christ cults are basically pyramid schemes with the money going to the top of the pyramid. Also, the ICOC cults lie about their history and don't tell the truth.Qewr4231 (talk) 23:29, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

August 2011

Welcome to Misplaced Pages! I am glad to see you are interested in discussing a topic. However, as a general rule, talk pages such as Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Religion/New religious movements work group are for discussion related to improving the article, not general discussion about the topic. If you have specific questions about certain topics, consider visiting our reference desk and asking them there instead of on article talk pages. Thank you. The Resident Anthropologist (talk)•(contribs) 17:01, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

I did not know that. Thank you for telling me. I am sometimes not sure where to post information. Qewr4231 (talk) 23:23, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

Inappropriate comment on the Keeping Up With The Kardasians talk page

I added the the content preceding my signature three and a half years ago (read the timestamp). Some idiot vandal added the phrase you are up in arms about. Take it up with them. Or just edit it out if it bugs you so much. Also, when commenting on a talk page, you should sign your name with four tildes ( ~ <---- a tilde). Happy editing. Buck O'Nollege 21:22, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

September 2011

Welcome to Misplaced Pages! I am glad to see you are interested in discussing a topic. However, as a general rule, talk pages such as Talk:International Churches of Christ are for discussion related to improving the article, not general discussion about the topic. If you have specific questions about certain topics, consider visiting our reference desk and asking them there instead of on article talk pages. Thank you. Escape Orbit 10:45, 23 September 2011 (UTC)

Information

The following template contains a lot of useful links to pages that explain how Misplaced Pages works. Arcandam (talk) 22:34, 5 June 2012 (UTC)

Hello, Qewr4231, and Welcome to Misplaced Pages! Thank you for your contributions to this 💕. If you decide that you need help, check out Getting Help below, ask me on my talk page, or place {{Help me}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages by using four tildes (~~~~) or by clicking if shown; this will automatically produce your username and the date. Also, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field with your edits. Below are some useful links to facilitate your involvement. Happy editing! Arcandam (talk) 22:34, 5 June 2012 (UTC) Getting started A tutorial • Our five pillars • Getting mentored How to: Edit a page • Upload and use images • Create your first article Intuitive guide to Misplaced Pages • Article Creation Wizard Getting help Frequently asked questions • Tips Where to ask questions or make comments Request administrator attention Help desk: A Wiki Styled page to ask questions on Help directory: A comprehensive list-style help contents page Policies and guidelines Neutral point of view • No original research Verifiability • Reliable sources • Citing sources What Misplaced Pages is not • Biographies of living persons List of policies • Three-revert rule • Sock puppetry Copyrights • Policy for non-free content • Image use policy External links • Spam • Vandalism • List of guidelines Deletion policy • Conflict of interest • Notability The community Build consensus • Resolve disputes Assume good faith • Civility • Etiquette No personal attacks • No legal threats Community portal • Village pump Signpost • IRC channels • Mailing lists Writing articles Be bold in editing • Develop an article The perfect article • Simplified manual of style Stubs • Categories • Disambiguation Peer review • Featured content Miscellaneous User pages • Talk pages Awards a registered contributor can achieve and award Clean up: General • Spam • Vandalism Join a WikiProject • Translation Useful templates • Tools • User scripts

Warning

You continue to insert information into the International Churches of Christ page that is not of an encyclopaedic nature, please understand Misplaced Pages is not a gossip column, blog, facebook page or a forum. It is an Encyclopeadia, treat is as such! JamieBrown2011 (talk) 14:11, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

My apologies for posting my own negative experiences in the ICOC. Qewr4231 (talk) 06:54, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

JamieBrown2011 are you a knowledgeable and credible source on the ICOC?? Do members of the ICOC make knowledgeable and credible sources on the ICOC? Do ICOC leaders make knowledgeable and credible sources on the ICOC?? (I'm not saying you are a member or leader in the ICOC. I have no idea who you are.) I'm just wondering what a credible source on the ICOC is. Qewr4231 (talk) 06:51, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

New Dispute on ICOC Page

There is a new dispute on the ICOC article page. You may undo the work of an editor you disagree with so long as you justify it on the talk page. I think you might find some of the recent edits disturbing. -Nietzsche123 (talk) 16:53, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

The Misplaced Pages ICOC page is so messed up. It's hard to tell what is fact and what is opinion anymore. I think JamieBrown11 and some past editors such as TransylvanianKarl are ICOC members. The ICOC is a fairly secretive organization in that people who are not part of the ICOC don't really know what goes on in the ICOC. As a person that has been a member of the ICOC for six years, and as a person familiar with Kip Mckean, what the ICOC presents as fact and what really happens in the ICOC are two separate things. Many of the facts in the Misplaced Pages ICOC article are only verifiable by hardcore members of the ICOC, and the facts are not verifiable by people outside of the ICOC. The Misplaced Pages ICOC page has so many opinions and unverifiable facts that the article is simply unreliable and is definitely not encyclopedic in quality. Qewr4231 (talk) 19:52, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

Article Feedback Tool update

Hey Qewr4231. I'm contacting you because you're involved in the Article Feedback Tool in some way, either as a previous newsletter recipient or as an active user of the system. As you might have heard, a user recently anonymously disabled the feedback tool on 2,000 pages. We were unable to track or prevent this due to the lack of logging feature in AFT5. We're deeply sorry for this, as we know that quite a few users found the software very useful, and were using it on their articles.

We've now re-released the software, with the addition of a logging feature and restrictions on the ability to disable. Obviously, we're not going to automatically re-enable it on each article—we don't want to create a situation where it was enabled by users who have now moved on, and feedback would sit there unattended—but if you're interested in enabling it for your articles, it's pretty simple to do. Just go to the article you want to enable it on, click the "request feedback" link in the toolbox in the sidebar, and AFT5 will be enabled for that article.

Again, we're very sorry about this issue; hopefully it'll be smooth sailing after this :). If you have any questions, just drop them at the talkpage. Thanks! Okeyes (WMF) 21:34, 1 September 2013 (UTC)

Dead links

Please don't remove dead links for no reason. There's a possibility the links can be repaired, as was the case at International Churches of Christ. Jackmcbarn (talk) 13:35, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

Some of the dead links on the International Churches of Christ page are still dead links and have not been repaired. How long do Misplaced Pages users and readers have to wait for a link to be repaired or fixed? Qewr4231 (talk) 22:01, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

Which ones are still dead? Jackmcbarn (talk) 22:26, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

Well, they are fixed NOW, but it's been months if not over a year that some dead links were left unfixed, and they are just now being fixed. My point is that this is a long time for people to leave dead links in a Misplaced Pages article. If I hadn't pointed out the dead links the dead links would never have been fixed. Qewr4231 (talk) 22:34, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

You're right, but that's how Misplaced Pages works. When random people see a problem, they're encouraged to try to fix it themselves. Nothing's wrong with what happened. Jackmcbarn (talk) 23:19, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

If there was nothing wrong with what happened, then why did you state, "Please don't remove dead links for no reason. There's a possibility the links can be repaired, as was the case at International Churches of Christ" ??? Then you said, " . . . that's how Misplaced Pages works. When random people see a problem, they're encouraged to try to fix it themselves."

Basically, I saw a problem, and did my best fix it. You agreed (see comment above) that this is how Misplaced Pages works. So you are scolding me for doing what you agreed is right? Or is it that you are saying that only certain Misplaced Pages users have the right to edit pages?? Qewr4231 (talk) 00:03, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

Using the ICOC Talk page as your SOAPBOX

Your comments have been removed from the ICOC talk page because they are not according to Misplaced Pages policy and violate WP:SOAPBOX

Who is an authority on the International Churches of Christ? And who has a neutral point of view? I bet if you conducted a survey of people not in the ICOC most people would either (1) have no knowledge of the ICOC, or (2) have a negative view of the ICOC. Qewr4231 (talk) 00:07, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

December 2013

Hello, I'm Dillard421. I wanted to let you know that I undid one or more of your recent contributions to America's Test Kitchen because it appeared to be promotional. Advertising and using Misplaced Pages as a "soapbox" are against Misplaced Pages policy and not permitted. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about Misplaced Pages. Thank you. Dillard421♂♂ 03:42, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

Hey Qewr4231, normally I would respond inline to the talk that you left on my page, but I want you to see this. It appears that you have copy and pasted information from The official ATK Website. Doing so is a violation of Wikipedias Copywrite policy. Please see Misplaced Pages:Copy-paste for more information:

In 99.9% of cases, you may not copy and paste text from other sources into Misplaced Pages. Doing so is a copyright violation and may constitute plagiarism. Always write the articles in your own words and cite the sources of the article. Copyright violations are often speedily deleted.

—Misplaced Pages:Copy-paste

I appreciate your willingness to edit the Misplaced Pages and to read Talk pages, not many people do so. The Misplaced Pages can be confusing when it comes to knowing just the right way to edit it. Please don't interpret my criticisms negatively, I assume good faith when it comes to editors and really appreciate all you do. If you are ever confused as to how you should format an article when adding content, please refer to the Misplaced Pages Manual of Style. As always, you can ask me any question on my talk page, or ask your question on this page by placing {{help me}} before the question. As for the comment that Misplaced Pages wanted you to add the content to the article, the Misplaced Pages is a community edited project, rather than a single entity. It is likely that a user wanted that on the page, but didn't quite know how to add it, so they placed a comment on the talk page. Thats what its for afterall, to talk about improvements on the article. If you ever need to test changes, you can test in your very own personal sandbox, located at the top of the page. Thanks Again! Dillard421♂♂ 23:26, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

My apologies. Qewr4231 (talk) 06:43, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

Reporting

Your edits on the ICoC article over the past 24 hours have been disruptive and you have broken the 3RR. You will be reported. JamesLappeman (talk) 18:56, 22 January 2014 (UTC)

JamesLappeman you are a bully. Someone keeps erasing the changes I make to the ICOC Misplaced Pages entry. I am trying to insert information on Henry Kriete and the Henry Kriete letter which is factual information that really did happen to expose a lot of evil and wrongs in the ICOC. Why not tell the truth about what happened in the ICOC? Your bias towards a rosy article that makes the ICOC look good instead of inserting factual information skews your point of view. Your point of view is not neutral. Qewr4231 (talk) 23:11, 22 January 2014 (UTC)

Here is what happened:

JamieBrown2011, you reverted my insertion of information about the Henry and Marilyn Kriete letter many times because you said the source I used was not valid. The source I used were Henry and Marilyn themselves on their own website: http://henrykriete.com/2013/12/29/london-the-letter-and-looking-back-marilyn-kriete/

This is Marilyn and Henry Kriete's continuing nine part series on the letter that they wrote in their own words. Henry and Marilyn Kriete are the most valid source on the letter that they wrote.

" 07:28, 23 January 2014‎ JamieBrown2011 (talk | contribs)‎ . . (61,327 bytes) (-2,467)‎ . . (Removed material from Self Published sources. Will try and find RS for the Henry Kreite letter and discuss on Talk Page before including)"

This revert makes me think that (1) you didn't even check the source I used or (2) you are trying to keep any criticism of the ICOC out of the main article.

I quote from WP:RS

"Definition of a source

The word "source" when citing sources on Misplaced Pages has three related meanings:

          the piece of work itself (the article, book);
          the creator of the work (the writer, journalist),
          and the publisher of the work (for example, Random House or Cambridge University  Press).

Any of the three can affect reliability. Reliable sources may be published materials with a reliable publication process, authors who are regarded as authoritative in relation to the subject, or both. These qualifications should be demonstrable to other people."

WP:RS says that a credible source is "the creator of the work (the writer, journalist)." The source I used was Henry and Marilyn Kriete's own website Gloriopolis (http://henrykriete.com/). Further I sighted the exact source that the material came from: Gloriopolis (http://henrykriete.com/2013/12/29/london-the-letter-and-looking-back-marilyn-kriete/). This is a nine part series written by Henry and Marilyn Kriete, on their own website; however you called what WP:RS calls a reliable source, unreliable. Qewr4231 (talk) 06:37, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

JamieBrown2011 and you are harassing me. Every time I make an edit to the Misplaced Pages ICOC article my edits get reverted even when I have a reliable source which was the case in this situation. Qewr4231 (talk) 06:55, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

Please note that users are expected to collaborate with others, to avoid editing disruptively, and to try to reach a consensus rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement. JamesLappeman you are not collaborating and basically you and JamieBrown2011 are reverting my post which was sourced correctly. Further you are trying to keep any mention of the Henry and Marilyn Kriete letter and the abuses mentioned in the letter out of the ICOC main article. Qewr4231 (talk) 00:02, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

Do not blank other editor's talk page comments.

In almost all situations it is not appropriate to remove other editor's comments from talk pages. In the rare occasions where it is appropriate, you must indicate your rationale in the edit summary. see WP:TPG. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 13:46, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Sorry I didn't know Qewr4231 (talk) 14:31, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

I thought you work for Misplaced Pages. I went to your user talk page and discovered otherwise. Anyway, thanks for your help. Qewr4231 (talk) 20:10, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

FYI

Do you know your query on the article about Justin Bieber? You said that "licence" was spelled wrong.

FYI: No, it wasn't spelled wrong, "licence" is the British English, and Canadian English way of spelling the American English way for "license". Happy editing! Cheers!-- Allied Rangoon‧talk 00:56, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

Talk page chatter

I have reverted your recent edits at Talk:Kip McKean because they are not constructive. The first version of your comment is absolutely absurd and unfounded. If you have a beef with me, you are free to take it up at ANI, but you are not at liberty to soapbox on article talk pages or to spout your unfounded hypotheses about other users. I don't understand what goal you are trying to achieve on the talk page, but I'll remind you that article talk pages are for discussing improvements to the article. Whatever "discussion" you are engaged in is confusing, doesn't seem to be oriented toward improving the article, and has taken far too long--you've been at it since April and it's now July. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 19:49, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

@Cyphoidbomb: If there is good proof/evidence of this should this be included in the Kip Mckean page? As a former member of the International Churches of Christ when Kip Mckean was the leader of the ICOC, Kip often told us to use the definition of the word cult when someone calls the ICOC a cult. By using the definition of the word cult, as suggested by Kip Mckean, ICOC members would supposedly be proving that all Christian churches are cults. Qewr4231 (talk) 21:21, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

A lot of people and scholars worldwide think that Kip Mckean is a cult leader. A lot of people, scholars, and ministers worldwide think that the ICOC, the ICOC without Kip Mckean, and any new Kip Mckean movements are cults. Should this not be placed into the article? The ICOC says they are the only true church and that people who are not members of the ICOC are going to Hell. Is that crazy or what? Qewr4231 (talk) 22:04, 27 September 2014 (UTC)

November 2014

Please do not attack other editors, as you did on Talk:International Christian Church. Comment on content, not on contributors. Personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Please stay cool and keep this in mind while editing. Diff: "But you probably already know this and want to only portray a flowery positive view of Kip Mckean" Cyphoidbomb (talk) 17:02, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

January 2015

You may be blocked from editing without further warning the next time you disrupt Misplaced Pages. Diffs: In this edit you use Talk:Gangsta rap as a soapbox. The purpose of article talk pages is to discuss improvements to the article, not for your general opinions and observations about the subject. In these edits you add links and more commentary to a discussion that has not been active in two months, with no clear discussion of ways to improve the article. Please stop. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 19:00, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

The comments were:

Kip McKean's International Christian Church: CULT https://www.facebook.com/ICCisaCult Qewr4231 (talk) 18:01, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

10 Signs of an Abusive Church http://www.crosswalk.com/blogs/christian-trends/10-signs-of-an-abusive-church.html Qewr4231 (talk) 18:14, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

A former leader in Kip McKean's newest cult talks about lies, corruption, hypocrisy, and abuse in the ICC "El Ministerio Latino" http://www.exicc.org/ Qewr4231 (talk) 18:18, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

Let's me explain why I posted the comments on the talk page.

The facebook page proves that people other than myself consider the ICC to be a cult and Kip Mckean to be a cult leader.

The "10 Signs of an Abusive Church" article immediately made me think of the ICC and Kip Mckean after I read the article. Kip Mckean and the ICC do all of the ten things listed in the article.

And the true firsthand eyewitness account from a former ICC leader under Kip Mckean is pretty hard evidence that Kip Mckean is a cult leader and that the ICC is a cult.

Qewr4231 (talk) 19:14, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

As I am sure has been explained numerous times, articles must be presented from a neutral point of view, and supported by reliable secondary sources that are independent of the subject. Blogs, fringe websites, and the first-hand accounts of people who have become disenchanted with the church typically do not qualify as reliable sources as Misplaced Pages defines it. This is especially true when no such "cult" attributions have yet been supported with references from reliable main stream media outlets, reliable books, etc. It is imperative that you read WP:FRINGE. Further, it is extraordinarily difficult to discuss things with you when you disappear for months at a time. I don't see how anything can be resolved or communicated to you satisfactorily this way. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 19:40, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

I have removed what you added to Talk:International Christian Church as well. Talk pages are there to discuss improving the article with content provided by reliable sources. They are not there for you to present original research or synthesis or opinion on the article subject. Misplaced Pages doesn't care what topics you have associated with others, or what you think about the article subject, or what you have come to a clear conclusion on. Please stop this and read the guidelines. --Escape Orbit 19:44, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

Just improve the article by telling the truth. Kip Mckean is a cult leader. Everyone knows it. Both of the movements he started are cults. He wants money, power, and sex. Qewr4231 (talk) 19:51, 30 January 2015 (UTC)