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Revision as of 16:37, 8 September 2006

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UNSC 242

The "inadmissibility of acquisition of territory by force" is not ambiguous. --Ian Pitchford 15:17, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

"Secure and Recognized Boundaries" is a lesser element because it's not accompanied by a specific recommendation or instruction and the phrase has no explicit meaning, whereas the abolition of the right of conquest was a core principle of the Covenant of the League of Nations and is a core principle of the Charter of the United Nations. --Ian Pitchford 15:33, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

The Charter of the United Nations does not allow the acquisition of territory by conquest. This prinicple is empahised in the preamble to UNSC 242. The addition of an ambiguous phrase about secure boundaries doesn't change international law. --Ian Pitchford 15:40, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Genital modification and mutilation

The work you are deleting seems to be non controversial. It does not seem to condemn relgious positions in any way.

NPOV is about capturing POV, not removing it from the encyclopedia, and this simply notes that there are POVs in the world. AFAICT it is correct in that, although I would prefer it if it noted that some religions perform these procedures as part of their belief structure and it had citations. But it does not seem to be incorrect, and so I have therefore reverted your edit.

If you believe that this piece is non NPOV, then I suggest you read NPOV again.WolfKeeper 01:03, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

You're violating 3 reverts. You've also removed a cite, and you are making false accusations that completely can't be sustained. You've got no leg to stand on here really. Seriously, the world isn't going to end if you leave this alone.WolfKeeper 03:01, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Hi

I noticed high quality of your contributions. Thank you for making WP better. ←Humus sapiens 08:33, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Circ changes you made are wrong

Those were exact quotes from the citations. Do not change exact quotes.TipPt 15:08, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

NB I changed no quotes whatsoever, and the few words of the article I have modified up until now had nothing to do with any quotes; I was neutralizing the POV that was inserted into the article byTipPt's dishonest and reckless manipulation of medical literature.Dasondas 15:40, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Your note re Genital modification and mutilation

Thanks for your note - and your concern - on my talk page. I appreciate your thoughtfulness. But I'm not sure that I agree with your reasoning. I would agree if you said it was intolerant for people to object to religious circumcision, certainly. However, there is intolerance in this world, and some people do indeed object to this. Their numbers are probably smaller than those who object to elective secular circumcision (itself a fairly small group), but they do exist. While we should be careful to avoid implying that there's a lot of controversy (as a certain editor seems to desire), surely it isn't intolerant to note that some exists? Jakew 09:46, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Dasondas, I understand the point you're making, and to an extent, I agree. The question, however, is at what point does a fringe element become noteworthy? I don't know the answer.

Please would you have a look here. It is an article by a gentleman who addresses the issue of religious circumcision from a supportive point of view. However, in doing so, he notes many of the objections that have been made. I'd be interested in learning your thoughts on the nature of the controversy in light of this. Jakew 12:21, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I understand the points you've made, and I agree that they're valid. I'm not entirely convinced that there should be no mention, but I'll help out and see if we can get some facts to help decide upon that. Jakew 15:30, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

"intolerant fringe groups"

excuse me? you're the one being POV and intolerant. I have no problem with you VOLUNTARILY getting YOURSELF circumcised for religion reasons. However you have no right to FORCE ANOTHER HUMAN BEING to be circumcised. Furthermore for religious purposes, would not voluntary circumcision be more religiously meaningful?

If you circumcise another without their consent (or before they're old enough to give consent) then you have engaged in genital mutilation and the violation of human rights. No religion gives anyone the right to deprive others of their human rights.

Do NOT attempt to imply others are "intolerant fringe groups" when you are merely projecting your own intolerance and bigotry. Whatever religion you are is not my concern, it is irrelevant. (and no, don't tell me, because I don't care what religion you are) Lordkazan 16:10, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

You need to consult the dictionary on the term "bigot". If I was a bigot I would be attempting to outlaw your religion. I am not, I don't care what religion you are. You, as part of your religion, can have yourself voluntarily circumcised if you want. Yes I do understand the religious significance of it for some people, no that significance does not justify you doing it to other people without their consent. As I noted above "Furthermore for religious purposes, would not voluntary circumcision be more religiously meaningful?". You have been reported for your repeated personal attacks, and I am watching the genital mutilation article for any vandalism from you Lordkazan 16:37, 8 September 2006 (UTC)