Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 16:11, 9 January 2007

• See User talk:Durin/archive for all prior discussion from this page.

Thank you

Thank you very much for the kind words on my talk page and your support at my RfC. It is greatly appreciated. —Chowbok ☠ 01:56, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

My userbox saga

Durin: I think I've finally found the brain cell necessary to comprehend image licenses and userboxes images. I think. Can I use Image:YorkUserbox.png? It's just text in PS and a free-use clipart banner. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Drcwright (talk • contribs) 20:11, 15 December 2006 (UTC).

• Ding ding ding! You did it! You found that brain cell! Congratulations! :) Seriously. Well done, nice job! :) --Durin 20:26, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

• Haha. Thanks. I really don't know what my problem was. Cheers Drcwright 20:28, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

• Don't sweat it. I'm just quite glad you were willing to work with me on the issue. Too often I run into users who are recalcitrant regarding the policy. So, thank you. --Durin 20:31, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Fair use

A number of images I uploaded were listed as fair use violations despite being tagged correctly because they appear to not be used in the main article mainspace. In actually, I did find those images in main articles on Misplaced Pages; it just doesn't appear that way because I use the images in userboxes, and most of them are too large to fit into userboxes. So what I did was scaled them down on an external program and then uploaded them under slightly different filenames. If you (or someone else) would please show me how to scale down images on Misplaced Pages, I will do that instead. Anthony Rupert 15:27, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

• While there is technical means to scale down such images, using fair use images on userboxes is simply not permitted. For how to resize images, see User_talk:Drcwright#Sizing_of_images where I discussed this with another user. But, again, you may not use fair use tagged images outside of the main article namespace. Please see Misplaced Pages:Fair use criteria item #9. If you have other questions about this, I'd be happy to answer. All the best, --Durin 02:29, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Arbitration request filed against Husnock

Please see the main WP:RFAR page if you want to add anything. Thatcher131 16:38, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Fair use rationale guideline

Hi. I'm posting this on your talk page because I have noticed that you are often active in one or more aspects of our image use and/or image deletion processes.

I would like to propose Misplaced Pages:Fair use rationale guideline as a guideline to detail the necessary components of a "non-free image use", or "fair use", rationale. At present, it's kindof a moving target. Some image description pages have a detailed, bulleted rationale, while others have a one sentence "this picture identifies the subject". Patroling Category:All images with no fair use rationale, I've seen image pages that explicitly have something of a rationale that have been nominated for a speedy.

This is not an attempt to change or influence the image use policy in any way - and I would like to steer it away from becoming a rehash of the arguments over recent changes to the fair use policy. The only purpose of this guideline is to assist users who upload fair use images in correctly and adequately documenting what they feel to be the rationale for using the images.

So I would like for us to formalize what is required. I have also created Template:Fair use rationale and I would like to propose that we use it or something similar as a template to assist users in creating an acceptable rationale. I have no particular attachment to the proposal as it stands now - I have created it only as a starting point. Please see Misplaced Pages:Fair use rationale guideline and the associated talk page to give your thoughts and ideas. Thank you. BigDT 19:49, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

• A bit busy right now, but on first pass it looks good. I need to review more in depth though. --Durin 20:17, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

I have seen some freshly uploaded images that had no source or license information. Those I do tag with {{nsd}} or {{nld}}. However, I have seen none with rational that omitted a fair use tag. If I have tagged such images with {{nsd}} or {{nld}}, please let me know. I do patrol recent changes including uploaded images. Will (Talk - contribs) 21:51, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

User:CamelCommodore

Please use whatever powers you have to find out who this may be and where they are posting from. The guy just posted a message on my talk page as if to confirm the sockpuppet suspicion just moments after I made my arb com statement. Someone is either trying to discredit me or this person has a warped sense of helping. I see you have already spoken to him, I need some assistance with this. Please. -Husnock 20:00, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

• Since I am party to the RfAr, I decline to become involved. Reviewing Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser, this decision lies with ArbCom anyway. See where it says "Question about a possible sock puppet related to an open arbitration case" the solution being "Request checkuser on the arbitration case pages". The matter is for ArbCom to decide. --Durin 20:05, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Why?/What?

What is a fair use tag? How do I not use it? Please tell me? You added the following comment to my my talk page:
"Please stop adding images tagged with fair use tags to your userpage as you did here. The use of fair use images on userpages is not permitted per Misplaced Pages:Fair use criteria item #9. If you have any questions about this, I'd be happy to answer. Thanks, --Durin 17:43, 18 December 2006 (UTC)"
Please help me. Zazzer 21:45, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

• A fair use tag is a type of image copyright tag that specifies that an image is copyrighted and used here on Misplaced Pages under terms of fair use. An exhaustive list of all fair use licensing tags may be found at Category:Non-free image copyright tags. In general, the easiest way to tell if an image has a fair use licensing tag is if it has the phrase "fair use" somewhere on the image's description page. Just search for that text. If you're uncertain, feel free to ask me. Misplaced Pages policy does not permit the use of fair use tagged images outside of the main article namespace, i.e. the actual articles of the encyclopedia. Thus, they may not be used on templates or on user pages. If you have any other questions, I'd be happy to help. Thanks, --Durin 14:46, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Husnock

Hello,

An Arbitration case involving you has been opened: Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Husnock. Please add any evidence you may wish the arbitrators to consider to the evidence sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Husnock/Evidence. You may also contribute to the case on the workshop sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Husnock/Workshop.

On behalf of the Arbitration Committee,—— Eagle 101 04:47, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

		The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
		Thanks for the support and for all you have done to assist me! MONGO 09:38, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Something I forgot to do before I left

		The Defender of Justice Barnstar
		Awarded to Durin, champion of justice. I owe this to you twice, thanks. —Doug Bell  12:46, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Holton Evangelical Lutheran Church

I've added the "{{prod}}" template to the article Holton Evangelical Lutheran Church, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but I don't believe it satisfies Misplaced Pages's criteria for inclusion, and I've explained why in the deletion notice (see also "What Misplaced Pages is not" and Misplaced Pages's deletion policy). Please either work to improve the article if the topic is worthy of inclusion in Misplaced Pages, or, if you disagree with the notice, discuss the issues at Talk:Holton Evangelical Lutheran Church. You may remove the deletion notice, and the article will not be deleted, but note that it may still be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached, or if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria. Ioannes Pragensis 20:48, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

• Fine by me. I only visited it to remove hopelessly POV comments. --Durin 20:50, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Cite

What is the code to cite a statement in an article, not the whole page, but rather just a little statement said in an article? Thanks, Coocooforcocopuffs 19:39, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

• Have a look at any featured articles available at Misplaced Pages:Today's featured article/December 2006 or Misplaced Pages:Featured articles. Any of these articles should give you excellent examples. --Durin 03:53, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Purdue.JPG

Hello, I see that you tagged this image. I was wondering why was this done? The reason why this image looks similar to PurdueSpiritMark.jpg is because the logo of the organization does not change. This is not the official logo of the organization as the official logo is Black and gold. There is another image that is the same as the Michigan State Spartans logo but this has been released into the free domain because the user has released it to the public domain. So for the same reason, since I have created this image it should be allowed to stay as I have released it to the Public domain. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rakeshsharma (talk • contribs) 05:16, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

• Because it is an obvious derivative work of the copyrighted work. If you want to do a simple black background with a gold P on it, that is not the logo. What you created is too close to not be considered a derivative work. As such, Purdue University retains rights. --Durin 15:08, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Wiltshire and Aularian Userboxes

Hi there, I noticed that in line with your fair use image policy you had deleted the images from the two userbox templates I had made. I've since restored them because I don't believe them to be fair use but rather public domain. I don't believe the Wiltshire county arms are fair use for similar reasons to those you cite in your related article about the U.S.S. Spruance image, it is the work of the British Government. The St. Edmund Hall arms are not officially recognised by the College of Arms and so are not officially owned by the college under UK heraldic law. Also to the best of my knowledge there has been no copyright issued to the college granting them ownership of the arms as a logo. Also the image in question was created by me but I'm guessing that has little bearing on fair use vs public domain. Would be grateful for any comments you may have. --AulaTPN 19:50, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

• With respect to Image:SEH.gif: This image is tagged as {{logo}}. This makes the image a fair use image and it may not be used on userboxes. Whether or not a copyright has been issued is irrelevant. International copyright law has, for some time now, recognized that creators of works retain rights even if not specifically granted by a governing authority. Thus, in order for this image to not be used here under fair use, we need a positive affirmation from St. Edmund Hall that they release all rights to this arms image which is clearly a derivative work of the arms that can be seen, in part, on the header of http://www.seh.ox.ac.uk/index.cfm?do=aularians. Until this release is obtained, the image is properly and appropriately tagged and may not be used on userboxes.
• With respect to Image:Arms-wiltshire.jpg: In the United States, most works of the federal government are in the public domain by law. This does not apply to any other country. Simply because something is a government work does not mean it is in the public domain. Each country has their own laws in this respect. Most, including the UK government, do not automatically place their works into the public domain. Thus, this image is not automatically in the public domain.
• I am reverting your reinsertion of these images into the userboxes. Please do not re-add them to the userboxes without first gaining copyright license release under, for example, terms of the GNU Free Documentation License and providing evidence that this has been done. If you would like assistance in doing so, I'd be happy to help. --Durin 20:20, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for getting back to me so quickly! I'm still new to Misplaced Pages and really appreciate everyone's help on my path to good wiki-citizenship.

• As far as St Edmund Hall goes, I created the image and tagged it with {{logo}} as that seemed the most appropriate classification at the time, this may have been a mistake. The issue of copyright is likely never to be resolved as it is frequently argued by the relevant issuing authorities that the Hall has no rights or claims to the coat of arms as depicted as they were never officially issued by the College of Arms. That being said, the image on their website is merely a photograph of a painting by a long deceased artist whose copyright claims would have expired centuries ago. Surely this makes their image derivative of an uncopyrighted/-able work? And if I really wanted to argue the case I could point out that the painting is derivative of the initial design on letters patent which would have been created nearly 800 years ago by a Herald. I'd be interested to hear what you thought the best approach would be for settling this one, as an alumnus I could write to the Hall and ask their official position on such use but if they're not actually copyright holders I'm not sure where that leaves me.

• As pertains to Wiltshire, there is a scaled version of the logo available on the Wiltshire County Council website. The copyright statement on the same website grants free use of all website pages/material for non-commercial use without obtaining explicit permission from the copyright holders. Would this be satisfactory for reinstating use of the full-size or scaled versions of the image? www.wiltshire.gov.uk

Thanks again for all your help --AulaTPN 00:31, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

• Re: St. Edmund Hall. Ask them! Can't hurt. They might be able to provide a clear answer without equivocation on the status.
• Re: Wiltshire. Misplaced Pages does not permit commercial use only images. We have two image classes here; free license and fair use. If the image does not fit into either of those, then we don't use it or we make it fit into one of those. In the case of the Wiltshire arms, we have to use it under fair use since the non-commercial only license is in effect. --Durin 00:43, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

John R. Ryan

I noticed that this page was under the pages for speedy deletion, I do not believe that it should be up for speedy delete. I did notice that the creator of the page copy and pasted most of the original page so i went through and fixed much of the page, if anything it just needs to be cleaned up. John R. Ryan was a Vice Admiral in the Navy and served at the Superintendent of the United States Naval Academy, he is now the Chancellor of the largest system of education in the nation (State University of New York), please take time to review this case. Thanks --Joebengo 20:18, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

• I removed the speedy tags. He's quite notable enough. --Durin 20:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
• Thank you, I will spend some time cleaning it up now. --Joebengo 20:29, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

Image:Eraserhead.jpg

What right do you have to remove it from the userbox? I took the photo. In the description is a link to my original photo, not cropped, where you can see it is an amateurish snapshot of the DVD cover. You said "the original author retains rights". I am the original author. Please explain to me the loophole in which I do not have control over an image that I created. NIRVANA2764 23:59, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

• You do have rights to whatever creative effort went into the creation of the photograph of the DVD cover. Additionally, the creators of the movie Eraserhead maintain rights to the DVD cover. You have the power only to release your rights, and can not release theirs. As such, the image must be used here under terms of fair use. --Durin 00:09, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Man, I give up. I'm just trying to get a nice image in the only userbox I've made and it's my favorite movie of all time. I don't get how it's unlawful to use if I took a picture of something copyrighted. I can't think of any other way to make the userbox look okay. This sucks. You should really see the movie sometime. Got any suggestions on how I can get an image in there? NIRVANA2764 00:25, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

• I have seen the movie. Saw it shortly after it came to video actually. Rather amazing movie. Depressing as all hell, but amazing nonetheless.
• As to the copyright problems; just taking a picture of something doesn't mean you gain all rights to it. Let's say you took a photograph of the Coca-Cola logo. Does that mean you can then go make a million shirts with the logo and sell them? Coca-cola would be on your doorstep faster than you could put one of the t-shirts on. You do have rights to the creative effort needed to create the photograph, but Coca-cola would absolutely retains rights to their logo. Similarly, David Lynch and/or Libra Films retain rights to imagery from the movie, including the cover of the DVD package. Now, since you took the photo you have rights, but they have rights too. For instance, they could not use your photo unless you gave them permission to do so. Similarly, you can not use the photo unless they give permission to do so. You both have rights, and both sets of rights have to be released under a free license in order for the image to be usable outside of the main article namespace here on Misplaced Pages.
• I know you're a good guy in this, and are trying to do the right thing. I really appreciate that! --Durin 00:29, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Fair use images in List of Mac OS X software

Durin, it seems to me that the images in List of Mac OS X software are allowed under the same fair use principles that Misplaced Pages uses to include discographies with images. --Ellmist 15:08, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

• This has been discussed at great length. The determination is that using fair use images in a gallery as was done in this case is against policy. Fair use images must contribute significantly to the article. The simple display of the image along with a title is not significant. --Durin 15:45, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your prompt reply. Are galleries such as this allowed for discographies? --Ellmist 17:35, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

• No, they are not. There's a substantial number of similar policy violations across Misplaced Pages, but they are violations nonetheless. --Durin 04:08, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

{{Coatofarms}} → {{GFDL}}?

See Special:Contributions/Askewmind and as an arbitrary example . -62.253.52.19 18:38, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

• Oww. --Durin 04:08, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

I came here to discuss exactly that. See Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Askewmind. —freak(talk) 02:29, Jan. 1, 2007 (UTC)

• The former {{coatofarms}} template can not automatically be shifted to {{gfdl}}. Affirmative, provable evidence of a copyright holder releasing material under GFDL must be available. All of these replacements need to be undone, unless there is such proof. --Durin 02:32, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
  • Indeed, I did revert all of his edits without hesitation, I was merely seeking broader input on whether to block him. In any case the thread was more or less ignored and is now archived here. Although... I guess if he doesn't use that account anymore it doesn't really matter that much. —freak(talk) 09:47, Jan. 2, 2007 (UTC)

Orbiter Online speedy deletion

Help, please (you've already posted once on this topic, to which I've replied). http://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:AMMalena I would appreciate any insights you can provide to make this article for Orbiter Online work. Thanks. Anthony 21:35, 2 January 2007 (UTC)AMMalena

Images in templates

If they were to be deleted and substituted, can the images be added back? --Howard the Duck 04:13, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

• Yes, since they would be used on a main namespace article only. --Durin 13:15, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
  • Ok, thanks! --Howard the Duck 14:56, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Fair use and userboxes

Argh, isn't there a simple way to know whether I can use an image or not in a userbox? I'm rather simple minded and technical jargon makes my head spin. By the way, although I find it irritating that I have to redo my userboxes often, I have to grudgingly commend your efforts to make sure Misplaced Pages doesn't get sued and whatnot. Rougeblossom 21:41, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

• Thanks for the compliments, even if they are given grudgingly :) As to images and whether they can be used; look for the term "fair use" on the image's description page...anywhere on it. In major browsers, you can do this with ctrl-f, and typing in fair use on the resulting dialogue box. --Durin 21:47, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Images, fair use and templates

Durin, thank you for expanding my understanding of fair use of images and where it applies in Misplaced Pages. As a result of the change you made to Template:WayneCountyNY, I tried an alternative by creating a different template, Template:Summarybox Wayne County NY, which accepts an argument for the image on the article page, thus moving the image reference out of non-article namespace. You can see an example of this on Williamson, New York (hit edit and look at the bottom of the page for the code) —

{{Template:Summarybox Wayne County NY | image = ] }}

Is this an acceptable solution to using images with templates? This is my first attempt at using parser functions with templates, so any suggestions are welcome.

Two last questions: (1) does the section "Images in templates" above apply to this situation; and (2) why is it okay to use the New York state flag in the template, but not a governmental subdivision of the same state? Thanks again for my education.

—  Jim Dunning  talk  : 18:46, 5 January 2007 (UTC)>

• The code you used is fine. But, the use here in the template at the bottom of the page is a decorative use. That violates Misplaced Pages:Fair use criteria item #8. If it were used on the infobox for the town, (as another seal is) it would be ok. In this case, it isn't ok. --Durin 19:24, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

google image

the image you requested for deletion, was beeing used as an image for userboxes.

thank you

--'•Tbone55• 23:17, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

• Where it may not be used. Please see Misplaced Pages:Fair use criteria item #9. --Durin 23:49, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Re: Use of fair use images in signatures

(aeropagitica), please stop using the fair use tagged image Image:United Federation of Planets flag.png. This image has now been scattered over a large number of non-main article namespace pages, and will need to be removed to adhere to Misplaced Pages:Fair use criteria item #9. If you have questions about this, I'd be happy to answer. --Durin 17:15, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Eh? I stopped using that ages ago, when first alerted to a problem! My sig now links though to my talk page and contains no image or other html/wiki code. Regards, (aeropagitica) 17:18, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

• Sorry, new year problem. I saw 5 January 2006 and read 5 January 2007. My apologies. Some help removing it from the various places it appears would be nice. --Durin 17:19, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Use of Image:United Federation of Planets flag.png

This image is a fair use image and may not be used outside of the main article namespace. Please do not re-insert this image as it constitutes a violation of Misplaced Pages:Fair use criteria item #9. --Durin 17:43, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Please look closely at the edit. THATS THE UN FLAG. If you arent going to at least review the contents of my edits, do not bother reverting them. --Cat out 17:47, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

• Fair enough. Mistake noted and apologized for. According to the file links section on Image:United Federation of Planets flag.png, it was still in use on your page. I saw an image closely resembling, and removed it, admittedly knee jerk. --Durin 17:51, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
  • Thats ok, I guess the problem is that since my userpage wasn't updated so far the servers still think the image is transcluded. That linkage should go away in a few minutes/hours I suppose when chaches clear. --Cat out 17:53, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Orphaned fair use images

• Image:Cardassian Logo.png
• Image:Klingon Logo.png
• Image:Romulan Logo.png

As a result of the deletion of Comparative ranks and insignia of Star Trek, these images are now orphaned and subject to deletion in seven days unless used in a main namespace article. --Durin 20:15, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Delete this image at this instant! Thank you! (uploader) --Cat out 21:26, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

• Done. --Durin 22:03, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism on my user page

24.60.115.76 has vandalized my page twice. Looking into his history, all he has done is vandalize pages, blanking out the Ukraine page and adding a troll comment to another page. Could he be blocked or warned or something? Thanks! Pacdude 06:23, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

• I warned him. --Durin 13:56, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
  • Thanks so much! Pacdude 17:27, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Barnstar for images

		The Working Man's Barnstar
		You arguably do the most thankless job in Misplaced Pages in policing images, and are probably the best at it. Sure, I don't like all the images you tag and remove, but I know it's policy and I proudly respect you for your contributions and not letting any angry users get to you. Wizardman 01:19, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

• Thanks! Much appreciated! It is at times quite thankless, but not right now :) --Durin 03:13, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Husnock sockpuppetry

Dear Mr. Durin, do you have some kind of problem with me? I see you are posting things about me on these pages because I answered a question about the Husnock case. I'm an english lit professor and couldnt care less about who that is or what he did. I was just pointing out that the page was linked in a newsgroup. Please come to me and say things to my face instad of posting this material about me on this webpage. -Pahuskahey 15:17, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

• I have nothing to say to you. --Durin 15:57, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Nice one, big man. Call me a happy sock and walk away when I have a problem with it. Dirty SOB. -Pahuskahey 16:11, 9 January 2007 (UTC)