Misplaced Pages

Oppose

Neutral

1. Neutral Not strong opposition, and willing to change to support, but I'd like an explanation regarding you're interaction with Achilles and the purported spammming. Normally I wouldnt question this, but there appears to be come controversy. freestylefrappe 00:42, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Reply Thanks for your question, freestyle. It is a little complex, so I will try to explain:

I was watching Jimbo's talk page when I saw Tony Sidaway leave this message. In his message, Tony asks Jimbo to weigh in on an action taken by Achilles. Tony said "Achilles, observing the failure to gain consensus for deletion of an autofellatio image, clearly diagnosed the problem (correctly, in my opinion) as bias due to the fact that most wikipedians don't watch WP:IFD or Autofellatio... he spammed a rather large number of Misplaced Pages user talk pages...he did so in a selective manner...contacting only those who seemed likely to express a point of view he agreed with."

I then left this message on Jimbo's page, saying "A message to selected people is not spam...Tony Sidaway stated on Achilles’ talk page "Spamming is sending the same message to lots of people." That is not a full or correct definition. For example, www.dictionary.com defines spamming as "Unsolicited e-mail, often of a commercial nature, sent indiscriminately to multiple mailing lists, individuals, or newsgroups; junk e-mail." While it is true that his message could be considered "unsolicited", it was not sent "indiscriminately". He sent the message only to people whom you had reason to believe would be interested in the message. What could be wrong with reaching out to people who are likely to have an interest in a topic?..."

I then left this message on Tony's page, alerting him to the fact that I had replied to his message on Jimbo's page, saying "Hello Tony, I wanted to let you know that I disagree with the comments you made at Jimbo Wales's talk page about Achilles reaching out to potential voters on the autofellatio image issue. I have posted my explanation of why I believe Achilles' actions are not spam on those two Talk pages. As a courtesy to you, I wanted to notify you here that I have made those postings since you may not be watching those pages. This way, you have an opportunity to respond if you wish."

Tony replied "A message to selected people is not spam I'm sorry but that is just silly. Spam is the same message repeated lots of times. Putting the same message on lots of user talk pages is spam. But that isn't the issue, is it? He didn't just spam, he intentionally spammed *only* those people who agreed with him. He tried to cook the vote, to campaign, to go against the consensual decision making that has served Misplaced Pages so well and turn it into a scramble for votes, and was caught red-handed."

To which I replied, "...Let's set aside for now whether it was spam or not so that we may focus on what you say is the issue. You are equating a "get out the vote" campaign to "cook the vote". They are not the same. Cooking the vote would be using sock puppets to stuff the ballot box. What he did was analogous to the Democratic party encouraging Pro-choice or gay marriage proponents to go to the polls in a United States presidential election; or the Republican party doing the same with senior citizens and members of the Bel Air country club. Why is there anything wrong with appealing to people who are likely to be receptive to your arguments? How does this go against the "consensual decision making" process? Were people intimidated to vote a certain way? Did he tamper with the counting of the votes received? No. People were encouraged to speak up about an issue he felt they would be interested in. In my relatively short time here, I've seen hundreds of examples of people doing the exact same thing without receiving criticism, and I don't see anything wrong with it."

So, in summary: what happened was Achilles did some campaigning on a deletion issue. Tony complained about it to Jimbo. I chimed in to disagree with Tony and defend Achilles' actions. Some discussion ensued. It was all pretty cordial. We all went on about our business. The full discussion thread is in my Talk archive if you are really interested. I'm happy to answer any follow-up questions. Johntex\ 01:31, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Comments

Questions for the candidate
A few generic questions to provide guidance for voters:

1. What sysop chores, if any, would you anticipate helping with? (Please read the page about administrators and the administrators' reading list.)

A. I like a lot of variety in my time on Misplaced Pages. I spend time: contributing to articles, contributing to AFD discussions, on RC patrol, reverting vadalism, answering questions at the Help Desk, welcoming new users, etc. I woud certainly continue these tasks. The one-click revert tool would be helpful in reverting vandalism as I come across it. I would also add helping with AFD closures to my "to-do" list. I know that we consider that being an administrator should be "no big deal". I think that is true in the sense that there is plenty a good user can contribute to the project without being an admin. On the other hand, I think that new users are especially likely to look to administrators for assistance and to set an example. Therefore, I would endeavor to be especially mindful of my obligation to help other users out and to act as a role model.

2. Of your articles or contributions to Misplaced Pages, are there any about which you are particularly pleased, and why?

A. Yes and No. Sometimes I go back to them and see there is so much still to improve! Two of the first articles I created were Hook 'em Horns and Stratellite. I think they have developed pretty well, though of course other editors have done a lot of the work. Sometimes, making a small addition to an article can be very gratifying, such as adding a source to help clear up confusion over what day is Victory over Japan Day.

3. Have you been in any conflicts over editing in the past or do you feel other users have caused you stress? How have you dealt with it and how will you deal with it in the future?

A. Yes, sometimes people get passionate about their views on how to improve an article or make this a better place. I think passion is great as long as it comes with civility. My experience is that participating in a dialog is usually sufficient, and I've had a lot of great conversations with people here that have allowed us to reach consensus / compromise on many topics. For example, I'm pleased about the development of Hubbert peak theory. This is an article where emotions can sometimes run high, but I'm happy that we've been able to keep the conversation at Talk:Hubbert_peak_theory civil and that we've been able to work together to improve the article.

I also feel it is important to get help when you need it. I think avenues such as peer review and the dispute resolution system are important parts of Misplaced Pages. I have tried to help in responding to peer reviews, and I have recently requested peer review on an article I created so that we can ensure my personal opinion does not carry into that particular article. I am a party to a request for arbitration involving User:Rangerdude and several other editors, and I am hopeful that the arbitration process will be helpful to those of us involved.

My plan for dealing with future stress is to try to set an example for good behavior. Also, if things get stressful in one area of Misplaced Pages, I can always go over to another area I enjoy, or simple hit "Random article" and look for a new way to contribute! Johntex\ 18:17, 19 October 2005 (UTC)