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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Sergeant Cribb (talk | contribs) at 06:07, 3 June 2011 (→Template:Political neologisms: '''Delete''' No clear unifying principle and hence unlikely to be helpful as a navigation aid.). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Revision as of 06:07, 3 June 2011 by Sergeant Cribb (talk | contribs) (→Template:Political neologisms: '''Delete''' No clear unifying principle and hence unlikely to be helpful as a navigation aid.)(diff) ← Previous revision | Latest revision (diff) | Newer revision → (diff)
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May 25

Template:Infobox GAA championship main

Template:Infobox GAA championship main (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)
Template:Infobox GAA tournament (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Propose merging Template:Infobox GAA championship main with Template:Infobox GAA tournament.
Both templates perform the same function. {{Infobox GAA tournament}} is new and unused, while {{Infobox GAA championship main}} has been around for quite a while. {{Infobox GAA tournament}} has extra parameters, and , I think, a better name (similar to other sports - {{Infobox football tournament}}, for example). So I'm proposing the merge in that direction rather than the other way. Either way, the two should be merged with their combined parameters Teester (talk) 23:17, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

Template:Political neologisms

Template:Political neologisms (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

The articles to which it links - and, inherently, any articles to which it may link - are almost completely unconnected. Essentially, it's a category for words or phrases that have been coined recently, with 'recently' meaning 'in the last 70 years'. The terms are defined so loosely so as to include frequently- and long-used words, such as Euroscepticism, Political correctness, and Islamism with a series of books about Eurabia (book titles are not neologisms...), santorum (if you haven't heard of it, check it out), and the Infamy Speech - which was made SEVEN DECADES AGO.

Which is basically saying that, without any reliable sources suggesting that these things are connected, or any definitive list of 'political neologisms', the template cannot be WP:NPOV. And thus should be deleted. It ought to be a category, whereby an article's inclusion can be established on an article-by-article basis with reliable sources saying that that particular word is a neologism. But it's not a template. Bastin 22:37, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

Comment: Yes, you said this when I raised the issue on the talkpage... and didn't provide any evidence from reliable sources. My statement above is that you'll never find any that support in reliable sources for santorum to be discussed in the same forum as Eurabia and Remix culture. WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is a really bad argument - particularly when you haven't even pointed to any examples (I don't see why I should dig through useful templates to find something useless to prove your illegitimate argument). Also, you should declare your interest as the creator of the template. Bastin 22:53, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
Yes, I created the template. And yes, it is discussed in reliable sources. Many of them. See the article. Your comment in reference to a specific entry from this template, seems to be advocating more about a particular article, than the template itself. -- Cirt (talk) 22:55, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
Stop assuming bad faith, SchmuckyTheCat; I came to this discussion due to Cirt's notice. If you accuse me of tag-teaming or some other offense again, I'll take it up on the appropriate notice board, where you have spent many a lovely day. →StaniStani  04:10, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
If you carry out your threat against SchmuckyTheCat, yours can be the latest in a noble tradition of complaints against him that have backfired against the complainants. The rapid-fire stub, split, template removal, and template deletion attempts that have plagued santorum and related pages for the past few days, always featuring the same cast of characters, is ample evidence of tag-teaming in itself. Since links have surfaced to discussions on Misplaced Pages Review and on the Wikien-l list about a concurrent anti-Cirt and anti-santorum campaign, the evidence of bad-faith behavior has been overwhelming. You have already marked your intentions as more ideological than encyclopedic, but gladly, you have also declared your intention to retire yourself from this public relations push. Perhaps you should stick to this promise. Quigley (talk) 20:07, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
I'm an editor in good standing here, and if I participate within the rules, accusations of bad faith can't stick. I have a record of cooperating with even people who I disagree with. As for Misplaced Pages Review, many editors at Misplaced Pages, including present and former members of Arbcom, participate in an uncensored discussion of this site's failings. WP:BADSITES was a long time ago. →StaniStani  18:12, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete Difficult to determine what should or should not be included. TFD (talk) 18:10, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Keep The criteria for an article's inclusion in this template is the same as with any other template or category: that reliable sources describe the article's subject as belonging to such a grouping. The term santorum, whose demotion in Google's search results is the stated goal of the faction campaigning to delete this template, has an excess of sources that attest to its being a neologism that was created and used for political purposes. If you don't think a certain article should be on this template, such as "Infamy Speech", then make the edit that you think is right on the template. TfD is not for cleanup. Quigley (talk) 20:07, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete. Wrong tool for the job. Revert to category, which is right tool for the job. —Scheinwerfermann ·C21:44, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete. The connections between the individual terms are so tenuous and the potential number of entries so great that this selection does not work in a template. Keep it as a category. Sam Blacketer (talk) 23:28, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Comment: It is my opinion that the template has value as a navigational tool, and I continue to believe that. However, if it is determined that the community consensus is for deletion, I will abide by that and not contest it. Cheers, -- Cirt (talk) 06:08, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete - Although I can see where the template could be useful I agree that it the method its being used for doesn't really tie the articles togather. I also agree that a category would be the best approach in this particular case. --Kumioko (talk) 18:52, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete. Whatever it started out to be, it is now a worthless junkpile of terms. Way too long IMO. Student7 (talk) 16:38, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete. Of course people want to delete this because of "santorum". That's not a reason not to delete it--it just means that people are finally trying to delete it because it's finally causing enough trouble to get noticed. Ken Arromdee (talk) 14:45, 29 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Keep. Aside from being a useful nav tool, it happens to bring together the linked articles in a way that's not so obvious. In fact, the commonality is so subtle that one or two editors above missed it completely. Misplaced Pages has quite a few templates that bring subjects together that otherwise would be dissociated from each other. So the links being otherwise unconnected is no reason to delete this template. Also, the point about age is compelling, although there really isn't any guide to tell us how old a "new" word must be before it's no longer a neologism. So it's tricky to "weed out by age" the links in this template. Changing this template to a cat rather than taking the time to improve it would be a disservice to the general readers of Misplaced Pages, who are more apt to open and check out a Navbar than to click on any given cat. Such a move would simply hide the problem rather than deal with it. So rather than delete it or hide it as a cat, improve it. – Paine Ellsworth ( CLIMAX )  05:38, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
Comment. Way too much irrelevant commentary in this discussion. Please remain focused. – Paine Ellsworth ( CLIMAX )  05:38, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete or split this template into well defined groups - Santorum is not even remotely in the same class of words as neologisms used in standard political discourse. John Vandenberg 04:06, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
    • Keep, I've removed many of the articles which don't fit into any reasonable definition of a "Political neologism". More work needed, and Cirt has removed Santorum, so I think this template should be kept and refined. John Vandenberg 04:15, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
  • Keep And edit if appropriate to meet concerns. If the thing is fine as a category, I don't see why having it as a navbox is a problem either. It brings together the articles in a useful and interesting way. —Tom Morris (talk) 16:04, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete, Upon reflection, I agree that this template is a bit too much in breadth of its scope, and might be better off simply maintained as a category. -- Cirt (talk) 01:58, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete No clear unifying principle and hence unlikely to be helpful as a navigation aid. Sergeant Cribb (talk) 06:07, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

Template:Infobox SW books

Template:Infobox SW books (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

This template is redundant to the normal book infobox, except that it adds irrelevant (at least for an infobox) in-universe information. It should be deleted after being replaced with the norm. Harry Blue5 (talk • contribs) 22:02, 25 May 2011 (UTC)