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Revision as of 22:32, 12 July 2006 by Touth (talk | contribs) (revert vandalizam)(diff) ← Previous revision | Latest revision (diff) | Newer revision → (diff)Please post new messages at the bottom of my talk page. Please use headlines when starting new talk topics. Thank you.
Alternative rock
Given the amount of work and attention you give to the topics of grunge and alternative rock, I thought I'd run a few ideas by you. Namely, how to improve the Alternative rock template box. Obviously there are far more subgenres than we can adequately fit into it, but what do you think should should be added to it? I've added a few in the last few weeks (Paisley Underground, noise pop), but we can still add a few more in order to give people a more well-rounded view of the genre.
I also think we should add a few more links to the "Other topics" section. The Heavy Metal template has stuff like Heavy metal fashion and the Heavy metal umlat. Some ideas I have for the alternative rock template are Alternative culture, Lollapalooza, Indie (music), and Generation X. If you have any other suggestions, let me know.
In regards to the Timeline of alternative rock: I've done what I can to fill out the 80's more fully, but I do agree that the 90's probably needs some trimming, or at least a reassessment of which albums and events to include. And personally I think the "last album" bit attached to some albums is unnecessary, as many bands are listed as breaking up immediately afterwards anyways.
Lastly, I want to make it known that I certainly bear no ill will regarding our debate about the subject of grunge's relation to hardcore punk. While I disagreed with your assessment, your response to the topic was certainly the approach I prefer when it comes to debates on Misplaced Pages. I trust your judgement in nearly all editing circumstances I have witnessed, and I appreciate any sort of help you can offer in developing and improving these topics on Misplaced Pages. WesleyDodds 02:09, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- Ok, I'll add Lollapalooza and Indie (music) to the template. As for the genre list, I've added all the ones I can think of and that have articles on WIkipedia (as far as I can tell). However, the recent addition and removal of Emo is one that highlights an unclear consensus. I didn't add it when I expanded the list because of the uncertainty. Obviously emo emerged in the DC hardcore scene, but I must say it has ventured closer to alternative rock since the 90's, especially since Sunny Day Real Estate. In it's current form (with the likes of The Used, My Chemical Romance, and scores of bands I personally don't care for at all) it pretty much is alternative rock. AMG lists it as an alt-rock genre. Consequently I think it should be listed both under punk and alternative rock genre lists. WesleyDodds 02:53, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
I'm looking at trimming some items on Timeline of alternative rock because recent edits have fluctuated past the 30 kb mark. There's some notable bands/albums, especially from indie bands sicne the 90s, that still should be listed (material by No Doubt, Sebadoh, and Fugazi are the first to spring to mind) and I think a few of the lesser mainstream alternative bands and albums from the 90's can be removed to make room for them. I'm thinking along the lines of Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Better Than Ezra, Luscious Jackson, and a few others. Let me know which artist/albums you think can be trimmed from the list.
Also, I think we should the White Stripes and the Strokes both to the timeline and the list of bands. While they may be garage rock revial, they aren't mere traditionalists like, say, the Hives or Jet are. They are indie rock bands that revive garage rock styles (The Strokes more so than the White Stripes; the Strokes basically defined the NY indie scene when they debuted), which certainly belong on such lists; also, the White Stripes reference blues and the Strokes have veered more toward traditional alt-rock in recent years. Even though I'm not particularly a fan of either, I feel by excluding them we ignore an important part of modern alternative/indie music. WesleyDodds 10:38, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
This sounds like a bad idea if it is just because of file size. Why not just split the page into decades or something? The current article, if it is so bloated, can still be retained as an abridged/summary version to trim per your liking or the latest whim without loss of content elsewhere. -Onceler 17:09, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
Arbitration case (Danteferno and Leyasu)
I read at Talk:Gothic metal that you have been involved in a recent dispute with Leyasu. He filed an RfAr a few days ago against User:Danteferno. The case is currently listed on the main WP:RfAr page. Just letting you know, in case you had any ties to the Gothic metal article or anything else to say about the users involved. --Idont Havaname (Talk) 01:18, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
A barnstar - no more, no less
I though it was about time you got one of these... Greatgavini 15:14, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
Re:Barnstar
Oh! And thanks for putting the Barnstar on your user page. - The Great Gavini
Days of the New
I left a comment on the talk page about the edit you reverted. I'd appreciate it if you could take the time to read over it and respond. (I'm adding this here because I'm not sure if you're watching that page or not). Thanks. —LrdChaos 00:06, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
Pearl Jam vs. Ticketmaster
I think there should be something about Pearl Jam's battle with Ticketmaster on the Timeline of alternative rock. Maybe something specific like the date they testified before the Senate (or House, I forget). I figured given your knowledge of grunge you would be able to add the relevant information. I know a lot about grunge myself, but that's one of the things I never paid much attention to. WesleyDodds 10:38, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
Wikiproject
I'm interested in starting a WikiProject for Alternative/indie music. From months of combing through various band and genre pages I've noticed that there should be better coordination between them. Additionally, since a good deal of the subjects aren't exactly the most well-known and many bands are notable yet have barely presence out of the underground rock scene, it'd be nice to coordinate a group of interested editors who are willing to work together on alternative rock and its various subgenres. Cetainly the level of care put into featured articles like Nirvana, Grunge music and This Charming Man should be applied to Gothic rock, Indie Rock, Indie (music), Britpop, The Cure, and countless others. So I'd like to start a project in the next few days. I know that a previous WikiProject called Misplaced Pages:WikiProject_Indie_music exists, but's it's been inactive for nearly two years, and its scope was limited. I want give attention to all forms of alternative music by cataloguing genres, expanding band pages, looking up sources, and so forth. If you are interesting in joining and/or can recommend anyone else, let me know. WesleyDodds 03:27, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
I made a temp page for the project at User:WesleyDodds/Alternative music. I also listed the project at Misplaced Pages:Wikiproject/List of proposed projects. Feel free to edit the temp page and add relevant pages to the relevant sections as you see fit. Also feel free to recommend how the page should be laid out (I just used the heavy metal project as a template, but we can alter it in order to better serve our purposes). WesleyDodds 07:05, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
article clean up
I was wondering when the "clean up" tag is going away in the Gen-X article as you specifically asked me to make certain ammends. Even though this article is far from, say, pinponting a demographic, it does cover a lot of credible viewpoints. Also, the "American Generations" Table that mysteriously appears here and elsewhere is very disputed; 1) it slants the article "American" 2) the birth years are in dispute. Ledboots 20:54, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
Wikiproject started
Ok, I started the project, which is located at Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Alternative music. WesleyDodds 22:57, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
Hello:
Hi I'm a new Wikipedian from Natick, Mass... just popped in to say hello to my Wiki neighbor:"
File:Peace Sign 2.svg Merlinus (talk)
- Hi I Am Marc:
I was recently married to my lovely wife; We have lived together for several years already...
- We love cats (3 currently own us)... Jeffy(15), Echo(6) & Gizmo(3). All sleep with us in the big bed and no room to move an inch.
- I was Disabled in a 1993 (Coma)/ and am very slowly recovering. It's tough going out sometimes, though with friends I still do. I have a few supportive friends.
- I am an "Unenrolled voter." Democrat/ Republicans, I don't care, whoever serves makes my life better in the long run I vote for!
- Avid reader. Has collection of many hundreds of rare books. Especially Science Fiction and Fantasy.
- Avid Music collector (2,500 albums)...mostly bootlegs...mostly rare bootlegs...Stones, Kinks, Clapton, Beatles. and solos!
I am what I am I'm strongly opinionated about disabled peoples' rights and jobs for American citizens who have trouble finding minimum wage jobs in my state today and support Universal health care, I would be dead if I did not have it. I am an idiot about Internet social skills. I hope that the Immigration Reform bill will protect disabled citizens who wish to work like myself first before considering allowing new people to come here. I was searching for an internet forum to be my outlet to express my needs, but found that Misplaced Pages is not best suited for that. I'm brushing up on Misplaced Pages's rules of conduct, and slowly starting to begin contributing again.
Current book and CD I own hundreds of rare books
- Current Book Jack Whyte: "Uther"
- Current CD Faves:
- Warren Zevon... "Life'll Kill Ya"
- Howlin' Wolf: "Greatest Hits"
- Latest Flick: "Charles II: The Last King"
File:Peace Sign 2.svg Merlinus (talk)
Good Articles
Hey! Since I've given you some work to do on Jello Biafra, perhaps you'd like to review one of my nominated articles? :) I trust you to pass it if it so deserves or fail it if doesn't :) --kingboyk 14:40, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
Article Reversions
Dear LGagnon,
We noticed that you totally reverted the recent editing done to the following articles: Dead Kennedys, California Uber Alles, Holiday In Cambodia, Mutiny On the Bay, Alternative Tentacles, East Bay Ray, Jello Biafra.
As the original entries contained obvious bias and misstated facts, we believe that a total reversion does not conform to the ‘neutral point of view’ policy of Misplaced Pages. On your User page we notice that you list Jello Biafra as a hero, and perhaps you have reverted the articles with that in mind.
However, Misplaced Pages is more than about advocacy. There were things in the above original entries that are factually incorrect, based on unreliable sources or are simply biased opinion. Please leave the recent edits alone until you know all the facts. And please feel free to contact us by email on any fact that you might question and we can work to resolve the issue.
Some of the original information looks like it simply came straight from Biafra’s press releases, but he was found to “lack credibility” by all the courts involved. Copies of the Court Judgment against Biafra are on public file in San Francisco, CA. You may not like some of the information in the corrected articles, but it has been found to be true by a neutral court of law and it is the public record.
Thank you, Bob
EBR sock puppet is back
...and he's got his astroturf kit with him. I just had to revert several things he redid back to your rv's. What a pain in the ass. If it's really EBR, I'm surprised he was able to lift his head away from his coke mirror, the prick. Have a nice day. --CJ Marsicano 12:36, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
Gremlins
Oh hey, appropriate you're the first one to comment on it... you're the guy who started the thing! CanadianCaesar Et tu, Brute? 01:31, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
Smashing Pumpkins
Hey, for the past few days I've been trying to mold The Smashing Pumpkins, currently a Good Article, into a Featured Article. While I'm still hunting down a few more sources and have major parts to add (an Influences section) or subtract (move the Discography to a new page), it'd really help if you could go over the article and provide some feedback about it before the inevitable Peer Review. Most importantly, I'm concerned with how it reads; is it wholly accessible and does it cover all important information an uninformed reader might need to know? Is it written well? Feel free to fix up little mistakes or (if possible) add new material with sources, but feedback would be most appreciated. WesleyDodds 08:04, 6 May 2006 (UTC)
Reminder...
When using template tags on talk pages, don't forget to substitute with text by adding subst: to the template tag. For example, use {{subst:test}} instead of {{test}}. This reduces server load and prevents accidental blanking of the template. — Ian Manka Talk to me‼ 22:54, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
Infobox Writer
Slow down on this - You have had only two responses on this template since you announced it on the Books WikiProject - both negative and you are rapidly propagating it's use - slow down and get some reaction and concensus first. :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 15:56, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
- As I noted at Talk:Harper Lee I don't see that the infobox has added any value to the article, and has detracted from the layout. --Dystopos 01:47, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Sub Pop
Hey, there. I've added a section the the Sub Pop page regarding their marketing (partiularly in the 80's early 90's) I was hoping to be able to explore that area further. Do you have anything you might be able to add? maxcap 19:45, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
Blind Melon
I saw you contributed to the Blind Melon article. Were they a Jam Band? TommyBoy76 18:58, 28 May 2006 (UTC)TommyBoy76
- Thanks. I was looking for a new song for my MySpace (Heh, I'm a teenager, gimme a break) and when I looked them up, it said Jam Band was their genre. Not exactly a reliable source, MySpace, but it sprung a question. Anyway, thanks again. See ya, in th next life. --tommyboy76
Chris Matthew Sciabarra
It's not entirely clear from his stub-like article, but Chris Matthew Sciabarra quite likely qualifies as a critic of Objectivism. He's sympathetic but not an Objectivist, and much of what he says is not welcome news to Objectivists. Check out some of the links and see for yourself. Al 19:59, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
User: RJII
Do you understand his userpage? I think that this user might be intentionally NPOV to Objectivism (Ayn Rand) as part of some sort of test or program. Crazynas 23:39, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
- You do realize that I consider myself an Obectivist, albiet a rational one that thinks NPOV is still a good idea. Crazynas 00:29, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
- The RJII Project began as a one year mission, however, due to a stronger than expected show of resistance due to entrenched bias and irrational integration of information, the Project was extended for a few months so that its goals for Misplaced Pages could be fully realized. Though resistance was significant, through the use of advanced... Sounds like a spam / NPOV campaign to me, especially with their accusations that LGagnon is taking part in personal attacks -- Xinit 15:50, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
Clear Channel
I have decided to stop editing the article as I feel I would not want an article I created under such a high degree of scrutiny to the point where I may feel defensive. I do ask however that you attempt to find a link of the document scanned, reproductions barely serve as evidence since they lack hints of proof such as letterheads or for the case of emails, addresses and identifying servers etc. I wish you the best in your wiki editing and not that it should be relevant, I wish I would have noticed you created the article sooner. I hope no hard feelings come of this. --zero faults 00:41, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Research Question
Where did you find the info that The Stand is a reworking of Night Surf?
Ayn Rand and Objectivists
Hey, what is your problem with Objectivists? I think you might have been soured by a few bad apples. Do you know any? Perhaps if you actually talked to some, you might change your mind. I run ObjectivismOnline.Net – the biggest Objectivist community on the net. Go to our forum http://forum.objectivismonline.net/ and check out some of the discussions. We have all kinds of people on board. Message me on AIM - GreedyCapitalist if you want to discuss your views.
I also run the Objectivist Wiki here: http://wiki.objectivismonline.net/ Cheers, --GreedyCapitalist 23:57, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
Ayn Rand POV links
What is the procedure for removing the POV links you put up? Why did you put them up in the first place?
Cult Category
Sounds about right for a non-religious cult based on the Cult entry and the Objectivist entry as well... You do realize that you're just adding fuel to the fire with that category addition though, right? --Xinit 20:43, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
Don't make personal attacks against other editors
Please do not make personal attacks on other people. Misplaced Pages has a policy against personal attacks. In some cases, users who engage in personal attacks may be blocked from editing by admins or banned by the arbitration committee. Comment on content, not on other contributors or people. Please resolve disputes appropriately. Thank you.
A couple examples of your many personal attacks: RJII 15:40, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
- Those don't look like personal attacks at all; perhaps the term "Randists" is what you're focusing on? Sounds like how I'd use the word "fan" when editing POV from a music group page. I don't really see much comparison to the NPA Examples... --Xinit 15:36, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
I'm new to Misplaced Pages, and I noticed the request for expert help/mediation on the Objectivism page. I have a PhD in philosophy, am not an Objectivist though I know quite a bit about it, and have no particular animus one way or another. I think I might be able to be of some assistance; the only shortcoming is a lack of experience with Misplaced Pages editing and policies, but I think I'm just the man for helping you all with your difficulties with the article. I'm not even sure if this is the right place for me to be posting this message, but if not, let me know what a better way of communicating would be. Because I am an untenured academic, any assistance offered as expert or mediator would have to be anonymous, at least as to my real name appearing in Misplaced Pages, and at least until my tenure case is concluded. --Agent Cooper 20:14, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
Wikistress
I'm sorry to hear that you're stressing out about things on Misplaced Pages. Take a second and sit back and relax, hopefully that will help things to calm down. -- Natalya 18:56, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Grunge timeline
Sweet! maxcap 19:46, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
removing my edits
excuse me! why do you keep removing my edits from the lists of computer and video games article? are you trying to hurt my feelings or somethin? Touth 19:26, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
A new section
hey LGagnon! i have added a new section to the Lists of computer and video games article! i want you to see want you think.Touth 19:40, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
LGagon WHY will you not accept that last edit that i just made? what is WRONG with you? i am TRYING to make the article miles better here! Touth 19:50, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
- Take a look at List of Wario games and then a look at Dizzy series and you should be able to see the problem. You're adding an article to a list of lists. If there were an article that was titled List of Lemmings games and consisted of nothing but a list of games in which Lemmings characters were used, with links to their individual title articles, then you could add it. You're adding full articles where they do not belong. --Xinit 19:56, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
- Point taken, copying to Touth's talk page. --Xinit 20:02, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
cult cohesion
- In religion and sociology, a cult is a cohesive group of people (often
"A cult is a cohesive group..."?? Objectivists are as far from cohesive as it gets! Michael Hardy 00:23, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
- ARI sticks together quite well. And all Randists I've known are cohesive. -- LGagnon 00:29, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
That shows you haven't known many, or much. So ARI sticks together: why not say therefore that ARI is a cult, rather than that Objectivists, including those who oppose ARI, are a cult? If ARI is cohesive, that's very remote from saying Objectivists are cohesive. Michael Hardy 00:32, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
- As I pointed out elsewhere, the cult allegations predate the ARI. Rand's own inner circle, The Collective -- was seen as cultish. Al 04:05, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
You wrote
- It follows the Word of Rand, and those who do are willing to work together despite differences
In view of the BLATANTLY obvious fact that they are NOT willing to work together despite differences---that some of them refuse to have anything to do with some of the others others, I have to conclude that you're pontificating on matters of which you are 100% ignorant. Michael Hardy 22:07, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
- Oddly enough, you appear to be saying things that are clearly false. You can see that these Randists are quite capable of putting aside their differences to work together so as to remove the cult categories from the Rand articles. Al 00:04, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
User notice: temporary 3RR block
Regarding reversions made on June 15 2006 (UTC) to Lists of video games and computer games
 |
You have been temporarily blocked for violation of the three-revert rule. Please feel free to return after the block expires, but also please make an effort to discuss your changes further in the future. |
- Re your mail: "vandalism" is difficult to define sometimes; for 3RR purposes, it must be blatant, which this wasn't William M. Connolley 16:08, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
- Um, why are you only talking by email? You do know you can edit this page, don't you? Anyway, read WP:3RR paying careful attention to the vandalism bit William M. Connolley 19:18, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
Not that Connolley wants to hear this, but the very fact that you had a good-faith belief that you were removing vandalism ought to be enough to leave you with a warning and explanation, not a block. Blocks are overused and punitive, which goes against WP:BLOCK. Al 19:43, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
List of Lemmings games
LGagnon, anyone can remove a {{prod}} tag. Even Touth. It should never be restored once removed. You can list the article on AfD if you feel the need. Powers 00:03, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
Your Apparent Sockpuppets
I have good evidence to believe that you have a number of sockpuppets used to back up your views on controversial pages. These include Alienus and, more recently, Courtland Nerval. The evidence include Alienus' (erased) response on YOUR talk page to accusations made against you, a strikingly coincidental agenda and edits on pages such as Ayn Rand and Objectivism, plus an obvious coincidence on the topics both usernames edit and their (your) respective POV, common language traits, etc. Considering I don't have that much free time, and am not willing, at this moment, to make a formal complaint, I'd just like you to know that someone is aware of this. In case I'm wrong, which is very unlikely given the bulk of evidence I could pretty much just point out, please dismiss this. Otherwise, I would recommend a change in your behavior lest you get in trouble with users who may be less lenient than I.Justice III 17:45, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
- You figured me out, I'm actually LGagnon, and in my spare time, RJII and LaszloWalrus. :-)
- Rather than wasting time denying an obviously false claim, I encourage you to file a Checkuser request so that you can have this all confirmed, but not to make any further accusations until and unless the admins support your theory.
- Thank you for understanding. Al 17:59, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Please by all means run a checkuser request on me. When the results come back that I am not a sockpuppet can I expect a formal apology on my talk page? I think that that would only be appropriate. --Courtland Nerval 18:31, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Imposter
You may be interested to know that User:L Gagnon has been blocked as an apparent imposter of you. Congratulations, if that is appropriate. :-) TheProject 22:33, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
- Do be careful with that statement though. NPOV is policy, so forcing you to follow it isn't necessarily such a bad thing. It just depends on various interpretations of NPOV, of course, as with all POV disputes. :-) Anyways, I don't really wish to get involved with a content dispute -- I just came to inform you about your imposter. TheProject 23:08, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
Aside from the fact that these Rand fans keep pushing their POV, which conflicts with NPOV, there's the little problem of using tools such as vandalism to intimidate those who want the article to be less hagiographic. Al 23:59, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
Hello
Please let me know directly if there are any additional sockpuppets. I'm keeping an eye on this one. Best, Mackensen (talk) 23:41, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
Touth
There was only one questionable action that I could find recently at all.Blnguyen | rant-line 02:21, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
Touth
LGagnon! you do know that i dont like what they put on that talk page. it just HURTS me! why wont you at least let me remove that little info? once its gone then i will be alright and my feelings might get a little better. Touth 01:39, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
just why wont you help me get better? you dont like me do you? Touth 02:01, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
Reply on Wikipedia_talk:Resolving_disputes#Dispute_resolution_does_nothing
Please see my reply on Wikipedia_talk:Resolving_disputes#Dispute_resolution_does_nothing. I look forward to your thoughts. JesseW, the juggling janitor 05:39, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
WP:PAIN notice
Hi, I have removed your entry on the WP:PAIN about User:70.231.225.228. The one edit you refer to is only a borderline instance of a personal attack and the user hasn't been warned. Please use the appropriate {{npa}} through {{npa4}} warning templates if you see instances of personal attacks. Of course if attacks continue after the final warning, please bring this back to the Personal Attacks noticeboard. Thanks, Gwernol 19:55, 11 July 2006 (UTC)