Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Epictrex (talk | contribs) at 04:55, 28 March 2021 (→Can I get in any form of trouble if I keep on redoing undone edits?: new section). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

• WP:TEA
• WP:TH

AlanM1, a Teahouse host

• To read the newest questions, skip to bottom
• About the Teahouse

Most recent archives
1225, 1226, 1227, 1228, 1229, 1230, 1231, 1232, 1233, 1234, 1235, 1236, 1237, 1238, 1239, 1240, 1241, 1242, 1243, 1244

Mobile Editing

I've noticed that when I'm editing on my phone that it's impossible to use the visual editor for categories when the title of the article is too long. The button to publish comes after the title and instead of wrapping around once it reaches the end of my phone screen it just goes right off the end and it's impossible to tap. I was wondering where I should mention this for someone to look into fixing. I know I can just type the category, but I thought I'd mention it anyway. TipsyElephant (talk) 16:27, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, TipsyElephant. You may want to consider using the fully functional desktop site, which works perfectly well on mobile devices, and does not suffer from the numerous bugs that affect the mobile site and the visual editor. Cullen Let's discuss it 16:38, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

@Cullen328: How do I change to the desktop version? TipsyElephant (talk) 16:27, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

TipsyElephant, while in mobile mode, scroll to the very bottom of the page. You will see a link to click to enter desktop mode. Cullen Let's discuss it 16:47, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

TipsyElephant Hi , welcome to Teahouse. It's simple to do that. After typing category just hold your phone horizontal on landscape . You will see button. Research Voltas (talk) 18:10, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

@Research Voltas: Turning my phone sideways does absolutely nothing (it just stays vertical), and even if it did I'm guessing that really long title would still go off the screen because whoever programmed it didn't account for long titles. I was originally wondering if there is someone who deals with the backend who would be able to fix the problem that I should get into contact with. TipsyElephant (talk) 16:24, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

I rethreaded the conversation above, hope that's okay. Pelagic ( messages ) – (06:33 Sat 20, AEDT) 19:33, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

TipsyElephant, when I go into mobile VE, I just have the toolbar buttons with Publish Changes across the top, no page title. Are you talking about the "Add pagename to new categories" screen? We could file a ticket on Phab:. User:Whatamidoing (WMF) might be able to advise who looks after the mobile categories feature, though she’s fairly busy with the talk pages project at the moment. Pelagic ( messages ) – (06:33 Sat 20, AEDT) 19:33, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the ping, Pelagic. The mw:Mobile visual editor belongs to the Editing team, and I'd be happy to file a Phab ticket (unless someone else gets there first).

@TipsyElephant, can you give me a link to the article where you encountered it, an example of a category that's too long, and some idea of what your phone/screen size is? They'll want to be able to see the problem for themselves, so that they can figure out whether their solution actually solves the problem. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:19, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

@Whatamidoing (WMF): so the problem isn't that any category is too long. The problem is that when a title of an article is too long it pushes the publish button off the right side of the screen. For instance, really long article names like The Carl Donnelly and Chris Martin Comedy Podcast make it impossible to add a category. I've found that article titles that are about 25 characters long render the button useless. I can just barely add categories to The Dead Authors Podcast, but I'm unable to add categories to The Anthropocene Reviewed. I'm currently using Android on a Moto G7 Power and as I've previously mentioned turning my phone sideways does not change the view, but even if it did I'm guessing the text still doesn't wrap around for really long titles. It's also worth mentioning that even medium length titles result in the publish button being only partially visible. For instance, titles around 17 or 19 characters cause the right side of the button to be pushed off the end of the screen. When adding a category to The Daily (podcast) the letter "h" at the end of publish is not visible. TipsyElephant (talk) 02:06, 21 March 2021 (UTC)

@TipsyElephant, I think I'm missing something. What device are you using? Which site (mobile view vs desktop view) are you using?

Your original comment says that you're concerned about the mw:mobile visual editor, but I can't see any edits labeled "Mobile edit Mobile web edit Visual edit" in your contributions. This edit seems to have been done in the mobile wikitext editor.

Also, I don't think that the mobile visual editor lets you edit categories at all. It has a character formatting menu (A) and a Link button and a Cite button in the main toolbar, but no button for categories. I wonder if you would be willing to describe for me, step by step, exactly what you're seeing and clicking on at each step. That would help me figure out what's going on, so I can get this bug report filed (because it is definitely a problem). Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:48, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

@Whatamidoing (WMF): I select the mobile view. I do not hit the edit button at all so I guess it's not the mobile view or the source view, but I wasn't sure what else to call it and it's definitely not source view. There's a categories button at the bottom of the article. If I select that button it shows me categories ("content based" or "organizational") that the article is already in and then I tap on the "add to category" button in the top right of the screen. I then "search categories" and select the category I want, but to finalize the category I need to press a button that says publish in the top right, however, this specific page always says "Add <article name> to new categories". So when the article name is really long it pushes the publish button located to the right of "Add <article name> to new categories" off the side of the page. TipsyElephant (talk) 01:05, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

Huh, I've never seen that tool before. I can reproduce the problem you're encountering. Let me go track down which team's working on that and get a bug report filed for you. Thank you for giving me the step-by-step description, @TipsyElephant. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 16:37, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

I also realised that using a phone can make editing difficult and frustrating therefore it is better to use a laptop or computer Lengeloi (talk) 19:35, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Been Hacked

216.8.236.112 (talk) 13:24, 22 March 2021 (UTC) {{subst:Been Hacked. I have little to no computer knowledge trying to learn as I go. Your site is awesome,John thanks for the heads up! I plan to learn more as I go.. However right now I have someone that is disrupting my digital life. Every aspect cell phone, computers the whole thing is a pain. I don't have any use for much and I am a simple person. About to retire and drop off the grid, Life is short now all I want to do is enjoy what time I have left... In the good old days, a really good shot to the nose cured a lot of problems. But today our world is too violent to attempt lessons like that.. Any help would be greatly accepted.

Thank you all so much.

}} 216.8.236.112 (talk) 13:24, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

You probably haven't been hacked. Try resetting your device(s) and see if that fixes the issue. Thanks, EDG 543 13:48, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi. This page is actually about questions specifically related to Misplaced Pages matters, and those who contribute here are not necessarily computer experts at all. We do have a forum, however, where general questions may be asked, that is specific to computer issues: the computing section of Misplaced Pages's reference desk <--that's a link>

So, if you restart your devices, and are still having the same problem, I suggest you post at that forum. However, your post gives no details that anyone who might have a solution to suggest could work from. If and when you post there, I suggest explaining in as much detail as you can exactly what is happening; the text of any error messages; that X happens when you do Y; what devices are affected; what operating systems you are using; which browser—anything that might be relevant given the actual nature of the problem.

To put it in more familiar terms, by analogy, your current post is akin to someone at a legal advice forum posting "I have a terrible legal problem that affecting everything in my life, please help me with it", and ending there, with no account of what the legal issue actually is. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 14:15, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

@EDG 543 and Fuhghettaboutit: for future reference, I presume this person was just confused about why they had received a notification about having vandalised Misplaced Pages (hence the reference to "John", as John of Reading left the warning). All that's needed to answer this question is to point them to the information at the bottom of the warning template: If this is a shared IP address, and you did not make the edits referred to above, consider creating an account for yourself or logging in with an existing account so that you can avoid further irrelevant notices. There may be additional context to the message but not Misplaced Pages-related. — Bilorv (talk) 19:44, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

@Bilorv: Except that that your presumption does not comport at all with the person's message.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 04:13, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Fuhghettaboutit: (didn't get the ping due to a misspelling) What do you mean? I've seen similar questions before at the Teahouse and that was the question intended. — Bilorv (talk) 07:45, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Bilorv: Hey. I mean that the person specifically said they are having problems with multiple devices (that seem related to one hack). First they saoid that what was being "disrupt" was their "digital life", and then they mention, apparently as examples among others: "Every aspect cell phone, computers..." So, it's possible they misunderstood the vandalism warning as one more part of the supposed "hack", but it doesn't sound like if that was the spark for their post, it could possibly be "All that's needed to answer this question". Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 12:32, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Making talk pages healthier, especially for newcomers

Is there a way to make talk pages healthier here, especially for newcomers? Some of the talk pages are so off-putting because of the way editors talk to others. Newcomers get the worst of it, from what I've observed. Or is the disrespect an expected part of the environment? I've read the talk page guidelines and the civility policy, but neither seem to have much of an impact on the unpleasantness occurring at some talk pages. New Sheriff in Town (talk) 22:09, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Howdy, New Sheriff in Town and welcome to the Teahouse. Personally, I think simply trying to set a good example in one's own communications is the best way to slowly lift standards of civility, and never to get riled up, nor tell the other editor that "Misplaced Pages ain't big enough for the both of us". Of course, it's hard to include nuance and subtlety in talk page posts via a keyboard, and many active editors find themselves inevitably having to leave short, sharp messages for editors when they make a mistake that needs correcting, before moving on to the next problem, and the next, and so forth. Here at the Teahouse we try to offer a friendly face when we answer questions, and I don't see that you've personally encountered any problems yourself. But I can see you are interested in subjects which can attract strong opinions, so perhaps you've seen some blunt speaking on those pages. Either way, welcome again to Misplaced Pages and enjoy your own Misplaced Pages Adventure. Nick Moyes (talk) 22:34, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello and thank you, Nick Moyes. I have been appalled by some of what I have seen. I plan to mostly stick to biology pages. After what I've seen at the more controversial pages, I'll try to leave those alone as much as possible. Even many pages people would conclude aren't going to be controversial turn out to be a hotbed of discord. I knew that female biology topics could be political, but the discord on the talk page can still blow me away. New Sheriff in Town (talk) 23:08, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Yes, New Sheriff in Town, people do get hot under the collar for all sorts of reasons but, being a collaborative project, it's important to be able to debate different perspectives without insulting the other person and thus to reach a consensus. Sadly, many editors seem to forget that, and descend to attacking the other person, not the statements they want to add or remove. Sometimes, it's the old hands (who ought to know better) who go straight for the jugular. Even today I found this happening in a minor way on my own talk page, hence this comment. Nick Moyes (talk) 23:22, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, I've seen senior editors being the worst offenders. Thank you for taking the time to talk to me about this. I'll do my best to not get hot under the collar. New Sheriff in Town (talk) 23:27, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi New Sheriff in Town. I'm a little late to the thread, but I notice that the article you're referring to is a Featured Article that is being actively edited by a team of senior editors. That might not be the best place for a newer editor to start. From my own experiences, sometimes I'll make a one word change to a featured article and it'll get reverted. The senior editors that work on those articles craft every word carefully, to conform not only to our complex Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines, but also to the written and unwritten norms of the Featured Article process. I consider editing Featured Articles to be an advanced skill, and you might have a better experience editing in a less stringent area. Hope that helps. –Novem Linguae (talk) 11:06, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Novem Linguae. It's a featured article, but some felt it wasn't the quality article it once was. So it's been undergoing what you guys call a review. Featured article or no, I feel confident in saying it's no excuse for how multiple editors there have been treated. From their own mouths with takes like this one (which was toned down afterward) and what is said in the thread as a whole, it hasn't been a pleasant environment. That's why those like me who are knowledgeable in the subject area are discouraged from taking part in discussions there. So are non-experts, even though an essay from you guys says Misplaced Pages doesn't give experts special treatment, and I don't see any experts in the subject area there. A newcomer can help out with advice or opinions on the discussion page. The newcomer doesn't need to edit the page outside of that. Still, if what the newcomer has to say will be dismissed or seen as lesser than because they're new, it's really discouraging. I didn't want to point to that thread because it's not the only page I've seen which colors the Misplaced Pages environment as rife with discord, but also because I'm not interested in hearing from those who have been rude there. So please don't call them here. I said my piece there. I said others and I observed that discussion page and other discussion pages to get a sense of how editors here collaborate. It's not one of the pages I was very interested in editing, but I know a couple of people who were considering contributing there and turned away when they saw the arguments there. Thank you for your opinions, but I don't want to linger on this. In addition to the crash course I've been given by others about Misplaced Pages, I've been reading up on Misplaced Pages's ways when time allows, and I will push forward with heavier editing once I feel more confident about doing that. For heavier editing, I will be starting with the circulatory system article and have said on the discussion page there that I will be expanding two sections. New Sheriff in Town (talk) 05:57, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

New Sheriff in Town, roger that. Thanks for the response. I hope your editing goes very smoothly and that you have a good experience. –Novem Linguae (talk) 06:02, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

New Sheriff in Town thanks, interesting conversation! I'd like to add to the title of this section "making talk pages healthier, especially for newcomers and for women". Aggressive writing on talk pages is one of the factors that has contributed to Gender bias on Misplaced Pages (check out the recent discussion on the talk page there; the most controversial thread has already been archived for now). I don't know if there is something wrong about the way I write on talk pages or how I edit (or are people getting tenser because of Covid lockdowns?) but just recently I've copped quite a big of flack, mostly from experienced, long-term, male (?) editors (who sometimes refer to everyone else as "he" instead of "she" or "they"). I assume there are probably PhD theses out there somewhere that have analysed how people use talk pages, who gets aggressive when and why. I very much like the policy of WP:NOBITE. - Anyway, thanks to the friendly helpers at the Teahouse and let's keep supporting each other! EMsmile (talk) 08:29, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

No. That kind of gender stereotyping is not helpful. Editors are editors. Male editors are editors. Female editors are editors. Genderqueer editors are editors. In each of these gender groups, and all others, the difference between individuals is going to be a lot more important than any similarities – especially since within each group, there will not be one single similarity that is not also shared with all other groups. In other words, a talk page discussion that is "healthier for women" is either going to be better for all editors, or better for some women and worse for others, and the mere wording is going to alienate a substantial number of female editors. --bonadea contributions talk 09:33, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Bonadea. Even though I requested that editors from that page not be called here, you made this post. Why? I didn't want this thread to become a part two of that one. For reasons I've said there and in this thread, I didn't reply there. I replied here (and only because Novem Linguae replied to me and I felt okay about expressing my feelings on that reply here). Now I feel unsafe in this thread. I posted to the Teahouse for uninvolved opinions from friendly editors. I don't want this thread to be a mouthpiece for why editors might behave in very subpar ways toward others when the page is a featured article or serve as an extension to say why an editor there may have been treated the way they were treated there. That will only lead to that editor arguing with the one saying that about them. I have gotten plenty of advice and insight already (thanks to friendly editors above and email), and this thread wasn't meant to be about just one discussion page. This isn't a knock on you, EMsmile. Your comment before this post is appreciated, and I can see from the article and talk page you pointed to that many agree with you about Misplaced Pages suffering from a male-female gender gap and partly due to bias. Still, count me out for saying anything more in this thread. New Sheriff in Town (talk) 09:45, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

When a discussion on one very high-profile and visible talk page links to a different talk page and criticises specific editors, it is a matter of basic courtesy to also create a link in the other direction. In some cases such a link is required – that is not the case at the Teahouse, but there is no reason not to connect the discussions, especially since the article talk page shouldn't be used to discuss editing behaviour anyway. --bonadea contributions talk 10:32, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the note, bonadea; I think a careful review of the entire talk page by anyone concerned will be revealing. Meanwhile, WP:FOC is a key aspect of Misplaced Pages editing that can be pointed out. Regards, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:29, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi bonadea, in theory you might be right ("Editors are editors"). In practice, research has shown that - in general - women might be more averse to "aggressive discussion styles" than men. See e.g. here. I copy some bits from there: "Former Wikimedia Foundation executive director Sue Gardner cited nine reasons why women don't edit Misplaced Pages: Aversion to conflict and an unwillingness to participate in lengthy edit wars; Some find its overall atmosphere misogynistic; Misplaced Pages culture is sexual in ways they find off-putting; Being addressed as male is off-putting to women whose primary language has grammatical gender; Fewer opportunities for social relationships and a welcoming tone compared to other sites." That's what I was referring to. Of course many males find that kind of stuff also off-putting, whereas some female editors don't mind and are perhaps even more aggressive than the average male editor. But overall, the research has shown those kinds of trends. It's normal, that a working environment where 80% of editors are male, there would be a certain tendency towards certain communication styles that are more prevalent amongst men. (sorry - probably the teahouse is not the right place for this kind of discussion (?); if so, I'll be quiet now. :-) ) EMsmile (talk) 15:11, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

All very interesting, but presumes to know whether the most offensive posts on that page are from men or women, so while an interesting discussion, not very relevant to that particular article talk page. At THAT article, we have a male engaging to help address a topic related to females (as one of the few Wikipedians competent to do just that), and it is not hard to see how he was treated (see WP:BLUDGEON); I leave it to you to guess which posters are male and which are female. And to speculate on whether anyone would ever want to put themselves through that again. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:26, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

EMsmile, no, I am not talking about theoretical constructs, but basing what I say on current research on empirical sociolinguistics (and not on a Misplaced Pages article). women might be more averse to "aggressive discussion styles" than men is true, but it is equally true that men might be more averse to "aggressive discussion styles" than women, depending on the context. There is a very slight correlation between gender and discussion style, which varies depending on the context, but the variation within gender groups (not only men and women but all other genders) is so much greater that we can say with complete confidence that there is no causation. And as Sandy Georgia points out, we don't know the biological sex or social gender of other editors in the vast majority of cases anyway. What is offensive is people such as the person quoted above presuming to be a spokesperson on what is "off-putting to women", or making it sound like women are incapable of intellectual pursuits – poor little flowers, they wilt without social interaction and we must protect them. How can she talk about aversion to conflict as if that is not significantly much more dependent on culture than on gender? Did she just shoot her mouth off without first consulting any research at all? Kind of sad, for a representative of an encyclopedia, and very sad indeed that her blog is used as a source in the article. --bonadea contributions talk 15:57, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Bonadea, the Teahouse is supposed to be "A friendly place where you can ask questions to get help with using and editing Misplaced Pages." New Sheriff in Town said, "I didn't want to point to that thread because it's not the only page I've seen which colors the Misplaced Pages environment as rife with discord, but also because I'm not interested in hearing from those who have been rude there. So please don't call them here. I said my piece there." But you pointed the editors New Sheriff in Town has some unease about interacting with to this thread. And by doing so, you brought the same tension from there to here, which is unhelpful. That's not beneficial to New Sheriff in Town. One of the editors (above me) has even made this about the feelings of the editor others have felt uncomfortable talking to (with an inaccurate claim of WP:BLUDGEONING for good measure). Experienced users in this thread looked at New Sheriff in Town's edits and easily connected the two threads. So it's very likely that those at that page who read New Sheriff in Town's post looked at New Sheriff in Town's contribution history and would have seen this Teahouse section. What your post there did, though, was invite them here. Now this thread has become a gender debate. Unless we assume that most people on Misplaced Pages take on a male identity for appearances' sake, there's really no reason to doubt that most of Misplaced Pages is male and the reasons given for this when the data on it has been strong and stable. The data has also been strong and stable supporting the sobering point that the Internet is overwhelmingly male and the reasons for this. So it's not just a Misplaced Pages thing. Sue hasn't said anything the women themselves haven't said. If we're going to talk about Sue Gardner, I say we point her to this discussion (through my notification and maybe through email). Sue, here's more material for your research. Count me out of commenting more in this thread too. ApproximateLand (talk) 22:35, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

I agree with your points, ApproximateLand. The tone in this thread has changed which is a pity. It's gone back to that conversation at menstrual cycle which is unnecessary as this is a broader issue, not restricted to a particular article or particular editors. Regarding genders, I don't make assumptions who is who, it usually comes out quite naturally during the conversations (and if it doesn't I don't assume anything). I give you here an example that I experienced on the India talk page (see here) (I gave the same example on the talk page of Gender bias on Misplaced Pages, now archived): An experienced long term male editor (User:Fowler&fowler) addressed another editor several times as "he" even though the other editor pointed out several times that she is not a he. She said: "If you don't know somebody's gender, why not use the singular they?". He replied: "You could have simply said you are female. It is important to acknowledge that in an enterprise that is pretty much all male." My reply was: "I find that very offensive. You are implying that the onus is on us (yes, I am also female) to state that we are female in order to avoid being called "he/his" because you say it's an all male environment. ." - This kind of stuff still happens far too often. And I agree that cultural differences are also important. It could well be that many people from Asian or African cultures don't enjoy the aggressive, argumentative style that people from Europe and North America are used to, and therefore rather stay away. So maybe the title of this thread could be "Making talk pages healthier, especially for newcomers and for people who prefer peace and calm". EMsmile (talk) 01:51, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

P.S. bonadea If you have time/energy please go ahead and improve the Misplaced Pages article on Gender bias on Misplaced Pages if you have more reliable sources than what is used there at present. I have no doubt that the article could be improved further to make it more accurate and comprehensive. EMsmile (talk) 01:54, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

I have absolutely zero insight into issues of gender bias at Misplaced Pages. If I gave the impression that I think I have any knowledge about that, I apologise. I have never carried out any research on the subject, nor am I qualified to do so, and I have no idea of whether there is in fact valid research in the area. But thank you for informing me of the fact that I am allowed to edit the article. As for misgendering others, that is indeed very rude regardless of who does it, but that is something that needs to be brought up with the individual who does it. That there are people who refuse to acknowledge the fact that English can use singular "they" only shows that those people don't know how language works – but again, that's an issue with those individuals. And @ApproximateLand: that was an excellent example of mansplaining, regardless of what your gender is. (I am not asking. It is none of my business.) I believe I explained my rationale for linking the discussion. Sue hasn't said anything the women themselves haven't said. There is no group of prototypical women who are able to say What Women Think. Sure, reporting on the results of a survey is all well and good, but we cannot extrapolate from that kind of survey to a very large population and pretend to know anything about that population, that is very poor research practice. It would be even worse if we started to generalise from the population to individuals belonging to the population – that's how systemic repression begins. It would also be very poor research practice to look at one discussion between four or five anonymous people, who probably but not certainly have different gender identities and cultural backgrounds, and cite it as representative for the discursive practices of an entire speech community. (If you want to investigate discourse practices you need randomly sampled data, absolutely not cherry-picked discussions.) --bonadea contributions talk 23:29, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Help! English-speaking reviewer who can read sources in French needed :)

I have submitted early december an article Draft:International_Association_of_Department_Stores which has been reviewed by SK2242. I have made changes, however he advised me to come and look here for someone who could review it top priority. I have submitted the draft 2nd of December, and I reviewed following his refusal on the following day. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you! --Perchsquirell (talk) 16:24, 23 March 2021 (UTC) Perchsquirell (talk) 16:24, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

@Perchsquirell: I can see why it was declined. It could also be declined again unless it is restructured and tightened up. I recommend you reorganize it into these sections: History, Operations, Membership. I've deleted the long list of managers and external links - that's too much, per WP:NOTDIR. Refs go after punctuation. Avoid unsourced promotional-leaning sentences such as "Of the many scientific management research groups set up in the 1920s, the IADS is practically the only body that has a record of continuing membership and activity since then." Also, please read WP:COI if you have a connection with the organization. TimTempleton 01:08, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

@Timtempleton: Got it, thank you. I have followed your advice and restructured / shortened quite a bit the article. I am not directly or indirectly compensated for this article, let me know if there is a procedure to show so. Regarding the list, I removed it - your edit was not published yesterday and I got confused between the long list of managers (that was shortened yesterday) and the long list of presidents (that were just removed). let me know. Above all, thank you for your time. --Perchsquirell (talk) 12:37, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

how do I create a profile on wikipedia?

I need to create profile on wikipedia for my boss who is a celebrity trainer, what is the process for this and who can help assist? Indiadiamond (talk) 15:39, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Indiadiamond Hello and welcome to the Teahouse Your use of the word "profile" suggests that you have a common misconception about what Misplaced Pages is. Misplaced Pages does not have "profiles", not a single one. Misplaced Pages has articles. Those articles summarize what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen on their own to say about a person, showing how they meet Misplaced Pages's special definition of a notable person. Misplaced Pages has no interest in what someone wants to say about themselves, only in what others completely unconnected with them choose to say. Misplaced Pages is not like social media where people tell about themselves, either directly or through a representative. If you just want to tell the world about your boss, you should use social media.

Please understand that a Misplaced Pages article is not necessarily desirable. There are good reasons to not want one. You should review conflict of interest and paid editing. If your boss truly meets Misplaced Pages's special definition of a notable person, someone will eventually take note of them and choose to write about them. 331dot (talk) 15:49, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

First of all, there are no "profiles" on Misplaced Pages unless you mean user pages. I'm curious why you need to create a page for your boss. You most likely should not do this, as paid editing is generally discouraged, and your boss may not be notable. βӪᑸᙥӴ • Talk • Contribs 15:49, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

how to do I create a wiki page?

I need assistance to create a wiki page this website is impossible to understand! Indiadiamond (talk) 15:51, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Indiadiamond We have answered you above. Creating a new Misplaced Pages article is the absolute hardest task to perform here. It's even harder with a conflict of interest. Please review either the information here, or on your user talk page, User talk:Indiadiamond. You have some formal disclosures you must make. 331dot (talk) 15:57, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

User:Indiadiamond - The problem is that your employer, in good faith, has asked you, in good faith, to do something that isn't consistent with what Misplaced Pages is. This is comparable to the situation if your employer asked you to go to a library and bring back books that were disposed of by the library, but the library wasn't giving books away. Everyone is acting in good faith, but there is a fundamental misunderstanding as to what is possible. You can't create a Misplaced Pages page for your employer just because your employer has asked you to do that. It isn't your fault. It isn't their fault. It isn't our fault. It just isn't. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:00, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

We, the hosts and experienced editors at the Teahouse, need an essay for the new editor who has been asked by their employer to create a Misplaced Pages page about them. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:02, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

:Honestly in my opinion this user's actions constitute disruptive editing or maybe even vandalism. I am reporting them right now to WP:ANI βӪᑸᙥӴ • Talk • Contribs 16:02, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

I'm glad this comment was struck through - in no way does a confused user asking a question twice constitute bad faith editing. Nick Moyes (talk) 21:33, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Thank you It was a computer error asking twice. I think that answer is a little harsh I'm just trying to find out how to write an article or some assistance. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Indiadiamond (talk • contribs) 10:27, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Indiadiamond And we have told you that doing so is not advisable, as it seems that you and your boss do not understand what Misplaced Pages is about. Please review the comments here, and feel free to show your boss these messages. If you just want to tell the world about your boss, you should use social media or other alternative forums with less stringent requirements where what you want to do is permitted. Writing an article is difficult under ideal circumstances- it's even harder with a conflict of interest. Misplaced Pages is not interested in what your boss wants to say about themselves, only in what others say about them. If you have reviewed the notability guidelines for people and truly feel that your boss meets the definition, and you have significant coverage in independent reliable sources to support it(not interviews, his own website/social media, brief mentions, routine announcements, etc.) you may use Articles for Creation to create and submit a draft article. You would need to forget everything you know about your boss and everything he tells you about himself, and only write based on what others say about him. Most people in your position have great difficulty doing that, and are unsuccessful with their efforts. I advise against you attempting to do this, but if you must, you should review Your First Article and use the new user tutorial first. 331dot (talk) 10:35, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Ok thank you for your advice — Preceding unsigned comment added by Indiadiamond (talk • contribs) 10:49, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

What is the best article on Misplaced Pages?

I just want to know what the best article is. It would more than likely be in FA-class. xdude (talk) 18:45, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Based on what criteria? RudolfRed (talk) 19:04, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

It's the article I most recently wrote, of course (which makes it Hell Is a Very Small Place at time of writing, and what an interesting topic it is!). — Bilorv (talk) 19:46, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Best. You may find Misplaced Pages:Top 25 Report interesting. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 20:14, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Can I also recommend Misplaced Pages:Unusual articles? Elli (talk | contribs) 08:34, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Toilet paper orientation. -- Hoary (talk) 23:22, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Good choice. And don't miss This article has been mentioned by multiple media organizations: at the talkpage. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:13, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

LTA 1105

Hi, I'm wondering who is LTA 1105? Firestar464 (talk) 01:41, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

"LTA" implies to me that it's a long-term abuser identifier, but I don't know what identifiers we use (in fact per WP:DENY we try to avoid speaking of LTAs when we can). Where did you see this? — Bilorv (talk) 01:44, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Bilorv In an edit filter. Firestar464 (talk) 04:10, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

1105 is yust a reference to the filter ID used internally by the software. In this case it would be Special:AbuseFilter/1105, which may or may not refer to a single LTA, though I am pretty sure no admin will tell you how it works exactly. Victor Schmidt (talk) 06:29, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Firestar464, I'm afraid you won't get an answer because the EF guideline generally prohibits sharing details of private filters. LTA filters are named the way they are to deny recognition and because more descriptive names would make reverse engineering (and thus circumvention) easier. For what it's worth, almost all filters have false positives, so someone may well trigger them without being (one of) the individual(s) targeted by any given filter (or a bad-faith or disruptive user at all). Blablubbs|talk 10:22, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

I would like to change my screen display to black background and white characters

As the title says. thanks!--SilverMatsu (talk) 01:48, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi SilverMatsu. I have heard good things about the Vector-DarkCSS skin (though I've never used it myself). In order to apply it, you can copy the contents of this page into your vector.css page. Another option is to go to Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets and check the option for "Use a black background with green text". Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 04:30, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Fuhghettaboutit:Thank you very much! I tried both. I thought it would be very convenient to use a cudget because it can be turned on and off. It's not dazzling, so it's good on the eyes.--SilverMatsu (talk) 10:19, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@SilverMatsu: Great. Glad to help. By the way, what's a "cudget"? (I did a quick Google search and I only found pages asking if I was misspelling cudgel.)--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:20, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Fuhghettaboutit: oh… This is a gadget typo (miss touch).--SilverMatsu (talk) 14:10, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Wee Willie Keeler

Wee Willie Keeler

Referencing what an Americanized name is? Anglecized is a known thing. "Americanized" on the other hand is not something I'm familiar with. Are we to have "Frenchacized" names? "Italianized"? "Zamibianacized"?? Shouldn't "he changed his name to Keeler" suffice? My mother thought he was a Keeler all her life. When in fact he was of no relation to the Keelers. 69.207.44.132 (talk) 04:09, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse! See wikt:Americanize. If you have any suggestions on how to improve the Willie Keeler article, you can make them on the article's talk page: Talk:Willie Keeler. Or just be bold and make them yourself! Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 05:26, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

And see Americanize at Merriam-Webster. I'm intrigued by your "Zambianacized": Simultaneously Zambianized and Namibianized, with an additional syllable tossed in just for fun? -- Hoary (talk) 06:51, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

How do I obtain a picture of a person for wikipedia without infringing on copyrights????????

How do I update this photo with out copywrite issues? I don't get this at all. dO i DO A GOOGLE SEARCH AND PICK ANY PICTUIRE? sOMEONE PLEASE LET ME KNOW. Beamer.Backdrop (talk) 04:59, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Beamer.Backdrop: You can take a picture yourself and donate it. You could also ask someone to donate their own photo - see Misplaced Pages:Donating copyrighted materials. GoingBatty (talk) 05:29, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Beamer.Backdrop Please, no multiple "?", no ALL CAPS: people here are trying to help. No, you definitely cannot pick any picture. GoingBatty's recommendation is good. Please do not frantically read the opening paragraph and the first section; it's a page that you have to read and digest in its entirety. (For example, there's no point following the advice under "Granting us permission to copy material already online" if the material isn't yours: You have to understand the section "You cannot donate what someone else owns" as well.) Getting a photo of your biographee into your now-draft, later-article is going to be difficult (though not impossible). Unless you can photograph him, somebody else is going to have to negotiate Wikimedia Commons's formalities. I imagine that they'd be more willing (less unwilling) to do that once they know that there is an article. I urge you to put all your effort into improving the text of the draft and getting it approved; once that's done, you can work on adding one or more photos to it. -- Hoary (talk) 06:46, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Okay thank you for your help. How can I prove I had someone donate a picture? Like I follow him on social media. If I reach out to his social media (and gosh, if he answers me) and if he sent me something, how do I prove this? Or maybe I can pull a photo from a concert?? Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by Beamer.Backdrop (talk • contribs) 17:26, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@Beamer.Backdrop: see the second half of the first bullet point I wrote at User talk:Beamer.Backdrop#Teahouse replies. I suggested that this process is not worth your time because, as you touch upon, the steps are difficult and have no guarantee of succeeding. For instance, were he to reply on social media saying "you could use this image", that would not even come close to acceptable under copyright law. He would need to get in contact with the photographer so that they could fill out this form (in the simplest case). I just do not think this is the right avenue to explore. Biographies on Misplaced Pages don't have to have images, and many don't. — Bilorv (talk) 19:46, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

how do i challenge a statement, find editor of statement?

i noticed references are used for dob, educational qualifications, etc.. excellent. out of curiousity how do i politely point out missing reference for dob, etc.. i have noticed there are several edits for popular articles. how do i find editor of a particular statement or sentence? btw, its cool to know for providing important parts about editing, tasks, etc. of wp on landing page. Givian (talk) 04:59, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Givian. It would be useful to know which article you are talking about, but in general, you should raise this type of issue on the talk page of the article. If you want wider input, use the Edit request process. If you are sure that you are correct based on what reliable sources report, then boldly make the edit yourself, being prepared to explain your edit. Cullen Let's discuss it 05:07, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Givian: Welcome to the Teahouse! I like using WikiBlame to find who added a particular statement or sentence. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 05:31, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

If it's simply an unreferenced date of birth, you can remove it without further discussion per WP:DOB.--Shantavira| 07:57, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Givian: You always have the option of just tagging it with {{citation needed | reason=clarify the specific info that needs a citation | date=December 2024}}. Also, I want to endorse the use of Wikiblame, though it is kind of slow and not obvious how to use. Also note that it doesn't match on the wikitext, i.e. it matches on visible text. But it can be very insightful, it really shows how a sequence of edits can make WP seem like a game of telephone. Fabrickator (talk) 09:23, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Rollback permission

Hello, after 3 months of counter vandalism i'm aiming to request Rollback permission, put they're saying Applicants with fewer than 200 mainspace edits are unlikely to be granted this right. So how could i know if i edited in more than 200 mainspaces ? Also they're saying the ccount should be old, how old should my account be to be granted Rollback permission ? Whatsupkarren (talk) 08:27, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Whatsupkarren I think you misunderstand. That means that you should have 200 edits to articles - articles are in "mainspace" (so for example, edits to talkpages or userpages would not count). this is a decent edit counter - you have 600 edits to articles, which is more than sufficient. Elli (talk | contribs) 08:39, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Draft Delete

How to delete a draft which is not edited for more than 6 months? Lemme know the templete to put there? Ghxhb (talk) 09:00, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Ghxhb: the template you are looking for is {{Db-g13}}. Elli (talk | contribs) 09:09, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Child Model

Hello, let me know what are the important things to know before writing an article about a child Model who did more than 50+ international advertisements? Ghxhb (talk) 09:03, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@Ghxhb: make sure you read Misplaced Pages:Biographies of living persons as well as Misplaced Pages:Minors and persons judged incompetent for information on writing about them - living people and especially children require special care given the potential legal and reputational consequences. I'd also recommend reading WP:NMODEL to make sure they qualify for an article. If you can find significant independent biographical coverage of them from reliable sources, they likely do. Elli (talk | contribs) 09:08, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

I'm not quite sure what an "international advertisement" is; but whatever it might be, even verifiably having appeared in two hundred of them does not bring notability in Misplaced Pages's sense. See WP:PERSON. And if this is about Draft:Izin Hash, note that Indian news websites (even those with serious-sounding names) are notorious for their paid-for profiles of celebs. -- Hoary (talk) 09:32, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Good suggestion to correct a article

Hi , Sureshdada Jain article's heading is wrong. The person about whom this article is written is a politician. In Maharashtra the followers and sidekicks of these politicians call them as Dada (means Big Brother in Marathi) And sometimes newspaper's also repeat this Honouring suffix. It is like a title. I know WP don't allow to write titles as Heading of article. I think his official name is Suresh Jain or Sureshkumar Jain but it ain't Sureshdada Jain. I suggest it to change to just Suresh Jain. I suspect a admin , extended editor from India who now say by his user page to live in US altered this title. Possible he know this person personal. But tweak this title. 106.195.7.163 (talk) 12:17, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse! I see that CommanderWaterford moved Sureshdada Jain to Sureshkumar Jain. For other comments or suggestions about this article, you can post on the article's talk page: Talk:Sureshkumar Jain. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 13:01, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Because I worked at great length on the housing scam article, I looked at numerous newspaper articles talking about this individual. Given how they refer to him, the common name appears to be Suresh Jain. I have completed the move.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:10, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

final check before submitting

hi and good evening I've been working on an article for a couple of weeks and I would like some help and advice to improve my article so it won't be rejected . I've read the manual script and I think all of the documents are cited and has links and references . In my previous article I used the words such as great and ..... numorous ... and now I've edited it . my I know is there anything that I should edit ? thanks for giving me your time best regards Neda Sajedi Neda.sajedi (talk) 13:57, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Courtesy: draft is at Draft:Masoud Shafaghi Declined 24 March. Not yet resubmitted. As mentioned at the draft's Talk page, many of the refs are to IFIA website, and as Masoud is an employee of IFIA, these are considered primary refs, and thus not contributing to confirmation of his notability in a Misplaced Pages sense of the word. David notMD (talk) 14:04, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Neda.sajedi.

• Comply with WP:PAID, since almost every draft similar to this one was written by someone who needs to.
• I immediately found you had copied swaths of text from the subject's (your?) Linkedin page (and one other source). Remove all other copyright violations (essentially, any text you copied from a source, though that's an oversimpification – see your talk page momentarily for more detail).

• Note that I have blocked your account since you re-added the copyright violations after I removed them. However, I blocked it for the shortest period possible (3 hours), and will undo the block once I have warned you on your talk page. I did so only to prevent you from adding back the copyvios again before I had time to warn you regarding them. If after you have been notified, you add them back, only then would I block you for longer.

• Get rid of all content based on Primary sources that are self-serving, provide any evaluation, or that are used for interpretation, opinion, synthesis or analysis and are not "straightforward, descriptive statements of facts that can be verified by any educated person with access to the primary source but without further, specialized knowledge".
• For anything left, that can technically be based on primary sources, see if you can replace with a secondary source anyway, and if you can, do so.
• Reformat all the references from naked URL, or just titles, to ones transparently attributing the sources, such as by providing the name of the work, author's name, title, date and such other details as identify the source, depending on context.
• Get rid of all hagiography like "Recognition of Shafaghi's outstanding achievements..." This is an encyclopedia.

Regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:09, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Note: User now indefinitely blocked for re-adding copyvios again, after warnings.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 15:09, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Please help, about "Zhou Chengzhou"

Dear Misplaced Pages editor,

Recently I came across such a problem, do not know how to deal with, ask everyone's help.

The questions are as follows:

I established "Zhou Chengzhou" English wiki entry "Zhou Chengzhou" has passed the audit. This is an article about Chinese mainland people. Here I would like to thank the wiki users who have passed the audit and edited together. However, after that, I received a discussion reminder that the page was deleted.

His user page is here: Chwiki page: https://archive.is/oLPpt (https://zh.wikipedia.org/User:AINH) ,

Please take a look at the comments on this user（AINH）page, he said: （Page Translation: “Ainh expressed strong dissatisfaction and strong opposition to frequent talks about Hong Kong affairs among Chinese Mainland users, and demanded that such persons stop interfering in Hong Kong affairs immediately What about the fight? Open the whole simple encyclopedia directly! Pink to hide your ears: you don't want to face the problem, I'll be with you. "Yellow and blue are political opinions, black and white are conscience") I come from Chinese Mainland.

His English p.: https://archive.is/yigjl (https://en.wikipedia.org/User:AINH) , which is the same user name, presumably a person.

This is the relevant page of "Zhou Chengzhou" article,

chinese: https://zh.wikipedia.org/%E5%91%A8%E6%89%BF%E8%88%9F

english: https://en.wikipedia.org/Zhou_Chengzhou

I have had some discussions, but I really don't know much about the terms of Wiki. Maybe I don't know how to deal with such a situation. I sincerely ask all experienced editors to help me and ask for help. Thank you very much.

I respect the standards and guidelines of Misplaced Pages very much, and I will try my best to cooperate if the items need to be improved.

Best and have a good day. Armidazhou (talk) 15:22, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

The discussion is at WP:Articles for deletion/Zhou Chengzhou. To bring it here could be regarded as forum shopping. --David Biddulph (talk) 15:35, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

I agree with DB. All the info above has already been provided by Armidazhou at the AfD. A key issue it that references that justify an article in ZH Misplaced Pages may not meet reliable source standards for EN Misplaced Pages. David notMD (talk) 18:55, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Ironically, this flood of attention from experienced editors they've given themselves has likely sunk any case they may have originally been able to eke out. Oops. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 20:41, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

It doesn't justify notability on ZH either. It's just that the notability process on ZH works differently than the one on EN and that it needs to wait a month-AINH (talk) 02:14, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Edit summaries

Hello, I've forgotten to edit the summary in few parts of my article. How to recover that. Can I publish my article with that mistakenly done error? TahiraY.Awan (talk) 15:40, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Edit summaries are not particularly important when you are the only person editing your own WP:userspace draft. What is important, before you submit your draft for AFC review, is to provide references to reliable sources independent of the subject. At present all of the references are to primary sources, so your draft would have no chance of being accepted in its current state. --David Biddulph (talk) 15:48, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Making an article

How do i make an article? Arezoner the best (talk) 16:49, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Please see Help:Your first article. It's kinda hard to explain within a comment. bop34 • talk • contribs 16:59, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Arezoner the best

• As noted above, see generally Help:Your first article. Then:

1. compile a list of reliable, secondary, independent sources that treat the topic in substantive detailTemplate:Z21 (think at least two to three paragraphs dedicated to the topic), to see whether it is actually notable, as we use that concept here;
2. if you can't make that list with at least three entries, with different content from one another, write nothing – no article is seemingly possible on whatever the topic is, at this time, because it hasn't been the subject of sufficient independent publication by the wider world – and you will be wasting your time; no amount of editing can overcome a lack of notability;
3. if you can, visit the Misplaced Pages:Article wizard and follow the prompts to create a draft;
4. write only what the sources you've compiled first verify (without copying the words used); and
5. cite those verifying sources as you write, which will also demonstrate the topic's notability.

Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:41, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

How to retrieve reference for an article

I have read through other articles on Misplaced Pages and noticed the retrieved attached to references cited with media sources for articles. What does that mean? How can that be created? Torksimlife (talk) 17:20, 25 March 2021 (UTC)Torksimlife

@Torksimlife: It indicates the date on which the source was viewed by the person adding, or altering, the reference (since a source may be changed at a later date). It's most often created by filling in the |access-date= parameter in a citation template. Deor (talk) 17:57, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

How to see a article's views ?

Like YouTube videos , Can we see a article is , How many times seen by reader. Traffic of a article. About which article readers are searching most at the moment ? Is there any button by pressing which we can see these statistics. 106.195.9.31 (talk) 17:57, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

See pageviews.toolforge.org. You can access it from the history page of every article. Kleinpecan (talk) 18:07, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

How do I send a new article for review from User Talk?

 Aoksk2099a (talk) 18:30, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello Aoksk2099a and welcome to the Teahouse. Forst of all, I have moved the article draft to User:Aoksk2099a/Article Draft. Your user talk page is intended as a central way for other editors to contact you. I have also added a banner to the top of the draft, allowing you to submit it for review. See Misplaced Pages:So you made a userspace draft for more info. Right now, I am slightly concerned by the choise of words, as Kaprov is greatly influenced by the bold and fearless approaches is unencyclopedic. See Misplaced Pages:Manual of Style/Words to watch for more info. Victor Schmidt (talk) 18:40, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Thank you!Aoksk2099a (talk) 19:23, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Your draft is currently in two places: User:Aoksk2099a/Article Draft and Draft:Susan Kaprov. I did some light editing to the first before realizing the second also existed. Be careful to work on only one. David notMD (talk) 19:13, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Many thanks!Aoksk2099a (talk) 19:23, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Probably a dumb question

Is there a way that I have to sign up to join this? I was invited, but I'm not sure what to do next ;-; Sorry...

}} Thanks! User:NotSchoolSmart (talk) 19:40, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

@NotSchoolSmart: Hello, and Welcome to the Teahouse. No, you don't have to sign up/in somewhere, all editors are welcome to ask questions here. Victor Schmidt (talk) 19:56, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Have we correctly inputted COI?

I am employed by the company I am developing a Misplaced Pages page for. The page is currently in Draft mode and we have submitted the page for review, but I'm concerned I did not state my COI properly. Can you please review to see what is possibly missing?: https://en.wikipedia.org/Draft:Better_Holdco Oat2021 (talk) 20:12, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Oat2021, your draft had been rejected because of clearly advertising your company, it will not be considered further. CommanderWaterford (talk) 21:24, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

And you made your PAID declaration while not signed in, so it shows up on an IP account rather than your User page. David notMD (talk) 21:47, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

I feel as though this would be a great candidate for RA though as it cites 39 sources total and definitely could be written about in a non-promotional way. bop34 • talk • contribs 21:50, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Deleted the Honors and Awards section entirely. All that might belong there are nationally or internationally awards from major organizations, not all the piddly crap there now. Ad remove naming staff (although a bit of that could be in an info box). David notMD (talk) 21:53, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Fixing a ref link that results in a 404

This page https://en.wikipedia.org/Kelsey_Lake_Diamond_Mine ref 13 results in a 404. Whereas I have found the document on the domain shown in the ref, there's no way to directly link to it as it's now behind a free paywall. I see that ref 8 does the same. I've done minimal editing, never of the refs. So what's the best way to fix this. 108.52.219.37 (talk) 20:29, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Are the sites archived on a service like the Wayback Machine? —A little blue Bori v^_^v 20:43, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi, 108.52.219.37. I went ahead and found an archive URL for that article and placed it in our citation, but I'll also see if this article is still up somewhere on their website and place that in the citation as well. I'm also going to do a bit of citation cleanup on that article. Link rot is a huge problem on a site as massive as Misplaced Pages, so bringing these incidents to our attention helps a lot. If you come across this sort of issue in the future, leaving a dead link template can help us find these as well. If you ever have any in-depth questions about combating link rot, feel free to hop over to my talk page, and I'll be happy to help out. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 20:50, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

(edit conflict)

Hello IP editor. My approach when hitting a failed link is to do a browser search for the article to see if it's available elsewhere. To be honest, we don't require any properly published source to be online, though it does help the user verify statements. But, I found your source at this alternative location. It would help if you would consider showing the specific page numbers to each use of the reference so that it shows clearly where the source can be found. Thus page 8 for the mention of a large diamond of 28.2 carat. I haven't checked whether the yumpu version was legitimately uploaded or not. But if it weren't I'd check the source supports all the statements and then link back to the free paywall site. Does this help? Nick Moyes (talk) 20:57, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

References

1. "Diamonds - Colorado Geological Survey". Rock Talk. 2 (3). July 1999. Retrieved 25 March 2021.

Editing My Talk Page

Hello! My talk page has a note that an article I wrote was initially tagged for deletion That did not happen but the note is still on my talk page Can I remove that as it is my talk page? Meam70 (talk) 21:52, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Meam70 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Yes, you may remove most content from your user talk page. There are a small number of exceptions, but none relevant to you now. Many prefer archiving, but it's not required. 331dot (talk) 22:04, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

331dot Thanks for the response!Meam70 (talk) 01:05, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Why is some editing

Why is some editing the page I have created, greeting me and inviting me to create an account, when I already have one?

 Philip Sugarman (talk) 21:57, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Philip Sugarman Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. I see a welcome message on your user talk page, but not where you were invited to create an account. When you create a new article, it then belongs to Misplaced Pages, and any editor may contribute to it. 331dot (talk) 22:01, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Philip Sugarman. It would certainly help if you advised where you saw this; whether it was an automated message that popped up, and if so, what you were doing when it did; maybe some default text on some page you visited—whatever the context is that would allow us to find it. (If it's a false-positive message provided by the interface, for example, we might be able to better tailor it to avoid this repeating.) Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk)

Sorry I can't track down the detail on this. Apologies — Preceding unsigned comment added by Philip Sugarman (talk • contribs) 05:14, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Can someone explain how to declare my bias?

Hi, I am Matthew Berdyck, hello investigated and exposed a toxic waste site in Akron, Ohio. I was just informed that an article was created about this Superfund site and I’m the person that conducted the original research on the subject matter. It looks like it was rejected for only having two sources but I have access to at least a hundred more secondary reliable sources for the subject matter. My concern is that I made a movie about it, which exposed it, and parts of the article talk about this, also from secondary sources. How can I complete this article and declare my bias? I am new here so I don’t entirely understand how things work. 2Famous2UseMyName (talk) 23:56, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi 2Famous2UseMyName. Please see WP:PAID#How to disclose. You can post to your userpage, which has not yet been created and is linked here, this template {{paid|user=2Famous2UseMyName|employer=InsertName|client=InsertName}}. See {{Paid}} for a information on the fill-in parameters. Question: Was the draft about Poison in the Grapes, or about the Superfund site itself? It might be good to tell us the name of the draft, so we can advise further.

Many drafts are created here and are rejected not because the subject is not suitable for an article but because whoever attempted to post it, violated copyright, or didn't use suitable sources, etc. It might be as you say, just needs more sourcing, or it may be it would be better to start from scratch for a variety of reasons. Just be aware that Misplaced Pages is by, and everyone you see here, are volunteers. Holes in coverage are filled by people like you noticing the hole and filling it. Anyway, I suggest starting with the WP:Tutorial and then reading Help:Your first article, exploring some of the more prominent links found through them. By the way, while you do have a technical COI, it's of a subtype that is often not so disabling the way so many are, and given your background I expect you have some innate sense of journalistic precepts, neutrality in writing, what an encyclopedia is, etc. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 00:32, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

You could put a list of them on the talk page of the draft. This would be very helpful and likely speed up the process of the draft becoming an article. bop34 • talk • contribs 00:36, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

The article is called Summit Equipment & Supplies Superfund Site and has a short section on my film which exposed it. I’m actually an arm chair historian and I have a strong belief in providing accurate, non-biased history, whether I like it or not, which can be controversial, like what happens when I tell you a Republican named Richard Nixon formed the US EPA, in 1970, and then a Democrat finds my moms phone number, calls her, threatens to slit her throat because I’m “funded by the Koch Brothers,” and then tries to get me to fire myself. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2Famous2UseMyName (talk • contribs) 00:54, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@2Famous2UseMyName:. Please see WP:REALWORLD because if you're worried that somehow the edits you make on Misplaced Pages might some be traced back to you out in the real world, then my suggestion to you would be not to edit at all or at least to avoid editing controversial or contentious subject where someone might be able to connect the edits back to you. As for your strong beliefs on things, please see WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS and WP:ORIGINALRESEARCH; your beliefs might be important to you, but probably not so much to Misplaced Pages unless they've can be supported by citations to WP:SECONDARY sources. Moreover, even in the latter case, they still might be considered WP:UNDUE or otherwise WP:NOTEVERYTHING for Misplaced Pages's purposes. Please understand I'm not trying to be harsh here, but try and keep in mind that Misplaced Pages wants us all to be as WP:HERE as we possibly can, and most editors only start having problems with other editors when then move too far into WP:NOTHERE territory. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:14, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Courtesy: Draft:Summit Equipment & Supplies Superfund Site was created in May 2020 and declined, not resubmitted. The creating editor was indefinitely blocked for behavior, so that person not coming back to improve the draft. David notMD (talk) 02:01, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

For starters, mention on your User page (perhaps before all the short paragraphs), that you are editing the draft while you are also mentioned in the draft. Anyone else have guidance here? David notMD (talk) 02:08, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Whoops - blocked for sockpuppetry (multiple accounts, including the account that started the draft). David notMD (talk) 12:50, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Duncan baronets

"Clarification needed". I can't clarify WHY, but I can help prove this is the case.

https://en.wikipedia.org/Duncan_baronets

Duncan baronets, of Horsforth Hall (1905) Sir (Surr) William Duncan, 1st Baronet (1834–1908)

Sir (Surr) William Duncan, 1st Baronet (1834–1908) has his title SIR as SURR. I don't know why but in the past few days I've seen both his first wife's gravestone (with him mentioned) and his (and 2nd wife's gravestone) both having SIR spelt/spelled SURR. Can't explain why but can upload photos. How do I deal with "clarification needed" when I can't clarify why on earth he did this, but can clarify this is the case with proof!?

Thank you. Iamaran (talk) 00:39, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

See the discussion that I had with Iamaran on my user talk page here. ~Oshwah~ 02:08, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Reference 5 in the article is to a pdf of a page in the London Gazette (which itself is about the most authoritative reliable source one could wish for: a pdf of it could theoretically be faked, but this and the other announcements there seem to check out).

It's clear from this source that "Surr" is not a bizarre alternative spelling of "Sir" or a different and unique title – it is simply the man's first name. His name was Surr William Duncan, just as the next person in the same announcement was John Reeves Ellerman.

Thus, the latter would, having been made a Baronet of the United Kingdom, be formerly called "Sir John Reeves Ellerman, 1st Baronet" or Sir John (Reeves) Ellerman of Connaught Square, and informally (probably) "Sir John"; the former would formally have been Sir Surr William Duncan, 1st Baronet or —ditto— of Horsforth Hall. Informally, since "Sir Surr" sounds a little odd, I suspect he might have used "Sir William." {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 2.219.35.136 (talk) 11:57, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Translated Titles

Why would you ever include the script title as well as the translated title? When you enter the script title it just translates it for the viewer anyway so including the translated title results in the English title appearing twice. I've been messing around with how to correctly reference Korean articles and I just don't understand it. TipsyElephant (talk) 01:30, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

I'm not sure what you mean about |script-title= being automatically translated. It doesn't happen for me, but maybe it's a new feature or something done by the WP:VISUALEDITOR. Have you tried asking at WP:KOREA about the best way to cite Korean language sources? Perhaps a member of that WikiProject can help sort out the problem you seem to be having? -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:03, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Marchjuly: Lmao, I had Google translate on so everything on the page that was in Korean was being translated to English even in the source list. So it was just a dumb user error. I know that it's preferred that editors who know both languages do translations and I know absolutely no Korean so I'm going to try and be cautious about what I use the sources for, but would you have any suggestions as to how I could mitigate any mistakes I'm making? Perhaps I should ask at the Wikiproject to have someone proofread for me once I'm done working on the article? TipsyElephant (talk) 13:51, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Category:Rabbis in Bnei Brak

The category, Rabbis in Bnei Brak is linked with the Arabic page تصنيف:حاخامات في بني براك, while the Hebrew page קטגוריה:בני ברק: רבנים is linked with the Yiddish page קאַטעגאָריע:רבנים פון בני ברק. Since all four of these categories are the same, can somebody please merge the interlaguage links of the English-Arabic categories with the Hebrew-Yiddish categories? Thank you, Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 01:47, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

 Done. Kleinpecan (talk) 12:10, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

How do I print/save a wikipedia article without the brackets/numbers that are interspersed throughout the article?

I am trying to make a long post on reddit that includes me copy/pasting about 40 paragraphs of text from wikpiedia but all the text I grab includes numbers like this and this. Is there a fast way to remove the numbers with brackets around them? Also what are the bracketed numbers formally called? 2600:1006:B054:DE27:9042:63B0:7DA9:3E23 (talk) 02:15, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi IP 2600:1006:B054:DE27:9042:63B0:7DA9:3E23|2600:1006:B054:DE27:9042:63B0:7DA9:3E23. Those bracketed numbers your seeing are footnote markers which indicate that the preceding content is supported by a citation. They are added inline to article content by those editing the article and can only be removed if the corresponding syntax itself is also removed, which is something that you shouldn't being trying to do since it will likely create problems that others will have to clean up. As to reusing Misplaced Pages content on other websites, please take a careful look at Misplaced Pages:Reusing Misplaced Pages content because Misplaced Pages's licensing policy requires that any content copied from it and used on other websites be properly attributed; so, instead of simply copying-and-pasting content from Misplaced Pages article's onto Reddit, it would probably be much easier to just simply add url links to the Misplaced Pages articles to the Reddit discussion. -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:31, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

I posted a way at Misplaced Pages:Village pump (technical)#How do I print/save a wikipedia article without the brackets/numbers that are interspersed throughout the article? Please only post a question in one place. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:18, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Additionally, without the references you will need to consider whether the information you are quoting is true, as Misplaced Pages is not a reliable source. The references are there by design so that anyone can check the information in a reliable source. What reason will someone have to believe the information without the referencing? — Bilorv (talk) 14:07, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

User page

How to protect a userpage from others to edit? Logical Puzzle (talk) 04:12, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Logical Puzzle. You can request protection of a page at Misplaced Pages:Requests for page protection. We do not protect pages pre-emptively, but only because they are actually receiving persistent vandalism, and we usually protect only for a period commensurate with how long the vandalism is likely to last. Any request that isn't based on those precepts will be rejected. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 04:26, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Are we, in any aspect, related to this fandom wiki, Military-wikia

Their articles are absolutely what we have on our platform. Not a single trace of difference. Try to speak to host there, but no one care to explain... Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 04:54, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Hypersonic man 11. My guess is that there's no connection between the two sites, except perhaps that maybe some people are editing on both. See WP:MIRROR for more details, but there are probably lots of other websites that get their content from Misplaced Pages. This is OK to do per WP:REUSE as long as the website complies with the terms of Misplaced Pages's licensing. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:00, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

So, is the site comply with the license. I don't really think so because it's a wiki copying a wiki as a public wiki. Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 05:26, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

I don't know what the site is doing, but Misplaced Pages content is licensed in a way that allows it to be re-used and even modified for any purpose as long as proper attribution is provided to Misplaced Pages. Even if the site is not complying with Misplaced Pages's licensing, there's not much that any editors here can do about it. You can contact the Wikimedia Foundation directly if you want. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:38, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Hypersonic man 11: We are not affiliated with Fandom (website) (previously called Wikia). Many articles at wikia:Military were copied from Misplaced Pages but later edited separately. Compare for example Dragoons and wikia:Military:Dragoons which have some differences. They appear to comply with Misplaced Pages:Reusing Misplaced Pages content. The bottom of their page says "This page uses Creative Commons Licensed content from Misplaced Pages (view authors)." Some of their articles were not copied, e.g. wikia:Military:Paramilitary firearm. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:54, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Dragoons, is, however, not the case. You expect some Chinese military articles, absolutely, the same. Those Chinese Military sources are hard to find, so over the case, they copied from us and re-used it as their own public wiki server. Besides, other wiki pages are copied directly from Misplaced Pages. Based on your explanation, which is unreasonable, they copied and slightly edit it over words, will your English teacher accept your paper, where you source from the web or a book, with some grammar exchange? This is an unlawful plagiarism act, and even if they edited it based on words, they still took it from our hard work, so what's the point of creating the Wikia? What's the point of copying us, losing our status, and take exchange. Should they even exist, if Misplaced Pages is already here, why are they doing so, its not in any way better? Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 11:37, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@User: Marchjuly, I want to do so to safeguard the justice and rights of Misplaced Pages. Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 11:39, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

That sounds good except that Misplaced Pages doesn't really care how its content is reused as long as those doing so properly attribute the content to Misplaced Pages and otherwise abide by the terms of Misplaced Pages:Text of Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unported License. You might want to take a closer look at Misplaced Pages:About and Misplaced Pages:Copyrights because this is pretty much the way Misplaced Pages has always licensed its content and likely will be the way it always licenses its content.I understand how it might be upsetting to find content you've edited or created on Misplaced Pages being used on some other website; however, you agree to relinquish any claim of ownership over such content every time you click the "Publish changes" button. That's part of the agreement we make with the Wikimedia Foundation; they let us edit their website for free and we agree to waive any claim of ownership over the things we edit. The next time you make an edit, read the small print located above the "Publish changes" button. -- Marchjuly (talk) 13:14, 26 March 2021 (UTC);

@Hypersonic man 11: It's only plagiarism if they pretend they wrote it. They say twice that they got it from us. The second time is via the category "Articles incorporating text from Misplaced Pages". Their only mistake is that the "view authors" link goes to the page history of the redirect Dragoons instead of the article Dragoon. Interested readers can still find the right page via the redirect so I forgive them. We explicitly allow others to copy our articles. They don't need a reason. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:58, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Hypersonic man 11. Let me give some background that might be helpful for a future actual instance of non-compliant re-use, if you want to take action on his type of matter.

1. We – us editors of Misplaced Pages, personally – own the copyright to our original contributions to Misplaced Pages that meet threshold of originality, and not the Wikimedia Foundation ( "we agree to waive any claim of ownership over the things we edit" is incorrect);
2. Thus, when I write an article, I personally own the copyright to its content, just as you do for your contributions that meet the threshold of originality (and aren't, for example, quotations of pre-existing copyrighted content, that we can use to a limited extent under fair use);
3. That personal copyright ownership, though, is under the free copyright license or licenses [depending on what and when it was posted) we automatically agree our original content is released under (although some small segment of users actually release their contributions into the public domain, e.g., by posting on their userpage {{User Publicdomain}});
4. The free copyright license or licenses (it depends), essentially require that re-users, such as the Fandom Wikia site i) provide suitable credit to the authors of the content, which we agree can be done by linking to the Misplaced Pages page where the list of authors are available from the page history, and ii) by re-posting the license, etc. (see Misplaced Pages:Reusing Misplaced Pages content for more nitty-gritty details on suitable compliance);
5. The rub of this is that any claim for infringement under the free license or licenses must be made by an editor here who actually owns the copyright; I can make such a claim, for example, for some instance of non-compliant reuse of the content of an article that I am a substantial contributor to; I cannot for an article I am not a substantial contributor to; and the Wikimedia Foundation could not, because they have no standing to do so as a non-owner of the content;
6. You can make such a claim by following the recommendations at Misplaced Pages:Mirrors and forks#Non-compliance process, such as sending a tailored Misplaced Pages:Standard CC-BY-SA violation letter (I have done this a number of times and actually had some results; mostly though, the response is silence – you can escalate to a DMDCA takedown notice if you're willing to spend the time; but your options are limited thereafter, unless you are willing to actually sue someone, which I'm not sure anyone has ever done for non-compliance with a Misplaced Pages re-use (the hypothetical ability to sue some person or organization tells you little about the practicality of doing so);
7. But as already mentioned, it appears this site is in compliance with copyright. Nevertheless, the unfortunate fact is that about five minutes after an article is crawled by search engines, there are numerous sites infringing the content. It's just the nature of the beast.

Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 17:33, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for clarifying things Fuhghettaboutit and pointing out my error. My apologies to you Hypersonic man 11 if I oversimplified things too much and gave you some incorrect information in the process. -- Marchjuly (talk) 22:41, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

So, end to end is it compliable with the terms. I don't think it's by standard CC copyrights and CC-BY-SA acceptable. What's the point of having the second wiki copied directly from the first wiki? If it's not, maybe let's just take action. I've tried to contact them, in the discussion centre, but no one replied. Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 01:59, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Why is it compliable, any clue? Is it a systematic approach or is it, well, your approach to their utterly "mute". Pls clarify it, it's not that they don't care or no result had been made over the past, but, it is about the basic violation of CC-BY-SA, so we need to take the systematic approach. Even if the answer is yes, how can all of you, maybe some who throw out the systematic ways of accepting things, accept this basic violation of the rules? Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 02:06, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

How to remove my userpage from certain categories?

Hello!

I'm sure this is likely an obvious question, but oh well. As the title states, how do I remove my userpage from certain categories without removing the userboxes that put me into those categories in the first place? Currently, I have the "This user knows science matters" userbox on my profile, and while I don't want to remove it, that userbox put me into the "Users interested in Secularism" category. It's not that I disagree (because I don't), but I have my own personal reasons for not wanting to be in that category. My first thought was to see if, like articles, the categories that page is in are listed at the bottom but apparently for userpages they aren't. So, is there any way to leave it without getting rid of the userbox? Thanks!

 glowing regards, paperandscissors 05:03, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Paperandscissors: try specifying |nocat=yes Victor Schmidt mobil (talk) 07:05, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Paperandscissors: Your example supports nocat but many templates don't. {{Suppress categories}} is a general method to remove categories from template output. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:26, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Review request by the company Freeport of Ventspils

Dear editors ar Misplaced Pages,

I have recently created an article titled "Freeport of Ventspils" describing the institution and it's activities, however, the article was almost instantly deleted due to copyright infringement. I am an employee at the company and we are trying to create wikipedia pages in different languages in order for people to find information about our company on platforms other than the website.

Could anyone perhaps guide me in the right direction so that something like this doesn't happen again?

Best regards, David Dravnieks Marketing specialist at Freeport of Ventspils authority 193.200.201.150 (talk) 07:26, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi IP 193.200.201.150/Dave. I suggest you take a look at the following Misplaced Pages pages: Misplaced Pages:The answer to life, the universe, and everything, Misplaced Pages:Notability (organizations and companies), Misplaced Pages:Conflict of interest, Misplaced Pages:Paid-contribution disclosure, Misplaced Pages:What Misplaced Pages is not and Misplaced Pages:Ownership of content. Bascially, an article will only be able to be written about your company if it can be demonstrated that it's Misplaced Pages notable. Moreover, it will be an article written about your company, not for or on behalf of your company and your company will have no editorial control of the content whatsoever. Furthermore, it will have to be written in a neutral point of view and reflect only what reliable sources (preferably secondary and indepenent sources) are saying, have been saying or have said about your company. In other words, the article will not be allowed to become a platform for your company to disseminate information about itself or otherwise promote itself in any way, and there's a really good chance that negative coverage about your company will find its way into the article as long as it complies with Misplaced Pages's policies and guidelines. As for the reason why the article was deleted, that has to do with Misplaced Pages:Copyrights, Misplaced Pages:Close paraphrase or possibly a combination of both. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:39, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

(Note for Teahouse volunteers: there is further discussion of the deletion on my user talk page.) —Tom Morris (talk) 08:02, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

What do you recommend as a next step?

I have been a contributor for over 10 years, but I haven't written or edited hundreds of articles yet. I have translated a handful, and expanded or improved a dozen articles or so. Although I am quite familiar with Misplaced Pages's policies and guidelines (I read more guidelines, conventions, and tutorials than I care to list), I have always been hesitant to request more rights. I guess it's time for me to be bold.

I recently wrote a draft for an article about my employer, and declared my COI so that someone else can supervise it and hopefully improve it or release it. I am not paid or compensated in any way for it, but I work for a non-profit organization (which autofinances itself, and doesn't gain anything from the article); I think an article in Misplaced Pages is long overdue. This led me to check the backlog of edit requests in general, and wondered if I couldn't jump in an help out with those I have no relationship with. So that's where this question comes in: what do you, more experience Wikipedians, think I should do next? I already volunteered to the Guild of Copy Editors. Should I jump on helping out with edit requests? Ferkijel (talk) 07:41, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Ferkijel. You can be WP:BOLD and improve any articles that you think need improving. If you're WP:REVERTed by someone who disagrees with your improvement attempt, then try and WP:DISCUSS things and see if they can resolved. The same basically applies to answering edit requests: if you think you can answer a request, then go ahead. You may, however, want to look at WP:ERREQ and start slow with some easy ones first just to get a feel for how the various templates work and how requests are typically answered. It might also be a good idea to introduce yourself to an editor or some editors who seem to be active in this area because they might be able to help explain things that might not be immediately obvious to someone not familiar with the process. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:57, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

• @Ferkijel: The WP:Task Center might be good to peruse. {{u|Sdkb}}  08:04, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Sbdk, it's an excellent resource. Down the rabbit hole I go. Ferkijel (talk) 09:05, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Change Talking Tom and Friends logo

On 24 March 2021, the franchise recently changes its logo alongside its most apps. Lkas123 (talk) 09:43, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Lkas123: Welcome to the Teahouse! If you are talking about changing the logo on Misplaced Pages, you have to upload an image. The new logo will fall under a non-free file; however, United States copyright law allows one to use non-free images of low resolution, called fair use. Sungodtemple a tcg fan!!1!11!! (talk) 12:07, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

It's worth adding to this that Misplaced Pages's policy on using non-free files is more restrictive than fair use law, and the non-free content criteria must all be met for a fair use file to remain on Misplaced Pages. If this is a change in logo and the logo is non-free then you can add the new logo in the article to replace the old one. However, depending on the simplicity of the logo it may actually be ineligible for copyright, so that we can use it freely. Are you able to provide an external URL link to an image of the new logo? — Bilorv (talk) 14:01, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

I had a look at the official website listed in the external links section of Talking Tom and Friends, which has a thumbnail of the logo. Apparently the logo change is relatively minor (the old logo (used at Talking Tom and Friends and Talking Tom and Friends (TV series)) was white text with red outline but now it is red text with no outline, and the "AND" has been replaced with "&"). Besides, since the logo is just text, I believe it is not eligible for copyright, though I may be wrong. 45.251.33.225 (talk) 15:44, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Close a sockpuppet investigation

How do I close a sockpuppet investigation I started a week ago and which hasn't been active since then? Both users in question are already banned, and honestly it was probably an overkill. Should I request a speedy deletion under G7? Kleinpecan (talk) 13:02, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

I don't thinkWP:G7 is necessary. Just post something similar on the SPI page itself to let the clerks who handle such investigations that you've decided to withdraw your request. You can also go to WP:AN and explain what you've explained here and an admin will probably close it asap. Maybe even one of the admins who are Teahouse hosts Like Cullen328, Nick Moyes, Hoary or 331dot will see this and close it for you. -- Marchjuly (talk) 13:23, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Also, even if both users in the investigation are blocked, it might still be worth a member of the SPI team looking at it, to check there's no more related sockpuppet accounts. Joseph2302 (talk) 14:34, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Many sockpuppet investigations are sitting in an open state for a long time, so adding anything to an open sockpuppet investigation will only be seen when the SPI itself is seen. Some SPIs have been open without being looked at by a CheckUser or a clerk for two weeks. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:58, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Question

Is it okay to move an article to draft space while editing? I've already place 'inuse' and 'under construction' templete there. The page reviewer moved the article to draft space while and editing without telling. Is that okay? Draft:SONA New York. YogeshWarah 13:05, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Yogeshwarah Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Yes, it was okay to move the draft. That is better than outright deleting it, if it is unsuitable as an encyclopedia article. Your draft just tells of the existence of the restaurant and that a notable person started it. You will need at least three independent reliable sources with significant, in depth coverage of this restaurant, showing how it meets the special Misplaced Pages definition of a notable business, to summarize in order for this restaurant to merit an article. It doesn't merit an article because a notable person started it. The sources you have are just routine announcements, which do not establish notability.

Successfully creating a new article is the absolute hardest task to perform on Misplaced Pages, and diving right in often ends up with disappointment and hurt feelings as your work is mercilessly edited and even deleted by others. It is much better to gain experience by editing existing articles first, to get a feel for how Misplaced Pages operates and what is expected of article content. There is a reason new users are not permitted to do so immediately. Even once you technically can create an article directly, it's a good idea to run it by other editors before it is formally placed in the encyclopedia. 331dot (talk) 13:32, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Hi Yogeshwarah. Once an article is added to the mainspace, it's there for anyone to edit at anytime, and this includes nominating or tagging it for deletion. So, sometimes an article is draftified instead because someone (often a WP:NPP reviewer, but not always) feels it's not quite ready for the WP:MAINSPACE, but has potential. This can actually be a good thing because it gives the creator or primary contributors to the article a chance to work on improving it at their own pace without having to worry about others editing it, or nominating/tagging it for deletion. My suggestion to you would be to continue to work on the draft and submit it Misplaced Pages:Articles for creation when you think it's ready. You might also want to read Misplaced Pages:Notability (organizations and companies) because that's how the draft is likely going to be assessed. -- Marchjuly (talk) 13:34, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

• @Yogeshwarah: Please don't remove a question from the Teahouse (even if you're the editor who asked the question) once it has been responded to by someone else. -- Marchjuly (talk) 14:25, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Help

Can anybody help me to expand a draft article, Draft:Divya Gokulnath, co-founder and director of Byju's. She is the wife of Byju Raveendran, founder of Byju's. The sources in the article have deep details about her and the reviewer also states that, see this. I'm new to Misplaced Pages and learning.. kindly kelp me please... Thanks in advance YogeshWarah 13:53, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

You started an account on 22 March, then started drafts on the 23rd, 23rd, 25th and 26th, with outcomes respectively declined twice (Divya), accepted, declined once and not yet submitted. From looking at the Divya draft, several editors appear to be contributing. Persevere. David notMD (talk) 15:42, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

• @Yogeshwarah: Please stop removing sections from the Teahouse. The questions will be archived in due course. Regards, --bonadea contributions talk 18:22, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

how can i create a sandbox in wikipedia

 Buzzie19 (talk) 14:06, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Welcome to the teahouse Buzzie19. You already appear to have one at , created March 20. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:14, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Sudden IP ban from Misplaced Pages

Question

For some reason the IP I had at home was blocked so I couldn't create an account, I had to request for one. I haven't done anything wrong, I rarely edit wikipedia posts unless it's necessary so it is weird. Anyways, I would edit wikipedia on my account because I don't want people seeing my IP. Could it possibly be... that someone was on a VPN and was doing vandalism on this one? I'd like to know. AlexEditsWikipedia (talk) 14:38, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@AlexEditsWikipedia: Hello, and welcome to the Teahouse. The folks here at the Teahouse can't see your IP, therefore, we are unable to help you. The vandalism idea is certainly possible, though there are a lot of other explanations, including autoblocks from blocked accounts, or any other rule violation. Victor Schmidt (talk) 14:48, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages History Questions

I want to know a few things:

1. What was the first Misplaced Pages page? 2. What was the first presidential election to be put on Misplaced Pages? 3. Who made Misplaced Pages? xdude (talk) 14:41, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Xdude gamer. Start by reading History of Misplaced Pages. Cullen Let's discuss it 15:06, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Xdude gamer. Please see List of presidential elections. If you mean US election, I believe the first was the 1788–89 United States presidential election.--Shantavira| 17:03, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

No, I mean the first one ever put on Misplaced Pages.

My bets kind of fall on 2000. xdude (talk) 17:04, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Xdude gamer: that is not the kind of information that is particularly easy to find out – it might not even be possible to do so. There must be thousands of articles about presidential elections, and even if you limit yourself to the English-language version of Misplaced Pages you'd have a pretty stiff job going through them all. The Teahouse is for questions about editing Misplaced Pages, so it is not really the best place to ask this kind of question. --bonadea contributions talk 17:36, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Oh. Sorry. Just trying to ask questions. xdude (talk) 18:12, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

It's okay – sorry if I sounded dismissive. I think the Village Pump might be a better place for questions about the history of Misplaced Pages, though. --bonadea contributions talk 18:26, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Xdude gamer might find illumination in the article History of Misplaced Pages and others linked from it. For what it's worth, no such article appears in Misplaced Pages:First 100 pages. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 2.219.35.136 (talk) 12:46, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Photo Rights

How do you know when you can use a picture? For example would a picture from the 1800's have any copyright and if so how can you tell? I want to know bout photo rights mainly for these two pictures of Alexander Hunter. http://www.arlingtoncemetery.net/alexander-hunter.htm and https://archive.org/details/confederateveter22conf/page/468/mode/2up. Please tell me if this is a reference desk question. Gandalf the Groovy (talk) 14:51, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Gandalf the Groovy It depends on your country but I suspect almost any photo that old would be okay to use. I don't think(but maybe others know) any country has copyright last more than 100 years. 331dot (talk) 15:09, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Gandalf the Groovy. In the United States, copyright has expired for all photos published more than 95 years ago. Cullen Let's discuss it 15:13, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@331dot: According to this article, Looks like Mexico has the longest copyright term, life of author plus 100 years, with Côte d'Ivoire coming in second at life + 99 years..--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:03, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Politicians and elections in Misplaced Pages

Hi I am currently attempting to fill in all of the members of the West Virginia House of Delegates who do not have pages and I came across one who was elected in 2020 but had run for office 5 times previously. Should I include his failed campaigns in the elections section? Thanks. FlyingKitten2024 (talk) 14:59, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

FlyingKitten2024 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. If they are a current member(and thus meeting WP:NPOLITICIAN), you can add information that you have independent reliable sources for, including failed campaigns. 331dot (talk) 15:08, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Courtesy link: West Virginia House of Delegates @FlyingKitten2024: The article doesn’t look like it has any information about failed candidates, only current members. If that candidate was notable enough to have their own article, you could put the previous unsuccessful campaigns there. TimTempleton 15:11, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hey FlyingKitten2024! Short answer: yes. If they are a member of the House of Delagates then they'd get an article, and you can put their past election runs in a separate section of that article (provided that you have a reliable sources for them like 331dot said). Which article are you currently working on? Bkissin (talk) 15:52, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

An article’s next step

Once all possible encyclopedic information has been added to an article, say a stub or start class article, what exactly is the next step for the article? Copy/edit format check? Nothing? Or once all possible information has been added, does the article’s class just increase? More of asking how can the article be improved once all information is in the article. Thanks for the advice in advance. Elijahandskip (talk) 15:42, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Elijahandskip: Wow, we are talking a lot today! The answer is that it depends. When I first started on WP (FOREVER ago) I worked on the article for my my local airport. When I felt like I had brought the article up to a good level, I asked that the article be assessed as a good article, with the hope that someday it would be featured. The reviewer pointed out several things on the talk page that still needed work on the article in order to bring it to a good level.

The other option is to look at the Misplaced Pages assessment criteria and see where the article fits. Look at the examples listed as a Featured Article or a B-class article and see what (if anything) your article needs to get up to that point. Some WikiProjects have more specific criteria for assessment. For example Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Canada has its own level of assessment and importance criteria, and Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Indiana has its own importance criteria that each of those projects uses to assess articles on its own scale. Sometimes, what is a High-importance article for one project will be a low-importance article for another. I hope this helps answer some of your questions. Bkissin (talk) 16:07, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks Bkissin! Elijahandskip (talk) 16:23, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Minor Edits?

Hello, I'm a little confused on what is considered a minor edit. While i'm pretty sure a grammatical fix etc would be considered minor, would it be considered minor to add a date or entry on to a list? Or a paragraph on an already large article? Defwe12 (talk) 16:31, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

There is no precise definition but you can look at Misplaced Pages:Minor edit. Ruslik_Zero 16:42, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Defwe12: Hello, welcome to the Teahouse. Help:Minor edit might be helpful for you. max20characters 🇺🇸 16:44, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Adding any substantive content, even a date, is not a minor edit. Cullen Let's discuss it 16:45, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Automatically change numbering in a list

I added an Chepstow to https://en.wikipedia.org/List_of_localities_in_Wales_by_population at position 32 but other listeing below remain unchanged so there are 2 entries for 32. Is there a way to automatically changing numbering when you add to a list? 222288 (talk) 17:15, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hmarcw, it seems that those numbers aren't automatically generated, they've just been typed into the source for the article. 5 is missing. Maproom (talk) 19:27, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hmarcw (talk • contribs) 19:45, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Formatting Tables

Hello! I am creating a table for an article and I am unsure about how to combine cells. To be more specific, I am listing a director's awards, and there are different awards she received on the same year at the same film festival. Instead of repeating the year and festival names in numerous cells, I would like to create a larger cell that only lists the name and year once. Any advice on how to do this would be greatly appreciated. Midnightmadness7 (talk) 17:19, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Midnightmadness7: you use rowspan="" or colspan="". An example table should illustrate that:

If you have problems with the formatting or don't like to mess up, I recommend using the VisualEditor. You can connect two ore more cells there by holding ⇧ Shift and selecting the cells. Victor Schmidt (talk) 17:55, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Draft Expansion

Hello, I've started an article on 'Sona' restaurant by Priyanka Chopra. Please help me to expand the article Draft:SONA New York.

Thanks in advance... YogeshWarah 18:09, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

The draft currently has no references to reliable independent sources, such as are needed to establish that the restaurant is notable enough to warrant a Misplaced Pages article. The sources it does cite are all based on statements made by Chopra, and so not independent. If you haven't been able to find any acceptable sources, I doubt anyone else can. Maproom (talk) 19:38, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

After searching, and failing to find any reliable independent sources that discuss the restaurant, I've realised why: it hasn't opened yet. No wonder it has no independent reviews. I suggest that you wait until it's been open for a couple of months. It should then be easier to find the sources that Misplaced Pages requires. Maproom (talk) 16:07, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Appropriateness of Interwiki Linking

The Help pages regarding interwiki linking describe 'how' to do it, but I'm not sure if it's acceptable in every case when there's an article on a subject lacking an article in EN WP. Is it better to hold off until there's an EN page on the subject? Do I have to confirm the linked page adheres to any basic standard by EN WP? Could I just add it to the prose, or add it as an external link at the end?

The question is somewhat general, but the article I'm looking at is Adaheli, I think the nl:Cornelius van Coll article could be linked. Cheers, Estheim (talk) 18:12, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Estheim. The preferred way for linking articles now is by Wikidata, but that should only be used where the subjects of the articles coincide. Where there is no precise match, it is still possible to use the old mechanism by putting ] (without a leading colon) somewhere in the article - probably at the bottom. --ColinFine (talk) 18:23, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

ColinFine, thanks, I plopped it at the end. Odds are that the Dutch page subject is more notable than the one mention of a mythological figure that all circle back to him, but that is another issue for another time. Cheers, Estheim (talk) 18:46, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Doane Tigers Draft

Hello, I am making a Draft article for the Doane Tigers football seasons from 2010 to 2019 (I think it is "notable", because WP:NSEASONS says that multiple seasons may be grouped together). And I'm putting summaries in the season sections with CFB Game templates, but after I put in the template, everything that comes after it appears in the box. Is there any way I can fix this. (The Draft is at User:BeanieFan11/Doane Tigers football, 2010–2019) Thanks. BeanieFan11 (talk) 19:29, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi, BeanieFan11, and welcome to the Teahouse. Since nobody had picked this up, I had a look: it baffled me (I even looked at the HTML source). Eventually I looked at another article which used those templates, and found that the last {{AFB game box scoring entry}} needs a parameter LastEntry=yes, or it doesn't work. This parameter is mentioned on the template documentation page, but I think it could do with a large friendly warning saying "You must use this or the world will come to an end". Note, by the way, that so far your draft does not have a single reference which is independent of the subject, and so does not establish notability and has no chance of being accepted as an article. --ColinFine (talk) 12:45, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Newcomer

 41.115.38.61 (talk) 19:43, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Do you have a question? Teahouse is a place to ask questions about how to edit. David notMD (talk) 20:14, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Reference Templates within Basic Form Templates

While editing articles, I've noticed that I've seen two to three (possibly four) Cite Web templates within one Basic Form Template. Is this an acceptable way to make citations? Should I remove the additional Cite web templates within the Reference Template, making individual citations? Pibal373 (talk) 20:50, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

 Anhy999 (talk) 20:52, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Anyh999. It is fine to put several references together into one footnote. See Help:Citation merging. Don't change them. StarryGrandma (talk) 21:57, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Pibal373, I've replied to the wrong person. Sorry. StarryGrandma (talk) 23:08, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Thank you. StarryGrandma--Pibal373 (talk) 01:46, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

IP block while logged in

I tried to edit a page with a VPN active and it blocked me form editing it (as is to be expected) then when I logged in, I was still blocked from editing. Is this a bug or can you not edit over a VPN even while logged in? Cynosure-NULL (talk) 21:08, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

VPN's are HARD BLOCKED. you cannot use them at all without Jimbo's approval. sorry man 162.245.178.141 (talk) 21:38, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Cynosure-NULL: welcome to the Teahouse. The IP above is not quite right – Jimbo's approval doesn't enter into it, but it is true that editing using an open proxy is generally not allowed. If you need an exemption, you can see what is required here. You would need to show why it would not be possible for you to edit without going through a VPN. --bonadea contributions talk 22:41, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

how do i get a good account

hello wikipedia overlords, I want to make myself an account (finally). how do you create an account? thanks, 162.245.178.141 (talk) 21:45, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello IP! Just head over to Special:CreateAccount, fill in a few fields, and you're done! If you have any questions as an editor, feel free to ask them here at the teahouse :-) Pahunkat (talk) 21:57, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

wait why is it that I don't have my contributions anymore? Creator of Chaos (talk) 22:01, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Your previous edits are attributed to your IP address 162.245.178.141. Sadly, it's not possible to re-assign edits identified with an IP address to an account; if you want, you can write on your user page that you previously edited Misplaced Pages with that IP address. Kleinpecan (talk) 22:10, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Unfortunate. Thanks for you help Creator of Chaos (talk) 22:14, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello

I was wondering, how do you create these little pages like KY 6116 or KY 3611 on this article: List of Kentucky supplemental roads and rural secondary highways (3500–6999) — Preceding unsigned comment added by TheGs2007 (talk • contribs) 21:52, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

TheGs2007, hello, friend! By "little page," I assume you mean a section. You can easily do that by going into the editor, finding where the section belongs, and typing the heading, like this: == HEADING ==. Then, under your heading, you can type the necessary content (don't forget your reliable references!) and go ahead and publish it. Is that what you wanted to know? Thanks, EDG 543 22:20, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

(e/c) Hi TheGs2007. If you go to one of those sections, and click the side edit link, you can isolate the code that is creating the content you see. I'm not sure which part of the content you are referring to above, but, for example, if you scroll down to the part of the page for KY 6116, it uses section header markup (==Header==) to create the title; below that makes the infobox you see using the template: {{Infobox road small}}, and uses another template, {{-}}}, to create the ending line, below the text. To wit:

==KY 6116==
{{Infobox road small
|state=KY
|type=KY
|route=6116
|length_mi=0.161
|length_ref=<ref name="DMI Ohio"/>
|location=]
|established=
}}
Text of section
{{-}}

You can see how many things work here in the same way (except when they use modules for the output, which presents an accessibility problem in my view). Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:26, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

A minor correction to the description above: the template {{-}} does not create an ending line; it "clears" the content so that one section finishes completely before starting the next, and they don't overlap.--Gronk Oz (talk) 22:35, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Appropriateness of images in an article

I recently removed a significant number of images from Truth (after consensus with other members) because they did not comply with Misplaced Pages:Manual_of_Style/Images. The matter of concern here is an excessive number of allegorical paintings that add no meaningful knowledge to the philosophical topic at hand (which violates the Misplaced Pages style guide. In Justice, There are 12 images in total of the Lady Justice, including particularly artistic interpretations where she is nude and then some large paintings where you can hardly make out the allegory. Of course at least one of these works of art, preferably a sculpture of lady justice outside a house of court should remain in the article, but I feel the remaining 10/11 works of are are a extraneous.

Since I've already done something like this in Truth, I was wondering if I am overreaching by modifying another article with a similar issue. Again, the images break the Misplaced Pages style considerably so should not have been there in the first place. Personally speaking, I took action for Truth because it immediately stood out to me that this is not how a high quality encyclopedia article should look and the changes I made were to move it towards a higher quality article by removing the unnecessary images.

Your feedback on the following questions would be appreciated:

• Since multiple wiki articles have the same issue, which is an obvious break from the style guides, am I missing some unwritten rule that says that articles in philosophy need to be decked in renaissance paintings as if it were the louvre?
• If those renaissance images should be removed, should I go looking around for other articles in philosophy where the same problem occurs?
• Do you have any idea why some Misplaced Pages editors add these figurative paintings to a topic on philosophy? Neither Britannica nor the other more formal philosophy encyclopedias (IEP and Stanford EP) do this, so this must be a homegrown Misplaced Pages aesthetic???

Reference: Previous justification made to removing the images in Truth, Talk:Truth#Improving the quality of images in this article. TranquilDragon (talk) 23:01, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi TranquilDragon. Lots of Misplaced Pages articles which display images of one type or another. Most of the times these might be format/syntax issues, but sometimes they are contextual/copyright issues. If you find any of these articles and you feel you can address the problem, then you can be WP:BOLD and do so. However, it might be wise (particularly if the problem is contextual) to at least check the article's talk page first to see if there's been any discussion about the way images are used being used because a WP:CONSENSUS might exist on the image. If you want to dig even deeper, you can check the page history to see who added the image and perhaps why it was added. A consensus can change over time, but you shouldn't ignore an existing consensus without at at least starting a discussion about it. Anyway, if you remove a file and someone restores, you should treat it like a "content dispute" and engage in talk page discussion, unless there's really clearly a serious problem with the image like a copyright or BLP violation. If you want to going around looking for images inappropriately added to philosophy articles, you can. Cleaning up problem articles is an important part of being WP:HERE and with over six million articles, there's always going to be something that needs cleaning up. You might, however, want to at least discuss what you intend to do on the talk page of the relevant WikiProject (e.g. WT:PHILOSOPHY) to let others in on what you're intending to do. You might find others willing to help, but you might find others with a different take a things who might suggest a different approach. Sometimes doing too much too quickly can attract attention no matter how good your motives are and others might prefer things be discussed first just to establish a consensus one way or the other out of principle.Misplaced Pages is edited by people from all over the world and everyone is a WP:VOLUNTEER; so, why people make certain edits is sort of a mystery in many cases. Many editors think you could never have enough images in an article; so, they add them whenever they can. Most of the time these are just good-faith attempts at improving the article and making it more interesting for readers. I think that's one of the strengths of a "homegrown" project like Misplaced Pages, but in can also lead to some inconsistencies as well that you might not find in a more formal and more rigorously controlled publication like the ones you mentioned. Nobody vets Misplaced Pages edits before they're made; so, the best that can be done is to try and cleanup problems as we find them. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:02, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestions Marchjuly. In the previous article (Truth) there were several attempts by previous editors to get some images removed in the Talk page, but all of these were shut down by another editor on the basis of censorship. Finally when I arrived on the scene, I wrote up a long piece on the fact that it was an unnuanced application of the style guide to call censorship and in fact there were several other issues with including those images as well. This helped me gain a degree of concensus with, I think, three other editors backing me and none against. While I think I could do the same (post on Talk and build concensus), I feel your suggestion to discuss first on WT:PHILOSOPHY would be better since otherwise I would have to write a long justification every time I make similar edits to an article. Besides, I feel like I've condensed some of the common ways the Misplaced Pages style guide is misused in Philosophy articles and this might be helpful for all other Philosophy articles in the future especially since the Philosophy style guide on images Misplaced Pages:Manual_of_Style/Philosophy#Images is pretty sparse and could include several phyilosophy specific applications of Misplaced Pages:Manual_of_Style/Images. A couple more questions:

• How do I find which WikiProject an article belongs to (e.g. Justice -> Philosophy)? Is it from the box at the bottom of the page (this simply takes me to the Philosphy article and not the WikiProject page however)? File:Justice-bottom-box.jpg
• There is a Law portal next to the Justice portal - does this mean the article also belongs to a 'WikiProject Law'?
• Also, does every Misplaced Pages article have a WikiProject it belongs to?

Thanks again, TranquilDragon (talk) 06:11, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

You can usually find out which WikiProjects cover an article by checking the top of the article’s talk page for WikiProject banners. WikiProject banners help with categorization, assessments, etc. and ideally every article probably should belong to at least one WikiProject if possible; however, many do not because whomever created the article either didn’t know about WikiProjects or didn’t think it was necessary. Even when there are banners on the talk page, sometimes they’re might not be really applicable. — Marchjuly (talk) 09:18, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

tools to see who has edited the article and listing which editors edit the same articles

i seem to recall seeing 2 external tools for editors:

1. tools to see who has edited the article and
2. listing which editors edit the same articles

Thanks in advance for your help and kindness! Infinitepeace (talk) 23:10, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

@Infinitepeace: "Page statistics" in a page history and Misplaced Pages:Editor Interaction Analyzer. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:19, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

About Misplaced Pages

How can I can be a much better Misplaced Pages editor? Zahsj (talk) 23:31, 26 March 2021 (UTC)

First, write better Edit summaries. Writing "Changing" for every one of your edits is bad. Second, see what constitutes a 'minor' edit (Help:Minor edit). Third, stop making small wording changes in existing articles when the existing wording has no problems (especially at Good Articles). Fourth, when you update population numbers, you have to provide an update reference. David notMD (talk) 00:41, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@Zahsj: To expand on what David notMD noted about edit summaries, those are there for the benefit of both other editors and you. An edit summary should give those reading the 'View history' section an idea of the kind of changes that were made, not just that a change was made – after all, an edit, by definition, is a change. So for example, in your edit to the article World War II, a good edit summary might have been "Added exact dates to first paragraph in lead section." For more information, please see the 'Help' page for edit summaries. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 08:39, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Notification of Change

Will I be notified is someone changes my information on my page? 2600:6C5E:117F:B839:5D6:2667:21E1:BE7F (talk) 02:15, 27 March 2021 (UTC) 2600:6C5E:117F:B839:5D6:2667:21E1:BE7F (talk) 02:15, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

If you create an account, you can add a page to your watchlist to be notified of changes. Also, you might want to read WP:OWN RudolfRed (talk) 02:20, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Content?

What kind of contents prohibited to be published in Misplaced Pages? Blasius B. (talk) 02:21, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@Blasius B.: Welcome to Misplaced Pages. You can see some things at WP:NOT. Also, everything you add must be supported by a published, reliable source. RudolfRed (talk) 02:24, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

New User would like experienced editor to work with me

Would anyone (experienced editor) be willing to help me establish a sitting politician's wiki entry?

I am new to wiki world, but I am an experienced journalist and copyeditor. Fast learner.

Thanks! Jackson Friedman (talk) 05:39, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi, Jackson, and welcome to the Teahouse! I don't necessarily have to be the only person who can help you out here (other people can jump in too), but count me in if you need any assistance. Would you mind giving the name of the politician just so I can make sure they pass Misplaced Pages's inclusion crtieria? If they don't pass notability guidelines, then there's nothing I or anyone else here can do, but these guidelines are decently lenient, and if the politician does meet them, then I can give you as much help as you need. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 08:24, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Where to report an instance of a shared account

Near the tail end of the discussion on Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Zhou Chengzhou, which some of you may have seen here the other day, the article's creator stated, in attempting to rebut claim that the article was an undisclosed autobiography: "Due to the IP address‘s problems. So I can't use my own account to edit. So I can just only use Zhou Chengzhou's own account to edit. The statement was never edited by him."

I don't think anyone in the discussion picked up on this, but this seems like a direct violation of WP:NOSHARING and an admission thereof, not to mention an admission of undisclosed COI editing. Essentially: "No, this is not an undisclosed autobiography. I actually just know Zhou Chenzhou and am using his account to create and edit the article about him." I was wondering if there's a sockpuppetry noticeboard where I could report this information. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 08:19, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

May be moot, given that the article has been deleted, and the editor in question has shown little interest in editing anything else. David notMD (talk) 10:54, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Swap page title with one of a page title redirecting to the first page

Hi. I have recently made some edits to CGTG-102 including the fact that its name has changed to ONCOS-102. However, I am unable to move the page as ONCOS-102 already existed, and now reedirects to CGTG-102. Is there a way to swap the page titles so that CGTG-102 becomes the redirect, and ONCOS-102 becomes the main page title.

Thanks!

Edit - Misplaced Pages:Moving_a_page#Swapping_two_pages Could do this but I think requires an administrator?

 YorkshireExpat (talk) 10:52, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@YorkshireExpat: Done. No history swap was needed, because the redirect did not have a major page history that needed preserving. (This could have been requested using {{db-move}} ({{db-move|1=page to be moved|2=reason}}), or by posting to WP:RM#TR). Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 12:59, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Is "The Kid Icon"a notable figure?

 The Kid Icon (talk) 11:44, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

The Kid Icon Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. That depends on who you are, what you do, and whether or not independent reliable sources give you significant coverage. Note that Misplaced Pages discourages autobiographical articles, see WP:AUTO. 331dot (talk) 11:47, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Based on , no. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:59, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Another attempt at autobiography

Hey, I am new to Misplaced Pages and today tried to publish an article about myself, but it declined, please help me Rshtun1993 (talk) 13:04, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

(Added a section title) David notMD (talk) 13:21, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages is not a website host. Nothing in what you submitted (Draft:Rshtun Babayan) suggests you qualify as Misplaced Pages-notable. Rather, it is promotional of your business. Articles require refs written about the topic. David notMD (talk) 13:25, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Further, Rshtun1993, they require independent references. Nothing said, written, or published by you or your associates will count. --ColinFine (talk)

Primary versus secondary sources

If I'm using a source that is published by a reliable secondary source but the content is an interview with the subject of the Misplaced Pages article is that then a primary source? If the source heavily relies on what the subject of the Misplaced Pages article said that seems less like a secondary source and more like a primary one. TipsyElephant (talk) 13:28, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@TipsyElephant: There's a nice essay about this at Misplaced Pages:Interviews. GoingBatty (talk) 14:09, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Draft Delete

Help me to delete this article Draft:Falguni Nayar, because it is not written in formal tone/ encyclopedia model. Kindly help me to delete that draft. Logical Puzzle (talk) 13:44, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@Logical Puzzle: Welcome to the Teahouse! If the only problem with the draft is that it is not written in a formal tone, you could help reword the draft, or provide suggestions on the draft's talk page. If the draft does not become an article, it will be deleted after 6 months of inactivity. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 14:13, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

(e/c) Hi Logical Puzzle. Assuming this is not improved and resubmitted, the draft will be deleted after six months of inactivity under section G13 of the criteria for speedy deletion (CSD). Unless you find that a draft meets some other basis for speedy deletion (e.g., it's a blatant copyright violation from it's first revision and meets CSD G12, or is such a blatant advertisement that it meets CSD G11), G13 is the normal way drafts are deleted, if not accepted. The only other option is to list it for a deletion discussion, at Misplaced Pages:Miscellany for deletion (MfD), but generally speaking it's a waste of community resources to take up time on deletion discussions for the average draft, when it will be ministerially deleted in the normal course under G13.

I don't see anything unusual about this draft that would make it a good candidate for MfD, nor do I see any other speedy deletion basis that applies. And not incidentally, it's not that bad a draft. You say it's not written in the necessary "formal tone..." That's not a deletion basis and is exactly what the draft space is good for: a place to incubate a proposed article so things like lacking a suitable formal tone can be fixed. Meanwhile, I think your edits tagging it with numerous speedy deletion tags that do not apply, continuing to do so quite a few times, and blanking the content, are inappropriate and rather disruptive. Please stop doing that. Thanks--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 14:31, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Logical Puzzle temporarily blocked from editing the article in question. LP created account on 26 March, and all edits have been attempts to delete draft or cut content from the draft in question. David notMD (talk) 14:46, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

I want to create an article about Ajay Goenka

hi, i want to create an article about Ajay Goenka. i want an editor to see if this article will be accepted or not before i begin editing. i mean anyone can tell me if Ajay Goenka is a notable person or not. thanks in advance. Ismail2212 (talk) 14:26, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Ismail2212 . What would be needed to make an assessment of his notability—the evidence needed on which to ground an opinion as to whether creating an acceptable article would seem possible—is the existence of a number of reliable, secondary, independent sources that treat him in substantive detailTemplate:Z21 on which an article could be written with verifiable content. Without knowing which Ajay Goenka your post regards (there appear to be multiple individuals with that name), conducting any sort of targeted search for the right type of sources, with a sufficient depth of treatment of him, seems a difficult task. Also, since you are the person who is interested in creating such an article, I think would be best if you did that legwork. Being aware of the standard, if you were to post back indicating the sources you have found, we could then take a look and advise further based on them. Please remember though: you're looking for sources of a very specific type. I emphasize this because we often see people advised to look for reliable, secondary, independent sources with substantive treatment, and in reponse we see a mix of sources that are one or more of "unreliable", "primary", "connected" ones, that "merely mention" the subject. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 14:47, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

thanks Fuhghettaboutit. I am talking about Dr.Ajay Goenka. i can provide sources like Google news, is that enough? can i create it in my sandbox then submit it for review before publishing? thanks!!😁 --Ismail2212 (talk) 15:23, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Your sandbox is fine Ismail2212 for a very preliminary draft that others can take a quick look at. Don't worry about making it comprehensive. Just add your own words to summarize what you find in four or so good (see above) sources. Or you can go for the full WP:AfC process and formally submit it when ready. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:56, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Ismail2212, nad welcome to the Teahouse. Google News is not a news source: it is an aggregator, which collects news items. Some of them are from reliable sources, some are not; some will be independent of the subject, some may not be. Your citations should in most cases not even mention Google News, but should name (and link to) the actual source, so that people reading can easily judge whether it is likely to be a reliable source or not. --ColinFine (talk) 18:27, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Drafts

is there any way to get your draft reviewed faster or do ya just gotta be patient? Gandalf the Groovy (talk) 15:34, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@Gandalf the Groovy: The draft template suggests adding WikiProject templates to the talk page, and you're already doing that. Other than that, you just have to be patient. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 15:50, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

New Article and Editing on Wiki

Thanks for inviting me to the Tea House. I'm loving Misplaced Pages.

My account is just 3 days old.

1. How do I submit my article to the live space so its visible to all?
2. I have photos from our official photographer but Misplaced Pages keeps showing error messages when I try to upload/submit them. How can I bypass this problem?
3. Lastly, how do I create/add a template/box showing details like name, occupation, siblings, spouse on the right side of my article?

These will be helpful so I can contribute more and also help edit some of the content I have seen so far. Mister Ishmael (talk) 17:42, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Mister Ishmael Your draft, at User:Mister Ishmael/sandbox appears to have a copyright conflict with https://www.accessgambia.com/information/oko-drammeh.html and also possibly with https://thepoint.gm/africa/gambia/article/profile-of-oko-drammeh-gambian-music-promoter. In addition none of the content has in-line references. I leave your other questions to other Teahouse hosts. David notMD (talk) 18:02, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Mister Ishmael, and welcome to the Teahouse. It's nice to be able to welcome new, enthusiastic editors to Misplaced Pages. Unfortunately, you have chosen to underake the hardest task here - that of creating an article about a subject you are connected with, and with no prior editing experience or understanding of what is and isn't allowed. It is often best to spend some time making small edits to existing articles and gradually building up experience - rather like driving a car for the first time.

In its present form, your article at User:Mister Ishmael/sandbox stands little chance of being added to the encyclopaedia, although it is possible that the subject might be meet our notability criteria. You clearly indicate that you are connected with the subject, so please declare your Conflict of Interest, as described here. But if you are being paid, or an employee, then you must follow the guidelines at WP:PAID to disclose your connection. Please don't try to bypass the issue over photographs - if you did not take them, then you have no right to release them for commercial re-use. Only the copyright holder of the image can do that. Focus more on making the article more like a readable encyclopaedia page, and less like a biased, promotional CV. Try The Misplaced Pages Adventure to gain more experience of editing and ensure you stay Neutral at all times. I could say more, but I am being called to dinner! Kind regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 18:08, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Indeed, Mister Ishmael, I echo what Nick Moyes said. Your question is a bit like saying "I'm new to building, but I've built a house and I want to know how to put the windowsin and the roof on". Unfortunately, until you have learnt the craft of building, and surveyed the land to make sure that it is fit to build on (= investigated whether your subject meets Misplaced Pages's criteria for notability), your house will probably fall down around you! --ColinFine (talk) 18:54, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

What is wrong with this draft?

Can you specify the errors in this article: https://en.wikipedia.org/Draft:European_Clinic_Maldives Nabyl8899 (talk) 17:55, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

(created section title) David notMD (talk) 17:57, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

The declining editor explained what was wrong with the draft. In short, it has no reliable, secondary sources. You can's use a .jpg on Commons as a source, nor the website of the organisation to show notability in Misplaced Pages's rather specific sense. Mike Turnbull (talk) 18:35, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Rejected article

Why Da fuck was my article reejcted? Its about my YouTube channel!!! FaarizPlayz (talk) 18:13, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@FaarizPlayz: Welcome to the Teahouse. Your channel does not meet Misplaced Pages's notability standards. Also, writing about yourself is strongly discouraged. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 18:16, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

• @FaarizPlayz, to expatiate on what Tenryuu already told you above, which was/is very much apt, The problem is joining the collaborative project with the primary aim of using it as a medium to promote yourself constitutes what Misplaced Pages is definitely WP:NOT. Furthermore please tone down the invectives, cursing isn’t welcome here either. Celestina007 (talk) 18:39, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

In addition to the above, you referred to the reviewing editor as a "bich" (sic) and told another they suck. That's not a great way to start. Please read WP:NPA PrincessPersnickety (talk) 21:37, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

When you say “it wasn’t constructive” when I added some information to some articles, what do you mean by constructive? How do I make the information I add constructive?

 Epictrex (talk) 20:11, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Epictrex, and welcome to the Teahouse. You'll have to ask Donald Albury why he reverted your edits, but I'm guessing that it's because you added information and changed dates without providing any sources. You could reply to him on his user talk page, or on your own, pinging him; but since I've pinged him here, he'll probably see this discussion and answer you here. --ColinFine (talk) 20:24, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Epictrex, You have been adding fringe theories to articles without even attempting to cite reliable sources. I doubt you will find any source that the community regards as reliable that makes any connection between prehistoric cultures in Florida and Mayan civilization. If you think you have found a reliable source that does make such a connection, I advise you to introduce it on an article's talk page, and do not try to introduce such material into an article until and unless a consensus has been reached that such material and source(s) may be used in an article. - Donald Albury 22:05, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

please help me i am trying to give the kathak dancer her due respect by adding her name under her image but the bot is removing it every 12 hours what should i do

 Himanshushukla433 (talk) 20:57, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@Himanshushukla433 everybody wiki is not something we can add here. Fiddle Faddle 21:04, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

I shall expand that, a bit. To state a fact, Misplaced Pages should have a Reliable Source, which is defined at great length in WP:RS. When something is said about a living person, the rule is most strictly enforced. Autobiography does not do the job. Something said in a blog or a wiki does not. For example, Misplaced Pages does not serve the purpose of a Reliable Source. Think if it were not that way. If the way Misplaced Pages knows something is true is, some other part of Misplaced Pages says so, we've got a circle unconnected to the real world. The site you are using, Everybody Wiki, is even worse, since for the most part nobody is checking and deleting unsupported statements. So, Misplaced Pages cannot say a thing is true just because that other Web site has a page that says it is. Jim.henderson (talk) 21:41, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Help

Guys, I do apologise for the editing of said pages, but i really need some help here please I'm trying to make some changes to a few Misplaced Pages pages i.e. Top Gun Maverick, Snake Eyes G.I. Joe Origins and List Of Paramount Films 2020-2029 but there's a user called Zack41Attack who claims my sources aren't accurately I literally always double check before editing. This user also believes that these websites are unreliable sources. skydance.com/film/top-gun-maverick and deadline.com/2020/08/paramount-pictures-new-republic-pictures-10-picture-cofinancing-deal-top-gun-maverick-1203018250/ MOVIEFAN2001 (talk) 22:41, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@MOVIEFAN2001:@FaarizPlayz: The movie studios’ own websites are considered primary sources and so you should avoid using them if you can find a better source. Also WP:AGF. TimTempleton 23:00, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Reviewers

WikiPedia, please provide better reviewers. Those reviewers are not telling what is causing the article to be rejected. They should leave better and more details telling me why they're rejecting. FaarizPlayz (talk) 22:55, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, FaarizPlays, and welcome to the Teahouse. I suggest you have a very careful read of What Misplaced Pages is not, because you clearly have no idea at all what Misplaced Pages is. It is a volunteer project: everybody who edits and manages it is here because they are choosing to spend their time helping to build an excellect encyclopaedia. That includes the reviewers, so Misplaced Pages has no way of "providing better reviewers". We don't have enough reviewers as it is, because reviewing is time-consuming and often difficult. The reviewers have told you precisely why your draft has been rejected: because promotion of any sort is forbidden on Misplaced Pages. Misplaced Pages has little interest in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Misplaced Pages is almost entirely interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If enough material is cited from independent sources to establish notability, a limited amount of uncontroversial factual information may be added from non-independent sources. If such sources exist about you, then we could have an article about you. It would not belong to you, you would not control what was in it, and it would be based on what those sources say, not on what you say or want to say. --ColinFine (talk) 23:15, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, FaarizPlayz. The reviewer left the following comment: "Zero independent sources and no indication that you pass WP:GNG." Your references are to your own work. That is not acceptable. You appear to be writing an autobiography, which is strongly discouraged. Please read Your first article. Please also read the conflict of interest policy, and the notability guideline for entertainers. It is your obligation to show that you are notable and to write a draft that complies with policies and guidelines. Cullen Let's discuss it 23:22, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Re: Misplaced Pages: Content Analysis, "Additional annotation" to sources as suggested Misplaced Pages:Citing sources does not seem to work.

Problem solved. But in "Misplaced Pages:Citing sources", where you write, "Sometimes ... it is useful to include additional annotation in the footnote, for example to indicate precisely which information the source is supporting", I recommend you explain to users HOW to do that. (Would you like to learn my way?) Surial57 (talk) 03:16, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

What if I find a reliable source to a “fringe theory”? Will my edits to the topic not be undone? Also, how do I correctly cite a source on Misplaced Pages? I tried to cite my source with proof that the ancient Mayans settled in Florida.

 Epictrex (talk) 04:38, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

Epictrex, welcome to Teahouse. Have a look at WP:CITE, WP:REFB, WP:IC, and WP:YFA. These links describe how referencing is done. –Hulged ⟨talk⟩ 04:46, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

Why did my edits to a certain article get undone even after I cited my source?

 Epictrex (talk) 04:45, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

Can I get in any form of trouble if I keep on redoing undone edits?

 Epictrex (talk) 04:55, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

• Misplaced Pages Teahouse
• Misplaced Pages help forums