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Voted Movie of the year by Empire
Empire magazine listed The Dark Knight as their movie of the year.
Joker hijacked the bus?
In the article on the plot of the film it say The Joker hijacked the bus after blowing up the hospital. Was there any evidence in the film that proves he hijacked that bus? I am asking because I've seen this movie several time now and although I always wondered why they allowed him on the bus, I didn't see any threatening gestures or weapons from The Joker as he got on the bus and I didn't see any of his henchmen either. I guess we could assume they were on the bus but for that sake of accuacy in the article it should be made clear if any evidence exists if he hijacked the bus. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.48.130.33 (talk) 16:41, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
- I wonder if that was the bus he drove in the opening credits. Still, it's not too important is it? Alientraveller (talk) 17:09, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
- I doubt he got on the bus (the same one Anthony Hall's character was pulled onto), and then asked them to let him off at another stop. Especially when the kidnapped people were doctors, nurses, and patients that he was holding hostage at the end of the film (they clearly say "clowns are hostages, doctors are the target"). Since they evacuated the hospital, it would be rather difficult to suggest that he grabbed a completely separate group of doctors/etc on his way to his hideout. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 18:05, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
- More telling is that the police recognize that one bus is missing from the convoy, and joker later uses the hospital staff as hostages. I'll try to look at the scene tomorrow for more.ThuranX (talk) 07:42, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
- I noticed that when he hops on the bus a shadow of him is seen slowly sliding down like he was laying on the bus hiding. Other then that i have no idea how he hijacked the bus. Jimlavalamp (talk) 22:02, 31 December 2008 (UTC)JimLavaLamp
- Somewhere on youtube I found a deleted scene of the Joker riding the bus, and never even looking back once to see all the destruction he caused. On the voiceover you hear a director or something of that sort giving info, and out of that info you can make up that it is the hyjacked bus from the hospital explosion. The scene was found on a british bluray 2disc special edition I think... This is my first post here, so I don't know if I'm allowed to post links, but this is the scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V13oMUD4La8&feature=related Hippodo (talk) 22:09, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
- I noticed that when he hops on the bus a shadow of him is seen slowly sliding down like he was laying on the bus hiding. Other then that i have no idea how he hijacked the bus. Jimlavalamp (talk) 22:02, 31 December 2008 (UTC)JimLavaLamp
- More telling is that the police recognize that one bus is missing from the convoy, and joker later uses the hospital staff as hostages. I'll try to look at the scene tomorrow for more.ThuranX (talk) 07:42, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
- I doubt he got on the bus (the same one Anthony Hall's character was pulled onto), and then asked them to let him off at another stop. Especially when the kidnapped people were doctors, nurses, and patients that he was holding hostage at the end of the film (they clearly say "clowns are hostages, doctors are the target"). Since they evacuated the hospital, it would be rather difficult to suggest that he grabbed a completely separate group of doctors/etc on his way to his hideout. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 18:05, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
Set the record straight
1- When Harvey Dent gets half of his face scarred, he stops being Harvey Dent and becomes Two Face. He doesn't see himself as Dent, so you shouldn't refer to him as "Dent", either.
And YES, unlike Iron Man and The Incredible Hulk, that name is actually used within the movie:
Two Face: Do you remember the nickname they gave me when I was in Internal Affairs?
Commissioner Gordon: Yes
Two Face: Say it.
Comissioner Gordon: Harvey, I...
Two Face: SAY IT! SAY IT!
Comissioner Gordon: TWO FACE! TWO FACE! Harvey TWO FACE!
Two Face: Why should I hide who I truly am?
2- The Joker's clown face is NOT make up! That's how his actual face looks like.
Read "Batman: The Killing Joke".
So, please stop referring to the Joker's clown face as "makeup" in-universe.
3-"Gordon's wife and son" have names. They are Barbara Gordon Sr. and James Gordon Jr.
In addition, the little girl we see is Barbara Gordon Jr. That's why neither Batgirl nor Robin will appear in the Nolan movies: they are both little kids at the time the movies are set.
4- Given that this is a sequel, stop deleting me pointing out which actors come bacvk from Batman Begins.
- First, please start all new threads at the bottom. Second, Dent does not go by the name. He talks about how the name he got while working in IAD ("Two-Face") is fitting given his now scarred face. No one, after Dent and Gordon's conversation, ever calls him "Two-Face", not even Dent himself. They never actually say that the Joker's face is permenantly colored, please do not cite a comic book as the source that proves this movie. Unless someone in this movie says it then it doesn't matter what the comic says. As for Barbara Gordon Jr., that name is never given in the film either. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 12:19, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
- I think Gordon's wife's name is in the film. I think when Gordon comes "back from the dead" and his wife answers the door he says "Barbara...?" and she slaps him. Wrad (talk) 04:53, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
Sorry but in the film the Jokers clown face is make up, we see his un made up face when he disguises as a police man at the funeral march —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.241.127.220 (talk) 12:46, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
In "The Dark Knight Featuring Production Art and Full Shooting Script" the shooting script refers to Harvey Dent as 'Dent' through the entirety of the screenplay. It only treats Two-Face as an alias. However I don't have any pages scanned at the moment to cite. Also During the robbery in the beginning of the film the two clown/robbers have the conversation about The Joker wearing 'make-up' and actually refer to it as 'war paint'. Tsurettejr (talk) 19:13, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
- Right, it is stated that the Joker wears make up. Not to mention that most of the statement by the original poster are original research. Grsz 19:23, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
Production: burning real money?
Hey. Today I read in the Star Phoenix (a Saskatchewan newspaper) that during the production of The Dark Knight, the Joker burned a pile of real money. Actual cash. The article is here:
http://www.thestarphoenix.com/Entertainment/more+dignified+movies/1142426/story.html
and it was originally written in the National Post (a bigger Canadian newspaper). Is this confirmed anywhere else?
Megosoles (talk) 03:58, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
- Highly doubt that they burned real (American) money, as it is a federal offense per Title 18, Section 333 of the United States Code. – LATICS talk 04:55, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
- Unless it was "real money" that the Treasury Department had removed from circulation (they're usually shredded, if memory serves); at that point, it wouldn't qualify as a "bank bill" anymore. And I would imagine a good special effects guy could probably glue the shreds back together (maybe onto other pieces of paper) in such a way as to make it look real enough for the camera, and that should be safe to burn... I'm just throwing stuff out here though, no idea if it was real money or not. - 208.247.73.130 (talk) 01:09, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
- Maybe the top of each stack of bills that was close to the camera was real. Everything else would have been just green sheets of paper. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.213.120.190 (talk) 05:03, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
- "I only ran over him a little bit, your honor."
- Seriously, the source seems more a rant than a reliable source of that info. I'd think something like that would make a bit more of a splash. - Arcayne () 17:58, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
The Crow
I know this could probably end up as sort of original research, but does Brandon Lee's The Crow by no means influence the design of Heath Ledger's The Joker somehow? Because I found some similarities, besides their ominous deaths. --Mato Rei (talk) 05:27, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
Added soundtrack reception (again)
Well, someone took out my edit about the score, and I chose to let it go. Another user commented "what are score reviews doing in the production section?" (can't remember who, beacuse they erased my comment on the talk page as well), and I thought it was fair enough. I would have kept my mouth shut, except for my stumbling upon the article for Alien vs. Predator (film) which also has soundtrack reviews on THE PRODUCTION SECTION, under "Music". Now, if I see the soundtrack reception on AvP is taken out, I'll give it a rest. But if it's still there, well, why shouldn't we also add a reception of Zimmer and Howard's soundtrack? --Surten (talk) 05:48, 22 January 2009 (UTC)Surten
- In this article? Because it's already long enough that we don't need to focus on those aspects of the film. The soundtrack has its own page, so the reception for the soundtrack should go on that page instead of on this one. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 05:54, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
- Then what about the AvP article? If it that section on the soundtrack is erased, I'll cut it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Surten (talk • contribs) 06:00, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
- Besides, it's just three lines of text. It's not an excessive amount of information. It could use a little trim on the description of the composition process. You said it, there's already an article to the album. Why include it here? --Surten (talk) 06:05, 22 January 2009 (UTC)Surten
- We're not trying to match the Alien vs. Predator article. Articles don't have to be the same as others. – LATICS talk 06:06, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
- I already told you. If the reception in AvP is erased, it'll be the last you'll hear from me about this particular thing. --Surten (talk) 06:10, 22 January 2009 (UTC)Surten
- We're not trying to match the Alien vs. Predator article. Articles don't have to be the same as others. – LATICS talk 06:06, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
Took out "excessive information" that belongs in the Soundtrack article, not the movie's article
All of the following is too much info for a general article about a film, and it belongs on a more detailed soundtrack article:
"Zimmer originally said the main Batman theme was purposely introduced at the end of Batman Begins, and would be fleshed out in the sequel as the character develops. Zimmer and Howard both realized that creating a heroic theme that a viewer could hum would ignore the complexity and darkness of the character. That the heroic theme is audible only twice, early on in the film, creates what Zimmer described as a "red herring", a kind of musical foreshadowing.
...which Zimmer claimed Nolan fully memorized.
...Zimmer compared its style to that of Kraftwerk, a band from his native Germany, as well to bands like The Damned."
It's all here, if you want to add it back. --Surten (talk) 06:18, 22 January 2009 (UTC)Surten
- Why yes, I think we'll try to make the article about the film and the music in it stand alone as much as possible. Alientraveller (talk) 11:31, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
- Kept bit on Kraftwerk, willing to leave others in soundtrack article. Alientraveller (talk) 11:51, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
- Thanks. Sorry for the whole fuss, y'all. --Surten (talk) 02:59, 23 January 2009 (UTC)Surten.
- Kept bit on Kraftwerk, willing to leave others in soundtrack article. Alientraveller (talk) 11:51, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
Dendermonde nursery attack
This section has been reverted from the article without explanation, save for the fact hat I should find a consensus for inclusion beforehand. Usually, that would be an appropriate defense for someone adding crufty, uncited or unrelated material, but such is not the case here. We have citations (1, 2, 3) from reliable sources notably making the connection (and I am sure that there will be more) connecting the event to a deranged individual's identification with a character depicted in this movie. I've tagged the section as a current event. If someone wants to delete it - and I am not at all convinced that it should be - we need to discuss how we are going to overlook the presence of connecting citation. - Arcayne () 17:42, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
- I think its good information but I don't think it belongs on this page. Maybe it could be linked in a "see also" section but it has no direct correlation to the movie. Yes, it may have been inspired by one of the characters in the film, but in the section you provided, "Any formal link between the attacks and the movie were formally discounted by De Gelder's lawyers." Bovineboy2008 (talk) 17:59, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
- Fair enough, but it isn't our function to be evaluating the PR statements by Mr. Gelder's attorneys; our function is to note the information (maybe even including the his attorney's formal statements) that is clearly cited and connected. Gelder's attorney's can say all they want. We have at least three sources noting the connection, and the litmus for inclusion is verifiability. We have verification, and until the current event info (ergo the template noting such) develops into noting that the massacre was inspired by Beatles lyrics or Twinkies, we should go with a heavily-cited connection to the film. - Arcayne () 18:09, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
- This incident already appears on the Joker page, where it is far more relevant than the movie. The cop compared him tot he Joker, not to heath Ledger; making that bit of synth is above our pay grade. Over at that page, coverage has been minimal, because of the Recentism and changing nature of a current event. All we've really got is one officer saying HE thought it looked like the joker, and lots of media hullaballoo because that's what the 24 hours news industry does, churns out FUD for profit. In a few days, it'll transition to him being a 'evil goth kid', then to the truth, mentally unhinged idiot. I see no reason to include it here. ThuranX (talk) 18:45, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
- Further, Arcayne, it's a barely related current event, you were bold and added, it was reverted, so per Bold,Revert, discuss, bringing it here was perfectly appropriate. ThuranX (talk) 18:47, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
- As well, one source is in another language, and a blurb. The other two admit it's unfounded speculation. One early report attributed the comparison to the Joker to an unnamed officer; I haven't seen that attribution repeated since, which suggests that it was a conjured citation based on some unattributable commentary, and when the police refuted it, it became 'speculation' in the general sense. Unless we can get a statement that the police are actively reporting that it was Joker-related, it shouldn't be on any page, and unless specifically Ledger's Joker related, it doesn't belong on this one. ThuranX (talk) 18:51, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
- (ec) Respectfully:
- the incident is connected via the source material to Ledger's portrayal, not Cesar Romero's, Jack Nicholsen's or Mark Hamill's - which means that it arose out of this film.
- even if we only have "one officer" saying he thought it looked like the Joker, we have solid citation that he did in fact say that.
- we aren't fortune-tellers, ThuranX; we have no idea what will eventually emerge as truth. Until then, we note the coverage connecting the incident to the film, and be prepared to update, revise or remove the material once more information is made available.
- Additionally (and with respect), your personal assessment of "barely related" is just that - your personal, uncitable assessment. As well, edit summaries, including polite ones, rather help matters, wheras empty or snarky ones do not. It is equally typical when reverting good faith material out to initiate discussion. That didn't happen here. And when prompted, I initiated it here.
- (addressing comments missed in edit conflict) Further, Misplaced Pages doesn't rule out sources because they are in a foreign language, especially when there exist numerous web-tools to translate the foreign language link. While I freely admit that the testimony of witnesses is usually caca, we don't get to evaluate that - the media source is reliable, we are able to verify the statements, and we can - as I noted above - adjust accordingly if more information demonstrates that the event is unrelated to the portrayal in the film.
- (ec) Respectfully:
- Maybe you can "cross the street" now. - Arcayne () 19:01, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
- Goldwasser, Dan (2006-11-02). "Breaking the Rules with Hans Zimmer, Part 3". soundtrack.net. SoundtrackNet. Retrieved 2006-11-03.
- ^ Martens, Todd (2008-06-02). "Zimmer Brings 'punk attitude' to Batman with 'The Dark Knight'". Los Angeles Times. Tribune Company. Retrieved 2008-06-04.
- Gallo, Phil (2008-07-14). "A different kind of 'Knight' music". Variety. Retrieved 2008-07-15.
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