Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Spitfire (talk | contribs) at 19:33, 23 May 2009 (Reverted edits by 89.123.103.136 to last revision by LessHeard vanU (HG)). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Buenas suerte

Take care, Eddie. I hope you decide to come back. —Viriditas | Talk 13:15, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm not abandoning WP altogether, I'll still come back from time to time. :) Eddie, Monday April 17 2006 at 02:09

That's good to hear. Take care and be safe. —Viriditas | Talk 03:24, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I don't think an unblocking is appropriate at this time. At minimum, this block will stand for at least 24 hours while we sort things out. --HappyCamper 04:45, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Fine, let it be that way, but I want you to know that it was User:Bunchofgrapes that started all this by nominated exicornt to be deleted. Now he blocks me because in his opinion, mentioning the word in wikipedia is a crime. Eddie 04:48, 25 May, 2006 (UTC)

The User That Blocked Me

The Bunchofgrapes|user that blocked me has caused me a lot of suffering on this site. We had a fight over a word that he nominated for deletion months ago. He hates the word so much that he suggested that any mention or inclusion of this word be consider vandalism.

I posted an {{unblock}}

In any case I will wait 24 hours and see if my request gets fulfilled.

Any user with sysop right can email me and we can talk outside of WP.

I'm letting the block stand for now - I'm writing a response to this, so it will take a bit of time for that. I have this page on my watchlist. I can't guarantee that I can respond immediately, but I will visit it periodically. --HappyCamper 05:36, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

As the first user who originally confronted Eddie, and asked him many times to stop what he was doing, I support this block. Eddie has had many chances to reform, and instead has deliberately chosen to disrupt Misplaced Pages instead of becoming a valuable contributor to rail-related articles. I'm sorry Eddie, I wish things had turned out differently, but these choices belong to you and you alone, and you have chosen to be a vandal instead of a Wikipedian. I hope in the future you will decide to truly change your ways. Until that time, take care. —Viriditas | Talk 06:28, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

A response

This is in response to this followup post. I'm assuming the IP address is yours. Yes, I can see that Bunchofgrapes was the nominator for that article, and was also involved with your recent indefinite block. Perhaps from your perspective, that particular pair of actions appears to be "unfair" or "unethical". I don't know how to change this perspective to alleviate the problem, other than to lift the original block, and replace it with an identical one of my own. At the moment, this seems to be the most reasonable thing to do. Now, there is some discussion about it here and here (near the bottom), so ultimately, the block will be subordinate to the opinion expressed there.

At minimum, I'm sure you recognize that some of your actions on Misplaced Pages of late have been less than productive - there is CheckUser evidence to substantiate this, for example, see 1 and 2. I would characterize this sort of behaviour as somewhat chronic (considering the AfD was months ago), and unfortunately, your recent use of Misplaced Pages's resources inclines on the side which does not support the case for you to be unblocked readily.

At the moment, what I can do for you is the following: I will keep this page on my watchlist for a little bit, so if you wish to respond to this, you are more than welcome to. I can't guarantee that I will respond immediately since I have other priorities to attend to, but I will visit this page periodically, at least for the next little bit. Based on my experience here, if you want to contribute more to this project, one option is to start over from another account, and preferably one that would distance itself from the terminology you wanted to introduce to Misplaced Pages. Up to this point, it simply has not been substantiated to an encyclopedic level which satisfies the community at large. Perhaps you have a differing opinion on the matter, and perhaps the system may be blind towards your wisdom. However, the negative associations with that word have been exacerbated now, and I imagine it to be rather difficult to overturn that sentiment at large.

If you do choose to make another account, it would be quite possible for other administrators to detect this, and based on current policy, I imagine there would be an inclination to block any additional accounts you might make. Should and when that happen, we'll talk more about it then. In the meantime, it would probably be a healthy thing to refrain from editing a little bit. Some of your actions today have upset a number of things, and it is in your interest to wait a little bit longer so that more people would be willing to listen and attend to your concerns. We'll see how things unfold. I hope this helps. --HappyCamper 05:52, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure what sort of resolution you wish to achieve - do you simply want to continue editing from your old account? As far as I'm concerned, that shouldn't be a problem. However, especially after today, I don't think the community is quite as open to trusting you just yet. My suggestion is to wait at least a little bit before requesting an unblocking. --HappyCamper 07:11, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

The problem I have with this block is that it originally came from a user that was fighting with me over the "exicornt" term. He hates the word, anytime i mention it, he calls me a "vandal". Im not here to mess up wikipedia pages.

Yes, I would like to be able to edit using this username. While I don't edit often, I doubt trying to post a word that's hated by another user merits being blocked indefinately by that very same user. However, I will wait a few days before I tag here with an {{unblock}} request. -- Eddie (email) 07:37, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Please don't request an unblock, Eddie. It just clutters up the backlog. Your case has been agreed on by at least five admins at last count (see WP:ANI), and the CheckUser evidence is hard to disprove. You will not be unblocked, at least not in the near future. Perhaps you might like to try in a month, but not in a few days. Also, please stop editing from IPs, otherwise your unblock request in the future may be compromised by accusations of block evasion. NSLE _(T+C) at 07:43 UTC (2006-05-26)

Response to your Email:

Eddie: No. Stop being silly. I haven't made the decision to block you alone by any means, as you know. This isn't about rivalry, or a content dispute, and if you genuinely don't understand that, I'm sorry. Finally, threatening continuing vandalization if we don't unblock you is not a negotiation tactic that has ever gotten anyone unblocked. —Bunchofgrapes (talk) 22:35, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:HenryBigg.jpg

Thanks for uploading or contributing to Image:HenryBigg.jpg. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is not a suitable explanation or rationale as to why each specific use in Misplaced Pages constitutes fair use. Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale.

If you have uploaded other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on those pages too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Misplaced Pages page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free media lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Chillum 05:50, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Unprotected

This talk page is now unprotected to allow you to appeal your ban. You probably know how to use templates, the one you want is {{unblock}}. Any rationale should directly address the reasons for your banning, which were: vandalism, sockpuppetry and harassment. Guy (Help!) 22:09, 18 April 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, I really appreciate it. I also would like to thank TML for His effort in trying to resolve this issue in Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration. I finally feel like I am getting somewhere after nearly three years of frustration.

Though I'm not quite ready to use the {{unblock}} template, I will address the three reasons You mentioned above:

1. Vandalism: While it's true I exausted everyone's patience back in 2006 for trying to recreate an articdle about a word I coined, I soon gave up trying to repost it. As for the recent incidents, that was not Me (I cannot prove it, but I can tell You I don't edit wikiquote or wikinews, and the deleted content contained a lot of vulgar language, and simply don't talk that way)
2. Sockpuppetry: The excessive number of accounts I had were created out of frustration and a few of them were attempts to return as a constructive user. See Voltron's edit history. I wasn't trying to come back and do all the stuff I did back in 2006. I've tried a few times to contact arbcom by email but no one responded and I felt that trying to email arbcom was getting no results.
3. Harassment: After a few months, I've emailed and apologized to the user who I argued with. He's accepted the apology and I have not contacted or interacted with Him ever since. Incidently, He was the user that started the AFD discussion. He also originally blocked Me during the ANI discussion after Essjay made His claim before I had a chance to reply. After I argued, I was unblocked and then immediately reblocked by user HappyCamper.

I am open to Email, but I would love to have this resolved on site (either on this page or ANI). The reason is that I want this to be discussed in a way so that I can come back under limited conditions that everybody agrees on. I know I still have some opponents who would never trust Me ever a bit and would not want to see Me return, but I don't think a permanent injunction from editing makes sense because I tried to recreate a rejected article numerous times. After all, what usually happens to such a page? It is blacklisted. The article title "Exicornt" is blacklisted (i.e. protected indefinitely from creation) and only an admin can create an article with that name. Therefore -- issues aside -- I can assure You that I won't return as the person I was in 2006. I hope everyone understands that. Eddie, Monday April 20 2009 at 00:07 00:07, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

1. Request for clarification: EddieSegoura ban appeal attempts Discussion on WP:RFAR
2. Creation of the AFD discussion
3. Essjay's claim that I and the throwaway accounts logged in from the same static IP Address, as opposed to AOL
4. Exicornt's page creation protection The page can only be create by a sysop user.

Ban appeal

Hello, EddieSegoura. This is to notify you that your request for a ban appeal has been deferred to the Misplaced Pages Community and is now (or will shortly be) posted at WP:AN#EddieSegoura Ban Appeal. To permit you to respond to comments and questions posted in that discussion, the section below has been transcluded onto that page. Any comment you make in the section below, above the <noinclude> tag, will appear on AN for other users to see. If you have any questions, please feel free to post them below or email me at hersfoldwikigmail.com.

For the Arbitration Committee, Hersfold 01:11, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Comments from EddieSegoura

This section is transcluded from EddieSegoura's talk page to permit him to comment in this discussion. Please make comments or questions directed to EddieSegoura in the section above. Thank you. Hersfold 01:11, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

First, I'd like to thank those who supported my appeal. I didn't expect many to support giving Me the clean slate I've been trying to attain. Of course, I understand Sarah's concerns. And yes, I see that I have some opposition to My return (users Friday and EdJohnston). The stuff back in 2006 I did was out of frustration. Being blocked indef in itself was hard enough, but I couldn't take the fact that it was the very same user who nominated my article for deletion. Everything I did after that was out of frustration. But a couple of months after the block, I finally let it go. I felt that if the word has become so infamous and rejected their is no reason to further waist My time. That was then. I doubt that I would make any further attempts to repost anything related to the article that led to me being in this position.

That being said, I cannot go back in time and change history. All I can say is that I truly regret it. I want to come back a different person.

As for my run-ins with bunchofgrapes, I decided to email an apology to him and he accepted it (I don't know if I still have his response, but we haven't had any contacted ever since and He hasn't edited actively). So if I'm banned for harassment, then the issue itself is resolved in respect to that person.

Those issues aside, If I am allowed to come back, their would be no reason to edit with another account beside this one. That addresses the socking issue. I hope we can reach a conclusion that every agrees with. EddieSegoura 05:06, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Just to let everyone know, I have received emails from Carcharoth (talk · contribs) and Hersfold (talk · contribs). I would like to suggest the following in regards to Sarah's comments above:

• The user that performed the check on EddieSegoure (talk · contribs) do a WHOIS on the IP the account edited on, it might beling to public computer (such as a library or internet cafe) Also I need a time frame as to whether or not the "other account" logged in immediately after EddieSegoure. If there is a substantial amount of time between the edits then I probably have nothing to do with the other editor and the only connection is the IP itself. Eddie, Friday April 24 2009 at 22:53 22:53, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Yes, we could do that, or you could simply quit playing games, put your cards on the table and be honest. I am sure that you are right and the IP of your socks resolves to a public computer - you told me you didn't want to use New York Dreams to edit from your home computer and the checkuser who originally checked the NYD account told me that if it was you, you'd learned to cover your tracks very well. So I'm quite sure you've been very carefully segregating your accounts. I don't want to oppose your return to Misplaced Pages and I would actually like to see you given another chance but I'm going to have to oppose this request unless you put your cards on the table and identify the accounts you've been using so they can be blocked (after all, you won't need them anymore, right?). You told me that you couldn't help yourself when it came to Misplaced Pages, that you were addicted to the site and couldn't stop editing, so I don't believe for a second that you haven't been editing over the last year and don't have any socks at present and I'm extremely disappointed that you are trying to side-step being honest with the community. Surely after being banned for all this time and finally having a realistic opportunity to be allowed to return legitimately, it is worth being honest and transparent? Please answer these questions: have you been editing over the last 6 months? What unblocked accounts do you have access to? Thanks. Sarah 07:41, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

I'll be happy to (I'd rather do it offsite) but we need to draw a line between the one that actually belong to Me and the one You think belong to Me. Looking at the list of accounts that were tagged there are a couple that I know don't belong to Me. Some don't even have edits. Frankly, I kinda wonder how You managed to find out about My NYD account. I would prefer we discussed by Email, because I need to know who and why You're targeting some editor and why You suspect Me of being that person. Eddie, Saturday April 25 2009 at 10:48 10:48, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

I understand your concerns, but I can explain it. I can tell you that I did user the IP user:38.109.64.162 to post My appeal. A WHOIS clearly states is a Library IP. Now if some other editor happens to edit from that IP in the future, You'd natually assume all future activity would belong to Me, right? That's why I need to know EddieSegoure's last IP so I can determine if it's public or not. Eddie, Saturday April 25 2009 at 20:18 20:18, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

I don't really see any benefit in you answering my questions off-site. These are reasonable questions which the community deserves honest answers to. It should be straightforward to answer those two questions - either you have been editing over the last six months or you haven't, either you have currently active socks or you don't. I think the community deserves an honest and straightforward answer here on this page or your request should be declined. I found the NYD account by recognising your writing style - simple as that. Sarah 10:22, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

To Keegan: I've tried many times to come back with a new account as a good standing user (Voltron, NewYorkDreams, etc.). Had I been left alone, then I wouldn't have had to make this appeal. It's clear most of the oppose users are people that have known Me in the past. It's clear to Me can't change their minds but I wish they'd stop looking at Me as a gangster that who likes to drive people crazy and start looking at Me like a human being. I'll be happy to discuss any recent activity but You can't assume everything You suspect is true. If You'd ask, "Eddie does Account X belong to You" and I say "No", You'd prolly insist I'm lying and that I really own it anyway. Therefore we need to draw a line between what I actually did and what You believe I did. This is especially important because if I am unblocked and during the probation period You suspect that another account is Mine, You'll assume it actually is and I'll be back here singing the blues. I'm happy that I finally have an opportunity to try and convince the community — as a whole — that I'm not the person I used to be. I can't let it slip up because of some suspicion that I can't clear up. I know I'll have a short leash for the first few months but I want to make it clear that I am trying to come back so I can drive people crazy. I'm trying to come back so I can have something productive to do with My time. Yes, I've had a shaky past, but it doesn't mean I can't change right now.Eddie, Saturday April 25 2009 at 11:13 AM

I appreciate you taking your time to read my comments and reply to them.

Your activities have not been destructive, but they have been disruptive. For years. Your alternate accounts have not been hunted down as you imply on this page (particularly your response to Sarah), but I am a firm believer that a tiger can't change its stripes. I am not making a personal judgment upon you; I am a very understanding person. It is from this understanding that I do not believe that you can uphold your part of the bargain. Your socks were found because of evident patterns in your editing.

Let me see how diplomatically I can put this:

A community ban, while insulting in nature of its title, is not reflection of you as a person. It means that you (personally, as oppossed to a block) don't belong here. We don't get along with you, you don't get along with us. You still don't now. I can't see why you'd want to return to the site considering the nature of comments like my own. If you want to build an encyclopedia, you can/could have through actually changing your behavior. If you had done so, your socks would not have been found. Persistence in trying to overturn a community ban after have continued disruptive behavior will never be favorable to an unban.

If you had chosen to just make a new account and leave this be, it is a violation of the ban policy but I wouldn't care on a personal level, and would turn the other cheek. Your two years of socking and this and that is way too much drama, and it is drama of your own making.

You can respond to this, of course, but I think I've laid it all on the line regarding my opinion and it's not going to change. I do wish the best, Keegan 08:39, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

You are entitled to Your own opinion. Still, knowning their haven't been any incidents since February 2008 I feel I should get that second chance. Eddie, Sunday April 26 2009 at 10:59 AM

The fact that their are people who support My return means that not everyone agree that I should never come back, there were few people I didn't get along with but most of the time there wasn't a problem. In fact, some are not around today. The few that do know Me have commented, and not all of them oppose. Eddie, Sunday April 26 2009 at 11:40 AM

"I've tried many times to come back with a new account as a good standing user...Had I been left alone, then I wouldn't have had to make this appeal." - So in other words, the problem isn't with you or your behaviour and actions but rather with the editors who identified and reported your sockpuppets and the administrators who blocked them? Sarah 10:22, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

It's the way it was handled in the first place. I can not deny My past action was wrong and yes I understand spamming and harassment are serious. But Going back to the 2006 discussion, I feel I was blocked prematurely. I never had a chance to state My case. I was blocked only minutes after the discussion was started. What about Voltron? Were their any annoying incedents when I used that account? The blocking user (I don't want to even mention His name, because He Himself has history of questionable actions) had to admit in an ANI discussion that the account wasn't disruptive. After that I wrote to You and after You told Me You could not help Me further I created NYD. I don't know how who told You I had that name, but trying to convince You that I don't have hundreds unblocked unused accounts won't be easy.

Re, I am writing about the discussion back in 2006, the original discussion makes no initial proposal for banning, just a block. Since the policy clearely distinguishes the two, I felt the original block (and protecting of my talk page) was too extreme. The protection especially hurt because I had no way to resolve it without making more accounts. Like I said above, emails to the arbcom were not answered and I felt I was being ignored. I feel appalled that people like You could entertain thoughts of Me making plans to go back to My old self and (secretly) make hundreds of accounts. I still don't know who exactly You're trying to hang My face on and why You believe these belong to Me. I am going to contact ArbCom and have them decide whether or not it this should be handled on WP:RFAR or not. Eddie, Sunday April 26 2009 at 23:43 PM

PS I got Your emails and I will respond shortly. Eddie, Sunday April 26 2009 at 10:59 AM

The account didn't need to be disruptive, however. You were editing while under a community ban and thus under the block and ban policies the account could be blocked. Whether the blocking administrator has had problems in other areas is not really relevant and I don't think it serves your case to engage in ad hominem arguments. No one told me you were using the NYD account. I simply noticed the account on my watchlist, felt something was "not right" about it, looked at their contributions and recognised your writing style. Same goes with the Power Ranger accounts. Sarah 11:14, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

(after ec) Also, you cite Voltron and NewYork Dreams as examples of attempts to return to Misplaced Pages as a user in good standing, however while using both these accounts you were concurrently socking with disruptive accounts (eg User:Grounded into a double play and the Power Ranger accounts). Can you please address this and explain why Voltron and NYD should be considered examples of good faith attempts to become a user in good standing when it appears you were simply segregating your edits and causing disruption with other accounts. Thanks. Sarah 11:05, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Okay, You win for NYD editing simultaniously with other accounts (when GIDP was blocked it was involved in a dispute as to whether or not a certain article should be posted) but how do You explain Voltron (I know You're going to tell Me about the account that tried to appeal on My behalf but then again why wasn't user TML — who initiated the request on WP:RFAR — suspected as an account of mine while that other one was?) Eddie, Sunday April 26 2009 at 11:33 AM

I think I can answer part of this question for you: the other account that tried to appeal on your behalf had no other edits aside from the appeal. I, on the other hand, have a sizable amount of edits, and my edits do not resemble your editing style in a way that would closely link my account to yours. (BTW, I stated on the original inquiry that "I have no relation to this user" - and I reaffirm that statement, as I have nothing to hide regarding this issue.) TML (talk) 18:53, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Please don't attempt to close the discussion on WP:AN. Just because it ended up at the top of the page and the vote tally is about 50/50 (and I am including the ones before Sarahs comments) that doesn't mean it should be closed. I call on the ArbCom to make a decision as to whether I should have them deal with this by email or if this discussion should continue on WP:AN.

I also noticed that VirtualSteve is retracting his support and there are still people who are entertaining thoughts that I plans to create and use more account do what got Me into this to begin with. That being said, and given the fact that the ArbCom is privyy to checking IPs I am making a request to check the following:

• User:EddieSegoure's last IP (Sarah said it was checked so it should be in the log) for any recent activity. This IP belongs to a wifi hotspot.
• User:Malmindser's last IP if it was checked. This user was the first to appeal on My behalf and it was tagged as belonging to Me but I deny this given the language used.
• User:24.185.34.186's recent activity. The last IP of User:Grounded into a double play. This was blocked by Alison for 6 months and has expired in August 2008
• User:24.185.47.131's recent activity. The last IP of User:The Blue Lion. The talk page was protected but recently unprotected.
• User:38.109.64.162's recent activity. As I stated above this is a library IP (has three more anon edits after My posting).

The following accounts were recently created by Me:

• User:PrimaDoll- Unused.
• User:PuzzleSolver - Made a few edits, but after the block of NYD I felt it was much safer to edit anon since their is no point in making further accounts only to have them blocked. I obviously am going to have to check edit histories and articles but if You feel any edits from these IPs raise any red flags, feel free to ask any questions. Eddie, Sunday April 26 2009 at 23:43 PM

Community ban

Eddie, I have closed the discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators'_noticeboard#EddieSegoura_Ban_Appeal as having formed no consensus to lift your ban at this time. Kevin (talk) 21:33, 28 April 2009 (UTC)