This is an old revision of this page, as edited by SlimVirgin (talk | contribs) at 01:47, 11 September 2009 (→Request for clarification: Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Lyndon LaRouche 2). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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Requests for clarification

Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification/Header

Request for clarification: Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Lyndon LaRouche 2

List of any users involved or directly affected, and confirmation that all are aware of the request:

• Leatherstocking (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) (initiator)
• SlimVirgin (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA)

Statement by Leatherstocking

I have received a message on my talk page from SlimVirgin, informing me in a very convoluted way that she believes that an edit I made "violates the spirit of BLP and the LaRouche 2 ArbCom case" and that "If that kind of editing continues," I'm "likely to be subject to sanctions." She also mentions that she is "writing this as an editor, not as an admin." I find this very strange for several reasons. Her argument against using a court filing as a source () may have some merit, although normally one would simply raise the issue on the article talk page and not leave a threatening note. I am concerned because SlimVirgin recently made an unsuccessful attempt to get me in trouble at the ANI board (,) and this appears to be a follow-up effort. My specific questions are as follows:

1. What on earth does this have to do with Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Lyndon LaRouche 2? SlimVirgin claims that I'm "editing about someone perceived as an enemy of a movement you support." I'm not sure who is doing the "perceiving" here, but I looked on the two main LaRouche websites and found no mention of A.J. Weberman.. I also find SlimVirgin's accusation that the LaRouche movement is "a movement that I support" to be outrageous and unfounded. I made this sufficiently clear at the ANI discussion.

2. Is SlimVirgin's accusation that I am a supporter of the LaRouche movement a violation of Misplaced Pages:Requests for_arbitration/Lyndon LaRouche 2#Caution to SlimVirgin on personal attacks?

3. This morning I restored material that I felt was improperly deleted by SlimVirgin, in this edit. This afternoon, she deleted it again, along with related material, in this edit, in which she cites Misplaced Pages:Requests for_arbitration/Lyndon LaRouche 2 as justification. Is this a permissable interpretation of LaRouche 2? It appears to me that SlimVirgin is arguing that Dennis King, or any other person "perceived as an enemy" of LaRouche, may not be criticized at Misplaced Pages, no matter for what reason and no matter how well sourced the criticism. By her logic, if anyone adds material critical of King or others, that person is transformed into a supporter of LaRouche, and is therefore, by her unusual interpretation of LaRouche 2, not permitted to edit.

Statement by Will Beback

Leatherstocking has been engaged in forum shopping, posting complaints in the last week to WP:ANI, WP:BLPN, Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring, Misplaced Pages:Neutral point of view/Noticeboard , and Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement. Regarding Leatherstocking's assertion that he does not support the LaRouche movement, virtually all of his 1000+ edits have been to LaRouche-related topics or to critics of LaRouche. Inevitably, he's added positive material or deleted negative material from the LaRouche articles, while adding negative material to the articles about critics or their projects. Despite his protests, I don't think his assertions of being disinterested are credible. I am currently compiling diffs to show the many occasions on which he's edit warred on behalf of a banned user, or to add LaRouche material to the project. As for Slimvirgin's concern, I'm not sure I agree with her view that it violates WP:RFAR/LL2. However if the ArbCom is interested in this case, I'd urge them to wait until all of the evidence can be assembled.   Will Beback  talk  01:25, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

Statement by SlimVirgin

1. Leatherstocking is clearly a LaRouche editor. He says he's not, but his entire contribution history (since 2007) says otherwise. He edits articles about LaRouche, and about LaRouche's "enemies," and about the friends of LaRouche's enemies, to add material that would be favoured by the LaRouche movement. When he's not doing that, he's posting on the BLP, RS, and NPOV noticeboards, or on AN/I and AE, trying to cause problems for editors who oppose him. Every request to Leatherstocking to change his ways causes him to file more complaints or requests for clarification (like this one), which takes up yet more time.

2. My warning to him today concerned this edit, which includes in the lead of A.J. Weberman that Weberman manages Dennis King's website. Dennis King is LaRouche's biographer, widely disliked within the LaRouche movement. The edit was a BLP violation because it was based on a court document that no secondary source has written about and, further, was posted on a dubious website. BLP says: "Exercise great care in using material from primary sources. Do not use ... trial transcripts and other court records or public documents, unless a reliable secondary source has already cited them."

3. In addition (and this is a separate issue from the BLP violation above), the LaRouche 2 ArbCom case cautioned named LaRouche editors not to edit Dennis King or make edits about him elsewhere. Although the ruling does not name Leatherstocking, the spirit of the ruling certainly applies to him. It says: ... the remedies applied in Lyndon LaRouch 2 are applied to Cognition, and the general ban on LaRouche-related article editing is expanded to include Chip Berlet, Political Research Associates, and Dennis King (and their talk pages).

Georgewilliamherbert is the admin who's been keeping an eye on LaRouche issues, so I told him about my warning to Leatherstocking, and asked if he would look out for the BLP issues.

Will knows more about this editor than I do, so I'm not in a position to provide more diffs about him at this point, in case more are needed. SlimVirgin 01:46, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

Statement by other user

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