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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. No credible s0urcing has emerged so the policy based arguments here are the ones for deletion Spartaz 04:28, 27 December 2009 (UTC)

Impulse Tracker

Impulse Tracker (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log • AfD statistics)

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Previously deleted by Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Schism Tracker, this article has no independent sources and no apparent statement of notability. Guy (Help!) 14:26, 19 December 2009 (UTC)

• Delete: I can't find significant coverage for this software. Joe Chill (talk) 16:04, 19 December 2009 (UTC)
• Keep: While significant coverage in books and/or the press is lacking, this software was tremendously important. For starters, it gets 50,000+ Google hits. Countless musicians who later went on to greener pastures have used it when starting out, i.e. Andrew Sega, Brothomstates, Jonne Valtonen, Infected Mushroom, and many others. Impulse Tracker was used to create the soundtracks of important games, such as Unreal and Unreal Tournament (see Unreal Tournament soundtracks), Age of Wonders, Chrono Resurrection, etc. No, I can't provide citations for these claims from books, articles in academic journals, etc., simply because tracker music has never been subject of books or academic journals. But I'm sure something can be done, some info gleamed from interviews, etc. For instance, here is a mention of Sega's IT experience. --Jashiin (talk) 16:26, 19 December 2009 (UTC)

Please see WP:RS and WP:V. If coverage is lacking, we are not allowed to compensate by using junk sources. Misplaced Pages is not a directory and WP:ILIKEIT does not count either. It's already been deleted once due to inadequate sourcing, if you want it kept you need to add non-trivial coverage in reliable independent sources, not just say that you're sure they must exist somewhere. Guy (Help!) 10:06, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

Exactly how Salon.com is a junk source? Or any of these:

* Gamasutra, which has an article on how Impulse Tracker was used to make music for The Sims DS/GBA: .

* The Times of India, which has an article about how Infected Mushroom started out using Impulse Tracker:

* Thescene.com.au, same subject:

* Epic Games's official page for Unreal music, mentioning modified IT format used for the soundtrack:

Etc. Since I'm not sure of your definition of "junk", I'm not adding these to the article yet, but simply use them here to demonstrate the importance of the software in question. --Jashiin (talk) 10:28, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

They should have been in the article if you want them considered as sources. The Gamasutra article is not a good reference showing notability. It is one sentence about this software, along with mentions of other software that have been used by an artist. We want several significant length coverage of this piece of software not an article on some artist who mentions offhand that he has used the software on one project. I didn't review the rest of your sources and do not speak for JzG. Miami33139 (talk) 11:10, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

The salon reference, as it applies to Impulse Tracker, is useless. Miami33139 (talk) 11:12, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

So basically, what you're saying is that it isn't enough that the software was used to create soundtracks of not one but several influential video games, and it is not enough that the software was used by influential musicians? But if there were a separate article dedicated exclusively to the software, that would show notability? Isn't this, um, against common sense? --Jashiin (talk) 11:18, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

No. Miami33139 (talk) 11:30, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

Excellent rebuttal, dude —Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.48.133.2 (talk) 21:36, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

These links show IT mentioned in passing. Perhaps enough to verify the software for use in a broader article (per my redirect suggestion) but nowhere near enough for WP:N. Marasmusine (talk) 11:37, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

• Redirect to Tracker (music software) or simply delete - I've been looking for sources for over a year now. I've no doubt that its popular - even influential - but if there's no way to base this on reliable sources then we shouldn't have an article on it (per WP:V policy). Marasmusine (talk) 17:00, 19 December 2009 (UTC)
• Delete per Marasmusine. Miami33139 (talk) 22:04, 19 December 2009 (UTC)
• Keep: per Jashiin. Guaka (talk) 01:34, 20 December 2009 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Software-related deletion discussions. -- Pcap ping 16:31, 22 December 2009 (UTC)
• I tried to search for sources and found some evidence that published articles about this tool exist: И.РОЩИН. Изменение порядка каналов в модулях Impulse Tracker - it looks like the article about Impulse Tracker in this issue of the magazine was three pages long. Unfortunately, I didn't find the full text of this article available online for all to view. --Sspeik (talk) 17:44, 22 December 2009 (UTC)
• And here is another article from a computer-related magazine, discussing work with Impulse Tracker in detail (only a google saved copy is available, but as it was on the site of the magazine, it was most probably published in that Russian magazine "Мой Компьютер" somewhere in 2002). --Sspeik (talk) 17:50, 22 December 2009 (UTC)
• Significant article about work with this software in Computerra: . --Sspeik (talk) 17:59, 22 December 2009 (UTC)
• If someone has this book: Mason McCuskey. Beginning game audio programming - please look, there may potentially be a significant coverage piece about this software. --Sspeik (talk) 18:30, 22 December 2009 (UTC)
• Keep or possibly redirect. I'm not sure. I do find numerous references to the software but by and large they appear to be passing references, or examples of a musician saying "I use Impulse Tracker" but do very little to elaborate beyond that. I searched Google Books but it does not tell me what Beginning Game Audio Programming‎ has to say about it. Beyond that I found a few text magazines called "Static Line", "Trax Weekly", and "Demo News" ie making reference to it, and I guess if we can cite the "Wrestling Observer Newsletter" for BLP articles about professional wrestlers we might as give this subject the same treatment and benefit of the doubt. JBsupreme (talk) 08:16, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

KEEP No, i don't either have encyclopedic or verifiable contents about IT, other than the datestamps of countless files on old hard disks -- of the program itself, and of music created by myself and many others using Impulse Tracker. However, if there's no article about such a landmark piece of software on this site, this isn't Misplaced Pages anymore. Delt01 05:10, 24 December 2009 (UTC)delt. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Delt01 (talk • contribs) *** sorry, didn't do the signature thing right.... *sigh* delete IT from wikipedia, is this a fucking joke????

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.