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Discussion at Talk:Space Race § NPOV issues

 You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Space Race § NPOV issues. 204.15.72.92 (talk) 12:37, 4 July 2022 (UTC)

Discussion at Misplaced Pages:Neutral point of view/Noticeboard § NPOV issues in some sections at Space Race

 You are invited to join the discussion at Misplaced Pages:Neutral point of view/Noticeboard § NPOV issues in some sections at Space Race. 204.15.72.92 (talk) 20:10, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

Apollo–Soyuz‎

Hey JustinTime, I was’nt after a debate on who won the space race. My main issue was that quote was out of context for that article. The reason why I added the bit about contraversy was I tried to make a compromise edit with Bilcat, but they just reverted both my edits Ilenart626 (talk) 21:20, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

I'm well aware of the edit history, thank you. We still need to thoughtfully reach consensus on whether or not to mention some think it the end. Many times, reaching consensus requires some debate. JustinTime55 (talk) 21:42, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

Citations on Space Age

Hey Justin, I had added a BBC foreign language citation into the article which you reverted under "citation overkill". Just for your information it is partially a result of an ongoing discussion at WP:NPOVN#First_human_spaceflight, and on the verge of going to WP:RFC due to it on a tense stalemate.193.233.171.17 (talk) 12:56, 20 July 2022 (UTC)

Thank you, I'm aware of the NPOVN. You are the one which seems to be defying consensus; another user, ‎@Ilenart626: has also removed your citations from the other two, citing lack of consensus. As the Overkill essay says, simply coat-racking more citations to support your side can be bad form. A Chinese version of BBC doesn't really add anything to verify Gagarin's first spaceflight (which is not in contention anyway). JustinTime55 (talk) 16:05, 20 July 2022 (UTC)

As Chipmunkdavis might say, "tense stalemate" is certainly one way to describe all other editors agreeing that your suggestions are bad. TompaDompa (talk) 14:13, 20 July 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for the support; glad to see I'm recognized as a "subject matter expert". I've stayed out of the fray; it seems like way too much WP:Wikidrama being made of a dispute which should be easily resolvable by growing the hell up and presenting the verifiable mainstream facts in a NPOV way. These facts are without lack of historical consensus:

• Gagarin is acknowledged as first human in space and in orbit; as the FAI decided, it's a trivial technicality he didn't land in the craft.
• Shepard is the first American in space; also first to control his spacecraft and land in it (but no cigar as far as "first in space" goes).

The FAI's pedigree to acquire jurisdiction as the world's authority on spaceflight (strikes me as) a bit dubious, given they were an airsports association; nonetheless, they have become so recognized.

The Ukranian war is tragic, but really has nothing at all to do with this. JustinTime55 (talk) 16:05, 20 July 2022 (UTC)

You're welcome. By this point can that passage be pared down to something like "first to control his spacecraft and land in it" with the Praxis citation? That "land in it" is also a bone of contention between me and User:TompaDompa since for them it's like putting Dyomin's "first grandfather in space" on those articles. If this can be resolved amicably then the RFC would not be needed, saving everyone's time. 193.233.171.17 (talk) 16:28, 20 July 2022 (UTC)