Misplaced Pages talk:Help desk

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Ca (talk | contribs) at 02:01, 19 June 2023 (add merge template). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Revision as of 02:01, 19 June 2023 by Ca (talk | contribs) (add merge template)(diff) ← Previous revision | Latest revision (diff) | Newer revision → (diff)

IMPORTANT NOTE:
DO NOT ASK QUESTIONS HERE, unless they are about the help desk itself. Go to the help desk to ask questions about how to use Misplaced Pages.

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Help desk page.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14Auto-archiving period: 45 days

To help centralize discussions and keep related topics together, the talk pages for templates related to the help desk redirect here. Centralized discussions

Template talk:HD

Misplaced Pages Help NA‑class High‑importance

	This page is within the scope of the Misplaced Pages Help Project, a collaborative effort to improve Misplaced Pages's help documentation for readers and contributors. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks. To browse help related resources see the Help Menu or Help Directory. Or ask for help on your talk page and a volunteer will visit you there.Misplaced Pages HelpWikipedia:Help ProjectTemplate:Misplaced Pages Help ProjectHelp
NA	This page does not require a rating on the project's quality scale.
High	This page has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

FAQ: How-to guide for those answering questions

This page was nominated for merging with ] on 19 June 2023. The result of the discussion () was Withdrawn.

Archives

1. Up to January 2006
2. January to April 2006
3. May to October 2006
4. October 2006 to early May 2007
5. May 2007 to February 2008
6. March 2008 to April 2008
7. May 2008 to early January 2009
8. January 2009 to August 2009
9. August 2009 to July 2011
10. July 2011 to May 2013
11. June 2013 to August 2015
12. August 2015 to October 2018
13. October 2018 to July 2022
14. August 2022 onwards

This page has archives. Sections older than 45 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III.

DENY and help desk posts

Way too often I see a user post something that is intentionally inflammatory and meant to evoke a specific response from people (such as this). I know we should assume good faith, however if a post is obviously inflammatory and is obviously meant to get a specific response (Such as claiming an article does not contain the "truth" or whatever) we should just delete it and move on rather than respond to them and engage with the troll. ― Blaze Wolf_{Blaze Wolf#6545} 03:35, 21 February 2023 (UTC)

I'm not convinced that such comments should be deleted out of hand. I think they should be calmly and succinctly responded to, and then quietly dropped. I can readily believe that such a commenter is a troll merely stirring up drama for the lulz; I can also readily believe that such a commenter is making a good-faith attempt to correct Misplaced Pages. In the latter case it would be unfortunate to delete their comment instead of redirecting their good-faith energy to a more productive use.But it's surely unnecessary for editors to unproductively pile on further comments when the first reply alone was beyond sufficient. Let one or two people reply helpfully, then let the matter rest. Shells-shells (talk) 08:09, 21 February 2023 (UTC)

I am almost sure that specific case is not a troll. We get religious nutcases of all stripes once in a blue moon (maybe more often at the WP:TH?), and it’s always dead serious. Blaze Wolf, I suggest you modify your closure rationale (with something like "unproductive discussion" rather than "attention-seeking inflammatory post") - though if you don’t I will obviously not edit war over it.

I mostly agree with Shells-shells except that we should not try redirecting their good-faith energy to a more productive use. I think that someone who leaves such a comment cannot contribute productively to Misplaced Pages in the short term (in the long term, people change). The probability they come back to edit Misplaced Pages for anything else than arguments or vandalism (again, in the short term) is less than 1%. However, it is still polite to reply to a good-faith if misguided question, and to put on a good show for the rest of the page dwellers. Tigraan 09:41, 21 February 2023 (UTC)

I don't think comments like those should be dismissed automatically, and I've seen people of all kinds on here who write as if they're trolling but are being genuine. Besides, if someone is actually trolling, the best thing to do is not feed them and let it remain unanswered and automatically archived. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 16:30, 21 February 2023 (UTC)

I agree that is the optimal response, but in order to arrive at it literally everyone who edits the help desk has to be on the same page and not take the bait. So, in practice a quick "this isn't a help desk matter" reply and hatting of the thread is probably more effective. Beeblebrox (talk) 18:17, 21 February 2023 (UTC)

English Misplaced Pages will be read-only for about an hour on 1 March

See this post at VPM. The test starts at 14:00 UTC and will last up to an hour. Some confused folks might ask about it here afterwards. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 23:22, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Open meeting for RecentChanges patrollers

Editing is hosting a meeting about their new mw:Edit check extension for the visual editor this Friday and hopes to learn a bit more about RecentChanges and watchlist patrolling. They're trying to find a balance prompting editors to add citations often enough to be useful, but not so often that it's annoying.

If you are interested in this project, please see mw:Editing team/Community Conversations#3 March 2023 and plan to join the meeting (17:00 UCT/9:00 a.m. California). Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:00, 1 March 2023 (UTC)

Bot linking here

As an FYI, Qwerfjkl (bot) 18 has recently been approved. This task notifies users if they have made a referencing error, with a link such as this one, leading users to post questions on the Help Desk. — Qwerfjkl talk 16:44, 18 April 2023 (UTC)

I apologize for the misunderstanding

I thought that the possibility of publishing content on wikipedia was discontinued, I apologize KodBake (talk) 14:04, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

Merger proposal

withdrawn Carpimaps 01:58, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
I propose that WP:Help Desk be merged into WP:Teahouse. First, Help Desk and Teahouse practically achieves the same goal, that being a venue to gain help with "using and editing Misplaced Pages. I get that Help desk is intended for experienced editors and Teahouse is for newbies, but it is never explicitly stated on any of the banners these help forums have. I believe this division is unnecessary. Volunteers resources are split into two different venues and it may confuse new editors. However, I see that we may need a separate venue just because of the plain volume of the questions being asked in Teahouse. I am leaving this up for community consideration. Carpimaps 00:22, 19 June 2023 (UTC) Idea Lab discussion for reference Carpimaps 00:24, 19 June 2023 (UTC) Support They are almost exactly the same venue we could split the help desk into different categories like what we do with the Reference Desk Qwv (talk) 00:32, 19 June 2023 (UTC) In essence we have two different categories now. 331dot (talk) 00:36, 19 June 2023 (UTC) Carpimaps Hello. It would have been nice if you had asked us here and at tbe Teahouse(not at the VP) what we thought of this idea before you made a formal proposal. As you've been told, the missions and audiences of the two pages are different. To be frank(for which I apologize), it doesn't even seem like you are too invested in your own idea. I oppose this proposal, and my gentle suggestion is that you withdraw it. 331dot (talk) 00:33, 19 June 2023 (UTC) There is already one support !vote, so I will be leaving this up for a little bit longer. I will withdraw when I see that the consensus is not favorable to the proposal. Carpimaps 00:58, 19 June 2023 (UTC) Okay, although the support is basically asking for what we have now. 331dot (talk) 01:11, 19 June 2023 (UTC) Oppose. When I answer questions on the Help Desk, I use the standard WP shortcuts that any regular user should know as I expect that to be the audience here. Over at the Teahouse I will assume that the person asking questions is completely unfamiliar with how the encyclopedia works, and as such would describe things in much more detail. Different target audiences. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 01:41, 19 June 2023 (UTC) Oppose. Both do serve different purposes, Help Desk is for the more experienced Wikipedians & accordingly has a more straight to the point style. The Teahouse is more for newer people to Misplaced Pages & aims for a gentle welcoming style with greetings. Teahouse even sends out welcome messages for new participants inviting them to stop by. Help Desk does currently advise that new users might feel better served at the Teahouse "If you are a new editor, you might prefer to ask your question at the Teahouse..." at the top of the page. So two different tasks being catered to with distinct styles for doing so. I feel the loss by merging of the distinct Teahouse community that dedicate time to helping would have nothing but an adverse affect. All the different help pages on Misplaced Pages have a certain amount of overlap in the questions being asked but I don't see any benefit in merging any of them to make one enormous help page, that just sounds like something that would be overwhelming to those seeking help & those trying to help alike. One monster help page would most likely end up being split for convenience, into what we already have now. ;) LooksGreatInATurtleNeck (talk) 01:51, 19 June 2023 (UTC) The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

withdrawn Carpimaps 01:58, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

I propose that WP:Help Desk be merged into WP:Teahouse. First, Help Desk and Teahouse practically achieves the same goal, that being a venue to gain help with "using and editing Misplaced Pages. I get that Help desk is intended for experienced editors and Teahouse is for newbies, but it is never explicitly stated on any of the banners these help forums have. I believe this division is unnecessary. Volunteers resources are split into two different venues and it may confuse new editors. However, I see that we may need a separate venue just because of the plain volume of the questions being asked in Teahouse. I am leaving this up for community consideration. Carpimaps 00:22, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Idea Lab discussion for reference Carpimaps 00:24, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Support They are almost exactly the same venue we could split the help desk into different categories like what we do with the Reference Desk Qwv (talk) 00:32, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

In essence we have two different categories now. 331dot (talk) 00:36, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Carpimaps Hello. It would have been nice if you had asked us here and at tbe Teahouse(not at the VP) what we thought of this idea before you made a formal proposal. As you've been told, the missions and audiences of the two pages are different. To be frank(for which I apologize), it doesn't even seem like you are too invested in your own idea. I oppose this proposal, and my gentle suggestion is that you withdraw it. 331dot (talk) 00:33, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
There is already one support !vote, so I will be leaving this up for a little bit longer. I will withdraw when I see that the consensus is not favorable to the proposal. Carpimaps 00:58, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
Okay, although the support is basically asking for what we have now. 331dot (talk) 01:11, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
Oppose. When I answer questions on the Help Desk, I use the standard WP shortcuts that any regular user should know as I expect that to be the audience here. Over at the Teahouse I will assume that the person asking questions is completely unfamiliar with how the encyclopedia works, and as such would describe things in much more detail. Different target audiences. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 01:41, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Oppose. Both do serve different purposes, Help Desk is for the more experienced Wikipedians & accordingly has a more straight to the point style. The Teahouse is more for newer people to Misplaced Pages & aims for a gentle welcoming style with greetings. Teahouse even sends out welcome messages for new participants inviting them to stop by. Help Desk does currently advise that new users might feel better served at the Teahouse "If you are a new editor, you might prefer to ask your question at the Teahouse..." at the top of the page. So two different tasks being catered to with distinct styles for doing so. I feel the loss by merging of the distinct Teahouse community that dedicate time to helping would have nothing but an adverse affect. All the different help pages on Misplaced Pages have a certain amount of overlap in the questions being asked but I don't see any benefit in merging any of them to make one enormous help page, that just sounds like something that would be overwhelming to those seeking help & those trying to help alike. One monster help page would most likely end up being split for convenience, into what we already have now. ;) LooksGreatInATurtleNeck (talk) 01:51, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Categories: