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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Alalch E. (talk | contribs) at 15:24, 19 June 2023 (Undid revision 1160925283 by Dr P Soni (talk) this is the talk page where things are discussed, it's not a page on which to put writings about homeopathy). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.
Serious encyclopedias: Serious and respected encyclopedias and reference works are generally expected to provide overviews of scientific topics that are in line with respected scientific thought. Misplaced Pages aspires to be such a respected work.
Obvious pseudoscience: Theories which, while purporting to be scientific, are obviously bogus, such as Time Cube, may be so labeled and categorized as such without more justification.
Generally considered pseudoscience: Theories which have a following, such as astrology, but which are generally considered pseudoscience by the scientific community may properly contain that information and may be categorized as pseudoscience.
Questionable science: Theories which have a substantial following, such as psychoanalysis, but which some critics allege to be pseudoscience, may contain information to that effect, but generally should not be so characterized.
Alternative theoretical formulations: Alternative theoretical formulations which have a following within the scientific community are not pseudoscience, but part of the scientific process.
Some common points of argument are addressed in the FAQ below, which represents the consensus of editors here. Please remember that this page is only for discussing Misplaced Pages's encyclopedia article about Homeopathy.
To view an explanation to the answer, click the link to the right of the question.
Q1: Should material critical of homeopathy be in the article? (Yes.)
A1: Yes. Material critical of homeopathy must be included in the article. The articles on Misplaced Pages include information from all significant points of view. This is summarized in the policy pages which can be accessed from the Neutral point of view policy. This article strives to conform to Misplaced Pages policies, which dictate that a substantial fraction of articles in fringe areas be devoted to mainstream views of those topics.
Q2: Should material critical of homeopathy be in the lead? (Yes.)
A2: Yes. Material critical of homeopathy belongs in the lead section. The lead must contain a summary of all the material in the article, including the critical material. This is described further in the Lead section guideline.
Q3: Is the negative material in the article NPOV? (Yes.)
A3: Yes. Including negative material is part of achieving a neutral article. A neutral point of view does not necessarily equate to a sympathetic point of view. Neutrality is achieved by including all points of view – both positive and negative – in rough proportion to their prominence.
Q4: Does Misplaced Pages consider homeopathy a fringe theory? (Yes.)
A4: Yes. Homeopathy is described as a fringe medical system in sources reliable to make the distinction. This is defined by the Fringe theories guideline, which explains: We use the term fringe theory in a very broad sense to describe ideas that depart significantly from the prevailing or mainstream view in its particular field of study.
Since the collective weight of peer-reviewed studies does not support the efficacy of homeopathy, it departs significantly enough from the mainstream view of science to be considered a fringe theory.
References
Jonas, WB; Ives, JA (February 2008). "Should we explore the clinical utility of hormesis". Human & Experimental Toxicology. 27 (2): 123–127. PMID18480136.
Q5: Should studies that show that homeopathy does not work go into the article? (Yes.)
A5: Yes. Studies that show that homeopathy does not work are part of a full treatment of the topic and should go into the article. Misplaced Pages is not the place to right great wrongs. Non-experts have suggested that all the studies that show homeopathy does not work are faulty studies and are biased, but this has not been borne out by the mainstream scientific community.
Q6: Should another article called "Criticism of homeopathy" be created? (No.)
A6: No. Another article called "Criticism of homeopathy" should not be created. This is called a "POV fork" and is discouraged.
Q7: Should alleged proof that homeopathy works be included in the article? (No.)
A7: No. Alleged proof that homeopathy works should not be included in the article. That is because no such proof has come from reliable sources. If you have found a reliable source, such as an academic study, that you think should be included, you can propose it for inclusion on the article’s talk page. Note that we do not have room for all material, both positive and negative. We try to sample some of each and report them according to their prominence.
Note also that it is not the job of Misplaced Pages to convince those people who do not believe homeopathy works, nor to dissuade those who believe that it does work, but to accurately describe how many believe and how many do not believe and why.
Q8: Should all references to material critical of homeopathy be put in a single section in the article? (No.)
A8: No. Sources critical of homeopathy should be integrated normally in the course of presenting the topic and its reception, not shunted into a single criticism section. Such segregation is generally frowned upon as poor writing style on Misplaced Pages.
Q9: Should the article mention that homeopathy might work by some as-yet undiscovered mechanism? (No.)
A9: No. The article should not mention that homeopathy might work by some as-yet undiscovered mechanism. Misplaced Pages is not a place for original research or speculation.
Q10: Is the article with its negative material biased? (No.)
A10: No. The article with its negative material is not biased. The article must include both positive and negative views according to the policies of Misplaced Pages.
Q11: Should the article characterize homeopathy as a blatant fraud and quackery? (No.)
A11: No. Inflammatory language does not serve the purpose of an encyclopedia; it should only be done if essential to explain a specific point of view and must be supported from a reliable source. Misplaced Pages articles must be neutral and reflect information found in reliable sources. Misplaced Pages is an encyclopedia and not a consumer guide, so while scientific sources commonly characterise homeopathy as nonsense, fraud, pseudoscience and quackery - and the article should (and does) report this consensus - ultimately the reader should be allowed to draw his/her own conclusions.
Do not feed the trolls! This article or its talk page has experienced trolling. The subject may be controversial or otherwise objectionable, but it is important to keep discussion on a high level. Do not get bogged down in endless debates that don't lead anywhere.
Know when to deny recognition and refer to WP:PSCI, WP:FALSEBALANCE, WP:WIKIVOICE, or relevant notice-boards. Legal threats and trolling are never allowed!
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Syeda ShahBano Ijaz (29 May 2023). "How Conflicts and Population Loss Led to the Rise of English Misplaced Pages's Credibility". American Political Science Association. Retrieved 30 May 2023. Take the example of the Misplaced Pages page on homeopathy: from 2001-2006, the lead on the page described homeopathy as a "controversial system of alternative medicine." From 2006-2013, the content changed to mentioning that homeopathy has been "regarded as pseudoscience" and sharing that there is a "lack of convincing scientific evidence confirming its efficacy." By 2015, this description had stabilized to "homeopathy is a pseudoscience."
Basic Research duckweed/ arsenic
In Switzerland at the University of Bern at the Institute of Complementary and Integrative Medicine Classical Homeopathy / Potentiazed Substancesare researched.University of Bern,Institute of Complementary and Integrative Medicine, Inselspital Bern, Freiburgstrasse 46, CH-3010 Bern
This study evaluated the effects with arsenic-stressed duckweed (Lemna gibba L.). The test substances were applied and compared with controls (unsuccussed and succussed water) regarding their influence on the plant's growth rate. Duckweed was stressed with arsenic. Afterwards, plants grew in either potentized substances or water controls All experiments were randomized and blinded.
In Germany the work on duckweed is widely accepted Yes, the DZVhÄ and other quackery lobby groups have been loud about it, and the coverage by journalists has been particularly gullible. But that is not what counts here.
That duckweed paper is a primary source, by at least one nominally incompetent author (a physicist). Not WP:MEDRS (read it).
There must be hundreds of bad studies on homeopathy, and you can probably find all of them in the archives because someone who is unfamiliar with Misplaced Pages standards wanted to include them.
Dann kommt ein „spektakuläres Experiment“ mit Wasserlinsen, diesmal von Stephan Baumgartner der Uni Bern. Dieser versucht seit vielen Jahren mit verschiedensten Methoden Unterschiede zwischen homöopathisch verschütteltem und ganz friedlichem normalen Wasser herbeizumessen. Hier hat er kleine Wasserpflanzen mit Arsen vergiftet, um sie dann mit „potenziertem“ Arsen wieder zu heilen. Lassen wir mal außen vor, dass ein Patientengespräch mit Wasserlinsen noch schwieriger ist: Das Ergebnis wurde noch nie unabhängig bestätigt, also nehmen wir es einfach mal hin, ohne dass wir ihm viel Beachtung schenken müssen.
long2:
Es scheint angebracht, weitere Forschung zu betreiben, weil das, was im Moment vorliegt, nicht genügt und zu viele Fragen unbeantwortet lässt. Sollten unabhängig replizierte Studien mit veröffentlichten Daten tatsächlich zum Schluss kommen, es gebe Effekte, wäre dies allemal willkommen. Wer wäre denn ernsthaft dagegen, etwas Neues über die Welt zu lernen?
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Hello,
I've been searching really hard for any other form of medication for Type 1 diabetes besides the blood testing and injections every single dday.And homeopathy was recommended. But I'm not seeing it being mentioned in all the information I've found so far. Can someone please help me with any info on this. 105.8.1.89 (talk) 12:17, 30 November 2022 (UTC)
As the article says, homeopathy is not useful for any medical condition. And I would strongly suggest not using any alternative medical "remedies" for something as dangerous as diabetes - if there were any real alternative to the usual regimen, I'm sure it would be famous. Black Kite (talk)12:30, 30 November 2022 (UTC)
This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.
The following text in the first section of the article is an issue: "The trend corresponded with the rise of the New Age movement, and may be in part due to chemophobia, an irrational preference for "natural" products". I do not contest any of the claims of the statement except the wording following "chemophobia". The use of the word "irrational" and placing the word "natural" in quotes make explicit and implied claims that are not only foolish, but deeply disrespectful. Chemophobia, as stated in its own Misplaced Pages article, is "an aversion to or prejudice against chemicals or chemistry". One cannot simply paint all chemophobia as irrational, even if some instances are. There have been many instances of abuse, misuse and misunderstanding of chemistry and pharmaceutical chemicals that have caused harm. For example, heroin was invented to help people overcome morphine addiction. We know how that went. Many medicines have serious and sometimes harmful side effects. While all this does not negate the value of biomedicine or pharmaceuticals, it is disrespectful and shortsighted to say that someone who fears putting manufactured chemicals into their body is "irrational". This is especially important if you consider the historical and societal context. For example, minority groups in the USA have historically been the target of harmful and sometimes non-consensual medical experimentation. To call someone with this background irrational for mistrusting pharmaceuticals - a large part of the medical industry - is also ignorant and insulting towards their very real history of pain. Additionally, putting "natural" in quotes as the author does is unnecessary and lends a sarcastic tone. It implies that there is something misguided about wanting to use natural products, or perhaps that there is no difference between what they call natural and manufactured chemicals. Again, this is disrespectful to large swathes of people and cultures. It is completely sensible to hold the opinion that a plant is more natural than something produced in a lab. In Japan, most physicians are trained in a type of herbal medicine. I hope the author is not implying that the herbal medicine traditions of such a scientifically accomplished country are something to be sneered at.
Please do not think that I am merely nitpicking semantics by writing this. Though the section of text I addressed is small and subtle, it is very important. I will explain why. Such language disparages the huge number of cultures, histories and worldviews that are not part of the white and christian dominated worldview of modern science and medicine. Holding this worldview is not a problem on its own. It is acceptable for Misplaced Pages to promote the modern scientific worldview. However, it is unacceptable to take that a step further and disrespect those many millions who may think differently. A site so widely used and trusted for accurate information stands to do serious harm through such thoughtless language. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.161.244.87 (talk • contribs) 03:19, 5 April 2023 (UTC)
Partly done: I've changed the wording to "an irrational aversion to synthetic chemicals", as I agree that there is an implied POV created by placing 'natural' in quotation marks. However, I've left 'irrational' for the reason that in the context of the article, it does appear to be explicitly referencing irrational fear - in no way does this label all aversion to chemicals irrational, but rather simply refers to the subset of this aversion which is irrational. Tollens (talk) 03:57, 5 April 2023 (UTC)
view · edit Frequently asked questions
To view an explanation to the answer, click the link to the right of the question.
Q1: Should material critical of homeopathy be in the article? (Yes.)
A1: Yes. Material critical of homeopathy must be included in the article. The articles on Misplaced Pages include information from all significant points of view. This is summarized in the policy pages which can be accessed from the Neutral point of view policy. This article strives to conform to Misplaced Pages policies, which dictate that a substantial fraction of articles in fringe areas be devoted to mainstream views of those topics.
Q2: Should material critical of homeopathy be in the lead? (Yes.)
A2: Yes. Material critical of homeopathy belongs in the lead section. The lead must contain a summary of all the material in the article, including the critical material. This is described further in the Lead section guideline.
Q3: Is the negative material in the article NPOV? (Yes.)
A3: Yes. Including negative material is part of achieving a neutral article. A neutral point of view does not necessarily equate to a sympathetic point of view. Neutrality is achieved by including all points of view – both positive and negative – in rough proportion to their prominence.
Q4: Does Misplaced Pages consider homeopathy a fringe theory? (Yes.)
A4: Yes. Homeopathy is described as a fringe medical system in sources reliable to make the distinction. This is defined by the Fringe theories guideline, which explains: We use the term fringe theory in a very broad sense to describe ideas that depart significantly from the prevailing or mainstream view in its particular field of study.
Partly done: I've changed the wording to "an irrational aversion to synthetic chemicals", as I agree that there is an implied POV created by placing 'natural' in quotation marks. However, I've left 'irrational' for the reason that in the context of the article, it does appear to be explicitly referencing irrational fear - in no way does this label all aversion to chemicals irrational, but rather simply refers to the subset of this aversion which is irrational. Tollens (talk) 03:57, 5 April 2023 (UTC)
