This is an old revision of this page, as edited by BKLisenbee (talk | contribs) at 15:10, 11 December 2008 (→user:BKLisenbee's concerns: first commenhts). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.
Revision as of 15:10, 11 December 2008 by BKLisenbee (talk | contribs) (→user:BKLisenbee's concerns: first commenhts)(diff) ← Previous revision | Latest revision (diff) | Newer revision → (diff) Note: This page is dedicated to administer and manage the dispute and conflict concerning a few Moroccan music bands with their undelying relationship with some "Beat generation" figures. This is a Misplaced Pages dispute which has lasted more than a few years. Several attempts of mediation have failed. There are 2 main single-purpose accounts concerned by the dispute; BKLisenbee (talk · contribs) and Opiumjones 23 (talk · contribs). There are a few other relatively involved users who edit from time to time. Please refer to this archived mediation for the whole background and details.This page is meant to be a central place for all volunteer uninvolved editors and admins seeking a resolution to this dispute. It will also serve to organize all work dedicated to reach a compromise. It has been made clear that both users would not reach a compromise if left alone. It is time now to listen for the last time to these users' concerns and deal with them according to Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines.
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user:Opiumjones 23's concerns
user:BKLisenbee's concerns
There is so much misinformation on Misplaced Pages regarding the confusion over who hereditary leader of the Master Musicians of Jajouka, Bachir Attar, whose father Hadj Abdesalam Attar, who was the undisputed leader of the Master Musicians of Jajouka when Brian Jones of the Rolling Stones once recorded in the village. This confusion is largely perpetrated on Misplaced Pages associated pages, Jajouka, the village; Master Musicians of Jajouka Featuring Bachir Attar; Master Musicians of Joujouka (I now feel there needs to be only one article entitled Master Musicians of Jajouka, with some information about the problems); Mohamed Hamri; Tangier; William S. Burroughs; Brion Gysin; Rolling Stones; Brian Jones Presents the Pipes of Pan at Jajouka/Joujouka, and perhaps several other Wik pages. The famous writer and composer Bowles was also dragged into this after his death, and is still being slandered by opiumjones23 on his site for Joujouka and by people he knows on various blogs, and it is disgraceful. He was accused of all kinds of misdeads, and it is still on "interviews" with opiumjones_23 and his co-workers who do his bidding on the Web. Lies have been repeated so often that people are now beginning to believe them, and Misplaced Pages is a big part of the problem as it currently exists. User and User Talk Discussion pages are also being indexed in Google and perhaps other search engines, so that trivia and nonsense and noninvolved parties names are turning up Misplaced Pages pages when searches are being done on their names. This is the kind of thing that makes Misplaced Pages look bad. Yes, there are problems with Misplaced Pages. Many professors give automatic failing grades in courses to students who use Misplaced Pages as references in their papers. I understand why, based on this "controversy" largely stirred up by Hamri and the other person involved. Even the place of birth of Hamri now seems to be wrong on Misplaced Pages. opiumjones_23 wrote an obituary saying he was born in Ksar-el-Kebir, Morocco (still a reputable source on Misplaced Pages), and it now says he was born in Joujouka. The same obituary says that Hamri was immortalized by Paul Bowles in a book, and it turns out that it was Brion Gysin's book The Process where Hamri was "immortalized" as a character. This same obituary calls a totally illiterate an "intellectual". Now opiumjones_23 has changed his tune to say that a limited-edition pamphlet (not a real book) about the artist Mohamed Hamri, which was written by an Irishman who fooled many people into believing that he would be the next king of Ireland, can be taken as fact, since it claims Hamri was born in Joujouka (sic), Morocco. This same writer extorted millions of dollars/euros/pounds from others and is forbidden to travel to his native country. He was not royalty at all; a total fake, yet this man's pamphlet is to be taken as the only justification in a Misplaced Pages footnote/reference to claim that Hamri was born in the village where his mother was from. On the other hand, several notable books, have references to Hamri as being born in Ksar-el-Kebir, and thus I think this definitely needs to be changed to Ksar-el-Kebir. It needs also to be noted that Hamri was never a musician.
The discussion/edits by opiumjones23 have been contentious, and long disrupted the lives of innocent people, causing nightmares, and I was once threatened with legal action. Many times in the past few years my edits were reverted by him and others. I began editing on the Jajouka and Master Musicians of Jajouka pages because I saw the group spelled as Joujouka, when I was familiar with the current leader, Bachir Attar, who lives in the village. opiumjones23 has repeatedly tried to say that his musicians represent the "original" group, but he has gone well beyond this to repeatedly discredit Attar, whose father was the hereditary leader of the group. Thus, as I see it, much of this has spread to blogs and only today I found a blog which seems to perpetrate this notion. It could be as a result of Misplaced Pages's having two separate pages, one for Master Musicians of Jajouka (which opiumjones23 felt should be redirected to Master Musicians of Jajouka featuring Bachir Attar). This redirection should be eliminated. The other band of musicians, is what opiumjones23 calls the Master Musicians of Joujouka.
The spelling of the village is commonly used in the West, and reputable sources and references, and many books, as Jajouka, and the name of the group spelled Jajouka. Invariably, these books have used knowledgeable sources and interviews, to accurately I feel spell the name of both the far more popular group as Jajouka, and it is led by Bachir Attar.
I will also say that this Master Musicians of Jajouka/Joujouka dispute seems to have comeabout beginning in the 1990s when Mohamed Hamri, a Moroccan painter, who was illiterate and a close friend of Brion Gyin who once lived in Tangier. (to be continued).