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Talk:Hannes Vanaküla

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Classification as charlatan

The common classification of Mr. Vanaküla in recent newspaper publication is soolapuhuja, literally one who blows onto salt, metaphorically a charlatan. If anybody knows a better way to translate it than to expand the metaphor, feel free to help. ΔιγουρενΕμπρος! 15:50, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

Further expansion?

Apparently, the raktobleer saga has some relevance to this article. Unfortunately, I don't know anything more about it than what I saw in the clip of Ärapanija. Anybody help? ΔιγουρενΕμπρος! 15:57, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

"America"

The obvious reason for entries of this list is naming a bunch of regions associated with esoteric geography. That is why the entries are so clearly vague, too. However, it means that "America" can not be linked to USA -- it would be imprecise, and possibly amount to WP:OR.

If the list actually had a meaning, Mesoamerica would be a likelier candidate. After all, among many of the funky beliefs of the tokronauts is the idea that Mayans predicted the Apocalypse to happen in 2012, and when that passes, they will rule the Earth. 62.65.237.233 (talk) 17:45, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

Claims to "Estonian paganism"

Paganism has certain generic connotations. While it is true that the Tokronauts sometimes call themselves 'Estonian pagans', and their website's name translates as 'House of pagans', Mr. Vanaküla's church can not claim monopoly on paganism in Estonia -- any more so than Antti Loodus, one of the few Christian Fundamentalists in Estonia, who maintains a website calling itself "Estonian Christian Forum", can claim monopoly on Estonian Christianity. ΔιγουρενΕμπρος! 08:52, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

Reply to claims to "Estonian paganism"

In Estonia there are pagans who are named "Maausulised", there are pagans who are named "Taarausulised" and there are pagans who are named "Estonian Pagans" (also in media) - this is written with recurring capital letter. Estonian Pagans with recurring capital letter means specific group of people not every Estonian pagan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by WorldReporter (talk • contribs) 13:04, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

corpse-finding

The corpse-finding episode is potentially interesting. Unfortunately, *this* is where the newspaper's yellowness matters: Õhtuleht is known for propping up such announcements with little factual basis.

Let's give this story a little time to develop. ΔιγουρενΕμπρος! 15:41, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

More details of that episode have become public. Needless to say, it's not by half as interesting as the original yellow report. I submit that describing it here would serve no encyclopædic purpose -- but if anybody disagrees, is another useful news source. ΔιγουρενΕμπρος! 23:25, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Violations of WP:Biography of a Living Person, Burden of Evidence, WP:Neutral Point of View, WP:Liebel, WP:No Reliable Sources and WP:No Original Research in Misplaced Pages article about Hannes Vanaküla.

I read the rules of Misplaced Pages and discovered that the sources for material have to be reliable. There is brought out sect accusations in the article about Hannes Vanaküla. The problem is that these sect accusations are made without any proof (slander). If these sect accusations are brought out in the encyclopedia of Misplaced Pages, then readers will take these as reliable accusations because only reliable sources can be used in an encyclopedia. It unrighteously harms the personal life, the reputation, the business, the friends of Hannes Vanaküla and other people in relation with Hannes Vanaküla. In the article, user Diqwuren has also implemented tagging of insulting titles such as self-declared mage, and a cult leader without a proof.

Sources for sect accusations under the topic „Media Exposure“ are not reliable sources WP:BLP WP:RS – A biography of a living person is not this what some people have said without any proof in a TV show "Pealtnägija" in which even the programmer of the TV show "Pealtnägija" lied about Hannes Vanaküla (the documented proof about that fact exists) and also not this what one yellow newspaper has written about this person without any proof on the basis of this TV Show only. An encyclopedia article must compose of facts about the person, not of this what someone has lied about this person without any proof. A lie about the person is not a reliable source for a biography of a living person. By the principle of Burden of Evidence, which Misplaced Pages follows, the burden of evidence WP:BLP Misplaced Pages: Burden of Proof lies on the one who accused Hannes Vanaküla not on Hannes Vanaküla. As I have understood ,Misplaced Pages is an encyclopedia. An encyclopedia is not a toilet wall where people can write and smear each other with lies and without an evidence.

Secondly, the article is not written from a neutral point of view WP:NPOV and is downright defamatory WP:LIBEL. The author of the article wrote that Hannes Vanaküla has been described as a charlatan, but he has not pointed out that media has also declared Hannes Vanaküla as a mage, a prime witch, a witch, a shaman and a clairvoyant. Also the sources the author Digwuren has used for this article contain this kind of declarations. The source of the first reference, which the author of the article has used to backup his claim, actually controvert to the claim of the author of the article – actually, media decleared Hannes Vanaküla as a mage not a self-declared mage. Some text under year 2008 activties is a lie. In fact, Digwuren’s opinion that his score was not noteworthy is Digwuren’s personal opinion, which hid important facts. As I have read the rules of wikipedia I know the place of such a statement is not in a biography of a living person in Misplaced Pages. Hannes Vanaküla’s score was noteworthy as there were over 20 sensitives in the beginning of the TV show Selgeltnägijate tuleproov (Template:Lang-et). He got the seventh place and his students got the fifth and the third place. His explanations for reasons of his failure were not complicated. Again, You did not follow the rules of Misplaced Pages. Most of his explanations for reasons of his failure were plain and logical. By the way, he did not blame russian sorceres in media. Do You have some reliable sources to prove that?

Under bibliography Digwuren has written: „Hannes Vanaküla’s zany publicity stunts, such as begging in the nude for people to buy the book, caused some media interest.“ This is also a lie. He was not nude (he was partially nude) and he did not beg – he said: “buy now, my book.“ There has been no other puplicity stunt, which has caused media interest. So You can’t write as You wrote. Or have You got some source to prove that? And naming it zany is Your individual opinion, it has been named as a parody in media.

The article violates WP:BLP, Burden of Evidence (Burden of Proof) which is followed by Misplaced Pages under WP:BLP, WP:NPOV, WP:LIBEL, WP:NOR and WP:RS. WorldReporter (talk) 21:42, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

  1. SL Õhtuleht 15 October 2007: Nõiad tülis! by Eve Heinla
  2. ^ Õhtuleht 19 September 2008: Maag Hannes: kellelgi on väga vaja Eesti nõidadele ära teha! by Kaja Roomets
  3. Tervendaja October 2007: Maag Hannes Vanaküla: Isepäisus teeb meist nõiarahva by Kaja Roomets
  4. SL Õhtuleht 17 November 2008: Kas Nastjale mängiti võit kätte? by Kaja Roomets
  5. Reporter Online 16 October 2008 15:27: Selgeltnägija Maila: Hannes on mulle sisse sõitnud
  6. 24tundi 25 February 2009 12:38: Hannes Vanaküla aitas DefRage võidule by Andris Tammela
  7. Reporter Online 18 January 2009 20:33: “Peanõid” Hannes Vanaküla otsustas Tõehetkes Merje saatuse
  8. Reporter Online 20 November 2008 21:44: Kas peanõid Hannesel on teisi halvavad võimed?
  9. Postimees 17 December 2007 22:30: Nõid Vanaküla: me ei ole vaimselt vabad
  10. Tervendaja December 2008: Mis Ootab Aastal 2009? by Sandra Otsus
  11. SL Õhtuleht 17 November 2008: Kas Nastjale mängiti võit kätte? by Kaja Roomets
  12. SL Õhtuleht 14 November 2008: „Ilmselge, et oli kokkumäng“ by Kaja Roomets
  13. SL Õhtuleht 4 August 2004: Nõiad läksid energiasammaste pärast tülli by Kadri Paas
  14. www.naistemaailm.ee 17 February 2009 Hannes Vanaküla: “Kole tüdruk sundis mind seksima!”
  15. Õhtuleht 15 October 2007: Nõiad tülis! by Eve Heinla
  17. Õhtuleht 15 October 2007: Nõiad tülis! by Eve Heinla
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