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Archives

/Archive 1

• disused maps
• 
• 
• 

Asia confirmed cases map

I think the scale needs adjusting. For one thing "red" as 30+ looks out of place, for another, 20+ and 30+ seems too close together. I suggest using the standard key (1+/5+/50+/500+/5000+) or the magnitude modified key (1+/10+/100+/1000+) or the 5x key (1+/5+/20+/100+/500+/2000+/10000+) or the doubling key (1+/5+/10+/20+/50+/100+/200+/500+/1000+/2000+/5000+/10000+)

70.29.208.129 (talk) 11:57, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

Type map counterpart for SWINE Flue in Asia.PNG

• File:SWINE Flue in Asia.PNG
• 
• 

Can someone make a counterpart map for cases by type for this file (file:SWINE Flue in Asia.PNG)? (The black-red-yellow maps)

70.29.208.129 (talk) 08:03, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

• File:Swine Flu in Asia 2.svg
• 

Here you go a black-red-yellow map and also a new case count map now both in a better SVG format. -- ] 23:56, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

What scale did you use for the new pink map? 70.29.210.130 (talk) 07:52, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

The new map uses the same colour scale as the old map however, I do remember 70.29.208.129 saying that the current scale is not right and needs to be changed (colour wise).-- ] 08:26, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Thailand

A seperate Thailand article should be created. The main article is getting far too large and unruly.Johnpacklambert (talk) 17:11, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

As you're a logged in user, you can do the first part... create 2009 swine flu outbreak in Thailand, copy all the stuff over, and then leave a stub here (probably keep the picture here also). And add a {{main|2009 swine flu outbreak in Thailand}} to the top of the section here. 70.29.208.129 (talk) 06:21, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

I've done the split. --Roentgenium111 (talk) 00:32, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

You forgot to leave a summary. 70.29.208.129 (talk) 04:09, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Article Assessment for WikiProject Medicine

Hello. I am a member of WikiProject Medicine, a Misplaced Pages wide project that maintains and improves articles that fall under the scope of medicine. Since your article has not fallen under our scope, I have placed the correct template(s) on this talk page. Leave a message on my talk page if you have any questions. Thanks, and keep editing Misplaced Pages! Renaissancee (talk) 16:39, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Per discussion at WP:MED itself, Renaissancee's decision is incorrect, and it is appropriate to tag this article. 70.29.212.226 (talk) 06:35, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Hong Kong

HK has reports that primary schools and kindergardens will be closed for a week due to a cluster in primary school children... 70.29.210.174 (talk) 14:37, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Country inclusions (Europe/Asia)

There are minor issues with the inclusion of various territories in this article and its homologue for Europe, namely those countries which may straddle both Europe and Asia. The WHO regional office for Europe (http://www.euro.who.int/countryinformation) includes Cyprus, Turkey, and other territories (e.g., ex-Soviet republics and Israel!) But, this is misleading. It would be very odd to include Israel, for instance, in the entry for Europe when very clearly it is not part of that continent; as well, the bulk of Turkey (i.e., Anatolia) and nearby Cyprus are physiographically parts of Asia; of course, Cyprus is in the EU and it is sometimes included in Europe, but the EU isn't the same as Europe. For this reason, I believe the articles should include territories per continental articles and per the United Nations geoscheme, which list countries by continents and various regions. Otherwise, the articles would have to be named '2009 flu pandemic in World Health Organization Regional Office for Europe' or whatever. However, I'm flexible. I've made these text changes to the articles. Also, if agreeable, I'll also amend the maps. Thoughts? Bosonic dressing (talk) 17:35, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

• Oppose I've removed Azerbaijan, Cyprus and Turkey to 2009 flu pandemic in Europe article but Bosonic dressing reverted them. I removed them again. This is not a geographical article so we don't have to take the UN geoscheme as our model. The Council of Europe, the European Union and the WHO all consider these countries as European. And I have to say that all diseased people entered Turkey through Atatürk International Airport which is in Europe. --Turkish Flame 19:30, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

If this isn't a geographical article, we shouldn't be using geographical terms in the title or categorizing them according to commonly known continents/regions, as reflected in the 'Asia' and 'Europe' articles ... the main maps and content of which generally include these countries in Asia (aside from Trakya in Turkey, commonly part of Europe). Though I'm cognizant of other viewpoints, a great many other sources -- including the UN (which I cite as an unbiased example for lists) -- generally consider these countries, Israel unequivocally so, to be in Asia (or, in other instances, wherever they may be). The bulk of Turkey's area and population are in Anatolia (AKA Asia Minor), and I'm sure not all 'diseased people' are in Trakya. As well, your alias reinforces perception of bias. If you can't convince or unless a consensus compels otherwise, I will restore the prior scheme per the UN shortly. Bosonic dressing (talk) 19:37, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

I don't think swine flu is about geography. It's about health. You said "UN geoscheme is unbiased" but it includes geographically mostly Asian Russia in Europe! But the WHO, a sub-organization of the UN classifies Cyprus, Turkey, Azerbaijan, etc. in Europe. It also includes Israel and ex-Soviet republics in Europe too, but I didn't move them to 2009 flu pandemic in Europe article. But you gave the Israel example all the time. And you said "I'm sure not all 'diseased people' are in Trakya". But they came from the US and stopped in Atatürk International Airport and treated in Şişli Etfal Hospital which is too in Europe. Do you really think Turkey would let those diseased people walk freely in the country? No. I also realized you are canvassing . This isn't allowed in Misplaced Pages. --Turkish Flame 20:31, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

Epidemics and pandemics are all about geography, and health: that's why the flu situation is now considered a pandemic (a wider, global situation). Anyhow, as for the UN geoscheme, it is unbiased: you can't split countries in two for statistical purposes, or here for that matter; while most of Russia's area is in Asia, most of its population and its capital are in Europe (which is likely the reason why it's included there). Can you say that of Turkey? (I may be mistaken as to where the cases in Turkey are being treated, but that's beside the point.) And, yes: it's important to note the example of Israel (included in the WHO region of Europe, but in Asia almost everywhere else), and the curiosity of why you didn't move that initially while moving/reverting other countries that are perhaps of more relevance to you (given your alias/background); this demonstrates that you've a point to prove. As well, my notice to that administrator is not canvassing, as I didn't ask anyone to say this or that, but simply a request of someone uninvolved to weigh in. And, you haven't yet convinced me why the countries included should stay the way you prefer them. Bosonic dressing (talk) 20:53, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

If Russia classified in Europe by the UN geoscheme because of its population in Europe, the name of this geoscheme would be population scheme. There is an unequal treatment in that scheme. Anyway, as for Israel, I'm sure you know why it is classified in the WHO European regional group. Because of political reasons including Palestinian dispute. I didn't add Israel to Europe because of this reason. I hope this can satisfy your curiosity. Also, I don't have to convince you. You are not the owner of this article. There is a discussion here and we are seeking for a consensus. And I think the UN geoscheme is already eliminated because all the cases in Turkey seen in the European part of İstanbul. --Turkish Flame 21:21, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

The UN geoscheme, nor a wealth of other reputable sources that corroborate it, is not invalidated just because you say so. As for Israel's inclusion in the WHO scheme for Europe, politics notwithstanding, your explanation is insufficient. Anyhow, I wonder how you would react regarding the country's location if the pandemic spread to the rest of Turkey. No matter, Turkish Flame, it is clear that have a point to prove regarding the location of Turkey and its neighbours. And, yes, we are seeking to garner consensus, which you dismissed when you reverted content which has been in place for a bit of time. So, I will await other comments, and will act accordingly. Bosonic dressing (talk) 21:30, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

Personally, I would place the country in whichever continent most if its territory resides in (ie. Russia should be in this article). Israel and Turkey would then be part of this article. Marginal cases in the Caucuses which depend on where one draws the line... whichever one works. I would keep the Mediterranean islands as part of Europe, so that would be Crete, Cyprus, Malta, Sardinia, Corsica, Sicily, etc. 70.29.212.226 (talk) 06:26, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Russia is European, even if the lightly and recently colonized region we all know as Siberia constitutes most of its territory. Likewise, Canada and India constituted the majority of Britain's territory for over a century, but that didn't make Britain part of Asia or America. This is not comparable to Turkey, which is essentially Anatolia with Thrace attached (Turks will often tell you that the "real" name for Turkey is "Anadolu"). It would make sense to have Turkey in Asia and Russia in Europe, but all that matters is that we have the information and it really isn't worth edit-warring over. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 05:54, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

I agree. Can you please tell that to a certain editor who maintains otherwise? Bosonic dressing (talk) 06:06, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Look Bosonic! I said you were canvassing! He came and support your absurd POV. Deacon of Pndapetzim, do you mean Siberia is Russia's colony? I don't think so. You also said Turks will often tell you that the "real" name for Turkey is "Anadolu". I'm a Turk and I don't think Turkey's real name is Anadolu! Our largest city, former capital, cultural and economical capital, Istanbul, is in Europe. It will be the European Capital of Culture in 2010. Swine flu in Turkey only seen in the European part of the country and the WHO classifies Turkey as European. How can you put it in Asia even if you think Turkey isn't European? See this link. --Turkish Flame 06:22, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

I am not canvassing: please read up on what that means. As well, DofP is an administrator, and I foresaw that there would be challenges in resolving this issue. Look: I'm not insensitive to your viewpoint -- after all, who do you think crafted the current introductions (more or less) for Armenia, Azerbaijan, and Georgia which embrace the dual viewpoints of their locations? Nonetheless, most of Turkey -- its area AND population -- IS in Asia, as the respective articles and many other sources attest to. It must go in one list/article, and I largely fail to see why we should include Turkey's entry in Europe, given the above, just because of your absurd POV-pushing. And, frankly, you are the only commentator explicitly supporting Turkey's inclusion in the European list/article; three above have so far indicated otherwise -- that's a preliminary consensus. Lastly, I've warned you about edit warring (and admit a bit myself), but you will be reported if you don't stop. That's all. Bosonic dressing (talk) 06:40, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

TF, I'm not here to back BD up. I don't care if Turkey is in the Europe or Asia article, and I'm saying you guys shouldn't either because it doesn't matter. BTW, you know as well as I do most Turks think of Anatolia as Turkey-proper. As for Siberia, see Russian_conquest_of_Siberia and History_of_Siberia#Imperial_Russian_expansion. Siberia is virtually uninhabited, and almost all of the European population are settled around around the old railway see this map. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 06:49, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Russia is only culturally European with its Ethnic Russians. most of its ethnic groups are Asian. And Geography should trump Culture, otherwise we should place Australia in Europe. I'd be fine if we split Russia in two. French Guyana is part of France, does that mean it's not part of South America? 70.29.212.226 (talk) 07:16, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Forget everything. Reaching a consensus in this matter is nearly impossible. And I don't understand why you're insisting on moving Turkey to the Asia article. Swine flu has never seen in Anatolia. It's valid for Russia too. Swine flu has never seen in Siberia. So moving these countries to the Asia article is meaningless. --Turkish Flame 07:32, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Very clearly, a consensus does seem to be emerging that at least Turkey is misplaced (i.e. that its entry should be in the Asia article instead of in the Europe article as you maintain): at least three editors have commented to that end or have made that edit, one of which you just reverted, while you alone support it. (And before you start producing another reason to justify your edit warring, I'm in the Americas.) It's very clear discussion with you is fruitless, since (per your alias) you've an obvious point to prove. So, I suggest you forget it. Bosonic dressing (talk) 19:41, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Swine flu has never seen in Anatolia so it's impossible to move Turkey to the Asia article. You said three editors want it to be moved. One of these editors is an IP with no edit history which means he/she is here for an edit war and I'll start a sock puppetry case about that IP. I think he/she forgot to move Russia to the Asia article too. If not, why didn't he move Russia to the Asia article too? The second editor is an IP too but he/she supports moving not only Turkey but also Russia to the Asia article. None of these users are supporting you. They don't mention anything about the UN geoscheme. And look what I've found. You moved Turkey and Cyprus to the Asia article first. The WP community put Turkey, Cyprus, etc. (but not Israel or Central Asian countries) in the Europe article first, but you moved them without a consensus. --Turkish Flame 20:33, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

If one thing is clear, these users are definitely not supporting YOUR position. I boldly updated the articles with consistent rationale stated, and all was fine until you started pushing your very obvious point-of-view with the insertion of a 'new' scheme. You then used the WHO regional definition as a crutch, yet didn't migrate Israel to the Europe article. You now maintain that because there may be no confirmed cases on the Asian portion of Turkey, where most of its area and people are, this entry belongs elsewhere. You also try to disprove arguments by disputing the editors. Enough. There's a Misplaced Pages guideline called boldly edit, revert, discuss -- you have been reverted and will continue to be until a consensus supports your position. And that's all I really have to say for now. Bosonic dressing (talk) 05:33, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

These users are not supporting your position too. You moved Turkey, Cyprus, etc. to the Asia article first without a consensus but kept Russia in the Europe article. When I came and reverted it, you said this articles uses the UN geoscheme. Who said it? Only YOU! This articles should use WHO's definition of Europe or real geographical borders of Europe. You rejected the WHO's Europe, so the real borders must be used. --Turkish Flame 06:13, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

There was no controversy when I made the changes, but your changes are senseless. And, yes, we should use 'real' geographical borders: almost all of Turkey is in Asia (per that article, and its many sources, etc.):

and that demarcation goes back centuries. Deal with it. Bosonic dressing (talk) 06:42, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

I'm not denying that Anatolia is in Asia. I'm only trying to explain swine flu has never seen in Anatolia. It has seen in European part of Turkey. Like it has never seen in Asian part of Russia. When the virus will seen in Asian parts of these countries, we'll move them to Asia too. --Turkish Flame 07:02, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Of course you are denying it, and your rationale makes little sense ... if only because it disregards the potential of unconfirmed cases elsewhere in the country (which has happened in many others). I see no reason to cater to your will alone despite centuries of reckoning to the contrary. And I remind you that no other commenting editor has yet to support your viewpoint. Bosonic dressing (talk) 06:56, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

We don't have any sources which claim that H1N1 has seen in Aatolia. Also no other editor supports your POV too. --Turkish Flame 07:07, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

Obviously, you can't count, since at least three commentators agree with including Turkey here -- none agree with you. So, that's that. Bosonic dressing (talk) 07:25, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

One of that users is a sockpuppet. And the other IP user supports moving not only Turkey but also Russia to the Asia article. And H1N1 hasn't seen in Anatolia, no consensus can move Turkey to the Asia article. --Turkish Flame 07:39, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

China

Do we really need a separate China article? (2009 flu pandemic in China) The section isn't all that long right now. 70.29.212.226 (talk) 11:25, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Yes we do! An artical covering both China, Mongolia, N. Korea, S. Korea, Japan, Hong Kong, Macau and Taiwan woud be both informative and aproriate for the situation!--86.29.241.64 (talk) 14:19, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

] Mongolia quarantines some tourists come swine flu suspects.--86.29.241.64 (talk) 14:19, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Some resent Chinese border casese. ]. --86.29.241.64 (talk) 14:19, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

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Deaths map

So can someone update the world deaths map to account for the Philippines? 70.29.212.226 (talk) 07:35, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

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