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Errors in the summary of the featured article

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Current DYK

• that a reviewer identified an "audible contempt" for men in the songs of Ceechynaa, who entered the UK singles chart earlier this month with "Peggy? I fail to see how this does not "unduly focus on negative aspects of living person". I'd think contempt for half the populace is a negative thing. Pinging Launchballer and Jolielover. Sincerely, Dilettante 00:34, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

Not undue; she is literally notable for songs about that. Otherwise, "that the "Peggy" musician Ceechynaa worked in the sex industry before her music career?" should work instead. Pinging also @Crisco 1492 and Z1720:.--Launchballer 00:54, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

• Yeah, I wouldn't call that "undue", or even necessarily negative. Same reason I'd expect a bon mot like "a woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle" to be allowed for a blurb for Irina Dunn or Gloria Steinem. — Chris Woodrich (talk) 01:01, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

Seconding this; the hook also specifically refers to songs by her which should not be a violation. jolielover♥talk 09:20, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

This is a blatant breach of WP:DYKBLP. Her having a "contempt for men" is not something that sources widely agree on, and is clearly a negative description of her, so is unudue negativity in a DYK Hook. There is no issue with having it in the article, where it sits in context, but not as a standalone one-liner on the main page. Not keen on focusing on her work in the sex industry either for similar reasons. I've amended to mention the review which is more positive sounding "proudly waving the sexual liberation flag". If this is no good then I think a pull might be the only other option.  — Amakuru (talk) 09:58, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

For the future, I'd also point out that we've got a MOS:SAID violation here: we shouldn't use "identified X" for a subjective judgement, but a more subjective phrase like "considered", "believed", "judged", "opined" or so on. "Identified" implies that we are endorsing this judgement. UndercoverClassicist 14:42, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

• ... that nearly 300 construction workers showed up to work at 8 am to continue building reactors 5 and 6, unaware of the Chernobyl disaster? The source reads "Despite the disaster unfolding next door at 8am that morning, the 286 construction workers of the day shift clocked on." I can't find any mention as to whether the workers were aware, though it's possible the reference didn't fully load for me. Pinging Hawkeye7 and Bollardant. Sincerely, Dilettante 00:34, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

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• At "more than 3000 years" maybe insert comma in 3000 per all over thousands in blurb? JennyOz (talk) 09:22, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

   Done  — Amakuru (talk) 10:01, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

General discussion

• T:MP
• WT:MP

JFK assassination

I guess the assassination of U.S. President John F. Kennedy on November 22, 1963, is not an important enough event to include in the list of events that happened on this day in history.

The death of Blackbeard, however, is. . . . ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.247.243.67 (talk) 19:52, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

Most years it has been there, but it is replaced by other items some other years to expose more history. I'm sure it will be back next year. --mav (reviews needed) 20:36, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

More importantly, the Assassination of John F. Kennedy article has a yellow-level maintenance tag in the "External links" section, making the article ineligible. Hopefully someone will get around to fixing that so we can have it for next year's 50th anniversary. —howcheng {chat} 21:14, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

The assassination was listed in 2004, 2005, 2006, 2008, 2009 and 2010. It's not that it isn't important enough, we just want to have some sort of variety in our choice of events listed. Hut 8.5 23:54, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

It would be nice if it was fixed up prior to next year's 50th anniversary. 216.93.234.239 (talk) 03:38, 23 November 2012 (UTC)

WP:SOFIXIT! Lugnuts 08:40, 23 November 2012 (UTC)

It seems a bit ridiculous to me, even with such policies, that we could not at least mention the event with a link to Kennedy's article and the necessary section. It's over, though, so not much that can be done about it. dci | TALK 04:28, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

I would have argued for keeping it out this year in favor of highlighting it next year, the 50th anniversary. Binksternet (talk) 04:35, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

• I think complaints show that OTD needs an open process like TFA/ITN/DYK have. Hot Stop (Talk) 13:12, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

The difference is that TFA, ITN, and DYK all have endless new content to feature, whereas OTD can only select from a limited pool of events each year. Some days we have a large pool, some days we have barely enough items to fit. Having a whole process where you "!vote for which 5 items out of these 8 get to appear this year" seems to be overkill to me (in addition to the fact that it may be subject to systemic bias; if it were up to some people, the JFK assassination would be included every single year, for example). The other primary difference is that OTD is editable by anyone. You want some article to appear on a certain day? Go put it in. As long as it meets the criteria, it will make an appearance. —howcheng {chat} 21:14, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

I agree. Although the JFK bit is a bit unusual, I get the rationales behind it. I can't see any reason to have a review process for On this Day articles, as long as they aren't so egregious in some way that we don't want the casual main page viewer to see them. An additional process would, in my opinion, be a waste of time. dci | TALK 04:06, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

Today's featured antivirus

Am I the only one who feels that today's featured article blurb reads very much like an advertisement? The logo is there and everything...--WaltCip (talk) 16:59, 23 November 2012 (UTC)

How do you propose to write text which describes the features of a product without describing the features of that product? --Jayron32 18:00, 23 November 2012 (UTC)

Note that only the wordmark was present. The icon, arguably a more important part of the logo was not because it is likely eligble for copyright protection (unlike the wordmark) and hasn't been released under a free licence so wasn't suitable for the main page. Nil Einne (talk) 09:16, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

Possible "on this day…" BLP violation?

A blurb currently on display in the "Selected Anniversaries" section of the main page is as follows: "1971 – Fred Quilt, a leader of the Tsilhqot'in First Nation, was severely beaten by Royal Canadian Mounted Police constables." A quick scan through the article shows that two inquiries were held, with both rejecting police brutality as a cause of death, thus directly contradicting the blurb. I would suggest that either the blurb be taken off the main page or the word "allegedly" be added to the blurb, which could otherwise be considered defamatory (assuming the officers allegedly involved are still alive). Made the mistake of starting two discussions because I thought no one was responding to this one *sigh*. Link here to other discussion, and I really should avoid doing that, no matter what. IgnorantArmies – 09:04, Wednesday November 28, 2012 (UTC)

Yes, that looks like a great big clanger. Formerip (talk) 11:33, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Actually per the main part of the article, the second inquest doesn't seem to have rejected police brutality but rather seemed to have been unable to determine precisely how the injury occured and therefore returned an open verdict and did not lay the blame against anyone (which is likely different from them saying there was no police brutality involved or rejecting it as a cause). The LEDE was misleading, but I've modified it. However I agree based on the article, the wording above is clearly not acceptable. Nil Einne (talk) 12:17, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

I've swapped out the OTD item (forgive me if I've been too bold in doing so or if I've done something wrong—I've not made such an edit to the MP before). matt (talk) 12:27, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

I'm no great expert on OTD, but I think the item will return next year unless you take this further. Please also note the two other issues with this item raised in WP:ERRORS today. --Dweller (talk) 13:20, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

This edit won't cause a return next year because it completely removed Fred Quilt. He wasn't just moved to "Eligible", where return next year would have been possible (not inevitable) unless someone (not just admins; the page will soon be unprotected when it comes off the Main Page) takes it further. Art LaPella (talk) 14:57, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Would we be OK with "Fred Quilt, a leader of the Tsilhqot'in First Nation, died while in Royal Canadian Mounted Police custody, leading to charges of police brutality, although the constables were later cleared of all wrongdoing." —howcheng {chat} 17:31, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

It wouldn't help with the issue I raised at ERRORS, which is that the blurb you suggest does not suggest any great significance to the event even in Canada, making its appearance in OTD seem inappropriate. Worse, the article does not suggest any great significance either. --Dweller (talk) 22:13, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

That's an issue to bring up at WP:AFD. —howcheng {chat} 21:15, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

You misunderstand me. I don't mean it should be deleted because it's not notable. I mean that the level of prominence required to appear in OTD is not clear in the blurb or the article. --Dweller (talk) 22:13, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

I think User:Howcheng is happy to feature sub-standard articles on the main page, as exemplified almost daily by WP:POTD. Recently, the main page blurb for POTD was the entire content of the article. Recently we've seen articles littered with maintenance tags featured. Apparently WP:POTD and Howcheng are happy with that. I think it's disgraceful. Our main page should point people to decent articles, not trash. The Rambling Man (talk) 22:20, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

• The article in question, Fred Quilt inquiry, is not as bad as the POTD articles you mention. Tags at OTD will make an article unsuitable. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:26, 29 November 2012 (UTC)
  • Don't make assumptions about what I do. Standards for OTD are different than for POTD. I've been scheduling OTD for 2 years now daily and POTD since May 2006. I know what I'm doing. —howcheng {chat} 06:29, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
  • Yes, using POTD to feature stubs and articles littered with maintenance tags. The Rambling Man (talk) 11:26, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
    • Considering you don't like when other people touch your precious Main Page section, I suggest you temper your POTD crusade. -- tariqabjotu 13:11, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
      • Entirely different things. POTD has a bold link often as not to a stub or an article cluttered with maintenance tags. I'm surprised it's considered acceptable. The Rambling Man (talk) 13:28, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
        • POTD is about the picture, not the article. It would be unfair to expect FA blurbs to maintain high quality image standards. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 13:40, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

If it's just about the picture, Commons is the place for it. This is an encyclopedia. At the very least, the bold-linked article in the blurb should not be a stub, should not have maintenance tags, particularly when, in many cases, the bold-linked article gets more hits than the selected image... e.g. article 3969 views, image 3128 views... article 26,846 views, image 13,797 views. I'm just surprised with such a huge POTD backlog, it's so hard to select images whose bold-linked article isn't in such a poor state. The Rambling Man (talk) 13:50, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

• I may be amenable to debolding the article, although my opinion is of little weight at POTD. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 13:55, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

• I just think it'd be better for the encyclopedia if we ensured bold-linked articles were up to scratch. I think it's the only bold-linked article in the "featured" section of the main page that has virtually no standard applied. The Rambling Man (talk) 13:57, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
  • As I explained to you on your talk page, if you have a preferred way of scheduling POTD blurbs, I am happy to cede my unofficial POTD director role. —howcheng {chat} 18:03, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
    • As I've said all along, it's nothing to do with scheduling, or blurbs, but selection of articles which are really sub-standard, like stubs or those with maintenance tags. Pretty obvious we shouldn't be "featuring" these kind of articles via bold links on our main page, isn't it? Especially if there is such a backlog of featured pictures.... The Rambling Man (talk) 18:30, 1 December 2012 (UTC)
      • Hmm, I wonder if it's time for User:Art LaPella/Is this criticism constructive? Art LaPella (talk) 19:10, 1 December 2012 (UTC)
        • Scheduling is the process of determining which pictures and which associated articles will be making appearances. You have a complaint about which articles should be shown. I don't understand your assertion about how this has nothing to do with scheduling when it appears to be exactly what you're talking about. —howcheng {chat} 19:16, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

Rap Genius feels like a wiki

I like the way rapgenius.com references explanations of users... How about add-on/plug-in for WP which uses the same approach? (comment/explanation bubbles)

--Foerdi (talk) 15:40, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

• That sounds a lot like original research, which we don't allow here. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:44, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Today's Featured Article

Given that one of the most read BBC news story is about multiple deaths from eating a soup made from poisonous mushrooms, is this featured article entirely appropriate? I know Misplaced Pages is not censored, but that is different from promoting an article on the front-page, the entrance to the English language Misplaced Pages, describing something so totally inappropriate at this time. 86.13.97.144 (talk) 20:03, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Being able to clearly identify toxic fungi Is rather important for the budding mushroom collector, what better way to educate than to have an excellent article on one particular (albiet, non-deadly but with many edible relations in its group) toxic fungi on the front page? There is no intention to cause offense, and it's not as if it's a person who just murdered 100 people on the front page. If people get offended by mere association that isn't wikipedia's problem.--85.210.97.62 (talk) 22:02, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Firstly, I don't see what's "inappropriate" about running the article at this time. If the subject were, for example, a comedic fictional story about the accidental consumption of poisonous mushrooms leading to zany hijinks, I might understand the criticism. But it's simply about a mushroom species (and not even the one involved in the incident). If anything, the timing seems good (as reader interest in mushroom-related topics might be elevated).

Secondly, it's far too late to act on such a concern. Last-minute rescheduling is possible (and has occurred due to unfortunate timing), but once a featured article is on the main page (in this instance, almost finished with its run), only extraordinary factors (e.g. the discovery of plagiarism or other legal issues) will get it pulled. —David Levy 22:08, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Featured Picture of the Day

Am I the only person whose breath was simply taken away by the sight of the Galeries Lafayette? That is truly one of the most amazing buildings that I think I have ever seen – for the artistry and the architectural detail and the grandeur to exist in something as ultimately mundane as a department store absolutely astounds me. This photograph in a nutshell is what keeps me opening up the Main Page on Misplaced Pages as the first thing I do when I turn on my computer every single morning, and what keeps me going back to the site regularly throughout the day so that I don't miss something. Shocking Blue (talk) 06:29, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

• It is indeed quite grand. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 06:36, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

  Not to be that guy, but I'm more astounded by how poor the Galeries Lafayette article is. I'm not saying the image shouldn't have been selected due to the poor state of the article, but I was under the impression this was France's Harrods and, frankly, there is no comparison between the two articles. -- tariqabjotu 07:55, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

I added some info which an anon removed about a half a year ago. It's still not a great article by any stretch, but it's slightly better now. Garion96 (talk) 08:07, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

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