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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Sue Rangell (talk | contribs) at 20:29, 15 February 2014 (→Stop now). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Welcome to my talk page. If you are here about an AfD, please keep the discussion on the AfD discussion page. If you are here about a PROD, please keep the discussion on the prodded page's talk page. If you are here because you don't like the way I closed a discussion, make your comment HERE WARNING: If you choose to ignore the above requests, I will move the conversation myself, answer and quote you per Misplaced Pages:Etiquette I make errors... a lot - if you are here to complain about a tag or a warning please assume good faith. I am human. I make mistakes. If I have erred, don't hesitate to tell me, but being rude will get you nowhere. I will generally respond here to comments and notes that are posted here, rather than replying via your Talk page (or the article Talk page, if you are writing to me here about an article), so you may want to watch this page until you are responded to, or specifically let me know where you'd prefer the reply. I am always around. Talk page messages will get a fairly timely response. Please click here to leave a new message, or talk to me on IRC HERE. I am Offline. It is 11:23 AM where I live in Alaska.

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Archives (Index)

Sunday 11th of November 2012 12:06:59 PM Sunday 2nd of December 2012 07:29:12 AM Thursday 13th of December 2012 07:19:29 AM Tuesday 18th of December 2012 11:35:39 AM Saturday 22nd of December 2012 02:36:45 PM Saturday 29th of December 2012 03:02:55 AM Sunday 6th of January 2013 04:49:09 PM Wednesday 23rd of January 2013 02:17:50 AM Monday 18th of March 2013 09:33:17 PM Friday 1st of November 2013 06:44:53 PM Thursday 16th of January 2014 04:55:20 PM Tuesday 12th of August 2014 10:56:22 AM Tuesday 14th of October 2014 05:37:58 AM Saturday 23rd of May 2020 04:01:33 AM

Non-Admin Closures

Reminder: WP:NAC is not policy, it is only an essay. My closures follow WP:NACD (actual policy), thank you.

Please place your complaints here. It appears that no matter how an AfD is closed, it will offend SOMEBODY, therefore please place your complaints below. I will read them all, but I will not respond to them if they are rude. I am also likely to ignore your threats helpful comments and advice if your own closures are regularly up for deletion review... I do not take a simple head count of the !votes, I consider consensus and Misplaced Pages policy. I close Afds that are WP:SNOW keeps. Or if they are hopelessly locked, with three or more relistings, as WP:NOCONSENSUS. If they have less than three listings, I relist. If I closed a 20 day old hopelessly deadlocked discussion as "no consensus", please do not accuse me of doing a NAC on a "controversial" thread, as obviously there was no consensus, and it was wasting everyone's time, and needed to be closed. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 18:50, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

I have undone your NAC as it met none of the criteria listed in the appropriate conditions for a NAC. Please review WP:NAC and restrict yourself to appropriate cases where appropriate. Hasteur (talk) 04:23, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

• You are free to do so of course, but I think it's a big waste of time. There is no chance of it being deleted. I closed it as "no consensus" because there isn't a consensus, nor will relisting likely result in a consensus, as it has already been relisted... In the interests of saving a lot of people a lot of time, I hope you will reconsider, but if not, it will most likely be closed as "No Consensus" anyway. Be well. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 04:30, 5 January 2013

You were wrong sue. The article was closed by an admin as a Keep. PortlandOregon97217 (talk) 01:23, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

• There is no right or wrong. No need for drama. "No Consensus" defaults to "Keep", so there is no real difference in how the article was closed, just a (very slight) difference of opinion between the closing admin and myself. Since the nominator was angry at my closure for not DELETING it, I am sure the backlash would have been considerably more had I closed it as a Keep, rather than "No Consensus". Either way, the article still stands. It was not deleted. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 01:34, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

Let me say this another way: You were unable to see the consensus that was right in front of you. PortlandOregon97217 (talk) 01:56, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

• Let me say THIS another way... I don't like drama. I try to be very friendly to everyone that I meet on Misplaced Pages. The last thing I want to do is quibble with somebody, on my own talk page, the difference between a "No Consensus" and "Keep". It is the tiniest of judgment calls. The absolute tiniest. Other than what you are doing here, you seem like a very nice and rational person, so I am willing to discuss this trivial matter with you, but I will not muddy up my own talk page with it. This discussion must continue on your talk page, thank you. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 02:03, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

No Thanks.I have made my point PortlandOregon97217 (talk) 02:10, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

• Very well then, I appreciate your input. Happy editing! --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 02:20, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Windows 8

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 Done

Please comment on Talk:Sustainability

Greetings! You have been randomly selected to receive an invitation to participate in the request for comment on Talk:Sustainability. Should you wish to respond to the invitation, your contribution to this discussion will be very much appreciated! If in doubt, please see suggestions for responding. If you do not wish to receive these types of notices, please remove your name from Misplaced Pages:Feedback request service. — Legobot (talk) 00:02, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

 Done

Please comment on an RfC about Living members of deposed royal families and the titles attributed to them on WP

I have opened an RfC on articles about living members of families whose ancestors were deposed as monarchs of various countries and the titles and "styles" attributed to these living people, often in a misleading way and inaccurate way in my opinion. Please join in the discussion at Misplaced Pages talk:Manual of Style/Biographies "Use of royal "Titles and styles" and honorific prefixes in articles and templates referring to pretenders to abolished royal titles and their families".Smeat75 (talk) 05:03, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

 Done (but probably not in the manner that you had hoped.) --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 19:05, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Li (surname)

Greetings! You have been randomly selected to receive an invitation to participate in the request for comment on Talk:Li (surname). Should you wish to respond to the invitation, your contribution to this discussion will be very much appreciated! If in doubt, please see suggestions for responding. If you do not wish to receive these types of notices, please remove your name from Misplaced Pages:Feedback request service. — Legobot (talk) 00:06, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

Infoboxes vs navboxes

Hi. I just saw your addition of Category:Music infobox templates to Template:Stereolab, and was wondering if you might re-consider some of your recent edits.

The WP:Navboxes are totally different things from WP:Infoboxes, and should be kept in separate categories. Only "infoboxes" (the meta-templates that are shared across many unrelated topics) should be in the music-infobox-category. The "navboxes" (such as the Stereolab navbox) should all be in subcategories of Category:Music infobox templates (in the case of Stereolab, it was already in Category:Indie rock group navigational boxes).

Hope that helps. –Quiddity (talk) 01:39, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

I have no idea how that template got onto my edit list. I was careful to add the Category:Music infobox templates only to infoboxes. My apologies for the error. Thank you for the correction. I will go through and double check my work. Be well. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 19:45, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

Hi. No worries. As someone said to me years ago, "You're not a real Wikipedian until you've made, and learned from, at least 50 mistakes", and I'm still racking them up! Just to narrow it down, it looks like these 128 edits are the ones that need reverting (a few of them already have been). Sorry, and Thanks! :) –Quiddity (talk) 07:29, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

What a mess. Thanks for bringing this to me. I think it's all cleared up now. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 21:24, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

Protected templates

About this - which were the templates that you wanted to add categories to, but couldn't because they were protected? These all need to be converted to use {{documentation}}, but despite my remarkable clairvoyant abilities I think I might need your help to find them. :) If you could give me a list of them or something, that would be very helpful. Best — Mr. Stradivarius 12:52, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Of course! But I was intending to go through my list and make the requests as you suggested, so I could meet the quota requirement. Won't that mess me up now? I would like to eventually have the responsibility so I don't have to bug admins to do these minor edits all the time. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 21:57, 1 December 2013 (UTC)

Well, it's more of a guideline than a quota. :) I would personally give the same weight to it whether you made edit requests for all of them separately or whether you gave me a list, but I can't speak for other admins of course. If you gave me a list it would take me less time to answer, but then I suppose making the requests separately might give you some practice in using sandboxes and the {{edit protected}} template. It's six of one and half a dozen of the other, really, so just choose whichever one suits you best. Hope this helps. — Mr. Stradivarius 09:44, 3 December 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Template talk:Convert

Greetings! You have been randomly selected to receive an invitation to participate in the request for comment on Template talk:Convert. Should you wish to respond to the invitation, your contribution to this discussion will be very much appreciated! If in doubt, please see suggestions for responding. If you do not wish to receive these types of notices, please remove your name from Misplaced Pages:Feedback request service. — Legobot (talk) 00:07, 1 December 2013 (UTC)

 Done --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 21:58, 1 December 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:List of vaporware

Greetings! You have been randomly selected to receive an invitation to participate in the request for comment on Talk:List of vaporware. Should you wish to respond to the invitation, your contribution to this discussion will be very much appreciated! If in doubt, please see suggestions for responding. If you do not wish to receive these types of notices, please remove your name from Misplaced Pages:Feedback request service. — Legobot (talk) 00:04, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

 Done --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 21:12, 12 December 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Template talk:Infobox album

Greetings! You have been randomly selected to receive an invitation to participate in the request for comment on Template talk:Infobox album. Should you wish to respond to the invitation, your contribution to this discussion will be very much appreciated! If in doubt, please see suggestions for responding. If you do not wish to receive these types of notices, please remove your name from Misplaced Pages:Feedback request service. — Legobot (talk) 00:06, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

 Done --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 21:55, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for your support. Cheers. Kraxler (talk) 12:17, 16 December 2013 (UTC)

You are most welcome! --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 19:35, 16 December 2013 (UTC)

Edit counter opt-in

Hi Sue. :) Would you be willing to opt in to X!'s Edit Counter? People at RfA usually like to look at the extended stats that you can only get access to from opting in. I'm no exception - I was just about to post them on the RfA talk page when I noticed that you hadn't opted in yet. Best of luck, by the way! — Mr. Stradivarius 10:14, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Hmmmmmmm. Thought I had already done that a long time ago. Must be my aging brains. I will get right on it. :) --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 19:59, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Hi there. Just a note that you still haven't opted in. I hope you do so soon, as you clearly plan on running the RFA gauntlet again and that's pretty essential stuff for doing that... Best regards, — Tim /// Carrite (talk) 02:34, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

I don't think that not opting in was the reason for the piling on, but I'll definitely have it done before next time, if there is a next time, so nobody has any excuses. Thanks for the reminder, be well. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 19:51, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

File:A tombstone with Sue Rangell's name on it (joke).jpg listed for deletion

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:A tombstone with Sue Rangell's name on it (joke).jpg, has been listed at Misplaced Pages:Files for deletion. Please see the discussion to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. MJ94 (talk) 03:15, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Merry Christmas!

Mediran (t • c) is wishing you a Merry Christmas! This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year!

Spread the cheer by adding {{subst:Xmas2}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Mediran (t • c) 08:25, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

Merry Christmas!

I wish you a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year 2014! This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year! — ΛΧΣ 20:59, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

Yo Ho Ho

Dougweller (talk) is wishing you Seasons Greetings! Whether you celebrate your hemisphere's Solstice or Christmas, Diwali, Hogmanay, Hanukkah, Lenaia, Festivus or even the Saturnalia, this is a special time of year for almost everyone!

Spread the holiday cheer by adding {{subst:User:WereSpielChequers/Dec13}} to your friends' talk pages.

Dougweller (talk) 22:11, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

A bowl of strawberries for you!

Thank you for the Christmas kindness on my talk page. I will pass it forward. Have a wonderful new year!! — Keithbob • Talk • 03:10, 25 December 2013 (UTC)

Merry Christmas

Many thanks, you too! GiantSnowman 08:43, 25 December 2013 (UTC)

Ditto. Thanks very much and all the best for 2014! -- Trevj (talk · contribs) 17:42, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

You've got mail!

John F. Lewis (talk) 23:45, 5 January 2014 (UTC)

 Done

Hello back!

Hi Sue, no worries and thank you for being so forthright. I'm a firm believer in common sense and wish that much of arguing that's been happening had more "common sense" injected into it... :) I'm also a gun control advocate, but my definition of "gun control" includes allowing any and all law abiding people to have them while keeping them from people who are not or that shouldn't have them for mental or similar problems. It also includes not making those same law abiding people into criminals because they chose to exercise this right. I have to say that I respect and appreciate your contributions and I hope that we can all be more dispassionate about the subject matter. Best regards, --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 00:44, 10 January 2014 (UTC)

Blog

I'm not saying that THIS is a reliable source, but it does suggest that the anti-Heller view is not quite so fringy. Cheers.Anythingyouwant (talk) 20:04, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

THANKS! I really appreciate it!! --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 20:10, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

Replaceable fair use File:Robert Spitzer political scientist.jpg

Thanks for uploading File:Robert Spitzer political scientist.jpg. I noticed that this file is being used under a claim of fair use. However, I think that the way it is being used fails the first non-free content criterion. This criterion states that files used under claims of fair use may have no free equivalent; in other words, if the file could be adequately covered by a freely-licensed file or by text alone, then it may not be used on Misplaced Pages. If you believe this file is not replaceable, please:

1. Go to the file description page and add the text {{di-replaceable fair use disputed|<your reason>}} below the original replaceable fair use template, replacing <your reason> with a short explanation of why the file is not replaceable.
2. On the file discussion page, write a full explanation of why you believe the file is not replaceable.

Alternatively, you can also choose to replace this non-free media item by finding freely licensed media of the same subject, requesting that the copyright holder release this (or similar) media under a free license, or by creating new media yourself (for example, by taking your own photograph of the subject).

If you have uploaded other non-free media, consider checking that you have specified how these media fully satisfy our non-free content criteria. You can find a list of description pages you have edited by clicking on this link. Note that even if you follow steps 1 and 2 above, non-free media which could be replaced by freely licensed alternatives will be deleted 2 days after this notification (7 days if uploaded before 13 July 2006), per the non-free content policy. If you have any questions, please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Hipocrite (talk) 20:39, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Feel free to delete it. If you don't want a picture of the guy on his own article that's fine with me. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 20:43, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

It's not about wanting, it's about our rules on non-free media. We don't use non-free headshots. Hipocrite (talk) 20:46, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

I think the photo is well within Misplaced Pages policy, but if you disagree go ahead and remove it. Just let's not make a big hairy deal about it. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 20:49, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Notice of Edit warring noticeboard discussion

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Misplaced Pages's policy on edit warring. The thread is Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring#User:Sue Rangell reported by User:Lightbreather (Result: )]]. Thank you. —Lightbreather (talk) 02:07, 24 January 2014 (UTC)

• result was No violation

...per WP:SNOW, I should think, considering how fast they threw the complaint out. Please, for the love of Pete, stop wasting everyone's time, and learn how Misplaced Pages works, how to work collaboratively, and particularly what a revert is. Thanx. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 22:35, 24 January 2014 (UTC)

Notice of a discussion that may be of interest to you

There is a Split proposal discussion on the Gun politics in the U.S. talk page that may be of interest to you. Lightbreather (talk) 04:35, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Please stop interacting with Lightbreather

I am asking you to stop interacting with User:Lightbreather and editing articles in the topic of gun control where she has been editing. She is maturing as an editor and there are enough editors in this controversial area to watch over these articles. Your following her to articles interferes with this process.

On Jan 25 Lightbreather created Global gun cultures and began to add contents, some copied some over from Gun cultures in the USA. She gave the reasons for this (also on Jan 25) at Talk:Gun cultures in the USA#In support of Gun cultures as uniquely notable WP:N topics. Rather than waiting for the article to develop, you nominated the page for deletion at Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Global gun cultures on Jan 26.

I had asked Lightbreather to ask for explanations when material she adds is removed as part of edit, revert, discuss. On Jan 26 after removing sourced material she added to Gun cultures in the USA, you refused to discuss your removal. Instead, at Talk:Gun cultures in the USA#How does removing Spitzer citation and material improve the article you of harassing you.

Please stop doing this and work instead in other areas. Thank you. StarryGrandma (talk) 20:01, 4 February 2014 (UTC)

StarryGrandma, I have been editing Misplaced Pages for a very long time. Over that time I have been trusted with responsibilities for a lot of duties, including handling personal information. I do not have a history of fighting constantly with other editors, as Lightbreather has. Lightbreather has been in a constant state of combat since she re-appeared and began disrupting the Assault Weapons Ban article. (It has been stable since she left it after her ANI boomerang) You are Lightbreather's mentor. If she has a problem with my edits (or anyone else's), I suggest that SHE move to other areas and edit something besides Gun Control. I personally see no need, as yet, for a step like that, but if she really has anger/frustration issues, she is the one that needs to be proactive. If she is maturing as an editor, as you say, she needs to learn how to back off when things get frustrating. That is what mature editors do, they take wikibreaks or edit other areas of wikipedia, they don't demand that other editors move in their stead. I will also point out that at least ten other editors have expressed concerns about Lightbreather's editing behavior, and have called for topic bans fairly recently. Rather than suggest that I am the problem, why not mentor her? --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 02:02, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Notice per WP:DISCUSSAFD

Reasons given in your AFD nomination of Global gun cultures have been addressed. The nomination should be withdrawn now. Would you please do so, so that the deletion discussion will be closed by an admin? I imagine you've just been too busy to follow-up on this. Thanks. Lightbreather (talk) 04:36, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

ANI notice

There is currently a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. The thread is Disruptive_editing_per_WP:DISCUSSAFD. Thank you. Lightbreather (talk) 04:19, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

Request for comment

I've made a request for comment on the page Talk:List of all war outbreaks during World War II. If you could add your opinion, I'd really appreciate it. Thank you. N4 (talk) 15:51, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

 Done --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 20:04, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

Thank you - from N4

Thank you for your help with the RfC! N4 (talk) 03:19, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

Stop now

Sue, the SALW article, which your first edit immediately preceded Lightbreather's first edits is one of the most blatant examples of following a user I've ever seen. If you do not stop reading Lightbreather's contribs and following them around, you'll find yourself blocked. See Misplaced Pages:Harassment#Wikihounding. This is the very definition of your activities with respect to Lightbreather. Whether or not you feel they are a POV-pusher and SPA, you've failed to gain consensus several times that their editing is problematic. I understand your concerns with Lightbreather, I know you have strong feelings about them, but reading their contributions is inappropriate. In addition, we have no rule about not removing content unless we have consensus. In fact, the policy says the exact opposite. Editors do not need to seek consensus before removing content from an article.--v/r - TP 18:25, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Since when is a single edit considered Wikihounding? Her edit triggered a notification, and so I went and checked it out. TParis, I do not follow lightbreather's contribs and edit them. I just looked at her recent edits since, and she has made something like 500 edits since I last interacted with her, and on various articles, none of which have been followed by me at all. On the other hand, apparently if I make a single edit that Lightbreather doesn't like, I get threatened by you. Who is doing the Misplaced Pages:Harassment#Wikihounding here? Do this again, and it will be *me* who complains. --Sue Rangell ✍ ✉ 19:37, 15 February 2014 (UTC)