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A fact from this article was featured on Misplaced Pages's Main Page in the On this day section on January 30, 2013.

Book: The Damned Don't Drown

Recently I added The Damned Don't Drown by A.V. Sellwood to the list of books about the Wilhelm Gustloff. I indicated that this is a "fictionalized account" of the sinking, which means that the accounts are true but that they have been retold in a fictionalized format in order to both flesh them out and merge them together into a readable story. My wording has twice been changed by an anonymous contributor, probably well-meaning, to read that the book is a "work of fiction on the tragedy", citing the copyright page.

I don't wish to get into a revert war with this nameless person, so I'll list my reasons here.

Firstly, "fiction" implies that the characters and their stories have been invented. In fact, I can personally attest to the accuracy of one account, which is that of my own partner and her mother.

Secondly, I've checked the copyright page of my book and it doesn't mention "fiction".

Thirdly, A.V. Sellwood includes a "Personal Note" at the front of the book, in which he writes:

Today, in The Damned Don't Drown, I have attempted a reconstruction of the tragedy ...

I hope this sufficiently justifies my characterizing Sellwood's book as a "fictionalized account", yet I remain open to any evidence that justifies the opposing point of view. Ian Fieggen (talk) 01:07, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Added Sellwood book to "Further Reading"

Fictionalized accounts are by definition poor choices as sources for encyclopedia articles. But I don't know of any policies prohibiting them from being listed under "Further reading" if they are in fact about the article's subject/topic. I've added this book to "Further reading" along with the recent one by Cathryn Prince (2013). Both Prince and Sellwood's books have WorldCat records to which I've linked. ChristineBushMV (talk) 04:52, 14 September 2014 (UTC)

Wilhelm Gustloff

it is my opinion that the articles on the sinkings of the Willhelm Gustloff and the Goya and others should be listed under German shipwrecks because they were German ships operating in German waters - Konigsberg, Danzig, East Prussia, Pomerania etc were all a part of Germany at that time, and had been an integral part of Germany for many years prior to the WW2. 68.103.125.194 (talk) 21:05, 5 October 2008 (UTC)Malcolm Freeman

Ship history

I placed and expand tag on the ship history section. I feel that we should provide more information on the Wilhelm Gustloff prior to it's military career. Some of provided links are good sources for this. If I get a chance I'll try to add some material.Shinerunner (talk) 21:17, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

Move to MV Wilhelm Gustloff

The page was recently moved (renamed) to "MV Wilhelm Gustloff". I'm just wondering if "MV" shouldn't be changed into "MS" (Motorschiff) or similar, to use the proper German abbreviation. At least I think we should be consistent in using the native language designations (is there a policy regarding this?). Please compare to the German WW1 warships, which are all called "SMS" (Seiner Majestät Schiff). What do you think? Cheers MikeZ (talk) 10:25, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

It does seem a bit strange. As well as this, the ship is most notable for its sinking, at which time it was a naval vessel. Clearly it would have had different German designations during its career, so perhaps a better name would be "Wilhelm Gustloff (German ship)" or something similar. By comparison, we have:German battleship Bismarck and German cruiser Emden.--Jack Upland (talk) 07:16, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

podcast of an interview with three survivors of the sinking (available till mid-February 2009)

On a recent radio broadcast of Late Night Live (Australian Broadcasting Corporation), the presenter, Phillip Adams, speaks for almost an hour with three survivors of the sinking, along with a historian and one of the wreck divers. The program first aired in 2005 but was repeated last night. This is the link to the podcast - which are normally only available for about two weeks (which is why I'm placing the link here rather than in the links section of the article). The page also lists a book (written in Swedish) which I didn't see listed in the article. Title: Dodens Hav ('Sea of Death') Author: Claes-Goran Wetterholm Publisher: Prisma, Sweden, 2003 GlenDillon 07:20, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

Note: The podcast of Late Night Live mentioned by Glen Dillon is still available after five years on the ABC website, under the link given (download and listening tested). --Zipor haNefesch (talk) 14:24, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

lead-in

explanation of my changes to the recent edit by IP editor: (1) "the Soviets" , in my view is a somewhat unencylopedic phrase - ie it was a Soviet sub, not the Soviet 'people'. Lives are not killed - people are. Lives are lost. Also - the term 'killing' may imply 'direct effect', such as those killed directly by the torpedoes, of which there was undoubtedly many. Obviously, the main cause of the loss of life was the Soviet sub's attack, but killed doesn't seem the best term. (2) Most of them 'civilians' - again- true - but this is not what made it the largest maritime disaster. (3) The term 'worst' is also unencyclopedic - because of its ambiguity. It was numerically the greatest loss of life. 'Worst' could be taken to mean other things such as 'most immoral' etc. (4) Finally - the term 'human' in 'human history' is redundant. In the context of maritime disaters, history=human history. (5) ALso - please note the number of lives. It was recently changed from 9k to 7k - without much explanation, other than a ref to the Deepimage website. (6) There is still a mismatch between the numbers stated in the intro paragraphs. I haven't attemted to resolve this, yet it is a glaring problem in the article. GlenDillon 15:12, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

She vs. He

Isn't it traditional in the German navy to refer to ships in the Masculine? I might be mistaken about that. --Nukes4Tots (talk) 20:27, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

There's a suggestion it might have applied to Bismarck, but not that it was a tradition; but so what? This is the WP for the English language, where it is traditional to refer to ships as "she". Xyl 54 (talk) 13:06, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

German wikipedia refers to the ship in the feminine, Die Wilhelm Gustloff, Bismarck is also feminine after a review of that article, Die Bismarck. --Farkeld (talk) 13:14, 30 January 2010 (UTC)

In German (my native language), as a general rule, all ships are feminine. -- HH 85.180.213.210 (talk) 20:15, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

The ship is actually referred to as "it" for much of the article!--Jack Upland (talk) 23:35, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

Gunter Grass dead link

I'm not sure how to edit the list of references, but no. 12 supposedly linking to the 2003 Gunter Grass article in the nytimes is a dead link. here is the active link to the article in the times' archive http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/08/books/still-intrigued-history-s-shadows-gunter-grass-worries-about-effects-war-then.html?ref=gunter_grass if a more experienced editor could fix this it would be greatly appreciated —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.90.164.50 (talk) 18:44, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

File:Gusloff map.jpg Nominated for Deletion

An image used in this article, File:Gusloff map.jpg, has been nominated for deletion at Wikimedia Commons in the following category: Deletion requests August 2011 What should I do? Don't panic; a discussion will now take place over on Commons about whether to remove the file. This gives you an opportunity to contest the deletion, although please review Commons guidelines before doing so. If the image is non-free then you may need to upload it to Misplaced Pages (Commons does not allow fair use) If the image isn't freely licensed and there is no fair use rationale then it cannot be uploaded or used. This notification is provided by a Bot --CommonsNotificationBot (talk) 10:47, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

Porthole

Can someone explain what this portion of the cutline (caption) below the photo of the recovered porthole means? — ...donated to the Museum ship Albatross in Damp 2000. "Damp 2000" ?? And where is the "Museum ship Albatross" ? Sca (talk) 17:12, 15 November 2012 (UTC)

It's in Damp, Germany. Transferred in the year 2000.--Jack Upland (talk) 23:52, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

Oh, a little Dorf in Schleswig-Holstein. German Wiki says it has a population of 112. Sca (talk) 23:43, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

Damp 2000 is the spa resort, rehab clinic and yacht port of the village of Damp, as H. Raeder noted below. It was built in the 1970s. 'Albatros' is a museum ship laid up on the beach there. It hosted an exhibition about the "Rescue via sea" in 1945 (closed in 1999), which is probably where this porthole went. See text and map in the museum registry for Schleswig-Holstein at Museen Nord (in English).--Zipor haNefesch (talk) 14:48, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

May be you are wrong. Damp 2000 is part of the village of Damp. "Damp 2000" is a private owned yacht port (with hotels and hospitals) in the city of Damp. It was founded in the years before the year 2000. That is why they called it "Damp 2000". --Dr. Hartwig Raeder (talk) 06:49, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

Re: section on "Books, Documentaries, and Movies"

Lists are popular on Misplaced Pages, but they generally bloat rather than improve an article. I would like to discuss improving this article by moving the listings in the "Books, Documentaries, and Movies" section into sub-sections under "Also see," "Further reading", or "External links". ChristineBushMV (talk) 05:27, 14 September 2014 (UTC)

• All unassessed articles
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