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Something different: swimming world record template

Hey. When you're looking for something entirely different to do, take a look a the different templates employed for this family of articles: Template:World records in swimming. The templates are a complete mess, with various built-in dynamic field functions. There should be one template, well-designed, that works well for all of these articles. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 13:18, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

Can you point to some of them? Are you referring to the tables? Alakzi (talk) 14:00, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

Just for fun, some of these articles use the templates, some use wikitables, and some use a mix on the same page. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 16:39, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

For the record, I did take a look at these, but the conversion is quite tedious, so I've been putting it off. Alakzi (talk) 12:04, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Trust me: I know they're a mess. I didn't expect you to jump in and fix them, or create a simplified replacement overnight. I really wanted you to get a feel for what a mess they are, identify the specific problems, start contemplating ideas for how to replace them with a more logical, simplified replacement, and then discuss. Whatever we do, it's going to require a lot of manual editing to replace the existing templates (and wiki tables where used), so I want to get your best answer on the first attempt. You're not a sports guy, but you are organized and logical, so you're a good guinea pig to see if the replacement is easily intelligible to general readers, not swimming/sports fans. Of course, I am also looking for the most elegant coding solution, too.
These templates originally had a dynamic field built into them for the swim meet locations that (a) forced you to use the three-character country codes, (b) rendered a flag icon and linked country name for every location contrary to several MOS provisions (I mean, how many times does the United States need to be linked in the same article?), and (c) rendered an ugly display error if you left the location fields blank or tried to replace the country code in favor of linked or unlinked text. Earlier, I had Frietjes perform some surgery on them just to get rid of the redundant flag icons for meet locations.
As far as I know, there are a maximum of 21 world record progression articles for specific swimming events which should be using these templates. There may be, however, other uses of the templates of which I am unaware -- I need to check the template transclusions counter. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 12:33, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
OK. Are there particular aspects of {{Swimmingrecord}} you're dissatisfied with? The reason we're stuck with a parameter for every tiny thing is for column sorting to work properly. I could investigate whether some parameters could be shed or combined for ease of use. The repetition of flags and wikilinks is unfortunate, but we could probably tolerate that in a table. The templates are also used in athlete articles, where some columns are hidden - see Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Swimmingrecord. Alakzi (talk) 14:40, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Well, that raises a very good question: Do these records need to be sortable? They are already in chronological order, and record times are descending. If a reader wants to find a particular swimmer, they can do that faster with their browser's keyword search function -- the date sort function only sorts to the series beginning in chronological order or the series ending in reverse chronological order; likewise the last name sort function only sorts to names beginning with A in alphabetical order, or to names beginning with Z in reverse alphabetical order. Sorting by swim meet location or event (presumably in alpha or reverse alpha order) is also not terribly useful, either. As the title suggests, these tables are most useful to illustrate the progression of the declining times of new world records over the last 90 to 100 years. I say we ditch the sortability functions for every data column -- would that simplify your possible coding solutions? Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 15:04, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
If we ditch sorting, there's hardly any reason for these templates to exist - that is, beyond enforcing a set number of columns. I agree that we probably don't need all of the sorting possibilities of {{Swimmingrecord}}, but I imagine that's something you're gonna want to discuss with contributors to swimming lists. If it takes so much effort to accomplish something so primitive, it might be better to look for alternatives. Alakzi (talk) 15:19, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Well, the templates do provide (1) a structure and (2) a measure of uniformity, which is not unimportant. The template creator has not edited in three years, and the current biggest consumer is a German editor who is grinding out incomplete national record sets for African countries (the least competitive region in world swimming). But my new favorite is the List of Burmese national records in swimming, which -- surprise! -- has a Myanmar/Burmese flag for every Burmese national record in swimming. LOL Given that something like 400 articles appear to be using these templates, ditching them and starting over does not seem to be a realistic option, inasmuch as every article includes multiple uses of the templates. I'm going to think on this some more; when you get bored with whatever else your working on, contemplate your ideal template solution (minus the unnecessary sort functions) for these tables. I can see now why someone just gave up and formatted several of the world record progression articles with wikitable coding: it was simpler. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 15:44, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

Mean people suck

So, don't play with them: . I've taken Ched's talk page off my watch list until that group are done shouting at each other. You might try it, too. Just a thought. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 01:33, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

Lawyer, consider the header. Firstly, it's self evident. Secondly, who are the mean people, by implication. If I appear on said page (I commented on it and don't know if it was archived already), am I in that group? Thirdly, if you try to mediate, would you listen to "don't play"? - Ched was the first person here who helped me in a crisis (To leave or not to leave, that was the question), - I will keep watching, declared nurse that I am ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:21, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
Selig sind die Friedfertigen; denn sie werden Gottes Kinder heißen. You are not a mean person, Gerda; in point of fact, in my personal experience, you are a very kind person. Taking sides on a user talk page, in the midst of some long-running feud about reliable sources in a Feature Article about the Boy Scouts founder Robert Baden-Powell, is not peace-making. Frankly, based on the level of invective exchanged there, I think we can safely assume that this animosity between two long-time editors did not start at the Baden-Powell article, and, sadly, probably won't end there, either. Sometimes, grown-ups just have to work things out amongst themselves, and if they can't, then they must live with the consequences. Takings sides in such a dispute, as several would-be Friedfertigen have done, only fans the flames. Alakzi takes these things too much to heart, when he probably should do his best to avoid being drawn in. My comment above was the short version. Prost! Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 08:42, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
Thank you. I believe that Ched is not mean, SandyGeorgia is not mean (see?), ... - a bit shortened too much. - I manage ARCA without lawyer's assistance, but it takes a lot of Friedfertigkeit to ignore the terms I inherited from Andy, - Alakzi, you know the tune of that song ;) - IGNORE IGNORE IGNORE was an email by a sadly missed friend for whom I wrote spirale of justice. - Seriously: WE ARE the outcasts, I told you. Some even want us not to miss. (I added the image that one of us took in memory of another.) - "Hope" is the first word in a comment kept on my talk, and I added the wonderful lyrics of the first piece I ever performed in choir - age 12 - yesterday: "Graceful, charming and sweet". --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:02, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
I don't believe that there are mean and not-mean people; I believe that there are people who hold different ideals, and who lose sight of the big picture in their effort to put those ideals into practice. I've yet to see anybody who's mean to everybody else. We've all got our times when we behave less than ideally. Nonetheless, the apparent frequency of these confrontations might lead one to postulate a systemic underlying cause. Alakzi (talk) 14:36, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
Follow the link to "not to miss" for long history in short, - and perhaps be bold and change the header here? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:42, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
I've read the page, but I don't feel like I should comment on things that happened before my time. I'll leave it to Dirtlawyer to change the title. Alakzi (talk) 15:58, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
No comment needed, only understanding for the background. I commented out the image of the missed, but it's never far, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:08, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
ps: I read it myself and had forgotten that wrote I the line "Sadness and pain are not measurable." - Feel better today, I must say. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:46, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
Alakzi, I like talking to you, remember? Everything you said refreshed me, - sorry if it didn't feel as positive for you. - I even have a new job, about listings of the parts of a composition, see BWV 11#Scoring and structure, - more later, - I woke up with an idea, but homework and RL first, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:39, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
Unfortunately for me, Gerda, I tend to be left out to dry; defending yourself will - without exception - only work against you. One editor has even gone as far as to suggest I shouldn't be a TE, because of my having inserted a two-pixel dividing line they didn't like. Alakzi (talk) 10:57, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
WP:MPSBKBO. (With apologies to WSC.) Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 11:02, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
(ec) I don't defend myself, ever, nor should you. This is about a new template, - you have to deal only with me ;) - I pinged you on QAIPOST, and so far it's only brainstorming, lawyers welcome, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:06, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

Hi

Just wanted to say thank-you for your efforts. There really are some great people on wiki. Don't let the unpleasant folks get you down - just ignore the BS per ]. I've got some things I hope to do, but maybe by late July I can work with you on an article if you'd like. Don't give up. — Ched :  ?  05:41, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Cheers Ched - look forward to working with you. Alakzi (talk) 11:00, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Nomination for merging of Template:Infobox T&W Metro station

Template:Infobox T&W Metro station has been nominated for merging with Template:Infobox station. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thank you. Jc86035 (talk | contribs) Use {{re|Jc86035}} to reply to me 07:32, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

An apology

I apologize

Hi, Alakzi. I am here to not only thank you for your effort to help, but apologize for two things: snapping your head off (unnecessarily), and taking so long to come over and apologize.

I recognize and appreciate that your intervention there was not only well meaning and well intended, but also that you had thoroughly investigated and accurately reported what happened. But instead of thanking you for that, I bit your head off, and for that I am sincerely sorry. The reason I've taken so long to respond is that I did not want to re-stir the pot because I was still holding out hope that just once, if others would stay out of the matter, Ched and I could get to the bottom of it ourselves and that then the behavior would stop. I see today that is not going to happen, and regret that my apology to you is long overdue.

I can see how trying to help and having your head bitten off was/is very painful and discouraging; I am so sorry for that.

Here is how I might have better handled that situation and what my response coulda/shoulda been:

  • Thank you, Alakzi, for taking the time and good-faith effort to investigate the situation and come over here to try to help smooth ruffled feathers and advance understanding. The problem, though, is that these specific behaviors, demonstrated so clearly in this example, have been going on now for years, and you can't be aware of the full background. Ched and Co. follow me to areas in which I work and where they don't even evidence familiarity with the processes, only to dig up an old grudge they bear, and to comment on the contributor rather than content no matter that I don't do that and no matter what I say or how right I may be about the content matter.

    Because it has been seemingly impossible to get this behavior to stop, if you don't mind, it might be helpful at this point if other editors would stay out and let Ched and me try to resolve it ourselves. I think that past intervention of other editors has prevented Ched from owning and addressing the issue. Thank you again for trying, but I'd rather hear from Ched this time, because this has gone on for much too long, and when others intercede, it seems he is never held accountable.

So, that is what I could have said that would have gotten the same message across without being so hurtful to you. I am so sorry, and hope you are not discouraged as a result of this dreadful experience, at my hands. Best regards, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:19, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Thank you, Sandy, I appreciate this a lot. I'm sorry to hear that you've not been able to resolve your differences with Ched for so long, and I'm sorry for not realising the true extent of the dispute. Alakzi (talk) 16:23, 16 May 2015 (UTC)
And thank you for the gracious acceptance of my apology. I am a bit of a Pollyanna at heart and never give up hope that differences can be resolved, and that leads to even more discomfort when they are not. I suspect-- given your attempts to help-- you have a good bit of that in your character as well, and I know how this incident must have hurt. Best, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 16:31, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Oops

I guess I should check my spelling before changing templates. I screwed up, I'm sorry. TrueCRaysball | 00:37, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

No need to apologise, True - we all make mistakes. Have a good evening. Alakzi (talk) 00:39, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

IETF language tag

Hi Alakzi. You removed the IETF language tag I had added to Template:Infobox language. I added the tag so a code could be added for articles such as Austrian German. Austrian German can only be identified by its IETF language tag de-AT. It has no ISO language code of its own, being the national variety of the German language (ISO 639 de) that is used in Austria (ISO 3166-1 AT). The corresponding article on the German wikipedia, Österreichisches Deutsch, shows the IETF language tag in the infobox.

Other articles that would benefit from the IETF language tag include American English, Canadian French, or Swiss Standard German, Brazilian Portuguese. All these articles on language varieties currently lack their language code, even though that code – the IETF language tags en-US, fr-CA, and pt-BR respectively – exists and is being used by countless people. I think all these articles would greatly benefit if the language infobox showed their code. I intend to add it again (unless you convince me otherwise). --mach 🙈🙉🙊 00:54, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

Hi mach. I'm sceptical about the IETF language tag being a key fact, but if nobody else objects, I won't either. Thanks for the explanation. Alakzi (talk) 01:02, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
Is any of the codes a key fact? In any case, I have taken the discussion to Template talk:Infobox language#IETF language_tag so others may voice their objections, if any. I apologize I didn’t do so in the first place. --mach 🙈🙉🙊 01:14, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

Small favor

Can you slap a friendly "welcome to Misplaced Pages" template on this guy's talk page: User talk:Vlmh? He's made a handful of edits since late 2014, and I just had to revert several with an explanation on his talk page. It would be nice if someone left a non-corrective message for him. If we treat the newbies right, we may catch a couple of keepers. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 02:52, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Of course; I've offered them some cookies biscuits. ;-) Alakzi (talk) 02:55, 19 May 2015 (UTC)
Thanks -- all is happy in the valley. We might even get a convert out of him -- WP:SWIMMING needs to replenish its ranks. I hate when the first communication with a newbie is a corrective message; that can be a real turnoff for potentially productive new editors. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 03:00, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Template:Inherit the Wind

When you closed Misplaced Pages:Templates for discussion/Log/2015 April 27#Template:Inherit the Wind, I thought you had considered the page move. However, it seems that there are now a bunch of page moves and template alterations based on a different interpretation of the results.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 16:01, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Hi Tony. No, I did not take into account alternative outcomes. Any such move or alternation is not supported by my closure nor is it prevented by it. Alakzi (talk) 16:12, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Editnotice edit requests

Rather than faffing around with individual edit requests for each one, can you make that same edit from <tt>...</tt> into {{mono}} on:

Thanks! EoRdE6 18:16, 20 May 2015 (UTC)
Done - thanks for digging these up. Alakzi (talk) 18:31, 20 May 2015 (UTC)

Athenry railway station

Instead of blindly hitting the Revert button, why didn't you actually look at the edit? If you notice, there was already a mixture of ] and {{stnlnk|Xxx}} in the body of the article. Also, the WP:RDT was renamed (from a redirect) and moved to the standard position in station articles (immediately following the Infobox). And let’s not get started on {{IERail start}}. Besides the obvious that it should be merged into the standard {{S-line}} — now there’s something useful for you to do — hard-coded colour values were replaced with calls to {{IrishRail Color}}.
And just for good measure, so nobody can say that I didn’t give fair warning:
Stop icon You may be blocked from editing without further warning the next time you disrupt Misplaced Pages, as you did at Athenry railway station.
Useddenim (talk) 14:14, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

PS: Also replaced <small>…</small> with {{small|…}} in the succession box. Useddenim (talk) 14:19, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
Hi Useddenim. I did look at your edit; I did not object to those other changes, so you could've reinstated them. Don't post bogus template-d warnings on my talk page, even if you're going to strike them out. Alakzi (talk) 14:20, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

template islam

read the names in template documentation, they are copied from Shia template and these names are Wrong..that's it! Stop protecting an incorrectly prepared template 68.100.166.227 (talk) 21:42, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

Fixed. Alakzi (talk) 21:49, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

Murji'ah

This is NOT a denomination but theology school!! It's incorrectly placed.. Then where are Maturidi & Mu'tazili? Murji'ah is something like Mu'tazili, Maturidi, and Ash'ari. 68.100.166.227 (talk) 22:18, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

I've practically got no knowledge of Islam; the first I touched the template was when I responded to your edit request, which concerned a technical aspect of it. Please contact somebody who edits Islam articles regularly. Looking at the page history, Dougweller might be able to help. Alakzi (talk) 22:37, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

Hide-Show Option

This switch is missing:

<!--NEEDS the following <includeonly>{{Sidebar with collapsible lists | name = Islam | bodyclass = collapsible {{#if:{{{collapsed|}}}|collapsed}} | titlestyle = font-size:88%; line-height:200%; | title = ] {{resize|115%|{{nobold|Part of ] on ]}}}} <br />{{resize|165%|]}} --> 68.100.166.227 (talk) 22:26, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

It defaults to collapsed; you can use {{Islam|expanded=all}} to the same effect. Alakzi (talk) 22:29, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

But the following form <!-- {{Islam|collapsed=1}} --> is not working.. All template should collapse if you introduce the following: <!-- <includeonly>{{Sidebar with collapsible lists | name = Islam | bodyclass = collapsible {{#if:{{{collapsed|}}}|collapsed}} | titlestyle = font-size:88%; line-height:200%; | title = ] {{resize|115%|{{nobold|Part of ] on ]}}}} --> on top Like Sunnni, Shia, Ismaili templates. 68.100.166.227 (talk) 22:41, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

Right, but if I do what you ask, the template will default to expanded, which other people might object to. Alakzi (talk) 22:45, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
  • No that's not right, you can compare with Sunnni Islam, Shia Islam, Ismailism, and Druze Templates They work well

68.100.166.227 (talk) 22:48, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

Oh I see, it's a separate setting to collapse the sidebar in its entirety. Unfortunately, I'd have to move the headline below the title and alter the style in various other ways for it to work - which I don't really feel like doing right now. If you make these changes in the sandbox, I'll take a look. Alakzi (talk) 22:54, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
Examples of collapsed=1 OPTION

{{Sunni Islam|collapsed=1}} {{Shia Islam|collapsed=1}} {{Ismailism|collapsed=1}} {{Druze|collapsed=1}} {{Alevism|collapsed=1}}

See it works fine 68.100.166.227 (talk) 23:06, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

ISLAM TEMPLATE with SHOW/HIDE options & * Murji'ah deleted

The following should work well in your template:Islam, sand box too does not allow any changes..So I put it here for your trial

Extended content

<includeonly>{{Sidebar with collapsible lists | name = Islam | bodyclass = collapsible {{#if:{{{collapsed|}}}|collapsed}} | titlestyle = font-size:88%; line-height:200%; | title = ] {{resize|115%|{{nobold|Part of ] on}}}}<br />{{resize|200%|]}} | image = ] | expanded = {{{expanded|{{{selected|{{{1|}}}}}}}}} | contentclass = hlist | list1name = beliefs | list1title = ] | list1 = {{startflatlist}} * ] {{small|of}} ] {{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}} * ] {{endflatlist}} | list2name = practices | list2title = ] | list2 = {{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] * ] {{endflatlist}} | list3name = texts | list3title = ] and ] | list3 = {{startflatlist}} * '']'' * '']'' * '']'' {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}} * ] {{endflatlist}} | list4name = history | list4title = ] | list4 = {{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{startflatlist}} * '']'' * '']'' {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * '']'' * ] {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}} | list5name = denominations | list5title = ] | list5 = {{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] * ] {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}} | list6name = culture | list6title = ] and ] | list6 = {{startflatlist}} * ] * ] * ] {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] * ] {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] * ] * ] {{endflatlist}}{{startflatlist}} * ] * ] * ] {{endflatlist}} | list7name = related | list7title = ] | list7 = {{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{startflatlist}} * ] * ] {{endflatlist}} * ] | below = * {{portal-inline|Islam|size=tiny}} }}</includeonly><noinclude> {{Documentation | content = {{Islam|all}} {{Collapsible lists option | listnames = beliefs; practices; texts; history; denominations; culture; related | example = practices }} }} ] ] ] }} </noinclude>

68.100.166.227 (talk) 00:27, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

OK, but is there any actual need for this? I don't see the benefit in obscuring the sidebar almost completely. Alakzi (talk) 01:36, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Answer: First, Some of the old articles had this template placed in collapsed=1-frorm because of the topic Islam was of secondary importance, and second reason: some of the articles are too short it occupies a lot of space if you put in the current form. i.e. the hide-switch is necessary..68.100.166.227 (talk) 18:05, 24 May 2015 (UTC)
Could you look at the page List of extinct Shia sects. There are 2 templates of secondary importance in collapsed-form since the page does not have enough space..
Nobody had answered my inquiry about Murji'ah, yet.68.100.166.227 (talk) 17:05, 25 May 2015 (UTC)
Another example about the collapsed-form is here. 68.100.166.227 (talk) 18:44, 25 May 2015 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Infobox Chinese

Template:Infobox Chinese has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Jc86035 (talk • contribs) Use {{re|Jc86035}} to reply to me 10:58, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

Alleged TfD outcome

Could you please explain how did you judge the TfD to be complete for the Multihull and Trimaran templates? It appears there was significant resistance to the idea of removing them and only one person vocally against their existence. A lot of my hard work is now deleted, I am truly saddened and demotivated. prat (talk) 15:41, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Actually, Prat, the idea is to convert your navbox to a list in article space, thereby preserving your work in a different and more appropriate format. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 15:53, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
Actually, your single voice is getting tiring in that echo-chamber, and you clearly have no idea about the topic area. Why don't you stick to your 1000s of other articles instead of deleting people's hard work? It destroys the community and the spirit of Misplaced Pages. Have fun with your deletion spree, I quit editing in protest. prat (talk) 16:01, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
There was sufficient and justified opposition to the over-broad infobox to merit its conversion to a list. Your work is not lost; it can be found in the new list and the template history. I'd be happy to help with the creation of navboxes with a narrower scope; however, people hadn't been receiving to your suggestions at the TfD, so I couldn't have reasonably closed it as a split. I hope this helps. Alakzi (talk) 16:13, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
Sounds a lot like an unwarranted judgement call with basically no evidence to me, followed by an edit rampage. Anyway, I have no time for this crap anymore. Do you have any idea how much of a hassle it will be to re-add all that stuff you removed to every damn multihull and trimaran page??? As if I am going to bother with that muck after going through a damn deletion review! Have fun mucking with other people's hard work and contributions, the reality is your recent uncalled for actions have ensured frequent and numerous real contributions have now been lost. This community is destroying itself due to the actions of people like you. FEEL PROUD. prat (talk) 16:25, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
@Pratyeka: There's little point moaning here; if you're not happy with the close, raise the matter at Misplaced Pages:Deletion review. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:31, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Infobox substitution

Infobox tornado

{{Infobox tornado}} is now ready for substitution. I can run AWB, but not write code. If you'd like to supply me with the necessary, and some instructions, I can do the job; or feel free to do so yourself ;-) Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 18:52, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Likewise {{Infobox tornado outbreak}}. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:06, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
Done both, except for userspace transclusions. Alakzi (talk) 19:26, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
Thank you. Also {{Infobox Canadian school district}}. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:45, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
And {{Infobox education in Canada}}. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:15, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
Education in Canada has got 1,650 transclusions; I'll do district. Alakzi (talk) 21:20, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
@Andy: We're missing |additionalname= - was that intentional? Alakzi (talk) 13:41, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Some fixes for {{Infobox storm}} are needed, as shown at Category:Convert invalid options which currently lists 21 articles which look as if they have a problem with the change. Take this edit for example. That changed the first of the following lines to the second: 

|wind = 121 mph (194 km/h)<br /><small>(at ])</small>
| highest winds = 121 mph (194 km/h)<br /><small>(at ])</small>

The problem is that the old infobox allowed free-form text, but the new infobox requires a number representing the speed in km/h and nothing else (because the number is passed to {{convert}}). I could fix them, but I would omit the extra information—perhaps someone with knowledge of the topic should take a look and decide what should be done. I'm reporting this here because you might know the background about the change, and could let the people involved know. Otherwise, I guess I should mention it at WT:SEVERE. Johnuniq (talk) 06:41, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

@Johnuniq: I've cough "fixed" it with this until we can think of something better. By the way, I did not make the infobox conversion. Alakzi (talk) 10:59, 24 May 2015 (UTC)
Yikes, I know you're not responsible for the syntax rules for templates either, but seeing stuff like that reminds me why Lua is better! Thanks—I did a purge to empty the convert error category which keeps me happy. I'll post at the wikiproject to let people know that edits are needed. Johnuniq (talk) 11:42, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Infobox country at games

Linking the three items from above. Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 03:03, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
I've done medals, but, as I've said elsewhere, I don't believe the other two to be necessary. Alakzi (talk) 03:24, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
The Olympic Infobox connects to both, so should these events. Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 03:25, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
I'll add the flag bearer link if there are no objections, but the competitors category link is taking too far; the infobox is fast becoming a link soup. @Dirtlawyer1: Thoughts on this? Alakzi (talk) 03:36, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
What are the specific questions, Alakzi? Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 04:20, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

@Dirtlawyer1: In converting {{Infobox Country Pan American Games}} to use {{Infobox country at games}}, I've got rid of the competitors category and flag bearer links. To illustrate:

Before After
Argentina at the Pan American Games

Flag of Argentina
IOC code  ARG
NOC Comité Olímpico Argentino 
At the 2011 Pan American Games in Guadalajara
Competitors 486 in 37 sports
Flag bearer Walter Pérez
Medals
Rank: 7		 Gold
21		 Silver
19		 Bronze
35		 Total
75
Pan American Games history (summary)
Appearances
Sporting event delegation
Argentina at the
2011 Pan American Games
IOC codeARG
NOCComité Olímpico Argentino 
in Guadalajara
14–30 October 2011
Competitors486 in 37 sports
Flag bearer Walter Pérez
Medals
Ranked 7th
Gold
21
Silver
19
Bronze
35
Total
75
Pan American Games appearances (overview)

Which do you prefer? Alakzi (talk) 10:40, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

I prefer the second for several reasons: (1) the two-line header looks better ("the" may be unnecessary in header); (2) labeling the flag with a caption is unnecessary; (3) the data field label links are unnecessary (you can probably ditch the "medals" label link, too); (4) the dates of the event is a good addition; (5) "Appearances" label is redundant; (6) no reason to state the names of the games twice (that's the purpose of the infobox header).
Other suggestions: (1) "Summary" does not need to be italicized; (2) I think "history" is better than "appearances," and it's shorter; (3) the games location should probably include the country as well as the city; (4) define the exterior boundary of the medals table with the same tool line used as its internal divider; (5) the medals table might look better if only the number cells were colored.
That's a really big flag -- not quite sure what to do with it from a design standpoint. There's got to be a better, less ostentatious way to use the national flag in these infoboxes. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 11:08, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
Thanks, Dirtlawyer1. (1) I've removed the italics. (2) I think that "appearances" is less ambiguous; "history" might be confused with the history of the games. (3) Don't we usually refer to games only by their city? Somewhat unintuitively, the link points to the games article, where the country is specified. I'll give (4) and (5) some thought. I agree about the flag; I'll see if there's anything that can be done. Alakzi (talk) 12:13, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
Should in be inserted before the city? Also you never addressed why the Olympics infobox is allowed to link to competitors and flagbearers, while this one cannot. They link to these articles for a reason, because it lists all the countries in one page (something you cannot do while just on one country page). Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 23:50, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Infobox nhsc

Infobox Greek Dimos

Hi, I saw you converted the {{Infobox Greek Dimos}} into a wrapper for Infobox settlement. I noticed some issues:

  • pop_community and area_community aren't displayed. I tried to find a quick workaround, but Infobox settlement doesn't support a third population_blank field.
  • a map box (show/hide) is shown below the pushpin map, also if the image_map field is empty Solved this one myself, see Template:Infobox Greek Dimos/testcases

See Askos, Sochos and Lagyna for example. Do you have ideas how to fix this? Markussep 15:08, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Is the community population (and area) not mutually exclusive to the municipal unit's? Presumably, no article uses both. Alakzi (talk) 17:16, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
A community is a subdivision of a municipal unit. If they have the same name, which is the case for Lachanas, Assiros, Aiani, Ptolemaida, Gargalianoi, Filiatra and many more, the articles give data for both administrative units. Markussep 18:06, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
I know that it's its subdivision, but I'd not considered the possibility that we'd be presenting both in the same article. It might be better to revert to an earlier version; I've not got time to look into this now. Alakzi (talk) 18:12, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
OK. I made a temporary fix, (mis)using the demographics fields, but I think the nicest way would be adding population_blank3 and area_blank3 fields to Infobox settlement. I don't think I can edit the (sandbox of) Infobox settlement without creating a total mess, maybe I'll post something on the talk page about this problem. Markussep 11:05, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Countries : Kosovo and Northern Cyprus

Please see: https://en.wikipedia.org/Category:Countries_in_Europe (Kosovo is listed here). You removed the Category from Northern Cyprus by saying "Upon further inspection, disputed territories do not use any of the country categories, so I'm removing all of them". Is Kosovo not disputed acc. to you? Did you miss Kosovo during your inspection?Ayka3b (talk) 19:48, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

I did not; Kosovo is not in that category. Alakzi (talk) 19:52, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
Hımmm, Ohh I see now. "Category:Kosovo" is in "Category:Countries in Europe", but "Kosovo" is not in "Category:Countries in Europe". So, do you have any objection to "Category:Northern Cyprus" to be in "Category:Countries in Europe"? If not, I wanna put it there just as Kosovo's example. Sorry, for my misunderstanding. Without clicking "Category:Kosovo" in "Category:Countries in Europe", I did not notice that "Kosovo" is not really there.Ayka3b (talk) 20:02, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
As you please. Alakzi (talk) 20:45, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

No consensus closes against vast majorities

Can you explain why you closed Template:Scott Rudin, Template:Brian Grazer and Template:Damon Lindelof as no consensus? They seemed to have consensus to keep.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:08, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

I did not feel that a (rough) consensus had been established, as (a) the nomination rationale had not been effectively rebutted, (b) the !votes did not appear to be especially informed (for example, nobody made any mention of WP:NAVBOX or the criteria therein), and (c) many of the !votes were - simply put - nods in agreement. Alakzi (talk) 16:05, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

WP:Swimming auto-archive function

Hey, A. At your leisure, can you code the WP:Swimming talk page so that it auto-archives anything older than 12 month? It's long overdue: there are discussion threads from 2009 on the talk page. Also, is a single archive adequate, or should it be segmented in some fashion? I'm sure it's easy to do, but I'm always afraid that I will throw a spanner in the works and damage or lose something that can't be fixed or recovered. Thanks. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 16:23, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Done! Alakzi (talk) 16:28, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
Thank you, sir. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:10, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

You're incorrect

Yes, in fact, they are. There's even a template for it. -- WV ● ✉ ✓ 18:46, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Which is? Alakzi (talk) 18:53, 28 May 2015 (UTC)