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Rich Farmbrough

Voice your opinion on this candidate (talk page) (4/11/5); Scheduled to end 23:59, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

Nomination

Rich Farmbrough (talk · contribs) – I'm nominating User:Rich Farmbrough for two reasons. First, I have observed the quality of his work on Misplaced Pages — both before I took a long wikibreak back in 2007, and since I returned earlier this year. Second, I think we should right a historic wrong: he was an admin once before; he was removed by the Arbcom for allegedly using his admin tools incorrectly (see WP:ARBRF). This finding was soon vacated, however. His admin privileges should have been restored forthwith, but somehow that got overlooked. At any rate, the issue was a long time ago, and even if the ruling stood (which it didn't), I believe it would be of little significance today. David Cannon (talk) 12:12, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

Candidate, please indicate acceptance of the nomination here:

I am delighted to accept the nomination. All the best: Rich Farmbrough, 18:50, 27 June 2015 (UTC).

Questions for the candidate

Dear candidate, thank you for offering to serve Misplaced Pages as an administrator. Please answer these questions to provide guidance for participants:

1. What administrative work do you intend to take part in?

A: I will do whichever tasks come to hand. Most likely a little anti-vandal blocking, a little CSD work, and some XfD closes. My (previous) admin-stats are available on a list here. I didn't do many (any?) unblock requests, though I am minded to do them, because by the time I have given the matter full consideration, someone else has either accepted or declined. For the same reason I don't believe I made or will be likely to make any controversial XfD closes or blocks.

2. What are your best contributions to Misplaced Pages, and why?

A: Some of the back-office templates I have built have been very efficient at labour saving. Articles like Whittington's Longhouse, Statue of John Bunyan, Bedford and Janet Harmon Bragg are nice to have created. Articles I started but didn't contribute a huge amount to such as Black Lives Matter, Je suis Charlie and 2009 Fort Hood shooting are probably more important. I have been working on viruses, which is a huge area we only scratch the surface of - starting alphabetically at Abaca bunchy top virus. Getting discretionary sanctions removed on six old arb cases was a nice administrative achievement. I am rather pleased with the essay WP:Misplaced Pages has more... which gives the lie to some common press pot-shots at Misplaced Pages coverage. I also rewrote a policy once, but I can't remember which one...

3. Have you been in any conflicts over editing in the past or have other users caused you stress? How have you dealt with it and how will you deal with it in the future?

A: Yes, I have dealt with it with humour, discussion and by walking away from the conflict, mostly the latter. I intend to continue to use these solutions, though I hope I become ever more adept at choosing the right mix.

Additional questions from User:DESiegel

4. What is your view of Process is important?

A: I have sympathy with the essay. Indeed I have taken more than one functionary to task for bypassing process. Specifically process is critically important where significant social impact is in the balance, for example deleting something which has taken a lot of effort, blocking users, imposing restrictions or iBans. The crux of the matter though is in the first paragraph " Poor process or no process ultimately harms the product." This is precisely what IAR is for. In some cases our process is poor or inapplicable to a special circumstance. In these cases we are faced with a trilemma, do the wrong thing because process says so, do the right thing, or change the process. Changing the process is a default in quality control systems I am familiar with, at least as part of the solution, by raising a corrective action.

I also think an important point made is that process is important for larger communities, and has become more important for en:Misplaced Pages over the years. Of course this is also why sub-communities sometimes wish to have special dispensation, which can cause friction with the rest of the community.

5. How strictly should the literal wording of the speedy deletion criteria be applied?

A: In terms of not deleting pages that do not meet the criteria, very strictly. (This was not the case last time I looked at what happens, I hope it has improved since.) In terms of allowing pages to move to the next step in the deletion process if their is reasonable doubt that they should be deleted, I would show leniency (actually I would perform the equivalent of WP:BEFORE prior to an apparently valid A7, which would probably mean that someone else had speedied it before I reached my conclusion).

6. What is the place of WP:IAR in carrying out administrative actions?

A: I would not apply IAR to an admin action unless it was a clearly necessary to avoid significant damage to the project or a person. I would not however have a problem with an admin who used IAR in a sensible non-contentious manner.

7. An admin is often expected or requested to help others, particularly new users, and to aid in calming disputes, either resolving them or pointing the participants to proper venues for resolution. How do you see yourself in this aspect of an Admin's role?

A: I am certainly willing to help new users and have spent a considerable time at WP:Tea House, and in welcoming and inviting new users there. I can, and have, pointed people to such places as WP:RSNB. As to calming disputes, that is a difficult matter, especially given the asynchronous nature of Misplaced Pages, but I hope that by encouraging people to focus on the content, rather than each other I have had that effect a few times.

Additional question from Winner 42

8. Why should the community trust you with adminship after you have repeated violated Arbcom editing restrictions resulting in several blocks including a one year long block in 2013?

A: I was editing a draft article (articles for creation as was) to help someone at WP:Teahouse. Here is the offending edit (note the page was successfully moved to main-space the following day). I was taken to Arbitration Enforcement by the only person who has taken me there, who was obviously following my edits very closely. From that edit he deduced that I was using search and replace, and should therefore be severely punished. Since this seemed an absurd use of the specific restriction, I asked for the Committee to rescind it. User:Sandstein asked the committee if he could go ahead with enforcement while the requested amendment was in progress. At 21:13 one arbitrator (not the committee) replied that he thought it could go ahead, since he had pre-judged the request. At 23:03 he imposed the 1 year block. I had had no time since the response from the committee to put my side, nor had I any intimation that one person could speak for the committee (and in fact they can't).

If you want some idea of the level of understanding the enforcing administrator displayed he believed that this edit was a sign of automated editing.

If you think that helping a new editor with a draft article as illustrated in the edit concerned is a good reason for a year-long ban, that's fine. I will continue to copyedit articles, even hopeless looking ones, and try and make them presentable. I hope I will make less and less errors doing it, though age, eyesight and general deterioration might have something to say about that. I would not have thought that that edit was one speaking to trust on a personal or community level, or use of admin tools, such as they are. Please feel free to ask supplementary questions on this point.

Additional questions from User:GregJackP

9.What is the most significant featured article that you have worked on?

A:

10.What is the most significant good article that you have worked on?

A:

Additional question from Mkdw

11. For those of us not familiar with Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Rich Farmbrough, would you in your own words summarize what happened?

A: OK, it's tremendously complicated because the roots go back to 2009, a very different time in en:WP. The case itself was over three years ago.

This summary will therefore necessarily miss a lot out, but I am happy to answer any questions arising. Also I can't claim an infallible memory, but I will check what I can.

I operated a bot, originally called SmackBot, later renamed (different account, same software) Helpful Pixie Bot, because someone didn't like the name "SmackBot" and I'm nice like that.

The major changes that this bot made were "dating maintenance tags" - the back end category and template system is largely my work, unless it's been re-written in the last few years. AnmoieBot has now taken over this task.

The bot originally ran on AWB, and made the standard AWB fixes, and a few others, as it dated tags. After some concerns I removed all the custom fixes, and eventually, because AWB couldn't ensure that no cosmetic only edits were made, and at the same time all essential fixes were I rewrote the entire thing in perl. (The number of "cosmetic only" edits was vanishingly small, but it needed addressing.)

Sometime prior to the case being opened an Arbitrator by the name of User:Hersfold (since resigned left the project) asked me to make a change to a bot task. I agreed but it took some time to implement (a few hours at most). He became rather angry, and blocked the bot while I was coding. I completed the changes and after an exchange of words got it running again.

A while later I emailed my impressions of this event to User:Elen of the Roads, another arbitrator (also now left), when IIRC she asked me about it. She later asked me if she could share it with Hersfold. Somewhat foolishly I said yes.

Shortly after Hersfold brought an arbitration case against me. Named parties were Herfold, Elen of the Roads, me and User:Fram (inactive for some time, if not left).

The crux of the case was that I was "going against community consensus" "Dismissing community concerns" "failing to lead by example"

I sent a preliminary email to the Committee, which they should have restricted the circulation of (they have a special list called the B-list for this). Of course they sent it to Hersfold and Elen too.

The drafting arbitrator was User:NewYorkBrad for whom I have a great respect. The deputy was User:Kirill Lokshin (who had previously had a disagreement with me over the banner name of a WikiProject he was effectively running).

During the course of the case, NewYorkBrad fell ill.

When the draft proposal was issued I was shocked. It did not to me reflect the progress we had made at the workshop, though sadly some had not been prepared to engage constructively there. I presume that it was a rush job since the drafting arbitrator had changed during the case, but it may be that Kirill remembered the disagreement, consciously or subconsciously. Be that as it may, I asked the committee for a fortnight to response. They denied it. The "findings" were found and the "remedies" were remedied.

Later I had one of the four (negative) findings overturned. It is one of the two that are factual, and was hence easy to disprove. The other factual finding is equally easy to disprove, but the Committee refused to even look at it. In fact the first comment called it (a finding ) a remedy. That is the finding that I broke bot policy. The three cited pieces of "bot policy" are not and never have been bot policy.

Other findings are are also weak, two of the three items listed as "gratuitous incivility" were made in the workshop page under a misapprehension, due to two sets of coimments running together. I had reverted these as soon as it became clear what had happened. The third was perhaps a little incvil I remarked when someone "piled on" to a discussion "Sancho arrives" - implying that they were tilting at windmills, and assisting a Don Quixote. But to find even that level of incivility they had to go back to 2010!

So were there problems? Yes, of course, I made mistakes, and even did things that were unwise. For example when Fram announced he had opened his nth report on me at AN/I I responded with a sigh. I would have done better to not respond at all. But to me this does not rise to the level of being remotely sanctionable.

Even during the case I had put into place an issue tracking system, so that a) people would be assured that any issues was being attended too b) I could show that I was responsive to issues and c) if I wasn't there would be no doubt about it.

What has changed since the case? Well the named parties apart from me have left the project as has the only other person who presented a non-negotiable face to our discussions. I have doubtless learned to avoid being a named party in an arbitration case (I encouraged ARBCOM to accept the case in my nativity). I will not be making literary illusions, nor using the inflammatory "sigh" or "facepalm" in the future. I will continue to, for example, cut and paste ISBNs rather than type them in by hand as I am supposed to according to my restriction.

Please feel free to ask supplementary questions here, at my talk page, or by email.

General comments

• Requests for adminship/Rich Farmbrough
• Requests for adminship/Rich Farmbrough 2
• Requests for adminship/Rich Farmbrough 2/Bureaucrat discussion

• Links for Rich Farmbrough: Rich Farmbrough (talk · contribs · deleted · count · AfD · logs · block log · lu · rfar · spi)
• Edit summary usage for Rich Farmbrough can be found here.
• The nomination statement is factually inaccurate and misleading. I was part of the Committee that voted to desysop Rich Farmbrough. Rich was brought to the Committee because the community had been concerned for some years with his editing pattern and behaviour. The community had imposed restrictions on Rich; but those restrictions were not working. The Committee looked into the case and decided to desysop Rich for his history of misconduct, poor judgement, and generally not working in a trustworthy and collegiate manner. The finding regarding unblocking of his own bots was problematic from the start (I commented at the time that not all the instances of unblocking of the bots were inappropriate), and after two appeals by Rich to reword the finding, the Committee decided to vacate that finding as it was not an essential finding anyway - he had not been desysopped for unblocking his own bots, but for his general history of misconduct and disruption. A year after that finding was vacated, the Committee had to formally warn Rich via motion that continued violations of the bot restriction would be enforced by a site ban. Essentially, there is evidence that Rich Farmbrough was a problematic user for years before the ArbCom case, and continued to push the boundaries of acceptable behaviour after the case. I assume the nominator was unaware of the history of Rich Farmbrough and the full details of the case, otherwise they would not have proceeded with a nomination and a misleading statement that could potentially harm their reputation in future RfA nominations. SilkTork 07:47, 28 June 2015 (UTC).

Please keep discussion constructive and civil. If you are unfamiliar with the nominee, please thoroughly review his contributions before commenting.

Discussion

Support

1. Contrarianism ;) Unanimity is boring. Still here after various dramas; obviously has the good of the project in mind even when there's dissent about particular actions. Thank you for the virus articles. I think there's a fair general case to be made in favor of responding to specific opposing concerns instead of templated questions like 4-7 and 9-10. A response to Q11 would be a good idea, though. Opabinia regalis (talk) 05:55, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
2. Desysopping for the smackbot thing was absurd – a really stunning example of the letter of the law trumping the spirit of the law (as well as common sense). I don't think there is any reason to think that he will cause any problems as an admin; any concerns about his automated editing seem totally orthogonal to having the bit. ErikHaugen (talk | contribs) 05:59, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
3. He was an admin before and I have sources that say he was wrongly stripped of his duties. And i would love to be a victim of one his blocks. As a vandal ,I know he would be a good blocker.He started pages,has a cool usertalk page and he has knowledge of bad articles that shouldn't be there. He reminds me of a younger NeilN circa 2009. Jameslucindo1 — Preceding undated comment added 06:25, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
4. Support From one former admin to another. I probably wouldn't pass a second RFA, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't be a good admin again if I did. I think you'd do fine with the bit again too. INeverCry 07:17, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Extremely strong oppose - Absolutely and positively is not qualified in any respect to be an admin, as his past history, loss of rights and numerous sanctions indicate. The block log itself is a travesty. The idea that he would try for the bit again is hubris in the extreme. I find this request to be appalling. BMK (talk) 00:28, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   Um.. so I am willing to take on additional work, and you find that appalling? All the best: Rich Farmbrough, 02:38, 28 June 2015 (UTC).
   

   No, I find it appalling that you apparently have so little self-knowledge and no clue about your standing in the community that you would cheerfully accede to this nomination; the last thing we need around here is a truly clueless admin. I would withdraw your nomination before someone feels it necessary to actually list point for point, item by item, the numerous reasons that you should never again be an admin -- oh, but I forgot, those are all "problematic", everything ever said about you, every block, every sanction, every ArbCom finding, every loss of rights, they're all "problematic" in one way or another in the world according to Rich Farmbrough. BMK (talk) 03:08, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   Look, we all make mistakes. It makes for a much happier world if we are given the chance to make amends for them. Let's give Rich a break! David Cannon (talk) 03:25, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   You were gone for a long time, so I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt: Rich has been given many, many breaks, and he screws them up each time. Besides, we don't make people admins to give them a "break", we make them admins because we trust them to do the job right. You may trust Rich, other may as well, but many people don't, because of his history of not being trustworthy. It's really as simple as that. BMK (talk) 03:31, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

2. Tentative Oppose. No explanation of previous removal of the bit. The above "vacated" link goes to a struck out section but many other sections that are relevant to adminship remain. The silence bothers me, and without further explanation, I'll accept the the other sections even if they are stale because there is no information about what has changed. Glrx (talk) 01:17, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   Please feel free to ask questions about the sections that interest you. I still have my partly drafted response to the proposed decision, which I was denied time to complete, so I will probably be able to answer, despite the passage of several years. All the best: Rich Farmbrough, 02:38, 28 June 2015 (UTC).
   

3. Oppose - Even if part of the case was vacated, there are still other concerns from that case. The findings regarding conduct, as well as his block log, give me pause. While the following does not bear on my decision, I also think that the holding an RFA to "right a historic wrong", as the nominator put it, is a bit out of place; RFAs should be solely held to examine an editor's work and ability to handle the tools, not to right a perceived injustice. Rich has done good work, but there is too much here that makes me uncomfortable with him having the tools. Sorry. -Pax Verbum 01:26, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   Please note the nomination was with my permission, but without my input, as it should be. If I remember aright the other findings are also a little problematic. Sadly the committee denied me the time to write a proper defence, and has since shown that it is unwilling to reconsider the other findings, even when they are patently wrong (diff can be supplied on request). I would be happy to answer questions if you think I have been "unresponsive" or "incivil" since the case. If not then either something has changed, or nothing was wrong in those respects in the first place. All the best: Rich Farmbrough, 02:35, 28 June 2015 (UTC).
   

   That's why I mentioned that the nomination bit would have no bearing on my decision. I do have a question though, and to be quite honest an answer will not change my !vote, but I am curious: why have you responded to almost all of the oppose votes (at the time of this edit), rather than answering the questions that others have asked above in the interview section? It seems that answering those questions might help allay some people's concerns or help to drum up support. Terribly sorry that this RFA has started out on such a negative note; you have had some good contributions, and I wish you all the best! -Pax Verbum 03:25, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   Thanks. The reason is that I glanced at the page and saw the opposes just before I went to bed. Being unable to sleep I decided to pop in and respond. I hadn't seen any of the questions until just now. All the best: Rich Farmbrough, 05:49, 28 June 2015 (UTC).
   

4. Oppose. I'm sorry, but checking your block log was enough in itself to make me oppose. Someone who had a one-year block expire only a bit more than a year ago is not fit for adminship. --Biblioworm 02:06, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   Well a one year block for a one-character typo was a little extreme... especially as there was no time given to discuss the matter. I believe the blocking admin made a comment to the effect that he would have lifted it if I had requested, but sadly he did not say that until the year was up. All the best: Rich Farmbrough, 02:26, 28 June 2015 (UTC).
   

5. Oppose. No answers to questions, extremely extensive block log, currently subject to an ArbCom-imposed restriction and two community-imposed sanctions, loss of community trust, personal lack of trust in his judgement, likely net negative. Moved from neutral. L235 (t / c / ping in reply) 02:36, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
6. Oppose - Very extensive block log and the subject of current sanctions which have been repeatedly violated. If we cannot trust him to obey Arbcom sanctions, how can we trust him with adminship? Choosing to badger oppose !voters instead of answering questions also reflects poorly on the candidate. If I were to support this candidate, I would expect all findings of fact relevant to Rich to be found false and be removed by motion of Arbcom as well as several years of productive, block-free contributions to Misplaced Pages. Winner 42 Talk to me! 03:02, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
7. Strongest Oppose - Per block log. I cannot have an admin who has been blocked for a year plus having editing restrictions. I cannot have an admin who had have an ArbCom imposed community sanction and also I do not think he is fit for the tools. - EurovisionNim (talk to me)(see my edits) 03:33, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
8. Oppose I still come across {{Use dmy dates}} templates placed in articles about American people and subjects by RF. This was done in a WP:POINTy fashion in clear violation of MOS:DATETIES. I do not care how much time has passed there is no way that I could trust this editor with admin tools. MarnetteD|Talk 03:44, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
   • Yikes. This is one of my "things" (MOS:DATETIES, on both sides of the pond, is very important to me). @MarnetteD: do you have a recent diff that shows an example of this? (In the meantime, I will refrain from any voting here...) --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:56, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   IJBall I have great respect for DATETIES and WP:ENGVAR. I haven't had to change one recently but that is because I haven't been editing film and actor articles as much in the last couple months. If you want to dig into my edit history look for articles about silent film actors. I can say that the ones I find have been there for years so another angle is to look for edits by RF circa 2010. MarnetteD|Talk 04:03, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

   Another way to search would be to create a tracking page using {{trackingcat}} for that template and then look at the articles listed there. I am not quite sure how to do that but I think it already exists somewhere so another editor may be able to show you how to get there. MarnetteD|Talk 04:07, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

9. Oppose. I see no reason whatsoever why someone with such a record should be trusted with admin tools. AndyTheGrump (talk) 06:05, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
10. Oppose because I don't trust the nominee with more tools. I, too, was tempted to post neutral to avoid the pile on but I'm not actually neutral, so I can't in good conscience do that. – Athaenara ✉ 06:35, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
11. Strong Oppose: The most important characteristic of an administrator is restraint. Regardless of user rights, everyone is bound by the consensus of the community. This nominee has repeatedly disregarded that consensus, as evidenced by the repeated violation of sanctions. I have little faith that he will show more restraint in the future given how frequently he's been given the opportunity to make that change and failed to do so. ~ Rob 08:00, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Neutral

Leaning oppose. I don't find that I trust RF after the ArbCom tumble. L235 (t / c / ping in reply) 01:16, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Moving to oppose. L235 (t / c / ping in reply) 02:34, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Elaborate? Dustin (talk) 02:36, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

1. Neutral because I don't want to pile-on. Jianhui67 04:06, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
2. Neutral for now, pending answers to questiosn and further responses from Rick. DES 04:28, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
3. Neutral for now, leaning support because a) BMK is in opposition, and b) everyone deserves a chance to redeem themselves. I'll wait for his answers before I make a firm decision. GregJackP Boomer! 04:39, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
4. Neutral because I don't want to pile on. The history of sanctions is too long. If this editor went a few years without getting into another fracas, I could consider supporting. I feel this nomination should be withdrawn before it becomes too unpleasant, as it has no chance of succeeding. Vanamonde93 (talk) 05:50, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
5. Neutral I saw the block log. My initial thoughts are "usual suspects" and I see no sanctions placed for over 2 years. Clearly Rich has seriously rubbed people up the wrong way, but I'm a strong believer in people moving on from past misdeeds and reforming. If he keeps his nose clean for another year, I could be persuaded to support then. Ritchie333 08:16, 28 June 2015 (UTC)