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Current Talk
updated 14 April 2009 — (changes • edit)


Infobox Incomplete

Is in the works right now the list will be up by 20:00 (UTC) The criteria are Name, Author, Publisher, Release, Genre, Country, Language, and ISBN. (these are what you recommended.)

The format of the list will be:

  1. Article Name StubData(Number of Words) <following this would be what ever criteria has been failed, if it is one, one is listed, if it is all 8, all 8 are listed)

A sample:

  1. The Time Machine;isNotStub(3472), Publisher?, Genre?, Country?, Language?, ISBN?

Tell me what you think. Also, did not think of it, but please tell me what year ISBN started to be used on books. (I can set up a if than statement checking for this... so that old books won't show up saying it needs an ISBN. :) Eagle talk 06:33, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Note: I clicked on The Time Machine and noticed that this is an example of flagging an old novel as needing an ISBN (ISBN was not around)). Thanks if you can give me the first year for ISBN. Eagle talk 06:36, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
United Kingdom in 1966 by the booksellers and stationers W H Smith and originally called Standard Book Numbering or SBN (still used in 1974). It was adopted as international standard ISO 2108 in 1970. This is from the ISBN article. Should I use 1966 or 1970? Eagle talk 06:43, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Oh, and these are filtered for novels. I would be surprised if we get any non-novels (excepting human error, putting it in the wrong cat). Do you think WP:BOOKS would like a list of their incomplete infoboxes? It is easy to do, all I have to do is swap the the novel filter to all articles that Don't qualify, and volia! you have all non-novels. :) Eagle talk 06:48, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Also, this list is going to be over 1,000 articles long!!!Eagle talk 06:50, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Novels/NovelsInCompleteInfobox

The list is up, Please read the infomation, and have fun! There are over 1150 articles on this list. Tell me what you think!! Eagle talk 07:26, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Gone for a week...

I will be gone starting on this sunday at 7:00 (UTC) and will be back the following sunday. I will have NO access to the internet. (just giving you a heads up!) Eagle talk 07:46, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Please look at the header on the list now!

If there is any wording changes you need to make, feel free to do so!! also, can you comment on the layout of the list? Also, should I do you think WP:BOOKS would want a list generated for them ? Eagle talk 07:49, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks!

Actually it is volenteer work, but will be fun any! I left a message with the guy for WP:BOOKS, hopefully he will respond by saterday. :) Eagle talk 07:56, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Hi via Pegship's, etc.

User_talk:Pegship#Book_.27Tools.27_and_such_topics! // FrankB 18:31, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Please don't cross out things :)

On the incomplete infobox talk page you mentioned cross out things you have a problem with... please please don't cross out anything!!! I can't automatically reorganize these items if some are striked out!!! unless you want to manually re-organize... :) I made a statement to that effect after your comment...

Also, feel free to tinker with the instructions of the page. (and add it to the project Template:WPNOVELS oops, you already did!) On the instructions... I put a basic outline that should be modified, (I will go in an mention that things should be deleted rather than striked out. :) Eagle talk 23:19, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Oh, and the volenteer work is donmestic... sorry about the delay :) Eagle talk 23:20, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

In regards to your changes to the instructions...

particurally this one... I decieded to keep put all articles missing a ISBN field (as opposed to filerting out only articles after 1968).

Two more things:

  1. I fixed the "namespace" bug (see note in false hits section)
  2. any more important sections to put on this list... (Image? media_type? ect.) To add these will take one extra line of code each :) Eagle talk 00:04, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

More lists

I am going ahead and filling up all the lists as much as possible. Give all three a check. (I may not get around to Book->Novel) Eagle talk 07:31, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Gentlemen & Players

Hi, I was just wondering why you rearrange bits of information within an article on a piece of literature, like in the novel mentioned above. As far as I can see, you have not added anything. In particular, it's the list of characters after the plot outline which I find pointless, especially as this is a suspense novel and characters turn out to be different people altogether in the course of the novel. Others (major ones) I have not mentioned at all so as not to give away the whole plot / the final twist.

What is the idea behind this? Why so much uniformity, which, as I see it, in no way reflects the diversity of literature? I strongly doubt that it is for the user's benefit.

All the best, <KF> 15:13, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Galahad at Blandings changes

Hi, I'm a little confused as to why you've fiddled with this page - moving the character list to after the plot not only seems odd (ever read a play with the dramatis personae list at the end?) and pointless, it also upsets the uniformity of the rest of the Wodehouse articles that've been (and will continue to be, my time allowing) done in a similar style.

Also, the information you added to the infobox is confusing - while most of what's in there relates to the original first publication (publisher, dates etc), your new "hardback and paperback" presumably refers to all later republications. Why not add pdf (sure some chancer's flogging one) and audiobook for good measure?

Don't mean to sound shouty, sure you're doing a great job and all :), JohnnyZen 10:17, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

- I see someone else has similar issues :) JohnnyZen 10:23, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

- I obviously wasn't implying this was a play, it is of course an article about a novel; I mentioned plays as an example of the standard, generally accepted way of providing a list of characters in use. Is there some reasoning behind putting it afterward in the official structure? JohnnyZen 10:37, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

re:WPP:Novels

xpost

Seen you have added this - when there are two already WP:NOVEL, WP:NOVELS what is the rationale for another. :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 07:52, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Not categorized, so unknown to this writer at the time of creation. Complex, huh! I'm not good at quickly assimulating new terms... a short term memory thing common to ADHD. The ones I wrote are case reflective of their proper names... so easier (for me at least) to remember. Nothing more. In further defense, no one had used {{shortcut}} on any of the pages I tagged, so the visibility was poor, so to speak.
One thought I had logging in a while back was whether there was a book templates catalog page... Something along the lines of the usage I wrote in {{commonscat4}} where each template is displayed and discussed for ease of reference. Strikes me as a good idea. (I'm big on 'self-documentation' and ease of use things... we all have limited time volunteering our services, and anything which speeds assimulation or spreads know-how to newcomers is good and Right Things to do, IMHO.) From a project management perspective, such should attract more people to become regulars in the overall project as they'd quickly gain a comfort level with the sub-community and it's tools and practices.
I'd submit that either WPP:Novels/tags and/or WPP:Books/standards name-types be considered. The page itself would be the full expanded form, not these 'shortcut' formats. (On further mature reflection, reserving 'standards' sub-article page might be better employed for some sort of checklist guideline.) // FrankB 16:44, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Hi guys - I recently rooted through the templates category and assembled a bunch of useful templates in the Category:Book templates. If you think a sub-page for either the Novels or Books WikiProject would be useful, I'd be happy to create an annotated list. Cheers, ♥ Her Pegship♥ 18:47, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Reply to your latest at User_talk:Fabartus#Kevin_joins_in! // FrankB 08:26, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Number of edits

Hi, I saw that you greeted me to Wikiproject Novels, and so I glanced at your userpage. It says that you have over 10,000 edits. How did you count them? Do you know how I could count how many edits I've done? I'm a little curious... LittleDan 03:19, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

By the way, I was wondering if one is supposed to show the year of publication of a book both in the infobox and in the lead sentence, or only in the infobox. What do you think? LittleDan 03:28, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Michael de Larrabeiti/The Borrible Trilogy

Cheers Kevin, I've added all the Larrabeiti works that have been categorized to the appropriate lists. If I wanted to add further novels, should I just go ahead and do it? I realise I should just Be Bold but I wasn't sure if there was a different protocol that applied to WikiProjects. -Jim 08:45, 11 July 2006 (UTC) (crossposted from Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Novels/Worklist).

Will keep additions to a minimum, as per your advice. Have added covers to Foxes' Oven, A Rose Beyond the Thames and The Borribles Go For Broke as promised; also brought Journal of a Sad Hermaphrodite into the WikiProject; and added all texts in the project to worklist etc.

Categorisation

Hi Kevin. I was a bit miffed you put The Wasp Factory and Walking on Glass down as stub quality. I've put a lot of work into both, and while they are far from perfect, I don't agree they fit the description:

"The article is either a very short article or a rough collection of information that will need much work to bring it to A-Class level. It is usually very short, but can be of any length if the material is irrelevant or incomprehensible."

You also marked the edit as minor when it is clearly more than minor. What's going on? --Guinnog 10:22, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply and apologies for the miffed tone. I appreciate the work you are doing. Is there anything I can do to help you? I have AWB. --Guinnog 11:03, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Novels categorisation

Hi, and thanks for your answer. I'm on the brink of departing to sunnier parts, so I may not have a chance now to fully respond to what you are saying. We'll surely have time enough to discuss this matter at some later point.

Just as far as the quality rating is concerned — this is the official description of "Start-class", according to Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Novels/Assessment:

Not useless. Some readers will find what they are looking for, but most will not. Most articles in this category have the look of an article "under construction" and a reader genuinely interested in the topic is likely to seek additional information elsewhere.
Substantial/major editing is needed, most material for a complete article needs to be added. This article usually isn't even good enough for a cleanup tag: it still needs to be built.

In the light of Last Seen Wearing ..., I simply do not understand

Ok, on that basis - neither do I -
First is that this is not specifically a "Novels" criteria as you might see it is a ] grading schema inclusion.
Second I have been working almost exclusively off the "criteria" column which I think is far more rational anyway.
Thirdly, I think I must challenge (i.e. with the people) at least some of that language of those other columns, far too combative in my view. It obviously got to you, and also when I think about it to me as well. :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 12:05, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
  1. what most readers will be looking for ("Some readers will find what they are looking for, but most will not");
  2. what exactly makes the article appear to be "under construction";
  3. why "a reader genuinely interested in the topic is likely to seek additional information elsewhere" (where, for Christ's sake?);
  4. where, if "most material for a complete article needs to be added", all that material is supposed to come from; and, finally,
  5. why "this article isn't even good enough for a cleanup tag".

I'm neither trying to defend a crime novel few people outside a circle of aficionados admittedly know exists at all, nor my own work. I'd be happy if some wonderkid rewrote the text so that it could pass as "GA" or (why not?) "FA". But again: What exactly would they have to do?

Next thing to say is don't confuse issues of article quality - with subject significance. I terms of what to do to improve the article I did throw up and idea or two last post. At least for the moment and based on your observations I think a B quality grading must be the thing. :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 12:05, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm going to add this to Talk:Last Seen Wearing ... (Hillary Waugh novel)/Comments as well. All the best, <KF> 11:44, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

9tail Fox categorisation

I'm (tentatively) querying your categorisation of the 9tail Fox article as stub-class - please see the article talk page. Thanks - Tyrhinis 18:58, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

The Face on the Cutting-Room Floor

Please stop assessing articles. Your ratings do not make any sense at all. <KF> 22:30, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Pattern Templates

Hi, you asked about Novel article. When you say cleared things up "a little". does that mean you have more questions? :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 08:22, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

I did not mean to belittle the assistance: perhaps a poor choice of words, given tone of voice is absent in the written word. Those articles – especially Ice (novel) – have made clear the aspects I was unsure about. Well, it would have been nice if the character template were used on a more notable character, such as Gandalf, so I could see how it would be used in a larger context, but if it does not exist, it does not exist. Elric of Grans 23:39, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Phoenix

Thanks, I'm just glad someone who had a cover found the article. ReverendG 21:40, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Image:FrankHerbert Dune 1st.jpg

I've just uploaded a replacement cover of the 1st editon of Dune. It doesn't have the black line, but the condition of the cover doesn't seem to be quite as good as yours. Which do you think is better? Grey Shadow 06:39, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Yours is better clearly - I would place it in the infobox and move the more recent one. :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 09:59, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
Done.Grey Shadow 16:01, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

New isStub functionality

Can you have a look at my Sandbox and tell me if the criteria for the "isStub" / "isNotStub" is set to a optimal location. The criteria are:

  1. To be marked "isStub" in bold, it must have less than 450 words (minus the number of words in a template i.e. words in a {{Infobox Book}} are not counted) and the article is not currently in a stub category.
  2. To be marked "isNotStub" in bold, it must have more than 450 words (minus the number of words in a template i.e. words in a {{Infobox Book}} are not counted) and the article is currently in a stub category.
  3. To be marked "isStub" in normal text, it must have less than 450 words (minus the number of words in a template i.e. words in a {{Infobox Book}} are not counted) and the article is currently in a stub category.
  4. To be marked "isNotStub" in normal text, it must have more than 450 words (minus the number of words in a template i.e. words in a {{Infobox Book}} are not counted) and the article is not currently in a stub category.

Let me know if any of the "word count" criteria should be changed up or down. Thanks! Eagle talk 17:10, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

P.S. New lists from this point on will be sorted alphabetically! (I have been working!)
Oh, and I am back :) Eagle talk 17:10, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

To be clear

I can adjust the wordcount for each criteria individually (really in pairs of 2 as they are in opposing pairs). Would you please make sure that this is noted somewhere, or tell me where to note this. Right now it is set to a uniform 450, but we may want to make some changes to reduce or increase the number of alerts the program gives.

Also on another note, I am right now almost done with a new alert tag. This one will alert users of all lists to weather or not the novel is in Category:YYYY novels or not. Advice on potential pitfalls is welcome :)

I have not decided yet on how to post articles that the only thing missing is this category. Advice here is also appreciated. Thanks :) Eagle talk 18:10, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

So true

Yes I agree it is hard to design with no imput :) So I am thanking you right now for giving me my needed imput. Thanks! Eagle talk 18:30, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

P.S. Do check my sandbox, I have an example of the new feature! Do note, I know it is very buggy (fixing that after this post) You can tell it is buggy becuase it is telling me that an article in Category:2000 novels needs a YYYY novel category, that tells me something is wrong

Also, what does "watershed" mean? I take it as a british term that I don't know :) Eagle talk 18:30, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Found the bug! ] ]... the I forgot about the possibility of "|Different wording" Eagle talk 18:34, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Permission to create new list!

I want to create a new list that will work on identifying all articles missing Category:YYYY novels. This is a list that will be run alongside all other autolists, (i.e. looking in the "whatlinkshere" for novels with an incomplete infobox will also run a second operation, all articles with the word novels in it will be checked for Category:YYYY novels and added to this second list. Thus even if the article has a complete infobox, it will still be added to this second list if it does not have Catgory:YYYY novels. Eagle talk 22:35, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

EDIT note that the prototype is in my Sandbox. Eagle talk 00:48, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Also, in the future... do you mind if I just create the list and tell you about it after the fact. This would make things easier on my part as most lists I create are on request of another WP:NOVELS user. (this one is!)Eagle talk 22:35, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Plus: do you mind if I move the book stubs->novel stubs list to a more inclusive name. (help on this is appreciated as I have no clue as to the proper name!) Eagle talk 22:35, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

I see you got that done, no problem. :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 17:37, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Novels/autolist/Missing YYYY category

The title is a link to a prototype list. This list should have no false hits, and will be updated everytime I update any other list! I request that you put this list in the WP:NOVEL infobox. I fully intend on this list to be useful. Eagle talk 17:31, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Had a quick look I will look more closely tomorrow. :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 17:38, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Something weird with the novel template

If you take a look at Talk:On Her Majesty's Secret Service, there appears to be a redlinked category at the bottom called "Category:No-class novel articles". It appears to have been generated by the novel template but I can't figure out where it's coming from as the template page itself gives no clue. The fact it's redlinked means the category itself has been deleted, or possibly never existed, and the term "No-class" is unlikely to be a term the Novels Wikiproject would use. I wonder if this isn't possibly a bit of sneaky vandalism somewhere down the line? I also found it on Talk:Meet the Tiger so I think it might be a template problem. 23skidoo 01:02, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Extremely well spotted - you know what it is you are trying to clean up a few things and along the way you make something else a mess. Anyway should be sorted now. Let me know if you see anything else. Thanks :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 07:58, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Looks good now! 23skidoo 23:17, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Graphic Novels

Re: User talk:Eagle 101#Follow on from Cat:year novels and User talk:Grey Shadow#is that a bug?

A question for you. Would you place something like 24: One Shot, a Graphic Novel, in {cat:Year novels} or leave it as it is in {cat:year books}? Grey Shadow 08:25, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Based on our project brief I would exclude them - they are considerably different animals than any textual novel, something half way between a comic and a novel. We deal in Novels and Novella (or Novelettes). Other raise short stories and being out of scope. In my veiw that is a hard one to see the borders of. :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 08:31, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Boogiepop assessment

Thanks for assessing those articles for me. I wanted to get a bit of a benchmark for myself so that I could better understand how people would assess things: I had underestimated things, so I am glad I made that request rather than just assuming things. I should be able to use this as a basis to improve things, and hopefully make larger contributions in future. Elric of Grans 11:46, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Template:Split

Just to let you know the image in this template has now gone AWOL. Another user seems to have killed the image itself! :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 15:47, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for bringing this to my attention! The image was deleted at the Commons (due to an apparent misunderstanding), and it's been restored. —David Levy 17:57, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Larrabeiti articles on WikiProject

Hi Kevin: I saw you moved all the Larrabeiti articles to the correct dates. Apologies for making this extra work for you; I didn't realise when I added the articles that the date referred to when the article was started, and not when it joined the project. I now know! Jim (Talk) 22:37, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Not much action yet, but I've just finished merging all the articles on the Borrible books into The Borrible Trilogy, and it looks pretty good: hopefully it'll start getting some interest soon. Jim (Talk) 14:14, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Adrian Snell

Yes, Adrian Snell is a composer. However, Category:Composers is supposed to be a parent category while the composers are supposed to be placed in its subcategories. See Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Composers for these guidelines. I'm in the process of removing composers from the large category and into subcategories, and you are welcome to help. Thank you! Dafoeberezin3494 14:58, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

2001 cover

You said: "change back to first edition cover - leave or improve 1st quality"

Ok. What's the problem? the aniversery cover is a clear and straight good quality image -- not to mention better artwork. The quality of the other cover pic just isn't the same level. The picture of Dellea on the cover isn't as awe inspiring -- it never was. I don't want to start and edit war, so I decided to talk here first. Why did you replace the image in the box? The 2 book covers are redundant. - Jason Palpatine 16:46, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

House Made of Dawn

Hi, You commented that you thought the House Made of Dawn article was over-long: could I ask you to please review the changes I have made and give your opinion on the talk page, along with any extant criticisms if necessary? Cheers Vizjim 09:50, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Giver and Thunderball

thanks for the notices about the FARs - please be aware that to get peoples attention our wikiproject uses Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Novels/GeneralForum for its discussions. Thanks :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 07:54, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks so much for letting me know. I've been putting out notices about the FARs for quite a while now, and yours is the first feedback. Sandy 12:22, 27 July 2006 (UTC)


Unspecified source for Image:BernardCornwell promo.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:BernardCornwell promo.jpg. I notice the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this file yourself, then there needs to be a justification explaining why we have the right to use it on Misplaced Pages (see copyright tagging below). If you did not create the file yourself, then you need to specify where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.

If the file also doesn't have a copyright tag, then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{GFDL-self}} tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media meets the criteria at Misplaced Pages:Fair use, use a tag such as {{fairusein|article name}} or one of the other tags listed at Misplaced Pages:Image copyright tags#Fair_use. See Misplaced Pages:Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. 160.218.156.85 22:10, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

Auto worklists

Ok, I updated my part. I will run the lists that need updating later today or tommarow. We need to get more effort on Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Novels/NovelsInCompleteInfobox. This is by far our largest and most complete list. Please have the project take advantage of the work that went into making that.

Note Kenvinalewis... if you want to try WikiVoter out drop me an e-mail... to steal a line from pegship... Cheers! —— Eagle (ask me for help) 15:18, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

Importance and Status Ratings

Hey, I just joined Wiki-projects novels and am a littl confused about one thing. Who do you (or can you) edit the importance and status ratings of an article? I've been working on The Violent Bear It Away's article, and it wasn't rated. Is it something anyone can do themselves, or do you need to apply to it or something? Thanks for your help.

Caesar 00:34, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Nevermind, I think I figured it out.

Caesar 00:46, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

The Novels WikiProject Newsletter
Issue III - August 2006
Project news
  • In the northern hemisphere this is traditionally the season for holiday's - if you are due for one - enjoy the rest.
  • Quiet work is going on trying to improve the coverage of Infoboxes in Novel articles and adding vital information to those Infoboxes. Those that make the most contribution do get noticed!
  • We now have a Collaboration of the Month (see below).
  • Misplaced Pages:Manual of Style (writing about fiction) should be looked at. It was adopted recently, but discussion is still going.
Member News
  • The project has currently 114 members, 10 joined since the last newsletter in early July 2006.
From the Members

Welcome to the third issue of the Novels WikiProject's newsletter! Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do.

We would encourage all member to get more envolved and if you are wondering what with, please ask.

Kevinalewis : /(Desk), Initiating Editor

Auto list news
Collaboration of the Month
  • Announcing our new Collaboration of the Month which for the month of August is The Mystery of the Yellow Room. This is our first and has already been worked on seeing substantial change (and hopefully improvement). Please get involved and submit other novel titles for future collaborations. If this is successful we can really improve these articles and we may increase the frequency of the title change.
Current debates
  • New book related notability proposals are to be seen at Misplaced Pages:Notability (books), if you have not seen these do take a look. The debate and level of change has slowed so thi may mean that a concensus is near!
  • Discussion about adding two new fields, Film adaptation and Based on film, to the {{Infobox_Book}} template is going on in the WP:BOOKS talk page.

To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here.

 :: Kevinalewis : /(Desk) 10:35, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

No heading

Just a note to say you forgot to put a heading when leaving the newsletter on my talk page. Lcarsdata (Talk) 11:43, 1 August 2006 (UTC)