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A request: Please do not delete or remove material from this page, unless it is vandalism (in which case please leve me a note informing me you have done so). --L33tminion | (talk) 06:36, Feb 20, 2005 (UTC)

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• Archive 1

TS and painkillers

On a "related" note, during a lethal injection procedure the condemned's arm is swabbed with antiseptic prior to insertion of the needle. So much for rational. Although, I suppose, there's an outside chance that clemency will be granted in between the time of the insertion of the needle and the time of administration of the drugs... but that's a bit of a reach, IMO. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 01:04, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)

Terri Schiavo's pain

For most of 15 years Terri Schiavo had a standing order for analgesics to relieve menstrual pain. There's no way that her caregivers believed that she did not experience pain. She behaved as if she experienced pain, which is all, existentially speaking, we know for certain about anyone else's experience of pain. When someone behaves as if they are experiencing pain, the only rational conclusion is that they are experiencing pain, even though you can't prove it in an absolute sense.

Take at look at the Exit Protocol that her hospice doctor wrote for her death in 2001. Take note of the instructions to use analgesics for symptoms of pain and discomfort: "Monitor symptoms of pain/discomfort. If noted, medicate with Naproxen rectal suppository 375 mg. Q8 prn." If you tell me that you don't think that means that he thought Terri could experience pain, I'm sorry, but I won't believe you. NCdave 04:37, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) (talk)

A patient who is unconscious does not react to pain stimulus, and so there are no "symptoms of pain/discomfort," and therefore no analgesics can be given in response to such symptoms. Nor are analgesics customarily given to comatose patients, simply because they cannot feel pain or react to pain. For example, see which is a reference to a study of the use of analgesics and sedatives in terminal patients from whom life support has been withdrawn. The abstract notes that, "Patients who did not receive medication were comatose and considered incapable of benefiting from sedation and analgesia." In fact, sedation to unconsciousness is commonly used instead of analgesics, to give peace to patients who cannot be made comfortable with analgesics.

Also, the testimony from George Felos's handpicked neurologists is highly suspect, because they contradicted each other. One said that most of Terri's brain had been replaced by "spinal fluid." The other said that most of her brain was "scar tissue." Obviously, at least one of them was talking nonsense: scar tissue and spinal fluid do not look remotely similar on a CT scan.

In fact, neurologists aren't qualified to interpret CT scans, anyhow. That's a job for radiologists. The two radiologists that I know of who looked at Terri's CT scans both concluded that her brain was significantly atrophied, but not nearly as bad as the Felos-selected neurologists claimed, and both doubted that she was in a PVS. Radiologist Thomas Boyle, M.D. (host of the award-winning CodeBlueBlog web site), who has interpreted over 10,000 brain CT scans, wrote, "I have seen many walking, talking, fairly coherent people with worse cerebral/cortical atrophy. Therefore, this is in no way prima facie evidence that Terri Schiavo's mental abilities or/or capabilities are completely eradicated. I cannot believe such testimony has been given on the basis of this scan." NCdave 21:47, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) (talk)

issues about school articles

In November 2003, there was a VfD debate over Sunset High School (Portland). The debate was archived under Talk:Sunset High School (Portland). What to do with the article is still being contested and has been recently re-nominated for VfD at Misplaced Pages:Votes for deletion/Sunset High School (Portland).

I am writing to you because you have participated in such debates before. There still does not exist a wikipedia policy (as far as i can tell) over what to do in regards to articles about specific U.S. public school. My hope is that a real consensus can come out of the debate, and a real policy can take shape. Take part if you are so willing. Kingturtle 02:25, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Earthquake

It has no proper name. "earthquake" should remain lower case as per the style guidelines. Please, before moving such an important and high-traffic article as this, consult the talk page first. --Golbez 07:07, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)

"2004 Indian Ocean earthquake" is more a description than a name. A hurricane has a name; i.e. Hurricane Andrew. Otherwise, it's 1970 Bhola cyclone, note the lower case. Bhola isn't the name, it's the location. As for the style guide, here: Misplaced Pages:Naming conventions. Specifically, Misplaced Pages:Naming conventions (capitalization). --Golbez 02:05, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)

No problem, and thanks for responding. Sorry if I came off gruff in my first comment, it had been a long day. --Golbez 13:50, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)

Gender pronouns

This is rather pedantic of me, of course...but...do remember that "they" is very difficult to manage right, and that classical English usage allows "he" to stand in for "he and she"...--VKokielov 07:42, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

To your user-page comment.  :) --VKokielov 19:56, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

Well, if you can manage "they", go forth! I think that a little conservatism in language doesn't hurt (since the blood runs in the veins, not on the skin, so to say), but c'est moi. --VKokielov 23:59, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Votes for deletion/Bro

I thought you might be able to help out a fellow inclusionist on the VFD for bro. It needs cleanup but some people are trying to redirect it to brother. Check out my vote comment. Thanks —Teknic 03:29, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

Combine the Existence of God Articles

I'm proposing combining the Arguments for the existence of God and the Arguments against the existence of God articles. Bryan also supports this, Mel opposes. Since you have supported a similar idea in the past, I was hoping you might want to give your two cents on the matter. Here is the discussion: Talk:Arguments for the existence of God#Combine the articles. Thanks! crazyeddie 17:47, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Mind Benders

Hello! I've noticed your past interest in Misplaced Pages:Mind Benders and wanted to share the following announcement with you! I've taken over the responsibilities of Mind Benders, and the page will now be regularly updated. Right now, the pre-round is open (it's more of a creative artistic competition), and round one will open soon (the questions are done, we just need to wait for the pre-round to begin/finish)! So why not check it out? I'll keep you updated! Thanks, Flcelloguy | A note? | Desk 01:39, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)

P.S. Feel free to pass this news on to other Wikipedians.

Existence of God merger

I'm attempting to develop a consensus in favor of merging the Arguments against the existence of God and the Arguments for the existence of God articles. A beta version of the resulting article is available at Existence of God. To date, there seems to be consensus in favor of this merger on the "for" talk page, I'm now trying to get a consensus together on the "against" talk page. Please visit Talk:Arguments against the existence of God to weigh in. I'm copy-and-pasting this message to everybody who has contributed to that talk page. crazyeddie 05:46, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Extreme category inclusion?

How would you feel about supporting the inclusion of a category that means well, and has a pretty specific purpose? Category:Major cities in North Dakota is under attack for initially being really bad. I improved it a lot, and now it's coming under attack for being arbitrary.

I personally feel that an article, or a category, about North Dakota, made by North Dakotans, and maintained by them, shouldn't be forced to defend itself from people who don't have the slightest clue what they are talking about. What do you think? --Alexwcovington (talk) 08:08, 10 July 2005 (UTC)

Thanks, I appreciate it! --Alexwcovington (talk) 03:55, 13 July 2005 (UTC)

RFC on SlimVirgin

I have filed a request for comment on SlimVirgin. You can visit the page by going here. FuelWagon 22:28, 14 July 2005 (UTC)

The Micronation article

Since you defended George Cruickshank during my arbitration against him last year, I would like to bring to your attention his recent alledged actions. There is strong evidence that the account User:Centauri is a sockpuppet of his. See this page for more evidence.

Recently, User:Centauri has been rather vigilant about linking to Empire of Atlantium from the micronation article:

This, despite the fact that he is the only user who wants this particular content in the Micronation article:

I am requesting that you look at this article and make up your own mind how to handle this content dispute (the fact that Wik may be back just fuels flames to the fire). Samboy 04:05, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

Yes, I would appreciate it if you looked at the matter too.

This is text that I am trying to include:

A "summit of micronations" hosted as part of the exhibition was attended by representatives of Sealand, Elgaland-Vargaland, New Utopia, Atlantium, Frestonia and Fusa, and will feature in a 5-part BBC television documentary about micronations produced by Danny Wallace and scheduled to screen in the United Kingdom commencing in July 2005. The exhibition is also being reprised at the Andrew Kreps Gallery in New York City from 24 June - 29 July 2005.

The section in bold (which has this reference to suppoort it) is what Samboy is creating a song-and-dance about, going so far as provoke an edit war on the subject with an editor who I and many others are reasonably certain is a sockpuppet of Gzornenplatz, who has of course been forbidden to edit anything, by Jimbo.

It should be pointed out that the paragraph directly above, causes Samboy no issues at all:

In August 2003 a summit of micronations took place in Helsinki at Finlandia Hall, the site of the Conference for Security and Co-operation in Europe (CSCE). The summit was attended by delegations of the Principality of Sealand, the Kingdoms of Elgaland & Vargaland, NSK-State in Time, Ladonia, Transnational Republic, the State of Sabotage and by scholars from various academic institutions.

Both paragraphs describe events that are of international significance as far as micronations go, and I think it's important to list the participants. The fact that Samboy is so cut up over one of them, while completely ignoring the other one, shows that his judgement on the issue is severely impaired, being affected by personal disagreements he has had with other editors in the past.

I'd also ask you to compare the edit history of myself and Samboy on this article. It shows that Samboy has not added a single word to the article, while I have contributed a significant amount of work to improving both the article's written content and formatting. This shows that Samboy's claims about "advertising" by me are rubbish. --Centauri 05:08, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

Well, me and Centauri are on good terms again, thanks in part to Keith Tyler, who fully supported Centauri, and was nice enough to talk with me on the phone about the issue. That said, I really appreciate you coming back to me; I asked for your help because you did support him (or maybe his assosciate) before. Samboy 00:45, 19 July 2005 (UTC)

Good to hear, and sorry I wasn't able to respond earlier. I hope you don't mind if I add my two cents.

It does seem that Centauri has been a bit less than perfectly civil about this, but I think his support of that content is legitimate. After all, consensus seems to favor including the story about that summit, so I don't see why it would be unreasonable to list the micronations attending it. (And the link he cited should definitely be included.)

I commend your work at removing irrelevant or completely non-notable material from the the micronation article. However, I do wish that there was a little more discussion on the talk page for that article this sort of problem. There seems to have been some complaining about the topic, but there is still room for constructive discussion and consensus-building there. --L33tminion (talk) 01:14, July 19, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for your response. Feel free to place a vote on the micronation talk page if so inclined. --Centauri 10:35, 19 July 2005 (UTC)

List of warez groups on VfD

Please see Misplaced Pages:Votes for deletion/List of warez groups for an ongoing discussion regarding the potential deletion of the List of warez groups article. —RaD Man (talk) 00:47, 19 July 2005 (UTC)

Esperanza made less bureaucratic

Hello again, I have (unilatterly) taken away the 'assembly' idea, as per my reasons at that edit summary and per Misplaced Pages talk:Esperanza/Charter. I have left the admin general, as some leadership is good. Now, all you have to do is be a member to establish consensus, the whole assembly idea is gone. Also, I have added an advisory committee, of four members, with limited power besides watching over the admin general and making sure he doesn't do anything stupid. Please look at the ammended charter, and I would love a comment. Redwolf24 (talk) 00:21, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

The last time I'm spamming you all with Esperanza stuff

Hello L33tminion. As you may or may not know, there have been some troubles with Esperanza. So now, as a last ditch to save the community, please vote at Misplaced Pages:Esperanza/Reform on all neccisary polls. P.S. I'm very sorry for spamming you all with these messages, and this will be the last time. I recommend putting ESP on your watchlist. Cheers and please look at that, let's stop the civil war then. Redwolf24 (talk) 02:48, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

Please vote on list of lists, a featured list candidate

Please vote at Misplaced Pages:Featured list candidates/List of lists of mathematical topics. Michael Hardy 20:56, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

Signpost

I appreciate your work, but please do not put "(see archived story)" in italics. There's no need to use italics except for emphasis. Ral315 (talk) 01:26, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

You bring up a good point. I'll discuss it with other reporters. We really need to have our own Manual of Style for these types of things. Ral315 (talk) 18:53, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

Esperanza elections

You've received this spam because you signed up for it here. To stop the spam, pop over and remove yourself and you'll never hear from Esperanza again!

➨ ❝REDVERS❞ 19:54, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

News from Esperanza

Hello, fellow Esperanzians! This is just a friendly reminder that elections for Administrator General and two advisory council positions have just begun. Voting will last until Friday, December 30, so make sure you exercise your right to vote! Also, I'm pleased to announce the creation of the Esperanza mailing list. I urge all members to join; see Misplaced Pages:Esperanza/Contact for more information. All you need to do is email me and I will activate your account. This will be a great way to relax, stay in touch, and hear important announcements. Thanks! Flcelloguy (A note?)

This message was delivered to all Esperanza members by our acting messenger, Redvers. If you do not wish to receive further messages, please list yourself at WP:ESP/S. Thanks.

An Esperanzial note

As I remember, the last spam that was handed out was on the 20th of December last year, so I think it's time for another update. First and foremost, the new Advisory Council and Administrator General have been elected. They consist of myself as Admin General and FireFox, Titoxd, Flcelloguy and Karmafist as the Advisory Council. We as a group met formally for the first time on the 31st of Decembe. The minutes of this meeting can be found at WP:ESP/ACM. The next one is planned for tonight (Sunday 29 January) at 20:30 UTC and the agenda can be found at WP:ESP/ACM2.

In other news, Karmafist has set up a discussion about a new personal attack policy, which it can be found here. Other new pages include an introductory page on what to do when you sign up, So you've joined Esperanza... and a welcome template: {{EA-welcome}} (courtesy of Bratsche). Some of our old hands may like to make sure they do everything on the list as well ;) Additionally, the userpage award program proposal has become official is operational: see Misplaced Pages:Esperanza/User Page Award to nominate a userpage or volunteer as a judge. Also see the proposed programs page for many new proposals and old ones that need more discussion ;)

Other than that, I hope you all had a lovely Christmas and wish you an Esperanzially good new WikiYear :D Thank you! --Celestianpower 16:57, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
Message delivered by Rune.welsh using AWB. If you wish to recieve no further messages of this ilk, please sign your name here.

Another Esperanzial note...

Hi again Esperanzians! Well, since our last frolic in the realms of news, the Advisory Council has met twice more (see WP:ESP/ACM2 and WP:ESP/ACM3). As a result, the charter has been ammended twice (see here for details) and all of the shortcuts have been standardised (see the summary for more details). Also of note is the Valentines ball that will take place in the Esperanza IRC channel on the 14th of February (tomorrow). It will start at 6pm UTC and go on until everyone's had enough! I hope to see you all there! Also, the spamlist has been dissolved - all Esperanzians will now recieve this update "newsletter".

The other major notice I need to tell you about is the upcoming Esperanza Advisory Council Elections. These will take place from 12:00 UTC on February 20th to 11:59 UTC on February 27th. The official handing-over will take place the following day. Candidates are able to volunteer any time before the 20th, so long as they are already listed on the members list. Anyone currently listed on the memberlist can vote. In a change since last time, if you have already been a member of the leadership, you may run again. Due to the neutrality precident, I will not vote for anyone.

Yours, as ever, Esperanzially,
--Celestianpower 09:00, 13 February 2006 (UTC)
(message delivered by FireFox using AWB on Celestianpower's behalf)

Article listed for deletion

Hi,

I noticed that you're an extreme article inclusionist, so I was wondering if you would be able to do me a huge favor and possibly place a vote here. I've been working on the article for months, and now they want to delete it. If you could, I would be greatly in your debt.

Best wishes,

Primetime 09:46, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

• Thanks! If you ever need a favor, let me know! Sincerely, Primetime 18:51, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Esperanza Newsletter, Issue #1

Esperanza Newsletter, Issue #2

Old Skool Esperanzial note

Since this isn't the result of an AC meeting, I have decided to go Old Skool. This note is to remind you that the elections are taking place now and will end at 23:50 UTC on 2006-04-29. Please vote here. Thanks. --Celestianpower 20:42, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

Esperanza Newsletter, Issue #3

A short Esperanzial update

As you may have gathered, discussions have been raging for about a week on the Esperanza talk page as to the future direction of Esperanza. Some of these are still ongoing and warrant more input (such as the idea to scrap the members list altogether). However, some decisions have been made and the charter has hence been amended. See what happened. Basically, the whole leadership has had a reshuffle, so please review the new, improved charter.

As a result, we are electing 4 people this month. They will replace JoanneB and Pschemp and form a new tranche A, serving until December. Elections will begin on 2006-07-02 and last until 2006-07-09. If you wish to run for a Council position, add your name to the list before 2006-07-02. For more details, see Misplaced Pages:Esperanza/June 2006 elections.

Thanks and kind, Esperanzial regards, —Celestianpower 16:00, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Proposal on Notability

Because you're a member of the Association of Inclusionist Wikipedians, I'm notifying you that the inclusionist proposa Misplaced Pages:Non-notabilityl is in progress to define the role of notability in articles. Please help us make this successful! Also note the proposal Misplaced Pages:Importance is a deletionist proposla that seeks to officially introduce notabiltiy for the first time. Make sure this is defeated! --Ephilei 22:56, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Atheism!

I am pleased to announce the creation of the first ever atheist wikiproject. The project is still in its infancy, and will need some love before it begins to take shape. Please help in any way you can. Thanks! Hezzy 03:49, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

August Esperanza Newsletter

Reward

You probably know about this, but since you're the nominator, I'll point it out: Misplaced Pages:Reward_board#Money, specifically the Megatokyo one. Assuming it passes FAC, of course. --PresN 19:25, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Megatokyo

"I made some edits, and I think the current version is clear, non-confusing, and not misleading. Note that the transliterations of the Japanese spellings of names are in Japanese order, while the other instances of those names are in standard English order. Also note the footnote after Erika's name. Finally, someone should add the Japanese spelling of Miho's name to the article (if it is known). --L33tminion (talk) 07:03, 18 August 2006 (UTC)"

And then someone reads the (original English-language) comic and finds the opposite naming order. UH-OH!

Do you see the problem with the proposal? WhisperToMe 13:36, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

September Esperanza Newsletter

Please help - inclusionism is "absurb" now

Sorry to bother you, but as an things are getting desperate and I need to appeal to your for help. We are facing a situation where a deletionist admin is free to declare inclusionist arguments "absurd" and ignore them at will. If you don't agree with this situation, please share your opinion here. Kappa 02:48, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

• Inclusionist Wikipedians