Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Mystar (talk | contribs) at 00:55, 2 October 2006. The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

This user is a member of the Sword of Truth task force.

http://www.terrygoodkind.com//chats/PIchat5.php

You have identified yourself as the webmaster of terrygoodkind.com. I ask that you act in good faith by restoring the contents of http://www.terrygoodkind.com//chats/PIchat5.php. Understand that it is cached indefinitely by Google and various quotes have been copied into other web sites under the fair use doctrine. This allows us to cite it at will. Unfortunately, removing it from the official site only makes Goodkind look like he's hiding something, which I'm sure is not the case. Al 17:43, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

As I stated, I have not identified myself as webmaster of Terry goodkind.com, but rather www.terrygoodkind.net. As for the afore mentioned interviews, you may or may not have noticed .com is undergoing a new look. Some of the content is not yet restored, but will be.

However, that is not the point. So Goodkind has an opinon of his works? So a few trolls got togather and asked Goodkind a loaded question, after posting that it was going to be a loaded question, and afterwards admidted that it was loaded... What you have is simply an interview. Some would wish to make more of it than it is. The point is that this site is for encyclopedic information and not for cross burning. You are allowing the cross burners a forum for their POV, when the site should be information as to the author and not petty gripes a few disgruntles ex-fans have.

I haev reviewd many many other wilipedia pages and see nothing like the crap you keep allowing here.

So S'up with that eh?

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Need I say more?24.236.196.174

T. Goodkind

I would like to extend a welcome. I see you have taken a good look at Goodkind’s page. So me good work I see. Although Terry has no Internet, he would like some to add some content and pertinent facts. Can you help? Mystar 05:12, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Sure, I'd love to help. I'm always looking to improve the status and quality of articles on Terry Goodkind and his books. Let me know what you need help with, and I'll see if I can be of assistance. - Runch 14:40, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Message for You

Mystar, I have left you a message on the Terry Goodkind talk page entitled: More Misguided Edits by Mystar. Please read it, I think it will be beneficial to you. - Runch 03:54, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

I have two points to make:

• 1. I have 0 ASOIAF edits. None.
• 2. I'm not going to expend any more energy trying to fight you. If you truly don't understand why your edits are summarily deleted, then I can't say anything to make you understand. I've tried pointing you towards a wealth of information on Misplaced Pages, and others have tried to explain to you the error of your ways. You either just don't understand or refuse to listen. All I can say is read the discussions on the talk pages again, perhaps you will learn why most of your edits are POV.

You should know that I have asked for a moderator to help with the edit warring on the TG page. You are probably not willing to admit it to yourself, but if you continue on making edits as you have been in the past, you may very well get banned from Misplaced Pages for a short period of time. Again, read the discussions on the talk page, and consider wisely before editing. - Runch 14:31, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Personal Attack Notice

"Please see Misplaced Pages's no personal attacks policy. Comment on content, not on the contributor; personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Note that continued personal attacks may lead to blocks for disruption. Please stay cool and keep this in mind while editing. Thank you. "
Your insults on Talk:Terry Goodkind have gone on long enough, Mystar. If you violate the rule on personal attacks again, I will post your actions on the intervention noticeboard. - Runch 18:40, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

As I stated in another forum, I'll assume that you also did the same for the other peopel who are attacking me. If not then I can only say it means very little for you to post it on me and forgo the others. mystarMystar 02:14, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Please do not make personal attacks on other people, as you did at Talk:Terry Goodkind#Verifiability of "online chat". Misplaced Pages has a policy against personal attacks. In some cases, users who engage in personal attacks may be blocked from editing by admins or banned by the arbitration committee. Comment on content, not on other contributors or people. Please resolve disputes appropriately. Thank you. NeoFreak 03:36, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

bub,I didn't make any,so get off my ass!Mystar 03:54, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Your contined attacks esp against Werthead in the form of name calling has already been refered to the administrator notice board for action. NeoFreak 03:57, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Mediation Notice

This user page is currently inactive and is retained for historical reference. If you want to revive discussion regarding the subject, you might try contacting the user in question or seeking broader input via a forum such as the village pump.

Misplaced Pages:Requests for mediation/OpenNote is deprecated. Please see User:MediationBot/Opened message instead.

- Happy Editing, Runch 15:55, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

In Reply

Your explanation about the "worthead" incidents is believable and understandable and I'm glad that won't be an issue any more. As for you accusations of "editing several pages of material you had posted in the past, in an attempt to make it friendlier" I don't understand or recall the instance in which you are refering to. Could you provide me with a link or example so I can understand where you are coming from? Also from you: "I've countless pages of attacks and openly encouraging attacks about Goodkind, starting and instigating Goodkind bashing etc. from you on everything from ASOFAI to Dragonmount to Bakkers page". I don't frequent the Dragonmount or Bakker pages (and it's ASOIAF not ASOFAI) and don't understand that accusation either. Again clarification would be helpful to me. I also do not recall "bashing Goodkind" or posting "vehemently negative opinion" anywhere. Any examples would be helpful. Thanks in advance. NeoFreak 04:55, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

I'll be only too happy to provide them. Give me a day to pull them out of my files.Mystar 04:58, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

No problem, thanks again. NeoFreak 04:59, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Would it be alright if I emailed your yahoo account? If so I'll use your listed account. NeoFreak 13:43, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Progress

I think the TG article is making alot of progress. I also thought most of your edits to George RR Martin and A Song of Ice and Fire were on the money. I was wondering where you see the TG and SoT articles going from here? NeoFreak 04:52, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your input.

Personally, I see them going nowhere as WLU is determined to keep arguing with everything I do, or anything about Goodkind that isn't either sterial or of negitive content

Mystar 04:58, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

Hi Mystar,

Check out your user page, I added some comments. I'm not trying to argue with everything you do, I'm trying to get you to justify your edits of the page. My rationale for why I want the changes I do are listed on your user page, I could move them here if you'd like. I'm not trying for negative content, I'm trying for accurate content. I'd also like to say thanks, this whole thing has improved me as a wikipedia editor. WLU 22:13, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

WLU's Notice

(Originaly posted by WLU on Mystar's user page)

Hey Mystar, how you doing? I'd like to use your page and my own talk page to discuss things about the TG page since otherwise we use up a lot of space on the discussion page. You can link the discussion page here if you want to, that way people can see what we're talking about. Now, down to business.

The reason I took out the 'best known for' is because if you look at the link that you provided, it does not say he was best known for it. It just says that he fixed antiques, repaired violins, and painted. It does not say 'best known for'. If someone wanted to look it up, to see where this information came from, all they would get would be a page where it lists a bunch of occupations, and in no way distinguishes one from any other, in particular, it doesn't distinguish the painting thing from the rest that are listed. Therefore, according to this page, he is not best known for it, he is just as well known for painting as he is for restoring antiques and fixing violons (or whatever else is on the page, I don't remember right now but I can easily check the reference - that is why it is there).

If I edited out any mention of him painting, I would clearly be in error, because the referenceable page very clearly states that he was a painter. It just does not say he is best known for it. So, I leave it in, and leave the reference, and have it list the occupation as one among many. This is not vandalism, I am not putting in any erroneous information, I am just making the page reflect what the reference shows. Just like if I looked up one of the references for the NYT bestsellers lists for the books, and found that it was a NYT bs during 2003, whereas the wiki page says it was a bs in 2004. It maintains the accuracy of the page. I don't understand why you call it vandalism.

I just found the 20 million reference on the prophets inc website, so I'm content to let that lie with the disclaimer of domestic book sales. However, I did note that on the prophets inc page (http://www.prophets-inc.com/the_author/) it says "As soon as I started writing Wizard’s First Rule, I knew writing was my calling. I’d found something to which I truly want to dedicate my life.”

This contradicts what is currently on the Terry Goodkind page in wikipedia, where it says being an author was a life-long ambition. Perhaps you could clarify since you are in regular communication with Mr. Goodkind. Should the wikipedia page in fact be accurate, you could also let him know that the prophets inc. page is inaccurate. Note that since both of the pages I am talking about are right there as clickable links, you can easily check both and verify their accuracy for both. This is the purpose of good referencing, it allows people to examine the evidence for themselves, and make their own decisions. I think that both Mr. Goodkind and Ms. Rand would both appreciate this.

This information is also on my own wiki page. user_talk:WLU

Thank you for reading this, and I look forward to your reply.

WLU 18:50, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

I don't think they are in contradiction, just very widely written so as to miss. From what I've been told, Terry enjoyed literature from a very young age and developed an ambition to write, but didn't know exactly the details of what he would write. It wasn't until he was writing Wizard's First Rule that he truly understood that writing was his calling. Mystar can certainly clarify this further. Omnilord 23:24, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

Sure, as long as he can reference it.

Hey Mystar, did you want to add some of his quotations to his wikiquotes page? I think that 'novelist not a fantasy author would be most appropriate there. Thanks,

WLU 13:14, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Plot Introductions

Hi Mystar, I see you've been rewriting the plot introductions to the books in the SoT series. I'm not questioning the factual validity of your edits (after all, I have a feeling you know the series much better than I do), but I do think that in several instances you put too much information in the intros. After all, the introduction is supposed to give the reader a very general idea of the novel without (ideally) giving away any plot details from the novel itself. In that sense, I think the general gist of the original plot intros may have been better (in some instances).

That being said, when I have a chance, I might try and trim down some of the sections you've written to try and keep the sections accurate while removing anything that might be construed as "spoilers". It might take me a few days to get around to it though, I've been pretty busy lately.

Ok, take it easy. - Runch 15:13, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

No offence, but the info contained within the Plot summery is fine, it is nothing more than would be found on any info site or any book description. They only give pertinent info and no spoilers.

HOWEVER!!! The rest of the pages are abysmal! Sorry to have to say it, but the book plot summaries are so full of misinterpretation and supposition/conjecture they need to be redone. I've already started and will be doing all of them, so that they will reflect proper information and not people assuming that this or that happened.

I will be up front and lay it out, the people placing the whole criticism thing in Naked Empire and Pillars, are in the minority. They only so called criticism calling it too "preachy" are a select few. You will not find that on any professional review, nor will you find it on any thing other than a select few other authors message boards. I simply will not allow such smearing attempts to succeed. We can state the reality of the content and that it has some long discourses from Richard helping the Bandakar to understand what they are misunderstanding, and some directives of understanding to help the reader better understand and grasp the contextual inference of the book. We can make statements without using words that are placed there to demoralize someone reading it in an attempt to dissuade them from reading it and to pre condition them to what they would read. Further, it is acceptable to place information to assist a reader, but not to make up the mind of the one looking for information.....as we have seen.

As I've said, I've several pages of info and content from several people stating the fact they are openly asking people to make such posts on Goodkind's Wiki page, and egging them on. Not to mention these same people suggesting that negative content be placed etc. All you gotta do is ask. Mystar 22:57, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Just please keep in mind that they need to be written in an encyclopedic tone. This is not a fansite or an advertisement page. Please see the pillars of creation page for more information and links. NeoFreak 06:43, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

It is written as such. But also keep in mind that it needs to be written and worded properly.Mystar 11:29, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Can I email you about that stuff you gathered together for me? NeoFreak 11:32, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

indeed. mystar@chartermi.net Mystar 11:38, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks alot. I'll send you one soon. NeoFreak 11:56, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Marking T'lan Imass for deletion

Dear Mystar,

I think you may be a bit premature on marking the article on the T'lan Imass for deletion, considering I added it less than 24 hours ago. I think that it should be left up for at least, say a week, to see if anyone, say me, expands it to a worthwhile entry. Rather than puting up a citation for deletion, I think a good faith gesture would be to mark it with a request for expansion. I already did this, don't worry about it. If you wanted to edit the entry for grammar, spelling or point of view, you are of course, welcome to do so. However, as I believe you haven't actually read the books, I think editing for content might be seen as tendentious, much like me editing a Sword of Truth article for content. However, if you do wish to add content and have read the books, feel free to do so. I'll check it against what I've read and correct accordingly. Tah! WLU 20:28, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Ahhh, so your sock puppets weigh in then I see... "I" like you simply seek to "clean up" pages that are unnessary and worthless. Thank you for your time Mystar 21:30, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Seriously dude, why would you think deleting the page after it's been up for less than a day', no hold on, I want to sound like I'm yelling, LESS THAN A DAY, is a good idea? How about we wait a bit before deciding if it's usesless. Let some other people edit it a bit, add some content, weigh in on possible further inclusions. Then, if we still consider it useless, we can consider deleting it. I mean, I know you want to piss me off and all but this just shows poor judgement. Incidentally, though I've looked at the High D'Haran page, I never weighed in on deleting it, 'cause I don't know enough about it. You should be looking for pages created by NeoFreak if you are looking for revenge deletion, I don't give a crap if High D'Haran is erased. Not even voting on it, 'cause I just don't care. Incidentally, I've added a bit more to the page in case you wanted to remove the marked for deletion notice. If that's not enough, I'll be adding more content over the coming days. WLU 23:27, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

WONDERFUL! I'm actually glad to see you doing something positive and out side your little world. I think it will make a fine addition. Adding good content is much more rewarding than simply finding things upon which you can edit war. Good for you my dear! I look forward to reading your well thought out additions to the page. Mystar 13:09, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Personal attacks

I realize that you are still relatively new to Misplaced Pages, and may not be completely familiar with policies, but it's clear from this talk page that you have been pointed to the policy on not making personal attacks. If you have not looked at it, you might want to do so; if you have, you should perhaps review it. Edits like this and this and this this are unacceptably personal, as are many of your edit summaries. As the notice posted above indicates, your comments should focus on content, rather than on other users. I realize that other editors have at times been unduly personal in their comments, and that needs to stop as well, but external provocation is not an excuse for you to engage in attacks yourself. If you feel that users are acting in bad faith, you should find more productive ways of addressing the problem than making personal attacks, such as steps in the dispute resolution process. I regret that it has come to this, but if you continue to make personal attacks, I will have to report you. I'd like to emphasize that your contributions to articles are not in dispute here, and this is not about the status of any article you have edited. It is entirely about how you communicate with other editors. Thank you for your attention in this matter. Brendan Moody 20:47, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Why would you of all people make an addition like that if not to just try and run salt+vinegar on an open wound? Condescension of this nature is just provocatory and unproductive. Stop antagonizing Mystar. That goes for the rest of you too. Omnilord 05:44, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

I have taken my recent actions because I feel that in the long run it is not doing so that will prove unproductive. Until recently I would have agreed that this was unnecessary, but recent conduct on all sides has convinced me that there are issues that will not be resolved without addressing the various behavioral complaints we all have made. It's clear that there's some disagreement about what constitutes a personal attack or incivility and about who has made them, and I no longer think we can move forward without some input from more experienced uninvolved editors. Mystar's reply to my above comments has only solidified that belief.

I am not antagonizing Mystar; I am asking him (as politely but directly as I know how) to stop making personal attacks, because it is my opinion (a) that he has done so and (b) that they are sufficiently counterproductive to be an issue. I may be wrong on one or both of those points, I make no claim to expertise. But I am not trying to hurt anyone. I am trying to help the encyclopedia, which I think we are increasingly losing sight of. Brendan Moody 05:58, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

My dear Mr. Moody, I truly think you need to stop! Take a step back! And actually LOOK at the ridiculous statement you just made. Polite though it may be, it is still acting in bad faith. I have been attacked. I have been the one seeking to stop the abuse. And YOU have chosen to address "me". How telling is that? As I said, Your words are nothing because you make decided advances to admonish me and over look the actions of your buddies. If you wish to be taken seriously act in GOOD FAITH!

Neo can do nothing but edit in poor judgment and bad form on Goodkinds pages. WERE he truly to have a care about Wiki as he clams then all he has to do is to stop and rewrite the content he finds improper. The actions of people like Neo show a decided lack of care or concern of the pages they edit. IF a person truly had a care then they would act with care, as we see you, neo, WLU, crawdad doing on their precious asoiaf pages. I'm thrilled that they feel so passionately about asoiaf. But their agenda is also made quite clear by the negative actions they take against Goodkind's pages. If you see a problem....FIX IT! Don’t run in and tag or delete it. I've been talking with several admin who wholly agree with that sentiment. Some people only want to tag and delete because it makes them feel important. It is much more work to actually stop and fix the error and the fact the Neo et al do this on several pages is very telling indeed. I see Neo is also being admonished from other editors for this same tactic. Same with WLU who suddenly popped to join in the edit warring against Goodkind and take pot shots against me, she was egged on from asoiaf mb....with no other activity here before. She jumps into the bash Goodkind party. Sorry you all can be seen to have an agenda. It is all too clear.

Admonish your group for their actions. Simply singling me out as an outlet for your agenda against Goodkind wont wash. Act in Good Faith. Mystar 13:05, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

My dear Mr. Moody. I feel the need to warn you here you are standing on very thin ice. If you are going to warn me and not your sock puppets I shall have no other alternative but to report you and your members Neofreak and WLU. I can see that you have indeed over looked their personal attacks upon me, their attacks against several pages and their rampant and unchecked double standards. No I think you are the one who is unclear on policy here. Misplaced Pages is not your personal soap Box. When you and your sock puppets make a decided attempt to damage pages it is incumbent upon someone to take up the cause. You all play a double standard and it must stop. I happen to communicate with openness and honesty. I do not hide behind lies and deceit. I call a spade a spade. I suggest that if you wish me to act in good faith, you then likewise should also act as such AND call your sock puppets to task and also warn and admonish them as well IN like manor...otherwise your words have no value and are little more than an annoying buzzing in my ear. Shold you decide to take your buddies to task in like manor I would be more than happy to discuss the situation with you. As you said, I'm not "all" that familure with "all" the rules etc, but I am familure with fair play and honerable intent. Mystar 21:29, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

BTW... I also see no personal attacks FROM me...Mystar 21:33, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

How about you compile a list of links to the personal attacks made on you, so people can more familiar with them and can easily judge them. Sure a lot more productive than protesting you're being unjustly accused. Please, by the way, report me. I look forward to an external judgement of our respective actions. Tee hee. WLU 23:27, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Welcome Notice

I moved your welcome notice to User:Alvspr to his discussion page - just thought I'd let you know.

Also, I think you're doing a good job on those SoT intros. I imagine Neo won't complain about them anymore - at least not much :). - Runch 17:27, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Just wanted to clarify my earlier statement: When you welcome new users, be sure to add the welcome to their discussion page (ie. User talk:Name), not their User page. - Runch 03:47, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

From Talk:Terry Goodkind

I didn't want to clutter up the TG talk page any more than it already is, so I'm putting this comment on your talk page. You posted:

Runch....lol.. You never cease to crack me up with your double standard. I can dig out your comments to me in the archives...lol.. You pulled stuff off the page I placed calling me a vandal and now you are allowing it, and encouraging it on grrms page...seriously dude get a grip please!

I guess I should have been more explicit in my post. I have yet to see one instance of true vandalism to the TG or SoT pages by a regular contributor. However, one could make a case that you have vandalized said pages. The reasons are:

• A) Blanking of the talk page (Instances: 1 2)
• B) Removal of dispute tags when dispute was still unsettled (Instances: 1 2 3)

Of course, I always assumed that you were merely ignorant of Misplaced Pages policies regarding these issues, and that's why I didn't consider the above instances to be vandalism. If you care to actually check the logs, you will see that I never accused you of being a vandal. So go ahead, pull up "the archives", I'd like to see what you find...

Oh and by the way, I've made only one edit to the GRRM talk page, and that was to inform WLU of the policy WP:RS. So I really don't know what you're babbling about as far as me encouraging anything on the GRRM page. Please don't accuse me, or anyone else, of things that obviously never happened. - Runch 15:14, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Bastique

Hey Mystar, technically you didn't provide the information. I did. And thank you for the compliment on the T'lan Imass page. Feel free to add content if you've read the books.WLU 23:19, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Ahhh well always looking for a way to break your word. I truly expected you to be a person who kept her word. I truly did. ANd I did provide you with proof... I gave you ONE of the names of the admins I spoke with. But we can ALL now see that you are not going to keep your word and just how good your word truly is. using a ploy like that is just bad form and weak.--Mystar 01:25, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Sword of Truth

The Sword of Truth WikiProject is now up and running. Thought you might like to know. It still has a long way to go before it'll look truly respectable, but it's a start. - Runch 18:50, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

If you have something to discuss regarding page edits, please do so on talk pages of the articles, or on my own talk page. Using the edit summary gives me no chance to reply and does not allow you to disclose the full rationale for your edits. WLU 18:13, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

User notice: temporary 3RR block

Regarding reversions made on October 1 2006 to Terry Goodkind

You have been temporarily blocked for violation of the three-revert rule. Please feel free to return after the block expires, but also please make an effort to discuss your changes further in the future.

My dear Mr. Connolley, I offer up my sincere regrets. I see your point and I will take my medicine, as a man should. After discussing it at length with several admins, I have come to see your point and heartily agree in my error. I was acting in Good Faith that what I saw as open contempt and vandalisms toward Terry Goodkind's page (see any contribs by WLU to assure your self of bad faith editing and edit warring), I was on the IRC channel while this was occurring and was asking for advise and help. Even they felt she was exerting overt ownership and was in the wrong. But that doesn’t make me right; I did err, and should be held accountable. I do appreciate your intervening and your insight. I am still relatively new to Misplaced Pages and not up to speed on all the guidelines and rules. I am learning and your efforts have added me in being a better editor.

Today I spend a great deal of time with a couple of admins and most notably JWSchmidt. JWSchmidt, helped me get a clear picture of my actions and what things I can do in the future to circumvent such actions again. As I told the Admins on the channel, I'll not disagree or postulate any unfairness. I’m a grown man as I will stand up and take my medicine. I will also not speak to WLU's actions as they speak for themselves ass do her contribs, nor will I presume to hypothesize on WLU's current torrent of attacks.

I am sorry for my actions, and shall endeavor to try harder. --Mystar 00:54, 2 October 2006 (UTC)