Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Veronica678 (talk | contribs) at 21:36, 4 October 2006 (→POV tag). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

NPOV tag

I've done some cleanup on this article. While the accreditation issue must be handled, the tone of the article and the balance of discussion has to be evened out. I don't know much about the university, and don't know where to start, but while an honest article is in order, it can't be a smear job, either. --badlydrawnjeff talk 20:18, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Is this a school? Does that claim meet WP:V? As for now it doesn't look like it. Arbusto 08:26, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Veronica678 18:00, 30 September 2006 (UTC)The part about the dog should be removed. If a person filled out an application using a fake (dog's) name, the content of the application must have been also falsified with enough detail to pass the equivalency meter. The problem is that if someone did complete the application with enough fake personal details to be awarded the Almeda degree, with the sole intent of discrediting Almeda, then it violates several laws including fraud and entrapment. All Almeda applications require that the applicant sign electronically that they are at least 18 years of age and all information contained within their application is true and correct. Also, the dog story was not created by a news team investigation, but was an uncorroborated story told to the news – which they then chose to print without verifying the details. This is akin to sending a friend with your birth certificate in to take your drivers license test for you and then bashing the Department of Motor Vehicles for issuing you a driver’s license when you can't drive.

Do not remove cited material.

Do you have any links that any accredited schools have awarded a dog a degree? You analogy doesn't work and it WP:OR. Arbusto 18:07, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

If you are going to quote the article without requiring any validity or corroboration, at least quote it accurately. Your out-of-context quote is misleading. It isn't Wally that teaches kids responsibilities, it's Wally's owner. See my correction. —the preceding comment is by Veronica678 - 21:43, 30 September 2006: Please sign your posts!

From the article, I think it's pretty clear that it's Wally's life experience that is being described. I'm changing your phrasing to make that more clear. William Pietri 16:23, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

POV tag

Would someone other than a single purpose account please quantify the supposed neutrality dispute? I see none here; the article is well supported by citations from reliable sources. Guy 16:02, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Since I, and not anyone else, added the tag: Balance of coverage, lack of information about the actual school, etc. This is stuck only on these issues about its accreditation and ome of the news stories that have come out about it. --badlydrawnjeff talk 16:09, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

The question is, can anyone find a reliable source that doesn't classify it a diploma mill? If not, we can't fudge the article just to be "balanced". That would be WP:OR. And if somebody does find such a source, just incorporate the information. A.J.A. 16:33, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Jeff, I see where you're coming from, but {{sofixit}}. You're a good editor - if you can find reliable sources adding the other POV to the article, then go ahead and do it. If you can't, then how are the rest of us supposed to do it? TheronJ 17:54, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Mainly because I've been working hard on another article and wanted to let this silly dog diploma edit war calm down a bit first. Meanwhile, as an example, it's as if no one's bothered to check out their homepage, which is useful in limited quantities to get a good idea of what they do. --badlydrawnjeff talk 18:07, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

This is a matter of taking an article out of context. The context as written on Misplaced Pages alludes to the assumption that Almeda knowingly issued a diploma to a dog. The facts in the news article state that the dog's owner completed the application with made-up information and used his dog's name, Wally. The way I had it in my version were accurate according to the article. The "editors" of Misplaced Pages keep saying that I am not allowed to change it as it is a single use account. But does anyone really care about accuracy here?Veronica678 16:27, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

No, it makes the point that Almeda make no attempt whatsoever to apply any standards of quality or verification to their degree applicants. If you can get a diploma for your dog, answering the questions truthfully as this guy did, then that shows something fundamentally awry in the institution's quality control. Or that it has none, and is a diploma mill, which seems to be what the majority of external commentators believe. Guy 16:29, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Are you kidding? The guy that got the diploma for his dog clearly perjured himself to discredit Almeda. And since he was willing to commit perjury on his Almeda application, what makes you think he was 100 percent honest in the news article? Veronica678 21:36, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Possible additional sources for Almeda College and/or University

Spurred by Jeff's challenge to offer balance, I took a look for more reliable source references to Almeda.

• A story in CityLink about Almeda as basically their textbook example of a degree mill - no campus, no courses, no tests, and you get a degree. The story also discusses Almeda's being driven out of Florida by the local regulators..

• A Naples police officer is forced to pay back his raise received after he received a promotion based on his Almeda degree.

• Two Naples police officers are fired for claiming degrees from Almeda; bring grievance.

• Stephen Twenge identifies Almeda as a "degree mill" that exists "only on the web." (Note: This source might not meet WP:RS, as I am not sure of its publication info).

Jeff, I don't see how we're going to be able to introduce the POV you want. Everything I see from any reliable source indicates that Almeda (1) has no campus, (2) teaches no classes, (3) administers no tests, and (4) offers degrees for about $600 based entirely on "life experience." Are you going to insist on the POV tag until someone finds a newspaper article somewhere saying that Almeda is a great school whose degrees are widely accepted by people familiar with the school? If not, what POV are we missing? Thanks, TheronJ 18:15, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

As I said above, there's certainly more that can be said about this place that isn't "diploma mill." If I can get around to it later on, I'll certainly do it, but I don't think I'm taking some extreme position here. --badlydrawnjeff talk 18:28, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Jeff, if you can expand it go for it, but make sure that is passes WP:V. Some diploma mill websites steal data and names from legit schools and post it as their own history. Arbusto 21:50, 2 October 2006 (UTC)