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    See also: Logged AE sanctions

    Important informationShortcuts

    Please use this page only to:

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    On community review

    Uninvolved administrators at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard ("AE") and uninvolved editors at the administrators' noticeboard ("AN") should revoke or modify a contentious topic restriction on appeal if:

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    2. This criterion does not apply if the original action was imposed as a result of rough consensus at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard, as there would be no single enforcing administrator.
    Appeals and administrator modifications of non-contentious topics sanctions

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    Modifications by administrators

    No administrator may modify or remove a sanction placed by another administrator without:

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    Important notes:

    1. For a request to succeed, either
    (i) the clear and substantial consensus of (a) uninvolved administrators at AE or (b) uninvolved editors at AN or
    (ii) a passing motion of arbitrators at ARCA
    is required. If consensus at AE or AN is unclear, the status quo prevails.
    2. While asking the enforcing administrator and seeking reviews at AN or AE are not mandatory prior to seeking a decision from the committee, once the committee has reviewed a request, further substantive review at any forum is barred. The sole exception is editors under an active sanction who may still request an easing or removal of the sanction on the grounds that said sanction is no longer needed, but such requests may only be made once every six months, or whatever longer period the committee may specify.
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    Information for administrators processing requests

    Thank you for participating in this area. AE works best if there are a variety of admins bringing their expertise to each case. There is no expectation to comment on every case, and the Arbitration Committee (ArbCom) thanks all admins for whatever time they can give.

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    VwM.Mwv

    Blocked for one week. Galobtter (pingó mió) 15:46, 13 February 2019 (UTC)
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning VwM.Mwv

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    RolandR (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 15:03, 13 February 2019 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    VwM.Mwv (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    WP:A/I/PIA :General prohibition, 1RR, disruptive editing
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 13:14, 13 February 2019 re-addition of reverted material to an article in the topic area
    2. 16:20, 12 February 2019 Disruptive editing - using Talk page as a forum
    3. 04:12, 13 February 2019 Disruptive editing - reversion of collapse of off-topic Talk page comments
    4. 04:40, 13 February 2019 Edit-warring - second re-addition of collapsed section, following reversion of first reversion by a third editor
    5. 05:32, 13 February 2019 Edit-warring - third re-addition of collapsed material (subsequently self-reverted)
    6. 10:12, 21 January 2019 Editing in topic area, following notification of General Prohibition
    7. 21:02, 22 January 2019 Another example
    8. 17:00, 30 January 2019 And another
    1. 17:57, 9 February 2019 One more
    2. 20:14, 30 January 2019 And yet another
    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    1. Date Explanation
    2. Date Explanation
    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
    • Alerted about discretionary sanctions in the area of conflict in the last twelve months, see the system log linked to above. Here
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    VwM.Mwv is a very new editor (account created on 6 January 2019). Almost all of their 200 edits have been to articles in the Palestine/Israel conflict area, and they were notified of the arbitration ruling and general prohibition on 9 January. Despite this, they have continued to edit extensively in the topic area - a sample of such edits is listed above.

    The editor has also been using Talk pages as a forum, polemicising about the subject rather than discussing improvement of the articles. See for instance this edit at Talk:Walter Guinness, 1st Baron Moyne, and several edits at Talk:Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions. In the course of thewse edits, the editor explicitly states that another editor is "anti-Semitic".

    After I collapsed (without deleting) some of the editor's off-topic comments and the replies, and left them an explanation on their Talk page, they started to edit-war to reverse the collapse, as detailed above.

    The editor has already been warned about edit-warring on another article in the topic area, but continued to edit the Talk page disruptively. Under the Genetral prohibition, "Editors who are not eligible to be extended-confirmed may use the Talk: namespace to post constructive comments and make edit requests related to articles within the topic area, provided they are not disruptive". This editor's comments have become disruptive. Combined with the personal attack and edit warring, they cross the threshold for a sanction.

    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

    Here


    Discussion concerning VwM.Mwv

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by VwM.Mwv

    Statement by Shrike

    • Some of his edits for example in Resilience party has nothing to do with the conflict and the article is not marked as belonging to the area the same applies to other articles.
    • user:RolandR Did you ask the articles to be ECP protected if you really thing that they belong to the conflict? --Shrike (talk) 15:32, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

    Result concerning VwM.Mwv

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

    Cristina neagu

    Topic-banned from Romania and Romanians for six months. Sandstein 12:24, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning Cristina neagu

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Tgeorgescu (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 21:16, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    Cristina neagu (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced

    Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Eastern Europe#Discretionary sanctions

    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 14 February 2019 Misplaced Pages is not comparative, it brings to mockery, please read the rules (regarding the EU, I will leave it that way in order Romania to do more efforts) Explanation: Hi Cristina, I don't know why you interpreted as "mockery" the mere fact that Romania is ranked at the same corruption perceptions' level with Cuba and Malaysia - is it not your perception that Cuba and Malaysia are somehow generally "inferior" to Romania and the fact that the perceived corruption level in Romania makes them as "inferior" as them? Mentatus (talk) 19:26, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
    2. 13 February 2019 Look, I was pissed off because our greatest kings, Burebista and Decebalus (Dacian), and Emperor Trajan (Romania) were deleted. Explanation for her psychological drive to perform WP:TE. Our kings? Romanians did not exist back then.
    3. 13 February 2019 First came the Hungarians who removed parts of our history in order not to be offensive to anyone, secondly you are coming and you are deleting everything. I will probably choose the most important images, because you know nothing about Romania since you are a Canadian trapper. Explanation: not necessary.
    4. 15 February 2019. Heartfelt but totally immature comment, during AE scrutiny. Same applies to and (both same day as the former).
    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
    • Alerted about discretionary sanctions in the area of conflict in the last twelve months, see the system log linked to above. 11 February 2019.
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    This editor shows a WP:BATTLEGROUND mentality and pushes a nationalist POV. A six months topic ban from East-European politics and history, broadly conceived, would be all right.

    @Mr rnddude: I agree with a formal warning and subsequent scrutiny. My impression was that she did not get the point to refrain from WP:TE, although she did not lack wise advice.

    We rarely have problems with holding opinions off-wiki; we do have problems with on-wiki behavior.

    I had agreed with Mr rnddude to let you go with only a formal warning, but then came . Do you realize that you're making yourself a disservice with such statements?

    Is supposed to be funny?

    About and : do provide evidence for you claims, otherwise you have just made it more difficult for yourself.

    Provide clear-cut evidence that I'm using "techniques of manipulation", otherwise you just make it harder for yourself. When I was prepared to let you go with a formal warning, why did you have not seized the opportunity?

    Injustice, mockery, false proofs, these are serious charges. But if you cannot provide evidence for your claims, you'll be the one found guilty of casting aspersions.

    I have stated My impression was that she did not get the point to refrain from WP:TE, although she did not lack wise advice. What could you have done to avoid a TBAN? Refrain from performing WP:TE, obviously. My two cents are that you have continued WP:TE, but I let admins be the judge of that.

    We're intellectuals. We don't listen to mere rhetoric, we listen to evidence. So, sorry, False proofs, I already proved just won't do without providing evidence.

    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested


    Discussion concerning Cristina neagu

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by Cristina neagu

    Hello! I am not "nationalistic" user in the terms of battling (patriotic person yes, is this forbidden?), I created 145 new articles on Misplaced Pages. Thank you, Tgeorgescu, that you are hunting my profile and every words. Then you pretend you are a Christian, because I am really not problematic at all. Burebista, Decebalus and Trajan are part of the Romanian ethnogenesis (Dacian and Romans, Romania comes from "the people of Rome"). See what Britannia says. But I obeyed, it was a talk about a gallery of images. Banned for what, and why so harsh? In 2 and 3 those were my comments indeed but find out we reached the consensus, most likely I agreed with the user's actions and the "spammed" gallery was removed. The user even educated me in Misplaced Pages rules on nations articles. Regarding 1 I just removed "at par with Cuba and Malaysia", I remember I have seen on some pages the same thing (that comparative notes are not really necessary). I didn't keep going, I had a removal, then a removal with explanation and that's all. The user came back and put it back, ok. I can live with that. Remember, I obeyed every time!!! With everything, I tried to make this work. I am really not problematic at all, just show me from where to read and tell me what I have broken. I have a positive attitude and I will really educate myself more. I accept any decision, just hoping Mr admins will be wise. Tgeorgescu already warned me, but he is a single user, he might have been subjective. Anyway, I still listened to him but maybe I am still wrong in some aspects. If you think I am wrong, dear admins, let me know. Why ban if I was never even warned by an administrator? I just hope women are also welcomed on Misplaced Pages. In all the 3 cases presented I obeyed the opinions of the users at the end. Battling is a lot said, believe me. We can't have different opinions at all? Did you see wars involving me? Most of the times I didn't have the last word. Ok, I can reproach myself I might have been rude in some comments, and I really do apologise. 145 articles in 1 year and my activity was really light. I try to be human with everybody. Christina (talk) 09:22, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

    Some users were blocked for 1 WEEK, FOR WORSE THINGS, examples are at the top. Whilst you are asking for me 6-month block... Thanks a lot! Christina (talk) 12:00, 15 February 2019 (UTC)
    Hello! But that was a only a comment on a gallery of images (regarding the images, it was not even written anymore as Romanian king - but Roman soldiers salute Emperor Trajan during the Second Roman–Dacian War (the war marked the downfall of the Dacian Kingdom), I didn't write on the article that and in the end we agreed to keep only some images in order not to spam (I just wanted to keep more photos, including one of Trajan, but we had a consensus not to re-post again the gallery since it's spamming; at the end we kept the Dacian map, the Skull, and the Dacian and Roman Dacia as colony sanctuaries). Yes, TBAN, some other users were blocked for 1 week for worse things. Thank you very much, I consider your comment to be really objective! You see I am as passionate as you on history also. PS. You don't have to agree, but Romania will always consider Trajan as a forefather. We speak Romance language and that's why we pretend we are the descendants of the Roman cohorts, some also mixed with the Dacians (very few). Let's leave this way, Tgeorgescu is trying to twist things up, those were only my personal comments (on the article we did exactly what the other users decided, regarding spamming with the gallery, also previously regarding the content). Christina (talk) 12:51, 15 February 2019 (UTC)
    I don't want to accuse anybody, but this could be written on my Misplaced Pages CV. I never had reclamation. This is a like divide et impera following the policy of small steps in order to remove me from the site. First, a warning came from him from nowhere. Then this. Tgeorgescu's opinion about me is probably not good, I am like an obsession. Guess what, he is also a Romanian and we never interacted, that's why I am so emotional! Do you also use another user Tgeorgescu? I love when you report your mates, like I am some bandit of Misplaced Pages. I only reported once a troll who kept doing that, replacing good info with false info.Christina (talk) 13:00, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: Just that it was off-article, I expressed my opinion but I didn't add it on the article. Just saying... Cristina neaguu (talk) 17:06, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

      • I am really sorry for my reaction and I am apologising again. I worked with Borsoka and Rosenborg fan for many hours on that project, and then the work was removed instead of a talk page message first. Nobody opposed to the spamming (image gallery) after he discussed the matter. You are a very qualified user but you are understimating me as a person and also my work. Btw you are using "much better" words in describing me than I did when I used "trapper". If it would be myself to judge, honestly I would not even judge users like me or you. Because we are a community here, and you can't really say I really break the rules of Misplaced Pages (I am talking for myself). Forbidding work on a topic, Sandstein? Really? Did you see previously what kind of users we had on those topics? All kind of mockers, I can prove most of them are still active and were never forbidden. Where was you or where were the others to keep the good work of Wikipeda as an encyclopedia and not the mockery site regarding Romania? I have seen for long time administrators banning the Romanians instead of the haters, because they treated the problem superficially. Don't you think I can also request enforcement for some users, but why would I do that since I try to get along with all? And then you call me non-collegial. You draw conclusions from two words. It's easy to talk from the outside. Christina (talk) 19:06, 15 February 2019 (UTC) (Moved here. Don't edit outside of your section again. Sandstein 20:27, 15 February 2019 (UTC))

    @Tgeorgescu: When did you agree? You are not administrator (Mr rnddude is a kind user, a real human being, but I think he is also not), it means you retract your reclamation involving me. And you are pushing it to the limits, I see you are doing everything in order to see me in trouble. One thing I can guarantee, I will check there is no steal of identity in the case of real Mr T. (Tudor) Georgescu of the Netherlands. I will mail him, contact him on Facebook, and I will find out who is the person on Youtube in the video (hoping it's not a big hoax). Because at your profile you pretend some personal things. This can also be against the rules of Misplaced Pages. Your hatred could be explained, if you have some association with some users on the page of Romania. Because you started hunting me from nowhere, we didn't even edit the same pages. I might be wrong, but what if I am true? Do you think what's strange? You are calling yourself on your page HACKER, threatening with some "hacker manifestos". Great guy, 45 years old and a Christian. Hacker. I ask you kindly to leave me alone, because all the users on Misplaced Pages could be similar with me if we look up. You just invent accusations without reason. Groundless. I don't care I have a big mouth against injustice, even Sandstein agreed I have a big mouth but I should not be judged here. You pretend you are moral and a man of God! Sure, I can't have an opinion, this is similar to the marxism not to the US/UK societes. They do not put their fist in your mouth. Christina (talk) 20:25, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

    @EdJohnston: Not at all, user Tgeorgescu is hunting me down and is harrassing me. I never had any conflict on Misplaced Pages (or at least I wasn't reported), I always proposed consensus if somebody wasn't satisfied with my edits and I rarely want to have the last word. Blocking me from an area which I also love, would be an injustice. I am being judged through some comments, not by my actions. In years, all the users had loads of comments like that. Including you maybe. Christina (talk) 19:42, 16 February 2019 (UTC) @Tgeorgescu: Sure. Regarding 1, the user had the last word, we had no war of reverts. I first edited by removing a very small comparative part (it was so small, for God's sake, I didn't manipulate anything). Then I explained my revert. It was only one revert, then I wrote him on the talk page. Regarding 2. It was independent opinion, on the history of Romania I didn't write that. On photos' description the same. It's like, do what the others agreed and not what you think! 3 I was rude but I reached a consensus with the guy, and he educated me a little bit. I apologised and I am really apologising once again. In the end I understood he had good intention. 4 AGAIN, reporting me for the first 3, of course I was emotional. But I didn't swear anyone. DO YOU STILL CONSIDER RETRACTING THE RECLAMATION? YOU SAID IT. Christina (talk) 19:55, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: At least Sandstein and Mr rnddude didn't find me any guilt. They stand for justice, even Sandstein, although he didn't like my comments! And I apologised before, and now after. If I would have been such a threat, I would have been commented by many administrators and users already in some days already. Generally from what I saw on Misplaced Pages, some admins are not interested really to be judges. But to eliminate any potential threat even if it isn't. I will never forget what you did against me, and as a pretending Christian. You harmed an innocent woman and a simple user. A contributor to the Misplaced Pages, nothing more. Shame on those that stand for injustice. Yes, I am also a big patriot and world's civilisation and culture lover, but not that type of crazy nationalist. Christina (talk) 20:14, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: How can I love you, when you keep going with the manipulation? You wrote sentences acting like an admin which you are obviously not. It didn't even matter that you brought false proofs. I had 0 complaints on Misplaced Pages, I feel it's a big shame for me even to be discussed here. In any trial, it would be written "unreliable evidence, solution is resolved by rejection (denunciation without reason)." But unfortunately I can't defend myself like that. 2 users (1 admin) said not guilty, and another 1 user (admin) said guilty. Christina (talk) 20:26, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: I don't "fill" anything, I am not vengeful. I am not on Misplaced Pages to report users, like you. You came from nowhere leaving on my talk page a "warning", when you weren't even admin. Almost 17 years and my Romanians still didn't choose you as administrator. And on your talk page you sent me to the therapy. Yes, you are pretending you are like an admin, but you are not. It's funny the Romanian Misplaced Pages knows you. You are making many users leave Misplaced Pages, Sandstein said something about collegiality. Didn't he? Now after that warning, you are reporting me asking a TBAN. That's very harsh, we never edited together, we never met on Misplaced Pages. Jesus, I told you it's important for me not to be blocked anywhere! The administrators will decide, I will wait for their decision and that's all. But I might leave Misplaced Pages for good. I am really opressed for absolutely nothing. A warning for my big and bad mouth (not the worst though) can be imposed. But that's all. I NEVER GOT A REPORT. I could have got an official warning from an administrator, not from somebody who wants me burned on a pillar like Joan of Arc. I would really want to ignore you, but unfortunately on Misplaced Pages it's not possible. Christina (talk) 20:45, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: You are just using psychological techniques of manipulation. I see you keep going. First, you are presenting false proofs of my behaviour and ask for a harsh 6 months (you ask a lot to be banned well, or to be surely banned in order to destroy my Misplaced Pages record which was clean). Then you are acting like you are an administrator. Then you take control over all, proposing ban and insisting with banning me. I am telling you to stop replying, then you start increasing the idea that a ban on politics is just nothing, nothing to me. Which is false, really not true! OPPRESSED? Yes, by you, and also harrassed. Not the Romanians, wtf? MYSELF. You already agreed with a formal warning, but just to know I only think I have a bad mouth. And why did you agree first? Just to picture into the good guy, then to return with accusations. ;) TO INCREASE MY GUILT IN THE EYES OF THE ADMINS! I already read about your page and some of your edits, and quite many of them are psychological. A hacker and a manipulator. Well, you are calling yourself a hacker. Christina (talk) 21:40, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: Because you have no word and the reclamation was wrong first of all. Retract the reclamation if you said it, you will have my respect, everything is fine. I am certainly not a crazy nationalist. I might be a quality contributor, you don't have many on those pages. I was already attracted by history, culture and civilisations, but I was editing handball until I saw injustice and mockery. On some pages there is equity, on the others was not. Just mockeries. I made a lot of friends. I am not having war or reverts, I am not battling just discussing. I rarely wanted to have the last word, I asked for more opinions. Christina (talk) 21:51, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: You don't even read what I am saying. Do you have problems with your eyes? Mockery has nothing to do with you. I said I started being attracted by those pages because I found mockeries. This was outside our subject. False proofs, I already proved, and 2 guys already voted against my TBAN. Of course it's injustice! You really want to see me banned, don't you? It's talking the rage in you. Christina (talk) 22:01, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: So Galobtter, top of "my case", was blocked for 1 week. For real accusations and a lot worse than I did. What did I do anyway? Admin Sandstein says he can't accuse me of anything than a big mouth. Compared to you, Galobtter is a real contributor to the English Misplaced Pages and a jurist. You are hunting positions, when we already have volunteers who met eachother in the United States, whilst I am contributing. This is not the Romanian Misplaced Pages where you look for that admin job for 17 years, and they rejected you because of your attitude towards users who are gone now. I HAVE 145 ARTICLES, YOU ONLY HAVE 8. Basically I am accused by a non-contributor. HOW CAN YOU BE ALWAYS RIGHT IF YOU DON'T WORK? That's not me, of course. I am a contributor so I can make mistakes. But not against Misplaced Pages policy. Christina (talk) 22:08, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: Just that you need to bring real proofs. Because it's full of your personal subjectivism. Christina (talk) 22:14, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @Tgeorgescu: You can easily use any accusation, about 1000, but without bringing solid, non-weak evidences.. I am sure you will be back. You like my user. I can easily do the same against you, but I am not gonna do that. Against you or anyone who is ok. Your outside behaviour is ok, just your reports are not. The admins will have to understand you really want to see me banned as innocent user, you can't stop, there is something burning in you. Christina (talk) 22:21, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @GoldenRing: With all due respect, NATIONALIST AGENDA? I have barely edited on Romania. And in each town I have edited, I just completed the Antiquity or I have added it. This is incredible what's going on and how you treat me superficially. Some user above me really did bad things and was blocked for 1 week, and I can get 3 or 6 month? After all all who proposed this unreal penance? An administrator or a hunting user? If you really want to punish me, without clear evidence (some users and admins found me no guilt, than a big mouth which can be improved since I only have 1 year), punish me 1 week or 2. Do you understand what a harsh and heavy punishment is even 3 months? Put yourself in my place! I also want to mention I had no report before, 0 official complaints. And now I am with the violators and criminals of the Misplaced Pages? Christina (talk) 11:05, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

    @GoldenRing: Did you even check my edits? On the talk page, I had an opinion, on the page I left exactly like the other history users agreed. I am punished for some personal opinions which were not added by me on the articles. Do you realise how lame is that? On the talk pages, I can have any opinion I want if my actions don't go against the community. Maybe my history education is the problem, but I learned from this and now I check sources like Britannica and not only (Western). For universal writings. Christina (talk) 11:06, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

    Statement by Mr rnddude

    Procedural comments: 1) Cristina neagu, comments are to be posted in independent sections. That is, don't post in another person's section. If you need to notify them, use the messaging system (WP:PINGs). 2) Tgeorgescu is pushing for a six month TBAN, not a six month block. A TBAN will prevent you from editing in a specific area of Misplaced Pages, but will not exempt you from contributing elsewhere.

    Comments on proposed TBAN: That said, a six month TBAN is an extremely harsh first step. For one, the issue presented is entirely localized to Romania. I can see no fathomable reason to extend a TBAN to cover all of Eastern Europe which spans from Poland/Croatia/Greece? to Estonia/Russia. Far too broad in scope. But, at this time, I don't really see a need to prohibit Cristina neagu from contributing to Romania topics either. The diffs presented are problematic (I loathe that word), and if persistent might be cause to TBAN. Right now, however, a warning to refrain from posting remarks about users ethnicities, or using ethnicity to further an argument, and to be more civil should suffice. Every editor, who is editing in good faith, has as much a right to edit/discuss any article on Romanian history as you.

    Short comment on content: Our kings? Romanians did not exist back then - You can practically ignore the ethnogenesis issue here. Trajan, emperor of Rome born in Spain, could under no conceivable definition be claimed to be a Romanian king. Mr rnddude (talk) 12:30, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning Cristina neagu

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • Well, most of these edits don't indicate much more than some serious competence issues (in terms of the English language and perhaps otherwise) on the part of Cristina neagu, but the "you know nothing about Romania since you are a Canadian trapper" comment is quite a bit more concerning. Cristina neagu doesn't come across to me as the type of knowledgeable, competent and collegial person we want to be editing sensitive and complicated topics. Thoughts by other admins? Sandstein 18:41, 15 February 2019 (UTC)
    • User:Cristina neagu's comments above are the type of nationalist editing philosophy that the sanctions are intended to deter. I support the topic ban. EdJohnston (talk) 14:26, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
    • Topic ban for Cristina neagu on all topics related to Romania broadly construed looks like a good starting point here.--Ymblanter (talk) 15:11, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
    • My thoughts generally align with Sandstein's above. While there is an evident nationalist agenda going on here, it is relatively difficult to pick out from general English-language competence problems. I agree with Mr rnddude that a six month ban from everything Eastern European would be excessive; a ban from Romanian topics I think would be appropriate but don't have a strong feeling on three months v six months. GoldenRing (talk) 09:32, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

    Springee, Trekphiler and RAF910

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning Springee

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Dlthewave (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 05:48, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested

    Springee (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Trekphiler (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    RAF910 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Gun_control#Discretionary_sanctions
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

    Note: This pattern of POV-pushing involves three editors. I hope that submitting them together is not problematic. These diffs and quotes are merely examples; the entire discussion should be read for context.

    1. 30 November 2018 Springee posts at WikiProject Firearms expressing concern that the "Criminal use" list at Glock is "out of control". RAF910 and Trekphiler chime in with POV-pushing comments: "...there are too many anti-gun editors who are pushing a political agenda, and doing everything in their power to gang-up on and ban pro-gun editors. So, despite our best efforts, I'm afraid there is very little we do about it at this time. Just "VOTE and HOPE" that enough editors realize where this is going and are willing to do something to stop it." "If it didn't lead to a change in the law, what impact did it have on Glock? Show that., & maybe it merits inclusion". These complaints are not a substantial consensus-building discussion and none of the arguments are based in policy, however it is cited later as prior consensus. My suggestion to discuss at Talk:Glock was ignored.
    2. 30 November 2018 Trekphiler blanks the entire Criminal Use section with the summary "which of these led to changes in law enough to impact Glock sales? none." This is not consistent with any current guideline and seems to be based on a deprecated WP:FIREARMS criminal use recommendation.
    3. 30 November 2018 After I reinstated the section, Trekphiler removes it again with a personal attack in the edit summary: "don't need to show impact? it smells like gun-confiscator propaganda otherwise
    4. 11 February 2019 Springee opens a discussion: "The list of crimes was deleted last November. A discussion with respect to the list was had here ]. Involved editors were myself, Dlthewave, RAF910 and Trekphiler. The concern and consensus was this had become an indiscriminate list of crimes with no indication that those crimes were associated with Glock in general. It is not clear that external RSs about the Glock company commonly include long lists of crimes. This isn't to say that a crime section can't be supported via RSs but we should base our inclusion and the associations of any particular crime with external sources about Glock that make that association." This raises several concerns: By linking the editors, Springee is effectively canvassing a group of editors who expressed support for his position; the previous, unsubstantial discussion is now referred to as "consensus"; and Springee is setting a high bar for inclusion, requiring that all sources in the criminal use section be about Glock specifically, an expectation which is not applied to any other section of the article. When challenged, Springee seems to apply a double standard to justify removing criminal use content while retaining information about police and military users: "The list is out of control because it is long, has no content other than "Crime X included a Glock" and is indiscriminate because no justification for inclusion was offered or suggested." (even though the Users section consists almost entirely of "Agency X uses Glocks" entries); " it is common in firearms articles to discuss police and military users" (while requiring that criminal use section be justified for inclusion in this specific article.)
    5. 12 February 2019 Trekphiler makes an uncivil accusation: ”This list is nothing but an effort to dirty Glock firearms, & by extension, all firearms. I don't see a "criminal use" section for the 1934 Ford or the Chevrolet Impala. Why not? Because there's a hate-on for guns. “
    6. 17 February 2019 After reliable sources including the Washington Post are provided to support the Criminal Use section, Springee makes dubious claims that they are ”basicallly content free” and insists that more sources be found. This is accompanied by unproductive, rambling walls of text about everything from police departments using Glocks to something about F-150s.
    7. 17 February 2019 RAF910 canvasses Drmies, an editor who previously supported removal, and misleadingly assesses consensus by counting votes.
    8. 17 February 2019 RAF910 makes a false accusation of forum shopping (I did not start any of the discussions) and assesses prior consensus by counting votes.

    Taken together in the context of the overall discussion, these comments represent a pattern of obstruction to the consensus-building process by refusing to work toward a compromise, refusing to accept that consensus may change and setting ever-higher bars for inclusion of criminal use content. The initial discussion on the Wikiproject Firearms page and selective notification of editors raise canvassing concerns as well.

    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
    • Springee alerted
    • Trekphiler alerted
    • RAF910 alerted
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint
    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested
    • Springee
    • Trekphiler
    • RAF910

    Discussion concerning Springee, Trekphiler and RAF910

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by Springee

    I don't understand why we are even here. This is a content dispute. The claim of improper notification Dlthewave made was wrong as APPNOTE specifically says notifying previously involved editors is not canvasing. However, when a few months after participating in said discussion Dlthewave reverts a consensus edit that is a problem. Rather than disputing the consensus Dlthewave ignored it. Since Dlthewave is concerned about improper notification I would point out that the project the editor started has a goal to add content such as mass shootings into firearms article when possible ]. The ~10 project editors have been nearly unanimous in their opinions on such material. Why wouldn't any notice to such a sympathetic project be automatically seen as improper notification? Dlthewave isn't a "bad guy" or anything and, even though I think this ARE is way off base, I think in general they are acting in good faith. However, this is a very inappropriate use of ARE to try to address a content dispute. Finally, I would suggest that Dlthewave's own POV is very strong in this area. Consider that in their Signpost submission, towards the end of their article, they implied that editors such as myself were keeping criminal content out of an article against a general RfC discussion ("To date, the article does not make any mention of criminal use") but neglected to mention to readers that this was due to a new, local RfC that said consensus to not include. If there is PUSH I would say it is in both directions but also, even in Dlthewave's case, all within Wiki policies and guidelines. Springee (talk) 11:52, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

    Legacypac's comments

    LP's history of INCIVILITY towards me should be kept in mind when reading this. The editor was blocked (later lifted with a warning) for their attacks against me. Block log ], related talk page discussions ], ]. Unsubstantiated accusations of COI are certainly not assuming good faith when I have already stated I have no COI in this area. Never have, unlikely I ever will. Also, I'm not an NRA member, never have been. Springee (talk) 11:58, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

    Statement by Cullen328

    I am neither pro-gun nor anti-gun and feel that I am neutral because I have been criticized roughly equally by people on both sides of that debate. But if someone added content to an article about a kitchen knife manufacturer reporting that some criminal stabbed someone with a knife made by that company, I would object. Undue weight. It would be inappropriate, in my view, if someone added content to an article about a company that rents trucks stating that company inadvertently rented a truck to someone who carried out a truck bombing. It would be inappropriate to add content to articles about Home Depot or Lowe's or any other home improvement company reporting that somebody bought supplies there that were used to build a terrorist bomb. All bets are off, of course, if such a company was proved negligent in a court of law. Last time I checked, sales and ownership of firearms remains legal in the United States for the vast majority of adult citizens. And the overwhelming majority of legally owned firearms have never been used in a crime or any act of violence. Personally, I favor universal background checks and other reasonable restrictions on gun ownership so the so-called "pro-gun" editors might be wary of me. But really. If reliable sources report that celebrity X died of alcoholism, and their favorite beverage was Cutty Sark should we add that to Cutty Sark (whisky)? I do not think so. Undue weight and soapboxing. This should be declined. Cullen Let's discuss it 07:36, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

    Statement by (RAF910)

    Please read User:Dlthewave/Whitewashing of firearms articles, User:Dlthewave/Signpost Opinion Firearms and Misplaced Pages:Misplaced Pages Signpost/Newsroom/Submissions "Opinion: Firearms". Where Dlthewave portrayed himself as the epic hero fighting the forces of darkness. Basically, this is in direct violation of Misplaced Pages:Advocacy. Also, see User talk:Felsic2/Gun use "Requested move 19 May 2018" where on 4 June 2018 there was a consensus NOT to move this page to Misplaced Pages:GUNUSE or Misplaced Pages:GUNCRIME. However, 18 January 2019‎, Dlthewave ignored said consensus and created (backdoor) redirects to said page anyway. This is also clearly a violation of Misplaced Pages:Tendentious editing. Also, he is constantly accusing his fellow editors of acting in bad faith and violating Wiki policies. And, as you can see he is adept at Misplaced Pages:Wikilawyering. Dlthewave's edit history speaks for itself. I believe it's his ultimate goal to get as many "pro-gun' editors as possible blocked or topic-banned, so they cannot interfere with his crusade.--RAF910 (talk) 06:50, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

    Statement by Mr rnddude

    Springee opens a discussion ... This raises several concerns: By linking the editors, Springee is effectively canvassing a group of editors who expressed support for his position. Really? Involved editors were myself, Dlthewave, RAF910 and Trekphiler. <- The OP is the second name on the list of those notified, and only four people commented here. So everyone that was there was notified. So there's a falsehood.

    Sigh. I couldn't read past there, although I see Drmies is also named. Fascinating that a pro-gun editor should canvass a gun-control advocate. Mr rnddude (talk) 07:16, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

    GoldenRing - this? it was closed as decide on a case-by-case basis if I recall correctly. Mr rnddude (talk) 08:02, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

    Statement by Legacypac

    I follow the NRA article where Springee can be counted on to push a "nothing negative about the NRA or guns" agenda. He denies any COI but from what I've seen the NRA should be sending him thank-you cards and maybe an honorarium for his dedicated efforts. Such volunteer dedication is truly rare. I'm not familiar with the other editors named here. Legacypac (talk) 09:12, 18 February 2019 (UTC)


    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning Springee, Trekphiler and RAF910

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • Also, want there a big RfC on "criminal use" sections of gun articles recently? Possibly specific to the AR-15. Can someone remind me where it was? GoldenRing (talk) 07:57, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
    • @Mr rnddude: The very one, thank you. GoldenRing (talk) 08:54, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
    • On the dispute itself, I'd value insights from other admins, but initially I'm not seeing any need for enforcement action here. The community have decided that inclusion of such material is to be decided on a case-by-case basis and so there is nothing wrong with the existence of the discussion per se. And at this stage I'm not seeing such tendentious behaviour in that discussion that enforcement is warranted. GoldenRing (talk) 09:10, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
    • As a matter of first impression, this looks primarily like a content dispute to me, and we don't resolve these via AE. I advise all editors to keep calm and avoid ad hominems, but the conduct reported here doesn't rise to the level of requiring sanctions, in my view. Sandstein 09:44, 18 February 2019 (UTC)